I'm done with fishing and PoE

[Guest]

Let's start with what's good: the actual spear chuckin mechanics aren't bad, and are a lot more interesting than most fishing games that require you to simply wait for a bobble to twitch and then click on it.  Spear chuckin is skill based, has a low skill floor, a decent skill cap and you get to move around a bit while doing it.  The only down sides to it is that you can't chuck your spear while aim gliding, and it's a bit buggy on dash wires.  It can be kinda fun if you get into a solid flow with steady spawns. 

Core mechanics aside, the rest of the fishing system is atrocious, namely it's connections to cetus rep and crafting for everything in PoE and the horrible RNG that is rare fish spawning and bait.  This isn't world of warcraft or skyrim, and it's DEFINITELY not Bass Pro 9000.  You clearly didn't consult an economist for the design of this horrible horrible system.  End game progression crafting in a looter shooter about space ninjas should not require absurd amounts of time and energy to be put into fishing, especially when that fishing is a total gamble of said time and energy.  The balance of the economy is abysmal, while the bugs make it even worse.

Those are fish that have swam through the terrain and are floating around under a mountain.  This happens everywhere, and it means that they're totally uncatchable.

When you guys announced fishing for PoE, I said "please don't make me fish"...  you said "don't worry you won't HAVE to fish".  I thought "oh good, it'll be like wyrmius or flappy zephyr - fun little pass times for bored people."  But no, I was a freakin idiot to assume you weren't lying.  You based the entire expansion around fishing and the endless slog of a grind that it is.  Every part of this system is designed to waste as much time as possible from multiple levels of required baits that are non-reusable, cost huge amounts of rep, and have abysmally low success rates, to requiring said mats for every arbitrary thing in the whole damn expansion, requiring 3 different spears for all the kinds of fish (you increase the gear wheel size and it's literally nothing but spears now), and all while having very meager daily rep gain caps.  Even partnered content creators who play literally 10 hours a day are finding this system to be utterly intolerable and disrespectful of their time and energy.  If I wanted to get the parts required to make the items I want, I'd have to spend years doing nothing but fishing whenever I log in to warframe.  You made an amazing boss fight that's challenging, fun, and rewards players for skillful play.  But, the real end game fight is against the freakin fishing system and the mountain of RNG and syndicate grinding that it entails.  You can't make any of the new end game gear without fishing.

With literally everything of interest to me locked behind this horrible, grindy, buggy garbage, there is absolutely no reason for me to go to PoE at all.  If I can't get amps, new arcanes, or zaws without fish guts, then there's no reason for me to bother with the teralyst, mining, bounties, or anything else that can be done on the plains. 

You could even argue that it extends to focus.  Since I've already got the basic passives that actually affect my warframes, and I know I'm never going to be getting any arcanes or amps for my operator, then what's the point of farming any amount of focus to upgrade my emo space baby?  I don't need eidolon shards for unbindings.  I don't need the extra 140 DAYS worth of max focus farming, just to have the way capacity for unbinds.  I don't need any of the extra focus stuff, because my operator is just gonna remain crap and I'll get by just fine in the rest of the game with a crap mote amp, without having spent a year of my life fishing.

Don't get me wrong, I really like this game, and your art and sound guys did a great job on PoE (sans caves).  But this fish economy design is objectively bad and is a terrible system to throw at all these new players you're trying to bring in.  It's daunting, and completely different from the rest of the game (except Kuva, which is another black hole of despair that we won't talk about).

Edited October 17, 2017 by Guest

[SoloTango]

UGH! I'm stopping my download right now. I'm tired of reading about how badly they've screwed the pooch with PoE. I was so excited for PoE and couldn't wait to come back but that excitement is gone before even playing. Maybe they'll have it all sorted in a few months. Maybe, a big maybe.

[RacerDelux]

@SoloTango POE is actually really good. There is just a small and very vocal subset of the player base that does not like it. When he said you "Have to fish" He means you will have to spend an hour or so getting fish.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

@SoloTango POE is actually really good. There is just a small and very vocal subset of the player base that does not like it. When he said you "Have to fish" He means you will have to spend an hour or so getting fish.

An hour or so getting fish will net you enough common fish to make bait to then try to get uncommon fish.  A couple hours fishing for uncommon fish will get you some materials to make bait for rare fish.  A couple hours fishing for rare fish may get you one or two of the components you need for whatever you want to make, if you're lucky, since you can go through 20 baits and not get a single spawn.  Never mind the possibility of MISSING any fish that does happen to spawn for you.  Then there's the fact that every time you want to make bait, you have to spend an absurd amount of rep just to buy a single-use blueprint. 

Edited October 17, 2017 by Guest

[RacerDelux]

Eh... took me an hour to get fish for archwing launcher and for bait.

[Yetman]

It has been said before, but yeah, they took they concept of side activities other games do for fun with fishing and mining and slapped the good ol' Warframe grind formula making them the primary basis of every crafting objective of the update. Maybe with some considerable number changes it could work, but as of now, it's the Ricefields of Eidolon.

[phoenix1992]

It is not nearly as bad as stated in the OP, outside of the part that 'fishing is not mandatory".

Yes they are mandatory for most (if not all) goals you may want to pursue in PoE.
Fishing materials also are not up for trading and don't drop from bounties (as of the current moment, as of my knowledge, this may and most likely will change).

[Sennera]

You need parts from the rare fish (ones that can take hours to spawn) to craft the new Operator weapons. I stayed up late last night trying to catch some, but after a couple hours I never saw a single one of the rare fishies I needed.

I don't know how fish guts are involved in the process, but apparently they're super important to make those weapons work.

Edited October 17, 2017 by Sennera

[Mudfam]

100% agree. I am completely disgusted by the fishing. The fishing itself isn't bad, as a sort of side mini game, but it get extremely boring and tedious very quickly.

The game is trying to force me spend hours of my precious time doing something I don't enjoy in the slightest, dumping hard earned standing into it that just goes *poof* into horrendous RNG and bugs.

 

11 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

When he said you "Have to fish" He means you will have to spend an hour or so getting fish.

Oh, if only! Maybe you've been blessed by the RNG gods or haven't gotten to the completely unreasonable grind for rare fish yet. I've spent who knows how many hours fishing and standing on non resuable blueprints for bait to get nothing but sore eyes. I can't even find confirmation that these fish actually exist. Frustration and rage levels: a gazillion.

[RacerDelux]

Just now, Mudfam said:

Oh, if only! Maybe you've been blessed by the RNG gods or haven't gotten to the completely unreasonable grind for rare fish yet. I've spent who knows how many hours fishing and standing on non resuable blueprints for bait to get nothing but sore eyes. I can't even find confirmation that these fish actually exist. Frustration and rage levels: a gazillion.

There are things that could be better. Blueprint for bait should not be one time use. They could maybe up the spawn timers on rarer fish. But this is ONLY if you want to do things like upgrade the AMP. You can enjoy the rest of the game (and update) without fishing. Hell, I have killed quite a few eidolons so far, and I have not upgraded my AMP once.

[Mudfam]

9 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

Eh... took me an hour to get fish for archwing launcher and for bait.

That explains it. That's incredibly easy to do. Try catching one of the rare fish, if they even exist. And btw the bait costs 7k standing for a non reusable blueprint and doesn't even work! It's beyond absurd, I don't even know how to describe it.

[RacerDelux]

2 minutes ago, Mudfam said:

That explains it. That's incredibly easy to do. Try catching one of the rare fish, if they even exist. And btw the bait costs 7k standing for a non reusable blueprint and doesn't even work! It's beyond absurd, I don't even know how to describe it.

Perhaps just stop fishing until they change it/fix it, as they probably will. I hear there are many things you can do apart from fishing.

[Sennera]

1 minute ago, RacerDelux said:

Perhaps just stop fishing until they change it/fix it, as they probably will. I hear there are many things you can do apart from fishing.

This is a feedback forum. They're providing feedback to point out the issues with fishing, they're not complaining just for the sake of complaining.

[Stanelis]

19 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

@SoloTango POE is actually really good. There is just a small and very vocal subset of the player base that does not like it. When he said you "Have to fish" He means you will have to spend an hour or so getting fish.

As a new player who just completed the war within I actually do agree with the OP. I'm not playing warframe to fish and do not intend to partake in this content. Whoever though it was a good idea to make fishing mandatory clearly doesn't understand what make players play warframe. 

Especially when said fishing is required for archwings charges (and that doesn't make any sens no matter how you look at it) and focus related content. 

[Mudfam]

3 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

There are things that could be better. Blueprint for bait should not be one time use. They could maybe up the spawn timers on rarer fish. But this is ONLY if you want to do things like upgrade the AMP. You can enjoy the rest of the game (and update) without fishing. Hell, I have killed quite a few eidolons so far, and I have not upgraded my AMP once.

Sorry, what..? Basically everything there is to get in PoE is locked behind an unsurmountable fishing wall. What else is there in PoE reward wise? Why should I bother killing eidolons for standing when the rewards that gives me access to are things that are built with fish parts. Lol.

Sorry, but you're really making not making sense here. I'm not going to play if I'm not going to get anything for my efforts.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

There are things that could be better. Blueprint for bait should not be one time use. They could maybe up the spawn timers on rarer fish. But this is ONLY if you want to do things like upgrade the AMP. You can enjoy the rest of the game (and update) without fishing. Hell, I have killed quite a few eidolons so far, and I have not upgraded my AMP once.

You do realize there is absolutely no reason to kill the teralyst except to upgrade your amp and to build the new arcanes, right?  There is ZERO reward from it apart from that.  Fishing is also needed for everything in Nok's anvil.  So, unless all you want to do is run around aimlessly killing whoever you run into in PoE, you're not going to get much out of the expansion without fishing..  Even gara requires fishing materials to craft.

[RacerDelux]

2 minutes ago, Sennera said:

This is a feedback forum. They're providing feedback to point out the issues with fishing, they're not complaining just for the sake of complaining.

I understand that. Sadly the way the OP presented his "feedback" had the NEXT reply with somebody that decided to forgo Warframe due to the negativity of this post, as well as many of the others I have seen. Many of which blow some of the issues out of proportion.

Feedback is good, and I encourage it, but present it in a format that does not make other potential players not even give the update a try.

[Sennera]

5 minutes ago, Stanelis said:

As a new player who just completed the war within I actually do agree with the OP. I'm not playing warframe to fish and do not intend to partake in this content. Whoever though it was a good idea to make fishing mandatory clearly doesn't understand what make players play warframe. 

Especially when said fishing is required for archwings charges (and that doesn't make any sens no matter how you look at it) and focus related content. 

I agree with this statement. I prefer spending hours playing Warframe actually fighting and stuff.

If I want to spend hours fishing, I'd play that fishing MMO that came out not too long ago. Let me KILL STUFF in Warframe WITHOUT making me spend HOURS trying to catch one stupidly rare fish.

 

Whoever came up with this fishing stuff is probably the person that came up with Tamagachi Kubrows and THANK GOD they made incubator upgrades to effectively eliminate that 'engaging content'.

Edited October 17, 2017 by Sennera

[phoenix1992]

2 minutes ago, TheDefenestrater said:

You do realize there is absolutely no reason to kill the teralyst except to upgrade your amp and to build the new arcanes, right?  There is ZERO reward from it apart from that.  Fishing is also needed for everything in Nok's anvil.  So, unless all you want to do is run around aimlessly killing whoever you run into in PoE, you're not going to get much out of the expansion without fishing..  Even gara requires fishing materials to craft.

Even if you want to skip on Nok, all cosmetics require fishing as well.

[RacerDelux]

So it seems the primary feedback I am seeing here is that many of the fish needed for crafting are too rare, and they need to be (much) more common. That would be some feedback DE could work with.

Would that fix the issue for most of you?
(along with fishing rods actually being pure upgrades, and bait blueprints being reusable)

Edited October 17, 2017 by RacerDelux

[Marvelous_A]

And you'd think who in the earth would fish for an hour just for a consumable item...than there came the archwing launcher which required 150 fish oil....1-5-0. Even after patch which now cost you 50 it's still unreasonably high amount considering it's consumable and it goes real fast coz you easily get knocked out of AW and you use one every time you mount again. Which is PLAIN STUPID.

[RacerDelux]

3 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

And you'd think who in the earth would fish for an hour just for a consumable item...than there came the archwing launcher which required 150 fish oil....1-5-0. Even after patch which now cost you 50 it's still unreasonably high amount considering it's consumable and it goes real fast coz you easily get knocked out of AW and you use one every time you mount again. Which is PLAIN STUPID.

Oh shoot, I did not even see that in the patch notes. I can stop fishing for my next batch of launchers now XD. Also nice pun.

Edited October 17, 2017 by RacerDelux

[Stanelis]

2 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

So it seems the primary feedback I am seeing here is that many of the fish needed for crafting are too rare, and they need to be (much) more common. That would be some feedback DE could work with.

Would that fix the issue for most of you?
(along with fishing rods actually being pure upgrades, and bait blueprints being reusable)

No my issue is that the fishing is mandatory and that I don't want to partake in that in a game which is about shooting space ninjas. 

Scanning was already tedious but it did somewhat make sense. Fishing doesn't no matter how you look at it. If you like it then it's fine but why in the seven hell would you make it required for totally unrelated stuff ? 

[RacerDelux]

1 minute ago, Stanelis said:

No my issue is that the fishing is mandatory and that I don't want to partake in that in a game which is about shooting space ninjas. 

Scanning was already tedious but it did somewhat make sense. Fishing doesn't no matter how you look at it. If you like it then it's fine but why in the seven hell would you make it required for totally unrelated stuff ? 

Perhaps they can add in rewards to some high level content that would give you the materials needed. That way if you want to pew pew for the upgrades, you can.
(it would probably be just as grindy, but not require fishing)

Edited October 17, 2017 by RacerDelux

[phoenix1992]

18 minutes ago, RacerDelux said:

So it seems the primary feedback I am seeing here is that many of the fish needed for crafting are too rare, and they need to be (much) more common. That would be some feedback DE could work with.

Would that fix the issue for most of you?
(along with fishing rods actually being pure upgrades, and bait blueprints being reusable)

I can't speak for anyone but me.
One of the main issues with fishing (outside of bugs) is that consumables come from Blueprints that are *one time use only*. So I have to burn ludicrous amount of reputation each time I decide to deal with serious fishing.

Edited October 17, 2017 by phoenix1992