Sick To Death Of Rushers - Can We Have A Kick Or Block Function Please?

[RogueDestiny]

i also find it annoying when you go to boss missions for bp's and resources that don't drop anywhere else, and then you get some guy who tries to farm resources you can get in abundance in a game mode that supports his needs like ENDLESS DEFENSE....endlessly dropping mods and resources at your hearts content....and as far as credits............................................i can't believe credits can be an issue for some people in this game....you only use it for 2 things, fusing mods, and buying bp's/equip from the market - in which a few t3 void runs can easily support............EASILY.

 

problem i see here is, for the most part, it's low tier players going to maps they don't belong in, expecting high tier players to hold their hand while they play how they want to play

 

i think because each map has a level range of mobs - you should only be allowed to enter that map if your current loadout you have equipped is suited for the task - like there should be a ranking system for load outs that tell how viable that load out is in the map they are in

 

example:

player 1

player with rank 30 gear - no potatoes no formas

going to say fight on a t3 map, would show a red light, warning him that his loadout is weak for the mobs he will be encountering

 

player 2

player with rank 30 gear - potatoed and polarized gear

going to fight on a t3 map, would show a yellow or green light, reminding him that his loadout is viable for the mobs he will be encountering, depending on how enhanced the player's gear is

 

i don't have a problem with rushing where rushing needs be

rushing around the map on defense is another story

 

if you are in a game mode that doesn't support your playstyle, or nobody wants to carry you though....you shouldnt be playing that game mode....it is that easy.

you need rare resources or rare boss drops, that is for you to work your way up to, not for the world to cater to you, and hold your hand so you can leech your way up

[TisEric]

When it comes to farming for blueprints for Warframe parts, I can understand the rushing. You have to run the same mission a plethora of times and, after awhile, mods and resources be damned in lieu of getting that one last part; at least that seems to be the general consensus. But... what irks me is when you run normal missions and people are flying through there like their asses are on fire; Volt's spamming their speed at whim and others are just literally flinging themselves through it.

 

What I find funny, is that the main defense is, "But I'm GRINDING, man!" Did you ever stop to consider that if you'd take a little bit of time to open containers and lockers, you may not need to grind and farm so much? I opened a container, on the way to fight the boss for an Orokin cell. Guess what popped out and fell right on my head? Yup... Orokin cell. So I got two for my extra two seconds of "trouble."

 

Now I'm not advocating that every mission should take 30 minutes with excruciating attention to every single locker and/or container, but if you slowed down just a little, you will probably find that you don't need to farm as much. I know I only need to farm for the occasional control module and orokin cell, so the game seems a lot less grindy to me than it does to others. Specific mods is where my sticking point is.

 

Moreover, these "rushers" are the same people complaining about being bored. We were given an entire new system and 12 hours later, people were already complaining because they burned through it. You've got no one to blame but yourselves. I joined randoms for the first planet and was forced to run through that mission so fast I missed 80% of the new content. Finally, a friend of mine logged on out of sympathy to run it with me so we could explore a little bit. Sure I could have run it by myself, but when there is no one there to share the enjoyment of a secret room or a particular find, I don't find that fun at all. And as a graphic designer, I can say with certainty that what you take for granted in a blur, is hours and hours of work.

 

The "rushers" are always fond of flaming the explorers and telling them to run solo, but if you're going to just blast through enemies, run for your life without any care about your fellow teammates' wellbeing or situation, then why don't YOU run solo? Rushing ahead of everyone is not team play. It's not co-op. It's pure selfishness guided by your personal desire to get X and Y while some of your teammates may need resources and/or mods as well.

 

At the end of the day, it's not about who is right or wrong, it's about different play styles. I would give anything if DE would make two modes you could toggle before running a mission. That way, if you're going after a blueprint and decide to ignore the loot, you have that option. However, if you want to run a mission a bit slower, explore and get the loot, you could.

 

 

you seem to be losing track of the irony in your own post there man.

rushers don't complain about turtle guys aka explorers which is a wrong term - you cant explore something you already know by heart >_>.

rushers ... which is also a wrong term for most of the people who like to play fast.

complain about how xps and turtles think they have some superiority or power  over how we get to play this game , how their play style of walking like a sac of potatoes getting shot and not keeping up with the rest of the group is somehow the correct way to play this game.

 

and furthermore the main "defense"  we fast paced players employ is "to each their own" .

you say "rushers suck , play solo or gtfo" we say  the same back to you.

that's how play styles work. stop being biased towards your own play style.

 

this is a co op game, if you choose to play in a public game you take the responsibility of playing with people  you don't know who play how they like.

they should not play the way you like and vise verse , but , its a common courtesy to play in the style that fits the group. 

so if the 3 people you paired up with in a RANDOM game want to go fast , you go fast.

they want to take things slower , you slow down.

 

there is no "me" there is "us" .

 

 

 

 

now as for the main argument you guys have.

stop complaining about issues you create for yourselves.

 

you don't want to deal with pug games , join a clan , play solo , play with friends .

those are your easy , already implemented solutions .

if you choose to ignore them that's your won damn fault , don't come to the forums venting because you cant handle pug games.

 

 

 

and one last time ,

 

rushing = ignoring every single thing and going for objective.

fast paced games = going as fast as you can killing and what not, same thing only you know how to move fast.

turtling= refusing to move fast with the team , stubborn way to play.

exploring = opening up containers and looking for stashes / secrets .

 

 

people you meet in most games are just people who move fast, you cant keep up and call them rushers. 

learn to move faster yourself  or stop complaining about it on forums because you had a bad couple of pug games.

Edited August 14, 2013 by TisEric

[fatpig84]

No need for vote kick.

Just an ignore will do fine.

 

 

Personally I don't care about Rushers or explorers.

I pace the game to team dynamics but if my frost (the frame which I am leveling now) is out running your frames, maybe you should consider picking up  the pace instead.

[KriLL3]

Problem is that at some stage 400-500h+ into the game almost nothing you gain from killing enemies and exploring have any value to players, at some point all you care about is mission completion reward or similar, good example is the recent corpus void missions, nothing there has any value to me at all except the points you get from capturing scouts and getting to the exit, the enemies especially at first were pushovers, I had 15+ keys and I wanted to chew through them as fast as possible to get the points as fast as possible, I invited people specifically saying it was rush only, and I still got plenty of players that couldn't find their shift key, and though it was an extermination mission from the way they chased every minor enemy down.

 

The problem isn't that one group is playing the game wrong, the problem is that different players need different things, and like to play in different ways, at some level DE needs to balance Warframe in such a way a MR11 and MR2 can play together without either considering the other a liability and a waste of time, but it's not an easy task to achieve.

 

The game does need vote to kick to to get rid of abusive/afk players, if someone picks up the datamass and then hides bellow the stairs or similar or a nova/rhino is spawn-camping the enemies on a mobile defense depriving everyone else of XP we need a way to deal with that.

Edited August 14, 2013 by KriLL3

[fatpig84]

Again a working black list would be better.

Deal with the dbag once, never deal with him again.

 

I would hate to see Warframe degenerate into a game where people VOTE kick others for inane reasons like, "he stole my kills !"

[Taranis49]

Problem is that at some stage 400-500h+ into the game almost nothing you gain from killing enemies and exploring have any value to players, at some point all you care about is mission completion reward or similar, good example is the recent corpus void missions, nothing there has any value to me at all except the points you get from capturing scouts and getting to the exit, the enemies especially at first were pushovers, I had 15+ keys and I wanted to chew through them as fast as possible to get the points as fast as possible, I invited people specifically saying it was rush only, and I still got plenty of players that couldn't find their shift key, and though it was an extermination mission from the way they chased every minor enemy down.

 

The problem isn't that one group is playing the game wrong, the problem is that different players need different things, and like to play in different ways, at some level DE needs to balance Warframe in such a way a MR11 and MR2 can play together without either considering the other a liability and a waste of time, but it's not an easy task to achieve.

 

The game does need vote to kick to to get rid of abusive/afk players, if someone picks up the datamass and then hides bellow the stairs or similar or a nova/rhino is spawn-camping the enemies on a mobile defense depriving everyone else of XP we need a way to deal with that.

 

This.

 

I do both, rushing and exploring - it's dependant upon the mission type and what I want/need. The event missions? I rushed for the most part, since all I needed from those were points. In the case of Nightmare missions? Likewise, I'm there for the mod awarded for completion. Ditto for assassination missions and BPs. By contrast, when running void, I'll take my sweet time and check every nook, cranny for boxes to break open, since they have a chance to drop mods there. Likewise if I need resources (which I don't at the moment) while running another mission type (simply because defense farming gets tedious).

[DirkDeadeye]

What's there left for me to explore..I've beaten these tilesets so many times.

 

You might even call me a rusher. I just kill stuff really fast and break containers and run over them on my way through the map.

[KriLL3]

While I agree "vote to kick" isn't ideal, warframe is way too large for a black list to be an effective solution, you can't black-list thousands of players. And it doesn't solve the immediate problem of a player causing problems on purpose or not, and while that player might be bugging out this mission and thus should be kicked, the next he might have no issues at all and is very helpful.

[PeaceOfMind]

DE already mentioned the ability to identify as a rusher or as a looter so jesus calm down

mentioned it where?

[PeaceOfMind]

.......check your key bindings. typically, its the tab key.........and if you want to kick? buy/make a kogake. try troubleshooting something before you publicly make yourself look like a whiny bozo.

Tab is not bound to anything by default and thanks for feeling the need to include personal insults in your response. Reported.  Enjoy.

Edited August 14, 2013 by PeaceOfMind

[DirkDeadeye]

Scott has actively stated in the livestreams that they don't like the rushing through the content and ignoring 99% of it.  You're just wrong.

 

I've already seen the content, about a thousand times. Kind of bored of it. Kind of got good at exploiting it to do it faster.

 

If they don't like it, they should find ways to incentiveize us to slow down. Rather than punish us for being more efficient at grinding endless missions. 

[PeaceOfMind]

I completely understand why some players want to rush and that is their choice.  What I am talking about is an option to allow players to avoid rushers if they wish to do so.  Sometimes I rush too only I have the common courtesy to rush with a team of people who also want to rush that particular mission. I I don't blunder into other peoples missions and ruin their game.

[PeaceOfMind]

(or they could find a like-minded group so they don't /ruin/ public matches)

I agree with this point and that is what I tend to do.  The only issue is that there are not always friends available to form these groups all the time.

[Stonnes]

If you aren't ready for people to play how they're going to play stop going into randoms and get a clan dude. People complain about people being too fast and too slow ect and the developers I'm sure would rather be addressing actual gameplay issues. 

[birdei]

why does rushers keep telling "slow" players to go solo when you know they go play solo. Rushers hardly rarely will kill anything so whats the point of having teammates then.

I personally play in the middle, I kill and loot things on the way to the objective. I don't take any side tracks or anything. This ensures, I get a decent amount of exp and loot.

[DirkDeadeye]

why does rushers keep telling "slow" players to go solo when you know they go play solo. Rushers hardly rarely will kill anything so whats the point of having teammates then. I personally play in the middle, I kill and loot things on the way to the objective. I don't take any side tracks or anything. This ensures, I get a decent amount of exp and loot.

 

I kill a ton of things. I just dont stop moving..

[Demiplume]

Those players that play like snails are so annoying. Its impossible to play online and not get coupled with these idiots! They rather play slow, beat a wave only to get stuck against more and more waves. Its beyond me why they dont understand rushing is the way to play. Rushing doesnt mean killing nothing, you can rush and shoot things... BUT MOVE. Its about optimizing your time... The faster you beat a map, the faster you can move on.

 

Seriously, please add a kick option to kick those slug teenage mutant ninja turtle kids. Its $&*&*#(%&.

 

( Just so you can understand your whining can go both ways OP ).

[Shackram]

Started playing again after not touching the game for a very long while, the majority of rushers i've meet aggroed a large group of enemies 3 tiles ahead, got pinned and promptly killed by them. Stopped trying to rescue them after the third time.

 

 

I'm not a proponent of rushing missions.  However, this statement has two different flavors of foolishness in it.  First, no one is entitled to control how other players play, provided they are not behaving in a manner that violates the EULA.  Second, I don't care what the game developer envisions for how I'll choose to use his product.  I'll play the game any damn way I want....provided I so in a manner that doesn't violate the EULA.

 

Said EULA will have a clause saying that DE can change the game as they see fit, meaning they are free to change things to make you play the way they want.

[shr0ud]

I actually do play solo when I want to rush, because whenever I play with a rush team I always feel like I'm too slow for the rest of them even though I try to rush anyway.

 

isn't it amazing? a game based on speedrunning a mission to get the reward fast, and someone actually doesn't want to slow other players down, as opposed to people who DO want to slow other players down to have fun.

[Hollow_Knight]

>Join clan

>Play with non-rushers

>???

>No more QQ

 

Whilst I agree with your sentiment ( I belong to a clan primarily so I don't need to dip into the great pool of unknown that is the matchmaking system )  Sometimes people don't want to join a clan or, even if they belong to one, there's no-one on at the time who wishes to play the mission type you do.

[magusat999]

I think some clarity is in order here. People complin about RUSHERS, which is distinctly different from players who are just moving quickly. Rushers are NOT the majority of high level players, as some of you would assert. High level players move quickly - but not so quick that they miss things, skip things or become useless to the team.

 

When I started out I got my second Frame - Rhino. I found out quickly about Rhino's speed problem and addressed it first with the Rush mod and later with the Vanguard Helmet. At the time when his level grew and moy mods were all maxed, Rhino is fast enough to keep up with the group of p[layers who move quickly - but the Rusher is a different thing. A group of people moving at a quick pace will not leave even a Rhino behind - a Rusher will leave everyone in the dust.

 

Rushers are not that group moving quickly, they are always one person flying through the map on their own, way ahead of everyone else. There are the Rushers who open containers - they love doing it in the extraction halways - and there are the ones that just go and complete the objective. These are the Rushers - not the fast moving group - that people are complianing about. When I was an undeveloped Rhino player I didn't complain about not keeping up with the group, I just did what I could to get faster. I have no coplaints about a fast moving group - the problem is that one Rusher who pops into a game - which is a co-op game - and ruins it for everyone else. I'd welcome one Rusher to explain why they don't just play Solo - I have yet to hear one explain why they feel the need to play with other people.

 

The Rusher we are talking about is NOT playing they way most people, or the majority of people are playing. I rarely encounter a mission containing more than one Rusher - it is the Rusher who doesn't seem to play the way everyone else expects to play, not the other people. Some of you are getting confused, lunping in fast moving players with Rushers, and jumping to their defense - you are not a Rusher, and the complaints are not about you. You have a squad of players running along, fighting and running to open containers, moving fast enough to finish quickly, but not so fast that players get left behind - that is not Rushing. When everyon is moving quickly, that is not Rushing. But if your standing on the extraction point, waiting for the entire squad to show up, who you left five or six rooms back - YOU are the Rusher. You didn't kill your share, you didn't help with lockout, you didn't help revive anyone. Again - why didn't you just play Solo? It's easy, just choose "Solo" at the big blue button.

 

Some people talk about how the game is designed as an excuse - well did you forget that the slow Frames are part of the game design? Reason that out. Co-op play is part of the game design. Player helping player is part of the game design (you can't revive yourself after you run out of free revives, can you?). There are abilities that affect and enhance other players - if they designed it for one player to rush through with no consideration for the others they wouldn't add co-op mode or features - why would they need to?

 

I think people who complain about Rushers are being misunderstood - sometimes outright maligned. In an effort to defend selfish play, true Rushers come in and define the complaints as coming from people who want to wander aimlessly at a snail's pace, getting lost way behind the group. That cannot be farthest from the truth. People, like myself, who complain about Rushers are part of the group. There are three of us and one Rusher. We are playing at a reasonable speed, and the Rusher is way ahead of us, making a general nuisance and sucking the fun out of the game. It would be nice if DE could look at it as it really is, and do something about it. The majority of us are playing plenty fast enough, there is no need to be rushed through by someone who isn't playing the way the other three people are playing -and again, they are not playing the way the majority of players are playing; they are playing THEIR WAY - which I don't see why they cannot do SOLO.

 

I like what DE did with the Jackal fight. The fight with that boss cannot start until all the players are in the room. Perhaps we need more of that? The way the jackal fight develops actually feels like a boss fight - ther's a cutscene, the room is locked down, and everybody has to be present. This is one way DE can correct the pace. Sure, you can rush TO the fight, but your going to have to wait until everyone shows up, so everyone can participate. That's how all the boss fights should be.

 

They could also implement barriers that take several players to proceed beyond, make elevators need all sqaud members to start. They can make enemies have abilities that will impede someone who is too far ahead. Ma,e something that will pursue someone who is way ahead and all alone; I'd call it a Chaser. You want to Rush ahead, do it at your own peril - your high level, you can take an encounter with something that's faster than you and more powerful than any enemy in all of Warframe - right? The Chaser will run you down, knock you down, take a tremendous amount of attacks to put down - it won't be invincible, but darn near. You can't climb from it, you can't hide. It can teleport to wherever you are and beat on you - you HAVE TO fight it... It's weakness will be that it doesn't like to fight groups... get where that's going? When the rest show up, it will leave.

 

Warframe is not based on rushing, and it wasn't made to be rushed through. You can go quickly all the way to snail's pace. Right now there is no penalty for being a Rusher - but remember, this is only a Beta. Keep running - for now...

[fddcsjxk]

a whole bunch of stuff

I would consider myself a rusher- I play Loki, I use Marathon or Rush, I use Dual Zorens in order to go very fast. I enjoy it, going fast is fun. I often find myself waiting for long periods of time at extraction or at double doors for my team. Sometimes, it is frustrating that they go so slow. But I don't complain, I wait patiently. If they die, I rush back and revive them. I don't use elevators until the entire team is there. My rushing is not penalizing the team beyond them not having a player to kill enemies with them.

That being said, I am not going to hesitate to complete an objective because my teammates decided they would rather kill enemies that are not part of the mission's goal. Call it a form of role-play. I believe Tenno should concentrate on what the mission objective is and complete it as quickly and efficiently as possible.

 

I agree with your sentiments of Jackal- I think it is currently the best boss fight in the game. But Jackal doesn't penalize rushers, it just makes them wait. Your "Chaser" idea is inane. It is unfair to those who decide to play a certain way, especially when rushing players aren't detrimental to those who lag behind. Players that want to kill, collect, and explore everything should be able to do so, until half the team is waiting at extraction and wanting to go. Players that want to go fast and complete the objective and exit the mission quickly should also be able to do so. Right now, both playstyles can coexist, and that's fine. If you want to be absolutely sure that you can play the way you want with four total team members, you need only one friend for playing fast and two for playing slow. Not an unreasonable requirement. 

[magusat999]

I would consider myself a rusher- I play Loki, I use Marathon or Rush, I use Dual Zorens in order to go very fast. I enjoy it, going fast is fun. I often find myself waiting for long periods of time at extraction or at double doors for my team. Sometimes, it is frustrating that they go so slow. But I don't complain, I wait patiently. If they die, I rush back and revive them. I don't use elevators until the entire team is there. My rushing is not penalizing the team beyond them not having a player to kill enemies with them.

That being said, I am not going to hesitate to complete an objective because my teammates decided they would rather kill enemies that are not part of the mission's goal. Call it a form of role-play. I believe Tenno should concentrate on what the mission objective is and complete it as quickly and efficiently as possible.

 

I agree with your sentiments of Jackal- I think it is currently the best boss fight in the game. But Jackal doesn't penalize rushers, it just makes them wait. Your "Chaser" idea is inane. It is unfair to those who decide to play a certain way, especially when rushing players aren't detrimental to those who lag behind. Players that want to kill, collect, and explore everything should be able to do so, until half the team is waiting at extraction and wanting to go. Players that want to go fast and complete the objective and exit the mission quickly should also be able to do so. Right now, both playstyles can coexist, and that's fine. If you want to be absolutely sure that you can play the way you want with four total team members, you need only one friend for playing fast and two for playing slow. Not an unreasonable requirement. 

The way you describe your play is not particularly what people, or at least myself are complaining about. There is the Rusher who completely disappears. They aren't going to come back and revive anyone, and they kill nothing. I don't disagree with you philosophy of getting through quickly, but that can be achieved without leaving the rest of the group - I'm not talking about one straggler who cannot keep up - behind. 

 

The Jackal example was not there to show a penalization, it is an example of good game balance. It ensures all players have a chance to participate in the objective. The Rusher can rush there, but he cannot spoil the fun of the rest of the squad (remember its a squad, not four individuals playing independently). I think it's a great mechanic to allow all players to enjoy the boss fight.

 

My Chaser idea is just an example off the top of my head, the point is that if someone wants to play a group mode game as if they are alone, then they should suffer a penalty for abandoning the group. I didn't say kill him, just impede him. Give the Rusher a challenge - why not? One of the reasons people say they rush is they "have no challenge" - so there you go, something to play for. Maybe some Rushers will rush so they can face the Chaser - they might enjoy it, since they all claim to be high level players bored of having to fight low level monsters. The way you describe your gameplay is you like to move quickly, but not as fast as a Rusher - I wouldn't call you a RUsher, per se; or for calrity you aren't the type people are complaining about. Idon't think you'd have a problem with the Chaser...

[Mainabi]

a question: where do you find these "rusher?" in 360h gameplay i only faced 3-4 of these rushers, else i could always order them to come back

[ClockworkSpectre]

a question: where do you find these "rusher?" in 360h gameplay i only faced 3-4 of these rushers, else i could always order them to come back

I virtually never see real rushers anymore. 

 

Personally I like to move through missions fast, but I do kill much of what I see along the way.  Even so, there are times when a slow player is left behind.  That being said I shouldn't have to deal with people trying to vote kick me for moving quickly, and honestly I don't want to be tempted to try and kick people for moving as fast as a snail. 

 

While there is a need for dealing with the problem vote kicking is the worst possible solution.  Vote kicking, without question will be abused.  It will offer a massive trolling method for single or multiple players.  A single player could vote kick players as they join their game in progress.  And a group of players can team up to kick players at any point in the mission, how would you feel if you got kicked during a boss fight?  And if you honestly believe that things like this wouldn't happen then you are naive. 

 

The points made earlier in this thread highlight a huge source of the desire to finish missions quickly.  As it stands anyone who has been playing for a significant amount of time has seen everything in this game.  Why would those players want to slow down and decrease efficiency for completing whatever goals they have left in the game.  There is no incentive for players like that not to finish missions quickly.