Fixing XP farms

[Shockwave-]

Draco was a problem. DE has said so and they nerfed it. But that just moved the same problem to other new nodes and it always will - effectively ruining said node for all other players.

In Draco one could hop on to Draco and be yelled at by other players for doing the actual mission (capping towers).  You could publicly join a game only to have some members of the group having a different objective than the other half of the group. This is poor game design. The missions are small enough and there are enough nodes that in most cases a the goal of the mission should be the same for all tenno. You might be after a different actual reward (different relic for instance) but the goal of the mission should be the same.

This is true in say, a Spy mission. At no time does one join a spy mission and suddenly find out that one member of the team is trying to succeed at only 1 spy vault for some reason - and trying to keep the team from succeeding at all 3. At no time does one join a capture mission where people don't want to capture the target (or at least extremely rarely).

But in XP farming nodes like Draco you had exactly that. And it continues to new nodes today with people farming xp over the goals of the given node (whatever that be). In addition people are incentivized to join a high level node with all level 0 gear because shared affinity will level up their gear for them even if they can't handle the node with that equipment.

So why not commit to incentivizing a single goal in each mission, in this case Rotation C? For spy that is 3 vaults, for cache missions that is finding 3 caches. For Endless that is 20 waves or 20 minutes. Take all of the exp gained from shared XP (from fellow tenno, and possibly from mission objectives like spy vaults) and award that affinity in a lump sum at Rotation C.

This will:

1) align the goals of the mission to Rotation C, you may not make it, but it becomes the shared goal of everyone joining the mission.

2) make it harder to join high level nodes with all level 0 gear. You will need to make it alive to rotation C alive (dead/inactive players shoudl get no xp reward just like they get no rotation reward). You can have people raise you of course, but if they don't and you are dead 4 times by wave 20, you don't get most of your xp.

3) slow down pure xp farming as, if your item hits level 30 at wave 10 because of shared xp, you have to stay to wave 20 to get that xp - DE has seemed to suggest they prefer xp to be gained through actual weapon use not shared xp with non use, so this should align with DE's preference. You have to use the weapon to level it up OR level it a bit more slowly through shared xp.

4) make xp gain a byproduct of playing missions for their other goals, not a goal in and of itself. The Lotus is sending us on these missions to say "defend the cryopod as long as you can", it's seems odd to reply to the Lotus "sorry got my weapon to max at wave 5, the dude can fend for himself).

 

If DE wants to provide an xp farming node there should be one, where the rotation rewards only give out xp in bundles like endo. This would also align THAT node's mission goals to a single mission so people going there are all on the same page..

If DE wants to incentives endless for "as long as possible" i'm ok with that to, with a fissure like increasing reward system, but currently it all resets essentially at Rot C, so that seems to be the best place to dump the xp on everyone and start another set of Rot C.

Edited July 25, 2017 by Shockwave-

[(PSN)horridhal]

There is really very little wrong with exp farm nodes.  They provide a quick way for veterans to forma and re-level gear and provide decent rewards.  If you don't want to play them they are fairly easy to avoid, and the issues you are talking about only crop up on the meta farming nodes and, really, only apply to Interception as a game mode.

I am strongly opposed to any implementation of the idea you presented on those grounds and, also, because it would negatively impact every other node in the game and force players to stay beyond what they want to.

Edited July 25, 2017 by (PS4)horridhal

[JazaJ]

You want to fix exp farm? Remove ranking up weapons/frames/companions again after forma'ing.

Edited July 25, 2017 by JazaJ

[Shockwave-]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)horridhal said:

There is really very little wrong with exp farm nodes.  They provide a quick way for veterans to forma and re-level gear and provide decent rewards.  If you don't want to play them they are fairly easy to avoid, and the issues you are talking about only crop up on the meta farming nodes and, really, only apply to Interception as a game mode.

I am strongly opposed to any implementation of the idea you presented on those grounds and, also, because it would negatively impact every other node in the game and force players to stay beyond what they want to.

It doesn't "force" anything. It incentivizes, and only with the XP that you didn't' earn yourself but was given to you by other players. xp you earn by using your weapons is always yours to keep.

[(PSN)horridhal]

4 minutes ago, Shockwave- said:

It doesn't "force" anything.

Uh, yeah, it does.  You are saying "Either play to Rotation C or get no shared affinity" which is you forcing something.

4 minutes ago, Shockwave- said:

It incentivizes, and only with the XP that you didn't' earn yourself but was given to you by other players

So if I run Trinity with an EV build and provide limitless energy to my squad who all use Nuking abilities to clear the map, I don't deserve that affinity because I want to leave at wave 5 or 10?  You are ignoring key things about the game to try and make a pedestal point about how unfair you think it is that other players level their equipment on specific nodes by making use of the affinity system.

4 minutes ago, Shockwave- said:

xp you earn by using your weapons is always yours to keep.

Which changes nothing about what I said or my initial point or lack of support for your idea.  Its poorly thought out, ignores entire aspects of supporting, and is effectively you saying "I don't think people should be able to level up weapons passively".  I disagree.  Strongly.  After you have put your 100th Forma in, the whole grind of releveling gets old.  

Edited July 25, 2017 by (PS4)horridhal

[Shockwave-]

Just now, (PS4)horridhal said:

You are ignoring key things about the game to try and make a pedestal point about how unfair you think it is that other players level their equipment on specific nodes by making use of the affinity system.

But they are playing the node improperly and ruining for players playing the node properly. and yes, i'm choosing the word properly on purpose.

DE nerfed Viver, and then they nerfed Draco. Clearly they don't think jumping into a node, leeching a bunch of XP and leaving after a wave or two is the proper way to play the node or they wouldn't have nerfed Viver and then Draco - but they did. Keeping the xp bonus xp to Rot C aligns with what they have been saying when Nerfing Draco, and Nerfing Viver - that afk farming xp and easy xp farming on the "loot cave" nodes ruins the node for other players and isn't what they had in mind.

It seems like the goal should be to have all players playing X node for the rewards it gives and getting XP on the WAY to that goal (again DE's preference, which I agree with) and this would help DE align the incentives to that goal, without having to keep playing whack-a-mole with xp farming nodes, as they have been doing.

[(PSN)horridhal]

24 minutes ago, Shockwave- said:

But they are playing the node improperly and ruining for players playing the node properly. and yes, i'm choosing the word properly on purpose.

The only improper thing demonstrated is the idea that you, specifically, are able to dictate what is and isn't proper gameplay to the rest of the community.  You aren't.  It's your OPINION that they should stay to rotation C but, in a PuG, you get what you get.  Things shouldn't be altered to make your PuGging experience more enjoyable when you have the option to create a squad to play the way you want.

24 minutes ago, Shockwave- said:

DE nerfed Viver, and then they nerfed Draco. Clearly they don't think jumping into a node, leeching a bunch of XP and leaving after a wave or two is the proper way to play the node or they wouldn't have nerfed Viver and then Draco - but they did.

Those nodes weren't just nerfed for being the Meta for affinity farm, they were nerfed because they provided such a MASSIVE boon over every other node in the star-chart when it came to farming and because people were running nothing but those nodes.  The same can't be said of the affinity nodes used today.

24 minutes ago, Shockwave- said:

Keeping the xp bonus xp to Rot C aligns with what they have been saying when Nerfing Draco, and Nerfing Vive

No, it doesn't.  It is simply you attempting to proclaim your attempts at limiting the way other people play falls in line with DE's intentions when, realistically, that isn't even close to accurate.  At no point has DE ever pushed anyone into staying for rotation C on any mission.  Ever.

24 minutes ago, Shockwave- said:

It seems like the goal should be to have all players playing X node for the rewards it gives and getting XP on the WAY to that goal

That's your opinion, not reality.  Please stop presenting your OPINIONS as anything other than opinions.  DE doesn't support your request in the way you are claiming so, again, please stop trying to make that claim.  It ruins your argument.

Edited July 25, 2017 by (PS4)horridhal

[motorfirebox]

I always went to rotation C on Draco anyway. That's where they put the good relics (back then it was keys, but still). I don't think this will put much of a dent in Draco-style farming.