Ash Revisit: Part Deux

[Nazrethim]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

I am not saying that he shouldnt deal finisher. Im saying he shouldn't be able to deal more damage that goes unmitigated, when other frames deal less and IS mitigated. Its an unfair combination.

Is just as unfair as Ash having aiming requirement and single kill mechanic (which makes his crowd clearing slow as sh*t) when other frames can press a button and for a fraction of the energy can kill or cripple enemies into oblivion without actually making visual contact.

8 minutes ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

Let me clean the coffee I just spit out off of my screen...Without any defense whatsoever? You've got to be kidding me. Grineer have the most powerful defense in the game.

Aww... you missed my Oberon joke. I seriously need to color those in rainbow.

I didn't say they are defenseless, I said they were vulnerable, they have high armor, yes, but they are vulnerable to every cc in the game and have zero dispelling units on their ranks. So CC vs Damage IS a valid comparison here, and Ash has one purpose: kill. He doesn't have CC, and while the mad bomber sounds Fun, it will never be a reliable CC as a Radial Dissarm, MP, Radial Blind or even the nerfed Prisma Discoball. And CC is just as powerful, if not more, than raw damage, killed enemies respawn, CC'ed enemies get rid of the problem while preventing further spawns (that's how people solved JV ant nest problem.) That's why on LOR you will see more mass CC than damage. And considering Ash can't instakill everything (because at high levels even combo powered blade storms can't kill bombards and heavy gunners, only the bleed proc) the damage the ability does is fine, if anything, Hydroid, Oberon and Zephyr are due for a buff or rework to make them viable at endurance levels.

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

4 hours ago, Nazrethim said:

Is just as unfair as Ash having aiming requirement and single kill mechanic (which makes his crowd clearing slow as sh*t) when other frames can press a button and for a fraction of the energy can kill or cripple enemies into oblivion without actually making visual contact.

Aww... you missed my Oberon joke. I seriously need to color those in rainbow.

I didn't say they are defenseless, I said they were vulnerable, they have high armor, yes, but they are vulnerable to every cc in the game and have zero dispelling units on their ranks. So CC vs Damage IS a valid comparison here, and Ash has one purpose: kill. He doesn't have CC, and while the mad bomber sounds Fun, it will never be a reliable CC as a Radial Dissarm, MP, Radial Blind or even the nerfed Prisma Discoball. And CC is just as powerful, if not more, than raw damage, killed enemies respawn, CC'ed enemies get rid of the problem while preventing further spawns (that's how people solved JV ant nest problem.) That's why on LOR you will see more mass CC than damage. And considering Ash can't instakill everything (because at high levels even combo powered blade storms can't kill bombards and heavy gunners, only the bleed proc) the damage the ability does is fine, if anything, Hydroid, Oberon and Zephyr are due for a buff or rework to make them viable at endurance levels.

 So because Ashs specialty is killing, you are OK with him killing level 80s at 1850% above that of Oberon, who's damage type is literally a bombards only major weakness?  I mean, he only deals 160% above Oberon, and yet he can out a deal that amount of damage by long and far. I hardly see a reason to make him more effective, even at low levels, because he already scales so late into the game that he would be like mag 1.0 versus corpus. As it is, being able to kill with 1850% of the efficiency of other frames is enough. He doesn't need to change.

 Personally I find all three of the frames mentioned to be very effective, in their own way.  I find that Oberon is a better crowd control frame at higher levels, zephyr is incredibly versatile given her CC and ability to adopt elements, and hydroid is effectively with Ash wood be if all of his powers were based on RNG, and focused on CC.

 

[Xekrin]

On 1/14/2017 at 11:55 AM, Nazrethim said:

Option B) zoomed out camera, you essentially see the crowd of enemies from afar and Ash teleporting between them.

I loooove this idea.  It doesn't even have to zoom out very far, just enough to get all the targets, and switch if targets are too far apart perhaps.  We already have the mechanics I would think with the remote camera doohicky.

The rest is probably good too.

[Nazrethim]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

 So because Ashs specialty is killing, you are OK with him killing level 80s at 1850% above that of Oberon, who's damage type is literally a bombards only major weakness?  I mean, he only deals 160% above Oberon, and yet he can out a deal that amount of damage by long and far. I hardly see a reason to make him more effective, even at low levels, because he already scales so late into the game that he would be like mag 1.0 versus corpus. As it is, being able to kill with 1850% of the efficiency of other frames is enough. He doesn't need to change.

Yes, he's okay like that, because, again, no mass reliable CC, Blade Storm doesn't need to change, only it's pointless augment, teleport into object sh*tty mechanic (which actually scr¿wed teleport to some extent due to it's soft targeting and the tendency to teleportbug you inside ramparts, blunds and magnetic bubbles) Shuriken being not worth using in general and his passive being lacking, which are the points this thread is about, not blade storm.

2 hours ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

 Personally I find all three of the frames mentioned to be very effective, in their own way.  I find that Oberon is a better crowd control frame at higher levels, zephyr is incredibly versatile given her CC and ability to adopt elements, and hydroid is effectively with Ash wood be if all of his powers were based on RNG, and focused on CC.

 

Yes, each of them has something, CC. Ash, lacking that key feature (because if you have done high level content you should know that mass CC is the bread while super damage is the butter) is fine dealing superb damage, befiting his theme.

[Exaedr]

As much as I hope they will read all those comments and feedback, I highly doubt it after, what, almost 2 months? Besides I feel DE will just be making an excuse why marking is better than all the other suggestions.

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

On 1/18/2017 at 1:58 AM, Nazrethim said:

Yes, he's okay like that, because, again, no mass reliable CC, Blade Storm doesn't need to change, only it's pointless augment, teleport into object sh*tty mechanic (which actually scr¿wed teleport to some extent due to it's soft targeting and the tendency to teleportbug you inside ramparts, blunds and magnetic bubbles) Shuriken being not worth using in general and his passive being lacking, which are the points this thread is about, not blade storm.

Yes, each of them has something, CC. Ash, lacking that key feature (because if you have done high level content you should know that mass CC is the bread while super damage is the butter) is fine dealing superb damage, befiting his theme.

He can do CC, but I can see that we arent going to agree on that. Especially Teleport. We do agree on the augment. Its lazy and boring.

[Nazrethim]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

He can do CC, but I can see that we arent going to agree on that. Especially Teleport. We do agree on the augment. Its lazy and boring.

He can do CC, he can't do reliable CC, as in, CC that actually lasts for longer than 1s and doesnt require a super specific build that works on gimping his defensive capacity (reducing Smoke Screen cloak to no duration)

Edited January 20, 2017 by Nazrethim

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

On 1/19/2017 at 9:09 PM, Nazrethim said:

He can do CC, he can't do reliable CC, as in, CC that actually lasts for longer than 1s and doesnt require a super specific build that works on gimping his defensive capacity (reducing Smoke Screen cloak to no duration)

But it still staggers those nearby, and breaks targeting for those further. Long duration or short, it serves its purpose.  The only thing you would be losing is the bonus to efficiency for blade storm. 

 

 For Ash, the ability to reliably stagger enemies and break targeting makes him very viable and versatile.  He doesn't need duration for his other powers. 

 

I feel like you play him like Loki, while I play him like Ash. 

[Nazrethim]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

But it still staggers those nearby, and breaks targeting for those further. Long duration or short, it serves its purpose.  The only thing you would be losing is the bonus to efficiency for blade storm. 

A.K.A. The "F*CK THE WORLD" killer move.

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

 For Ash, the ability to reliably stagger enemies and break targeting makes him very viable and versatile.  He doesn't need duration for his other powers. 

I don't doubt it's CC capability, but it still isn't a "hard" CC, it's a soft CC.

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Fenrushak said:

I feel like you play him like Loki, while I play him like Ash. 

I play him like Ash, using his whole ability set according to the situation, and there are situations where at least 5s invi are helpful. Or are you going to tell me that Smoke Shadow is a Loki Augment?

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

9 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

A.K.A. The "F*CK THE WORLD" killer move.

I don't doubt it's CC capability, but it still isn't a "hard" CC, it's a soft CC.

I play him like Ash, using his whole ability set according to the situation, and there are situations where at least 5s invi are helpful. Or are you going to tell me that Smoke Shadow is a Loki Augment?

Efficiency already makes his F*ck the world killer move insanely affordable.

 

its insanely affordable and fast CC.

 

at least five seconds? Blade storm can manage that, only you aren't at risk of AOE damage.. Instantaneous teleportation out of the way can manage making you safe as well, which you can manage with a single second of Smoke Screen. Smoke Shadow is so far outside of his play style that I rarely use it. If I'm going to be sneaking a group somewhere, I'd rather have Ivara, due to her ability to maintain your cloaking at any range.

[(PSN)GR13V4NC3]

This just came to me, but what about doing something like how they are approaching Limbo right now? I think it's a cool fix for his Smoke Screen, the "dash in and out" mechanic. It reminds me of Scorpions dash/teleport ability from MK. This also free's him up to have 4 separate moves on top of the passive smokey-ness (this seems fair to me because of what a basic frame Ash is, meaning he is based off of nothing fancy, just martial arts, no nukes). If it needs a draw back, maybe performing abilities while stealthed would cost more energy? With 4 free slots for abilities, he could have a better shuriken, a better teleport (fully free roam, hopefully), a completely new move and a better (and more appropriate) BS.

Combined with a fine-tuned version of this:

"2nd ability - Invisibility + x-ray vision through walls. In this ability you see all in grayscale, enemy is red and the ally is green. You can kill the enemy only by finisher attack (with finisher animation) and you can teleport through wall only to ally.
This make Ash more different than Loki with 2nd ability"

I would somehow incorporate this into his ultimate or just make it a default feature of Ash's stealth/invisibility mode. Love the idea and on the right track in terms of separating Ash from Loki.

Edited February 18, 2017 by (PS4)GR13V4NC3

[Nazrethim]

3 hours ago, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

This just came to me, but what about doing something like how they are approaching Limbo right now? I think it's a cool fix for his Smoke Screen, the "dash in and out" mechanic. It reminds me of Scorpions dash/teleport ability from MK. This also free's him up to have 4 separate moves on top of the passive smokey-ness (this seems fair to me because of what a basic frame Ash is, meaning he is based off of nothing fancy, just martial arts, no nukes). If it needs a draw back, maybe performing abilities while stealthed would cost more energy? With 4 free slots for abilities, he could have a better shuriken, a better teleport (fully free roam, hopefully), a completely new move and a better (and more appropriate) BS.

Combined with a fine-tuned version of this:

"2nd ability - Invisibility + x-ray vision through walls. In this ability you see all in grayscale, enemy is red and the ally is green. You can kill the enemy only by finisher attack (with finisher animation) and you can teleport through wall only to ally.
This make Ash more different than Loki with 2nd ability"

I would somehow incorporate this into his ultimate or just make it a default feature of Ash's stealth/invisibility mode. Love the idea and on the right track in terms of separating Ash from Loki.

I don't think that kind of mechanic would fly with Ash, at least not in the way you describe it. Smoke Screen is probably the only ability that is fully functional and reliable right now, at best it could use a "create a smoke cloud" thing. Teleport is also fine as it is, it just needs the Teleport-to-object replaced by 'hold to teleport to terrain' or no hold at all, make it teleport to terrain by default and stagger enemies around him, opening them for finishers, fatal teleport just randomly autofinishing the nearest enemy. Shuriken needs to prioritize the target Ash is actually aiming at. And Blade Storm needs to be a stance with old blade storm's crowd kill potential+ more interactivity than "sweep the screen and let the game play itself".

What DE is doing with Limbo is the kind of develoment Ash should have got, but for some F-ing reason he didn't. That's why Limbo is getting a rework, like previous frames, but ash got a "revisit" (not a rework)

Edited February 18, 2017 by Nazrethim

[Neightrix]

Lots of good feedback here and very interesting ideas. I think this is the most crucial point to be made:

Blade Storm is too slow. I have max Energy Overflow and run a full Arcane Energize set with energy pads on tap - I'm not running out of energy under any circumstances. You can change the energy consumption and any number of other numerical factors, but if the execution takes a full second for each enemy then it's not in competition with any strong melee weapon, and too slow for the hordes at high level. How was Blade Storm changed to make it slow?

1.) Ash has to target each enemy individually.

2.) Ash has to attack each enemy individually with the clones only doing follow-ups (previously targets were shared with clones and Ash only did follow-ups on survivors).

I don't think changing or removing the targeting would help much, it would just revert to a very slow version of the old Blade Storm. However, the execution could be changed in a couple different ways, the first being to remove Ash from the attack, and let his clones do all the work. I think this is the better choice, and it would effectively remove the cinematic, which was the stated intent of the Blade Storm rework. The other option would be to only make Ash attack every 4th or 5th enemy targeted by Blade Storm, and leave the rest to the clones. It would still be a cinematic, and it would still be slower than the original Blade Storm, but it might become passable as an offensive ability.

Ash is your space ninja, and I think having his signature ability be both fun and worthwhile would make the game better.

Edited February 19, 2017 by Neightrix

[Nazrethim]

1 hour ago, Neightrix said:

Lots of good feedback here and very interesting ideas. I think this is the most crucial point to be made:

Blade Storm is too slow. I have max Energy Overflow and run a full Arcane Energize set with energy pads on tap - I'm not running out of energy under any circumstances. You can change the energy consumption and any number of other numerical factors, but if the execution takes a full second for each enemy then it's not in competition with any strong melee weapon, and too slow for the hordes at high level. How was Blade Storm changed to make it slow?

1.) Ash has to target each enemy individually.

2.) Ash has to attack each enemy individually with the clones only doing follow-ups (previously targets were shared with clones and Ash only did follow-ups on survivors).

I don't think changing or removing the targeting would help much, it would just revert to a very slow version of the old Blade Storm. However, the execution could be changed in a couple different ways, the first being to remove Ash from the attack, and let his clones do all the work. I think this is the better choice, and it would effectively remove the cinematic, which was the stated intent of the Blade Storm rework. The other option would be to only make Ash attack every 4th or 5th enemy targeted by Blade Storm, and leave the rest to the clones. It would still be a cinematic, and it would still be slower than the original Blade Storm, but it might become passable as an offensive ability.

Ash is your space ninja, and I think having his signature ability be both fun and worthwhile would make the game better.

Or keep the current targeting but make Ash and his clones attack at the same time different enemies until everyone is attacked, like old bladestorm minus being stuck attacking the same invulnerable enemy forever.

[Neightrix]

57 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

Or keep the current targeting but make Ash and his clones attack at the same time different enemies until everyone is attacked, like old bladestorm minus being stuck attacking the same invulnerable enemy forever.

I was hoping that's how the second suggestion would come across, but yes.

[(PSN)GR13V4NC3]

18 hours ago, Nazrethim said:

I don't think that kind of mechanic would fly with Ash, at least not in the way you describe it. Smoke Screen is probably the only ability that is fully functional and reliable right now, at best it could use a "create a smoke cloud" thing. Teleport is also fine as it is, it just needs the Teleport-to-object replaced by 'hold to teleport to terrain' or no hold at all, make it teleport to terrain by default and stagger enemies around him, opening them for finishers, fatal teleport just randomly autofinishing the nearest enemy. Shuriken needs to prioritize the target Ash is actually aiming at. And Blade Storm needs to be a stance with old blade storm's crowd kill potential+ more interactivity than "sweep the screen and let the game play itself".

What DE is doing with Limbo is the kind of develoment Ash should have got, but for some F-ing reason he didn't. That's why Limbo is getting a rework, like previous frames, but ash got a "revisit" (not a rework)

Yea, I see what you are saying and I still like the Stance ultimate as the best replacement for BS. I just saw that limbro rework and it seemed like they were doing it right, finally... plus i can see the dash in and out of SS being good, but I did forget about the staggering cloud and in that respect (i like the bonus of the cc) it won't work. I guess, I already made the best replacement for SS in my thread (you know it, cause you like it).

As far as the other moves (very simply), I think they need these changes):

Shuriken - strike multiple targets, seeking, punch-through.

Smoke Screen - my rework is perfect.

Teleport - again, my rework is the best I've seen, so far.

BS - Other then a "stance" (even though I hate using this word cause people get so hung up on the terminology), I haven't got a clue.

 

I totally agree, DE completely screwed over Ash players with that disaster of a "revisit." Oddly enough, nothing exemplifies this more than the rework to Limbro... you are correct.

Edited February 19, 2017 by (PS4)GR13V4NC3

[Nazrethim]

Just now, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

Yea, I see what you are saying and I still like the Stance ultimate as the best replacement for BS. I just saw that limbro rework and it seemed like they were doing it right, finally... plus i can see the dash in and out of SS being good, but I did forget about the staggering cloud and in that respect (i like the bonus of the cc) it won't work. I guess, I already made the best replacement for SS in my thread (you know it, cause you like it).

Yes, I also got excited about Limbo's rework. DE are doing it right this time. Perhaps in a future update they will come back to Ash for a 'part deux' and finish what they started to make it a true 'rework'

Just now, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

BS - Other then a "stance" (even though I hate using this term cause people get so hung up on the terminology), I haven't got a clue.

It's just the most straight forward problem-solving option, and doesn't require as much work as other, more flashy, rework ideas. Just slap a few claw and sparring moves on a streamlined stance, make it rely more on proper combo use than mindless E-spam and make it trigger small scale old bladestorms on Finisher attacks to wipe small groups of enemies.

Just now, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

I totally agree, DE completely screwed over Ash players with that disaster of a "revisit." Oddly enough, nothing exemplifies this more than the rework to Limbro... you are correct.

They made mistakes, it seems it was a combination of developing Nidus (and focusing on him), TWW development and fixin Specters of the Rail that impaired a proper rework, then the art team got the Koga deluxe skin ready and they rushed the "revisit" to release it alongside the deluxe skin to uphold a promise they made months ago when they first mentioned Ash was going to get a rework instead of DElaying it a few months.

Hope is not lost. I trust DE will do the right thing, in time. Hopefully within this year and not a far flung future.

[(PSN)GR13V4NC3]

6 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

"DElaying"

Brilliant! Simply, genius.

The (biggest) problem I have with the Ash revisit is the complete lack of remorse on the part of DE for their terrible decision and how they wouldn't have made this terrible decision had they even, briefly, taken a look at any of our posts... but they didn't and then to add insult to injury, they just shrugged it off like, "my bad!"

Edited February 19, 2017 by (PS4)GR13V4NC3

[Nazrethim]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

Brilliant! Simply, genius.

I also have another brillant idea for the camera thing.

Some players like the cinematic camera angles, some players don't. Algonside a proper Ash rework, DE could implement a new option in the Gameplay menu:

"Cinematic Finishers"

When toggled 'ON' it would make all finisher attacks, regardless of weapon or frame used, to have the cinematic camera angles Blade Storm has. When toggled 'OFF' all finishers play like current melee finishers work, without cinematic camera (Blade Storm stance would also be affected).

I think it would please both sides, what do you think?

[(PSN)GR13V4NC3]

2 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

I also have another brillant idea for the camera thing.

Some players like the cinematic camera angles, some players don't. Algonside a proper Ash rework, DE could implement a new option in the Gameplay menu:

"Cinematic Finishers"

When toggled 'ON' it would make all finisher attacks, regardless of weapon or frame used, to have the cinematic camera angles Blade Storm has. When toggled 'OFF' all finishers play like current melee finishers work, without cinematic camera (Blade Storm stance would also be affected).

I think it would please both sides, what do you think?

I like finishers for the damage but I hate them because of how slow actual animations are, not to mention how they always ruin stealth kill runs because you end up bumping into another enemy while taking out your intended target and there's nothing you can do about it. I would like it if BS gave you the finisher damage on strikes but left you mobile and quick.

Something like this, just with wrist blades...

 

[Nazrethim]

6 minutes ago, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

I like finishers for the damage but I hate them because of how slow actual animations are, not to mention how they always ruin stealth kill runs because you end up bumping into another enemy while taking out your intended target and there's nothing you can do about it. I would like it if BS gave you the finisher damage on strikes but left you mobile and quick.

Something like this, just with wrist blades...

Or we could get a general "chain finisher" similar to multikills in PoP:T2T, So if you stealth finish an enemy who is in a group a minigame starts where, if you succeed, you Finish all enemies and presumably get a full stealth buff. Or go by the Blade Storm stance I've been proposing for months that allow Ash to finish with wristblades groups of enemies at the same time without breaking counter.

[(PSN)GR13V4NC3]

20 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

Or we could get a general "chain finisher" similar to multikills in PoP:T2T, So if you stealth finish an enemy who is in a group a minigame starts where, if you succeed, you Finish all enemies and presumably get a full stealth buff. Or go by the Blade Storm stance I've been proposing for months that allow Ash to finish with wristblades groups of enemies at the same time without breaking counter.

POP:T2T?

I like your idea of a multiple target-hitting BS and that is what I want, I just want it to function like how you saw in the Zohan video and be actively controlled. So you'd activate it (either by itself or with a target lined up) and if you have a target in sight, it will teleport you to it and begin the first attack (which would just be the player smashing E, after activation, with the aiming reticule placed on different enemies in range), simultaneously (if no enemy in sight it just remains activated). If there are enemies in tight groups, you'd be able to strike them like the Zohan and jump to new enemies/enemy groups within range and keep doing this until you run out of energy or cancel the ability. You could also lock down enemy groups by keeping them engaged in combat with you/clones and by bringing more into your fold, but up to a max limit (maybe effected by range/strength).

TLDR: I just want to be able to do what Zohan does in the video (actively), but to many more enemies/enemy groups in a single sitting. As far as damage multipliers and what not, whatever he has now seems sufficient.

Edited February 19, 2017 by (PS4)GR13V4NC3

[Nazrethim]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

POP:T2T?

Like that, but applied to all melee finishers, not just blade storm.

2 minutes ago, (PS4)GR13V4NC3 said:

I like your idea of a multiple target-hitting BS and that is what I want, I just want it to function like how you saw in the Zohan video and be actively controlled. So you'd activate it (either by itself or with a target lined up) and if you have a target in sight, it will teleport you to it and begin the first attack (which would just be the player smashing E, after activation, with the aiming reticule placed on different enemies in range), simultaneously (if no enemy in sight it just remains activated). If there are enemies in tight groups, you'd be able to strike them like the Zohan and jump to new enemies/enemy groups within range and keep doing this until you run out of energy or cancel the ability. You could also lock down enemy groups by keeping them engaged in combat with you/clones and by bringing more into your fold, but up to a max limit (maybe effected by range/strength).

TLDR: I just want to be able to do what Zohan does in the video (actively), but to many more enemies/enemy groups in a single sitting. As far as damage multipliers and what not, whatever he has now seems sufficient.

I would like that too. In fact it could get challenging by making it a 3 key system. For each attack you get a promt to push a key, the first is always 'E' but the following can be random of 'R' 'E' or 'Spacebar' or whatever. If you fail, the finisher spree stops.

 

 

 

 

[(PSN)GR13V4NC3]

1 hour ago, Nazrethim said:

I would like that too. In fact it could get challenging by making it a 3 key system. For each attack you get a promt to push a key, the first is always 'E' but the following can be random of 'R' 'E' or 'Spacebar' or whatever. If you fail, the finisher spree stops.

How it could be made better is by adding in clones (though it takes away from some of the activeness of the ability). For every 3 enemies engaged you get one clone which can be left attacking that specific enemy or enemy group and Ash can be free to go and find others to rope in (either by running or free teleport if currently engaged in attacking). It's basically the same as the default BS except you have to work harder to engage the same amount of enemies...

Oddly enough, as I was writing that, it seemed to make less and less practical sense. The hard part to get over about the original BS was how easy/fast it was to target and attack enemies. That speed and efficiency is where the difficulty in creating a new or even augmented ability vs. the old, comes into play.

That is why I came up with the Valkyr Hysteria Stance version of BS, or the reverse version, rather. So, unlike Valkitty, Ash's surrounding circle indicator begins small but grows with every kill. With every 5 meter growth, Ash gains a clone ally (up to a max of 4 clones). These clones will perform a mini BS (or more accurately, perform the grineer manic version) on all surrounding targets (up to a certain distance). The clones' attack distance is directly connected (some % of it) to the size of ash's circle indicator (I'd say he has a range cap of 40 meters, maybe less depending on testing). Ash's circle indicator will be constantly shrinking (how fast will be determined through DE and play-testing), so it pays for him to be in the middle of the fight. Not only this, but activating BS (stance) will increase his movement/attack speed (with all weapons) and dodge chance. Ash would not be limited to only melee attacks in the new BS but would gain the greatest range boost from melee kills. Combine this with my new versions of SS and Teleport (the Smoke Dash/Dash Strike) and Ash is the fast/agile/deadly, ambush predator that he is meant to be.

Visually: it would look like Ash has a trail of 4 shadows (just like a shinobi, ninjitsu-looking power), which would be colored by your chosen energy tint and as each clone is released, it jumps out of its place in line behind ash and starts attacking foes. if the circle shrinks and the clone returns, you will see it add back to the shadow chain. Like this:

I guess, technically, you'd refer to it as Seishinteki kyōyō – spiritual refinement? I'm not sure.

Edited February 19, 2017 by (PS4)GR13V4NC3

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

On 1/14/2017 at 9:50 AM, Nazrethim said:

 

As an Ash main that likes the Bladestorm rework, I approve this message for more attention to his Shuriken/Teleport/Passive.