Duralumin Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 (edited) I didn't know there was a shortage. It doesn't matter if there's a shortage or not. You have Mastery Points that people who started playing after the closed beta will never get. Anything stronger than the Braton at this point is pretty much OP. Which seems to be what people are trying to make the Brandal. Edited July 13, 2013 by Duralumin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volt_Cruelerz Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 (edited) So? It's not like it makes a real difference. I have more mastery than you more because I've been playing longer, not because I have an exclusive weapon. If the Brandal didn't exist, I'd have just spent that time on another weapon. Your argument is moot unless your goal is to set the record for mastery points, but I don't think that's the goal of the game. Edited July 13, 2013 by Volt_Cruelerz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duralumin Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 So? It's not like it makes a real difference. I have more mastery than you more because I've been playing longer, not because I have an exclusive weapon. If the Brandal didn't exist, I'd have just spent that time on another weapon. Your argument is moot unless your goal is to set the record for mastery points, but I don't think that's the goal of the game. As more weapons are added, more weapons are going to require a higher mastery level. Having the Brandal gives you an edge in mastery points over those who don't, same way that those who have the Vandaltron and Snipetron will have an edge in mastery points over those who don't. Currently the end-game is nothing but grinding. The more unique weapons you have, the further you'll be able to grind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nirnad Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 The Brandal is NO abonnement for the best Braton! First it should be en par or better then the Braton and now with the Prime? People are getting very greedy... And I remember players clinging on the description of the Brandal (higher damage ...), now do the same with the term "Prime" Prime should be best. End of discussion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volt_Cruelerz Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 As more weapons are added, more weapons are going to require a higher mastery level. Having the Brandal gives you an edge in mastery points over those who don't, same way that those who have the Vandaltron and Snipetron will have an edge in mastery points over those who don't. Currently the en stop even thinking about that argumentd-The more unique weapons you have, the further you'll be able to grind. So you mean to tell me that because I was on vacation and didn't get the Vandaltron, that I've been horribly gimped in my ability to get mastery. it makes no difference. I'll hit rank X when I get around to it. One weapon plus or minus won't make that difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrokinNoob Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 The Braton Vandal was exclusive to the Closed Beta players, who deserved to keep thos weapons exclusive. The game will continue to progress, so some older weapons may just be left behind. Should Braton Vandal have a scaled comparison to how the Braton changes, yes. But if the standard braton doesn't change, I don't see why Braton Vandal should be changed. Considering the differences, Braton Vandal is quite like a "prime" version of the Braton. As I see it, Braton Prime should out rank both of these weapons in terms of stats and polarity. Not a huge fan of the look of it, seem more like a Burston prime to me lol, but I'm gonna grind till i get it. Somewhat hate I forma my braton 4 times now though lol. http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Braton_Prime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othergrunty Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 (edited) Well i stand to the theory that Prime weapons are new updates created via recovered Orokin technology and not "original" versions of weapons. As for the Braton. The Snipetron is now explained to be a Lanka modificated by Grineer to fire bullets (perhaps being a railgun using the energy acceleration part of the barrel). Perhaps the Braton has a similar origin. We see Lotus symbols in Corpus bases. It's likely the Lotus and Corpus are officialy trading with each other. Maybe the Braton was commisioned by the Lotus, to have a stable reliable basic assault rifle or submachine gun to equip the the Tenno with in the absence of a similar Tenno weapon. So the Corpus created a bullet firing weapon for them. First they produced the Braton MK1. Which was okay but did not meet the standards of experinced Tenno. So they modificated it into the regular Braton. Meanwhile the Lotus are sitting on a large stockpile of Mk1s so they give it to any new Tenno as place holder until they have regained enough experience. The Braton Vandal was a further modification of the regular Braton, made by the Lotus to be handed out to the first re-awakend Tenno aka. Beta players (similar to how the Snipetron Vandal was now awarded to Tenno who showed more initiative). The Prime lastly is a prototype rifle designed by the Lotus to make the best out of recovered Orokin tech. Edited July 13, 2013 by Othergrunty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volt_Cruelerz Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 The devs have come out and said that Primes are the originals, you know that right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eruend Posted July 13, 2013 Share Posted July 13, 2013 Prime = 1 1 = first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Namacyst Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 (edited) Here are some things people without the Braton Vandal should think about when bringing up those pseudo-facts and faulty arguments about why the Braton Vandal should be kept as bad as possible because they can't get the Braton Vandal anymore so it should be bad for all those who got it: Braton Vandal being exclusive has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal giving 3000 Mastery XP not everyone can get has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal being not a prime Weapon and therefor inferior instead of being an exclusive on par equivalent has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal not being in your posession and thinking that any changes to it will affect you in any way has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal being sold via 1 credit in the Market so it was easier for DE to distribute it to everyone that was entitled during the 3 days open beta weekend does not lower the worth or deserved power of the gun and has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal not directly stating that it is an upgrade to the normal Braton (and ignoring the fact that it was released back then with 4 base damage more than the normal Braton) has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal deserves a buff of 4-5 base damage to be superior to the Braton and on par with the Braton Prime (which it would still be even with +5 damage because of lower fire rate, clip size and i bet other stats). Period. End of discussion... NOW we can end this discussion -.- P.s.: That's my opinion, no flame, no insult so.. Live with it! Edited July 14, 2013 by Namacyst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newtype Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 Here are some things people without the Braton Vandal should think about when bringing up those pseudo-facts and faulty arguments about why the Braton Vandal should be kept as bad as possible because they can't get the Braton Vandal anymore so it should be bad for all those who got it: Braton Vandal being exclusive has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal giving 3000 Mastery XP not everyone can get has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal being not a prime Weapon and therefor inferior instead of being an exclusive on par equivalent has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal not being in your posession and thinking that any changes to it will affect you in any way has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal being sold via 1 credit in the Market so it was easier for DE to distribute it to everyone that was entitled during the 3 days open beta weekend does not lower the worth or deserved power of the gun and has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal not directly stating that it is an upgrade to the normal Braton (and ignoring the fact that it was released back then with 4 base damage more than the normal Braton) has nothing to do with why it should not be buffed. If you think that and use it as an argument then you do that because of your own jealousy or need to grief about the fact that you can't get that gun... otherwise you would not care a bit or be pro Vandal buff. Braton Vandal deserves a buff of 4-5 base damage to be superior to the Braton and on par with the Braton Prime (which it would still be even with +5 damage because of lower fire rate, clip size and i bet other stats). Period. NOW we can end this discussion -.- P.s.: That's my opinion, no flame, no insult so.. Live with it! One more time,why would it need to be on par with the Braton Prime? You argue that it needs a buff Braton Vandal's text decription states that it has higher damage and Accuracy but lower RoF yet ignore the fact that it was just a special version of the Standard Braton. I do also think my points have foundation as this is what was stated on Brandal's text description which you also kept on using on the other thread(Braton Vandal Balancing Suggestion). With this all being said, please do correct me if you find something that state that Braton Vandal should be better than the Standard Braton like what I found and I posted on the first page. I somehow think its getting pointless to discuss this with you since it looks like if something doesn't go your way you'll just bring out your "you're just jealous" argument. I also would say that I'm not the one being unreasonable here that's why I will urge you to think about it, is it that we're jealous? or you just don't want to get out of your "I'm so special" chair. Again my ideas are simple to stop complaints and they are: Make Vandal weapons as a sidegrade or maybe have its DPS 3-5% greater than the standard ones but NOT on par with Prime weapons. Prime Weapons should be the upgrade version of the said weapons. I would agree to nerf the Snipertron Vandal to make it inline with the Vandal Weapon Class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archangelzz Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 Seriously. Bronco? I want bolto prime! Furis prime! Lex Prime! Even sicarus prime! Tho I'll still use the bronco I like the regular one OK =P and bolto prime is unnecessary, we got acrid. But Furis prime would be fun. you do realize that only tenno weapons can be prime weapons right grinner corpus weapons can not be turned into prime weapons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volt_Cruelerz Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 Namacyst, please explain why it should be on par with the prime. euetype, I'm inclined to disagree about the Vandaltron since snipers in this game hardly have a niche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newtype Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 Namacyst, please explain why it should be on par with the prime. euetype, I'm inclined to disagree about the Vandaltron since snipers in this game hardly have a niche. I'm actually okay on how Vandaltron is right now, I just mentioned that I'm okay for it to be nerfed so that the "Vandal" type weapons are all inline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonicbullitt Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 I'm actually okay on how Vandaltron is right now, I just mentioned that I'm okay for it to be nerfed so that the "Vandal" type weapons are all inline. That does not make sense. Why nerf 2 weapons just to make it inline with one ? Sounds like bullS#&$ to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niryco Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 (edited) Braton prime has been datamined for those who don't know. 25 damage(better), 10 rate of fire(worse), 2.37s reload(no diff), 50 clip(better) and no special polarities(no diff). The accuracy stat has been defined yet so overall it makes it a sort of a side-grade for now if accuracy stays the same or is reduced. Edited July 14, 2013 by Jacate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vashramire Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 There is no reason for the Vandal to be on par with a Prime. It's not a Prime, nothing compares to a Prime. At the most if it were to get buffed, it should be in the middle of the standard and Prime. I for one don't believe it needs a buff. I'm not all emo that my "special" gun is getting outclassed by others that are supposed to. I also use it as my main weapon. Just because it was the best Braton hands down at one time doesn't mean they ever intended for it to be even close to a Prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoctah Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 I loooove my braton vandal, but I don't think it would make much sense that it should be stronger than the Prime version. Slightly stronger than the normal braton? Absolutely! Stronger than the Prime? Actually, it shouldn't even be on the same tier as the prime. Vandal should be between the prime and the regular braton, that's a good place for it imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newtype Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 That does not make sense. Why nerf 2 weapons just to make it inline with one ? Sounds like bullS#&$ to me I'm confused, if read it more clearly we just need to nerf the Snidal, I repeat the Snipertron Vandal so that the Vandal Description would be consistent. AFAIK as it stands right now Lato Vandal is a side grade and has more or less 3-5% more DPS than Lato Braton Vandal at the moment is UP compared to the Standard Braton- I'm recommending a buff here so that it would be on par with the Braton Snipertron Vandal is more powerful than Vulkar and Snipertron- I'm not saying we nerf it, I'm just saying I'm okay nerfing it so that they would be consistent with the Vandal's being a sidegrade. Again, the last part could go either way, Buff the Vulkar and Snipertron or nerf the Snipertron so that this would eliminate the "But Snipertron Vandal is an upgrade for its counterparts so other Vandal weapons should be an upgrade" confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Namacyst Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 Namacyst, please explain why it should be on par with the prime. With on par i mean a viable alternative... meaning if i can choose between Vandal or Prime Braton because both are available to me i can go with either one without having to think about which gun is better. Vandal and Prime are both Special weapons.. one because of it's exclusivity and the other because of the effort and difficulty to obtain it. the normal Braton is a generic second grade starter gun.. the Braton Vandal is not. Vandal was released as a direct upgrade with superior stats and it still would be an upgrade on the level where the prime is now if the jealous mob had not cryed nerf and DE complied. Nerfing the Braton Vandal was a mistake without reason behind it and the Braton Vandal is the only Vandal gun that sticks out of the Vandal group because it is so bad compared to it's normal counterpart. I'm fine bringing the Braton Vandal back where it was when it was released meaning +4 base damage and a little more accuracy.. superior to the normal Braton, inferior to the Prime weapon. I like the Braton.. i want to use the Braton but i can't use the Braton Vandal because it is bad and even if it gets buffed to where the normal Braton is i can't use it because the Braton Prime is better. Braton Prime is intended as a huge upgrade for the normal Braton but it should be only a small upgrade to the Braton Vandal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newtype Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 With on par i mean a viable alternative... meaning if i can choose between Vandal or Prime Braton because both are available to me i can go with either one without having to think about which gun is better. Vandal and Prime are both Special weapons.. one because of it's exclusivity and the other because of the effort and difficulty to obtain it. the normal Braton is a generic second grade starter gun.. the Braton Vandal is not. Vandal was released as a direct upgrade with superior stats and it still would be an upgrade on the level where the prime is now if the jealous mob had not cryed nerf and DE complied. Nerfing the Braton Vandal was a mistake without reason behind it and the Braton Vandal is the only Vandal gun that sticks out of the Vandal group because it is so bad compared to it's normal counterpart. I'm fine bringing the Braton Vandal back where it was when it was released meaning +4 base damage and a little more accuracy.. superior to the normal Braton, inferior to the Prime weapon. I like the Braton.. i want to use the Braton but i can't use the Braton Vandal because it is bad and even if it gets buffed to where the normal Braton is i can't use it because the Braton Prime is better. Braton Prime is intended as a huge upgrade for the normal Braton but it should be only a small upgrade to the Braton Vandal. So I was right that you just want to be a "Special Cookie" and you just want your OP weapon back? I read Jacate's post on the other thread and there you'll find one probable reason why they nerfed it and I think it has something to do with power creep. If you really want to to be one of the highest tier weapon at the moment then I think it should become obtainable in game. You choose, make it a sidegrade and keep its exclusivity or make it what you want but let it obtainable in game. P.S. I'm still waiting for your proof that Braton Vandal was supposed to be an upgrade compared to the Standard Braton. AFAIK Special =/= Upgrade/Better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinydunsparce Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 Just for the main bp you have to get a 7% chance from the t3 void mission which you have to get from a 3/5 chance from a 2% drop from a normal defense mission. HAVE FUN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyfe3rX Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 (edited) Twin Viper Prime nuff said ! Edited July 14, 2013 by Zyfe3rX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newtype Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 (edited) Congrats Zyfe3rX, How long did it take you? Also will any T3 Void mission work or should it be the new ones? Thanks, Edited July 14, 2013 by Neuetype Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsubasakuroi Posted July 14, 2013 Author Share Posted July 14, 2013 Also will any T3 Void mission work or should it be the new ones? New ones. Extermination and Raid are worthless if you're going after the new Primes https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0Au6mBXle3cFtdHBYUzVJaDJfdkIzSEN1cUh5UlRvckE&f=true&noheader=true&gid=17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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