Slide Attack/Maiming Strike/Whip and Polearm range -- an absurd mixture of overpoweredness

[(PSN)BLOOD-LINE-01]

18 minutes ago, rune_me said:

Actually everyone has the right to do that. You are, of course, free to ignore me of I do that.

The point is, you glorify people who literally just want to ruin someone elses day by saying “they’re not a deafestist”. Being stubborn and not admitting you’re wrong, when you clearly are, is not a position that warrents glory and admiration, more like disdain. We’ve already established how your view of defeat is flimsy at best and can be interpreted as offensive at worst.

When people offer solutions like, “go solo” it is not a deafestist attitude. It is just one of the many solutions available that the OP is outright ignoring. Someone who is trying to push and push for others to do what they want so they can feel good, should not be glorified for “not being a defeatist”. That is the sort of attitude we see with Social Justice.

Edited March 28, 2018 by (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01

[rune_me]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01 said:

The point is, you glorify people who literally just want to ruin someone elses day by saying “they’re not a deafestist”. Being stubborn and not admitting you’re wrong, when you clearly are, is not a position that warrents glory and admiration, more like disdain. We’ve already established how your view of defeat is flimsy at best and can be interpreted as offensive.

No, the point is, you villify people who literally just want to improve the game they’re playing, by claiming they are trying to ruin your day.

Get over yourself. No one cares enough about your day to try and ruin it. Like everyone else against the nerf thus far, you think you are far more important than you really are. We are not all out to get you, so you can all stop playing the poor, set upon victims.

As for being perceived as offensive, I apologized. But that was 15 pages ago. Things have, erh, escalated since this. In the past two pages alone, I’ve been called pathetic, a kid, an elitist a-hole, not to mention being accused of trying to ruin other peoples day. I think we are all far beyond the point of caring how offensive we come off.

[Kinjeto]

58 minutes ago, rune_me said:

If you think something is wrong in the world, you should work to change it, not look for ways to avoid the problem.

Ember proved that getting things changed in the game is possible (we can always argue if the changes had the desired effect). Sure all the people calling for a nerf to Ember could have just played solo, but instead they confronted what they considered a problem, and the affected real change. 

Yeah and the Ember nerf was the worst decision I've ever seen. It's been through what? 1 re-work in 2015. It didn't address the core heat damage proc scaling issue. It didn't address the heat proc damage issue either. At a fundamental level, the change basically demonstrated that the people being listened to are the ones that do baseless appeals to emotive "well I want it nerfed, because it's effecting my play-style" which in game design circles is a terrible way to do changes.

And MOST important of all, It didn't value add anything to Ember as a core Warframe. That's the problem with a lot of players these days. They don't ask for anything to be value-added to the Warframe system. You talk about defeatist this and defeatist that. When value adding and making changes so the frame has more substance.

Like I said before the vibe I keep getting...
"Oh this community is great and wonderful."
But when it comes to something that inflicts on supposed quasi- muh playstyle jeez some the people in this forum.

 

[(PSN)BLOOD-LINE-01]

9 minutes ago, rune_me said:

No, the point is, you villify people who literally just want to improve the game they’re playing, by claiming they are trying to ruin your day.

I do not vilify anyone who wishes to truly improve the game, or any game for that matter. I only go against those who wish to improve their game experience solely and using flimsy "Everyone disagrees with me, therefore I am right" logic. We've already talked about how this is not how real life works. 

I honestly don't know why you act like I'm unjustly disrespecting the OP when all you have to do is look at how he talks to people he doesn't agree with to see that's not the case. He is very egotistical, unlikable and acts like the world should revolve around him, it does not. This post shows how much he really thinks of everyone overall gaming experience:

6 hours ago, Vindicus8235 said:

No string of characters that you can type will make <thread title> stop ruining games for me.  My feedback on the matter shall flow until Warframe shuts down, I move to another game or slide attack spam is fixed.  It's really that simple.

i.e; "I'm not listening to anyone. Me me me me me me me me."

11 minutes ago, rune_me said:

Get over yourself. No one cares enough about your day to try and ruin it.

The reasons why this thread and others like it exist is stark evidence to the contrary.

12 minutes ago, rune_me said:

you think you are far more important than you really are.

No, I do not. I never claimed myself to be of higher standing than anyone here. That's the very reason I'm arguing against the OP, who does think he is somehow above everyone else. 

13 minutes ago, rune_me said:

As for being perceived as offensive, I apologized.

Apologies mean nothing if you don't stop. 

17 minutes ago, rune_me said:

Things have, erh, escalated since this.

I can tell, since you appear very aggressive towards me now, even though I haven't done anything, and before we were having quite an enjoyable calm conversation.

19 minutes ago, rune_me said:

I’ve been called pathetic, a kid, an elitist a-hole, not to mention being accused of trying to ruin other peoples day

I haven't called you that. 

20 minutes ago, rune_me said:

I think we are all far beyond the point of caring how offensive we come off.

I am not. I'm doing my best to remain respectful everyone here, except the OP who has just been an outright troll to anyone not on his side. I was never trying to be aggressive to you, nor will I start doing that. 

[(PSN)BOSS_TPH76]

1 hour ago, rune_me said:

If you think something is wrong in the world, you should work to change it, not look for ways to avoid the problem.

Ember proved that getting things changed in the game is possible (we can always argue if the changes had the desired effect). Sure all the people calling for a nerf to Ember could have just played solo, but instead they confronted what they considered a problem, and the affected real change. 

They really didn't affect a real change except for Ember being less viable for higher level tiers. Ember still nukes entire levels and the problem they wanted changed still exists. 

Ember is a perfect example of how "working for change" based on subjective emotions instead of comprehending the complexity of issues and thinking further than your own self centered feelings is not change for the better. Simply crying for nerfs doesn't in fact make games, as you claim you want, "more balanced" or "better". 

This is a concept you repeatedly fail to comprehend.

[(PSN)BOSS_TPH76]

3 hours ago, rune_me said:

Removing one option does not equal “take away any options”. If you think that without the mod, you are somehow out of options, removing it should be a very positive change for you, as it will show you all the other options you have been dismissing so far. Hell, we are calling on this nerf for your sake now.

 Opinions about a mod will never be fact. Your opinions about maiming strike are no more or less facts than mine. I think the mod is OP. You don’t. That’s all there is to it. All your fancy words and random insults won’t change that. It’s just your words against mine.

Argument you are ready to accept. Jeez. The world does not revolve round you. What on earth makes you think you have to “accept” my or anyones arguments? The rest of us don’t need your acceptance, my friend. You are a random stranger on the internet. No one will loose any sleep over you not accepting their arguments. 

It’s called General Discussion. It is not for off topic. Oh wait, was that a fact or just my feelings? Do you accept my argument here?

No one is dictating how you play the game. Play the game however you want, that’s your right. If I run into you in a game, you will not here any complaints from me about how you play the game. That’s a promise.

Destiny 2 is the result of people whining about their feelings? I haven’t played it, but that sounds an awful lot like something that isn’t fact and just, you know, your feelings about the game presented as fact. But considering your previous posts, you obviously would never do that, right?

The word "any" is used to refer to one or some of a thing or number of things, no matter how much or how many.  So no. When you argue to get a combination nerfed or move set removed people can not use that move set or combination of mods (which is more than 1 of a thing) anymore. 

When you demand such a nerf then you should have very good reasons that go beyond the personal level of "I do not like it" because otherwise you are effectively making your own subjective perception of what constitutes good game play as well as your own enjoyment more important than that of others. Effectively you are trying to force others to conform to your vision purely based on subjective and emotive arguments which are not a reality for the experience of others. What that means is that you are saying "my opinion" is worth more than yours and your doesn't deserve to be in the game 

This is the very, very, very simple concept you...from the very start...took umbrage with. It is in the very first post your reacted to. 

This very same attitude is why Destiny 2 (partially) turned out as bland and uninteresting as it did. People were complaining about just about everything they did not like and subjectively thought was OP...running to the forums to demand nerfs. Creating a vocal minority. It never ever worked in favor of the game because it lacked any form of complex and intelligent thought and real understanding of the issues. 

This is what I was telling you in my first reply to you. Your idea of balance is based on your subjective emotions. You think the game will get better because it does for you personally....not because of the game itself. It ignores all the other people who do not think and feel like it will be an improvement and, by now, you have certainly made it abundantly clear that you do not give a rats ass about what other people think. Just as long as you get your way. So your arguments never rise above your own limited experiences. 

You are not interested in a general discussion, off topic or otherwise, or exchange of ideas...at all...all you care about is that your personal subjective feelings get a hug from DE.
 

[Vindicus8235]

1 hour ago, (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01 said:

i.e; "I'm not listening to anyone. Me me me me me me me me."

Is that really what you take away from that quote?  Allow me to simplify it for you:

No string of characters you type will make my 3rd degree burn stop burning.  You can tell me countless times that it's all in my head, I'm imagining it, that the pain is merely a construct of my mind.  Now you start demanding evidence that my burn is painful to me, because let's assume you're a hardcore masochist and absolutely love pain.  You can not understand how I can not enjoy pain when you revel in it.  Any of this making sense to you?

Some things can't be cured by word salad.

[(XBOX)Madinogi]

14 hours ago, (PS4)dA_BLoK_iS_hOt said:

Yea take a little snip but disregard all the other valid points I made. Real clever.

its what these people do. they dont have the skills necessary to hold a intelligent debate. when they are beat down by facts and reason they nit pick your argument and focus on one point because they are to afraid to address the other points made. or they strawman. i deal with the same crap in politics. when you make a very strong and convincing argument. your opponent will normally straw man you or focus on just 1 point out of say 6 or 10 points. im going to be breaking down his reply to me once i finish the last few pages. currently on Page 17 at the time of making this reply. 

[(PSN)BLOOD-LINE-01]

1 minute ago, Vindicus8235 said:

-snip-

Again, all I hear is "Me me me me" and complete arrogance/wilful ignorance. "Word salad" Seriously guys don't bother with this person, they're beyond ridiculous.

[(XBOX)Madinogi]

13 hours ago, rune_me said:

And once again, I think we can all agree, if you start your post with a petty insult, everything that follows it will obviously be ignored. 

You’re too sensitive, my friend. I get that my opinions hurt your feelings and make you lash out in anger. But really, you should try not to let your emotions do your arguing for you.

hes too sensitive? not his or my fault you have a thin skin rune. if you take offence to being called out then maybe you should get off the forums. seriously if you cant ignore the insult and instead focus on the points being made, then you really REALLY need to grow a thicker skin and stop being the sensitive one. ive been called names countless times in a myriad of topics in both gaming and politics. guess what? im not a thin skinned coward who ignores ones argument because he got name called. 

 

and apparently your the one who gets your feeling hurt over being called out onw hat you are. so whos the one whos sensitive again? if you arent going to partake in a discussion rune. do all of us a favour and stay out of it and let the adults talk. if you really take offence to being called out on your BS then you really shouldn't be here.

[Vindicus8235]

12 minutes ago, (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01 said:

Again, all I hear is "Me me me me" and complete arrogance/wilful ignorance. "Word salad" Seriously guys don't bother with this person, they're beyond ridiculous.

Proof that you can't reason with the unreasonable.

[(PSN)BLOOD-LINE-01]

Just now, Vindicus8235 said:

Proof that you can't reason with the unreasonable.

Coming from someone who has repeatedly dismissed valid opposing arguments and collectively boiled them all to "word salad". But of course, a person with no integrity can't actually admit their hypocrisy. Reasoning is a concept lost on you.

 

[Vindicus8235]

1 minute ago, (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01 said:

Coming from someone who has repeatedly dismissed valid opposing arguments and collectively boiled them all to "word salad". But of course, a person with no integrity can't actually admit their hypocrisy. Reasoning is a concept lost on you.

 

So explain to me where my reasoning went wrong regarding the 3rd degree burn scenario so that I may better understand it.

[(PSN)BLOOD-LINE-01]

Just now, Vindicus8235 said:

So explain to me where my reasoning went wrong regarding the 3rd degree burn scenario so that I may better understand it.

You went wrong because the 3rd degree burn scenario only involves you, not the grand majority of the community. 

[Vindicus8235]

Just now, (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01 said:

You went wrong because the 3rd degree burn scenario only involves you, not the grand majority of the community. 

I guess I'm still not understanding, perhaps that's a failure on my part.

If the majority of the community tells me that burning is not painful, but that it is in fact pleasurable, that's when I should accept it?

[Voltage]

19 minutes ago, Vindicus8235 said:

Proof that you can't reason with the unreasonable.

How is this player being unreasonable? This matter of Maiming Strike is a matter of perspective. Console players have very valid arguments and you essentially throw their feedback out the window because it doesn't affect you personally.

I am going to use some statistics here. It is by no means for bashing or shaming, just pure context. I have 3000+ hours playtime in this game and I have achieved maximum mastery rank (25) twice. You have 300 hours at mastery rank 17. 

I am by no means stating you are a worse player, so please don't take it this way. Mastery Rank doesn't mean much, but the hours reflect where you are coming from. I understand that really good setups can be annoying for other players who want to contribute, but it is impossible to construct a discussion about this thread and refuse other players' perspectives. My perspective as a PC player with 3k hours is that the mod is not that bad compared to many other setups in the past (Greedy Mag trivializing survival/interception for example).

If you want something positive to come out of discussion, you have to respect everyone's opinion and not look at this thread on whether it affects you or not, but the general game.

Efficient players are the true problem you have, not Maiming Strike. It may be hard to see since every efficient player uses this mod currently, but you would definitely be annoyed by different setups that wipe rooms.

Please stay on topic instead of devolving this thread into useless bashing. People will take your concerns more seriously.

[(PSN)BLOOD-LINE-01]

11 minutes ago, Vindicus8235 said:

If the majority of the community tells me that burning is not painful, but that it is in fact pleasurable, that's when I should accept it?

You accept the fact that DE go with the majority who are in favour of Maiming Strike and that you can't make people play the way you want them too. You don't have to like it. There are things I dislike in this game, but I acknowledge that someone out there likes it and they have the same rights as I do. 

One man's trash, is another mans treasure.

Edited March 28, 2018 by (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01

[(PSN)BLOOD-LINE-01]

23 minutes ago, --Q--Voltage said:

Efficient players are the true problem you have, not Maiming Strike.

This is what people have been saying since the beginning of the thread. A good/experienced player can make anything look overpowered if you are relatively new to the game.

[Sqecmi]

3 часа назад, Kinjeto сказал:

Yeah and the Ember nerf was the worst decision I've ever seen.

 

i suppose the puprpose of ember nerf was to make it active frame

so current duration build works almost same way, except you cant go afk for 10 mi same way as banshee did. you cant still use for cc, but also in active control mode, not toggle-and-forget.

Edited March 28, 2018 by Sqecmi

[Vindicus8235]

 

13 minutes ago, (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01 said:

You accept the fact that DE go with the majority who are in favour of Maiming Strike and that you can't make people play the way you want them too. You don't have to like it. There are small things I dislike in this game, but I acknowledge that someone out there likes it and they have the same rights as I do. 

One man's trash, is another mans treasure.

There's no fact I've ever seen regarding DE siding with the majority; and this is presupposing that those in favor of slide attack spam in its current state are actually the majority.  I can't "make" people do anything in Warframe, DE can though, so I should appeal to them and so should you when wanting change in the game.  You are correct that I don't have to like it, and I'm exercising my right to say that I don't, as you exercise yours to say you do.  Someone out there also likes to murder people, and they have the same rights as you, but you are not obligated to accept their position that murder is good.

I'm fine with another man treasuring mountains of coke cans, but when they're my neighbor and their coke cans are overflowing into my yard, it'd be quite reasonable to expect me to file a complaint with the city.

[(XBOX)Madinogi]

11 hours ago, Vindicus8235 said:

That you lack the capacity when perusing the thread to see that, once again, ALL of this has been addressed ad nauseam is not my problem to solve.

Everything posted is feedback, not a truth claim.  Full stop.  Fin.  El Endo. (Spanish for "The End").

I'll accept your challenge, though, for funsies.

"Asking for arguments not founded in "it is a problem just because we say so" or "it is a problem because I don't like it""

Complete misrepresentation.  Just because you hear "blah, blah, wah, wah, sniffle, sniffle" when I or someone else has described the negative impact of <thread title> on our gameplay experience doesn't make it any less valid.  It only makes it less valid to you.

The rest of your post gets the snip because it's more hullabaloo about subjectivity and objectivity that you feel you're entitled to some kind of proof that <thread title> is a negative force in the game.  See: feedback, opinion

Where is your objective evidence that <thread title> is perfectly fine?  You can provide no such thing because it doesn't exist, the same as objective evidence that it is not perfectly fine doesn't exist.  How many times must I define things such as feedback, opinion, truth, subjectivity and objectivity before you will understand it?  Dictionary time is over.

Vin. we have repeatedly told you. it is not a problem for anyone but you. its only a negative impact on you because YOU let it be by going into public games where it happens. instead of trying to force your will onto other who clearly do not want it. instead sit back and think long and hard as to what you could do to actually solve the problem without ruining other players fun of the game? he even said on PC its more of a macro problem anyway for them a MS problem. 

also i have taken the luxery of going back to Page 1 to screencap of one of your most arrogant posts in this thread. and even included at the top a picture of the link so people know for a fact this is the same thread. because i have learned damn well to start screen capping stuff as proof for people to see. as ive learned that people cant be really deceptive by going back and editing or removing comments of things that expose someone in a fear of being wrong. 

Link

this comment alone should show everyone they should not take you seriously when you act that arrogant. your comment there boils down to. 

"so many of you are opposed to me so i must be right and the combo must be broken" instead of using your brain to think "hmm. maybe they have a point. and im in the wrong here" your comment hat showed me one thing. You never intended to go into this conversation with the intent to have an intellectual debate. you only came in here to whine and moan and gain support from like minded people. 

and there you go again. dodging your oppositions points instead of tackling them. really shows the kind of person we are dealing with here. 

 

and the amount of ignorance on your part is astounding Vindicus.

"The rest of your post gets the snip because it's more hullabaloo about subjectivity and objectivity that you feel you're entitled to some kind of proof that <thread title> is a negative force in the game.  See: feedback, opinion

Where is your objective evidence that <thread title> is perfectly fine?  You can provide no such thing because it doesn't exist, the same as objective evidence that it is not perfectly fine doesn't exist.  How many times must I define things such as feedback, opinion, truth, subjectivity and objectivity before you will understand it?  Dictionary time is over."

actually Dictionary time is not over infact heres a little dictionary schooling for you,

we are not the ones making the claim of something. thus it is not on our side of the court to provide proof. the ball is in your court Vin thus you must be the one to provide proof for your points its this little inconvenient thing we call "burden of proof"

"Burden of proof can define the duty placed upon a party to prove or disprove a disputed fact, or it can define which party bears this burden. In criminal cases, theburden of proof is placed on the prosecution, who must demonstrate that the defendant is guilty before a jury may convict him or her."

in this case you making the claim that MS is broken and needs to be fixed needs to back the claim up with substantial evidence to prove your point. what you are doing. right now is a fallacy calling Shifting the burden of proof. by placing the burden on proof on those who didn't make the claim in an attempt to spare you of humility. that Bull crap i do not tolerate. and WILL call it out. 

[Sqecmi]

27 минут назад, (PS4)BLOOD-LINE-01 сказал:

You accept the fact that DE go with the majority who are in favour of Maiming Strike and that you can't make people play the way you want them too. You don't have to like it. There are things I dislike in this game, but I acknowledge that someone out there likes it and they have the same rights as I do. 

One man's trash, is another mans treasure.

the main achievment and (i suppose) intention of maiming strike is to make most melees playable, not only top 1 in their types of atterax, galatine, venka, hirudo, prisma dual cleavers and orthos prime.

Edited March 28, 2018 by Sqecmi

[MasterChef5311]

In a game like Warframe, you CANNOT, make EVERYONE, happy, or even in any game, its impossible, there will always be people who dislike something enough to make a post.

[AcidicGhost]

On 3/26/2018 at 7:21 PM, Vindicus8235 said:

My statement stands, and your lack of understanding stands, still.

I see your one of those types of people who likes to look down on and belittle others but can't admit they are wrong. 

That you also want to dictate how other people play because you don't like feeling impotent is hilarious. 

 

[Voltage]

9 minutes ago, Vindicus8235 said:

I'm dictating nothing and it's not within my power to do so even if I wanted to.  Boundaries are set for a reason.  Just because some people want to drive 150 mph on the freeway doesn't mean they should be able to, and it has nothing to do with my car only being able to go 80 mph.

I didn't know that driving 150 mph on the freeway while endangering other people and yourself is comparable to a game that harms no one and is for entertainment. Also, you forgot to mention Warframe allows you to choose not to play with the "reckless guy going 150 mph". 

I guess I better watch out, or a police officer might pull me over for ruining his fun when I was speeding.

Edited March 28, 2018 by --Q--Voltage