Redeemer flaws

[DjKaplis]

Hi, guys!

I just tested Redeemer a bit and there seem to be a few things not working correctly:

1) Saryn's Toxic Lash gives no bonus damage (or guaranteed toxic proc that it also should give) to Redeemer shots.

2) Weeping wounds appears to not work with this weapon properly as well. Modded it with 4 dual stat mods+ Drifting contact, getting base status at 38%. With weeping wounds and 4x multiplier that should be guaranteed 100% status chance (which would be great for redeemer as it shoots 10 pellets and therefore like shotguns needs 100% status to reliably proc with each pellet). Yet at 4x combo multiplier the probability to proc status with Redeemer shots appeared the same.

 

Would be nice if this could be fixed, it isn't cool that there are such overpowered things in game like Blood Rush scaling crit chance up after +crit chance on slide attacks from certain mods has been added to equation while on using simple status mods to increase Redeemer base status still isn't able to get its status chance to 100% with Weeping Wounds and 4x multiplier.

 

Also let me know if after doing some of your own testing you have perhaps found out some other strange behavior of this gunblade. ^.^

 

Thanks for attention and have a good day!

[EDM774]

The shooty bit of gunblades is a semi-separated thing where dedicated mele mods don't work (i.e. blood rush weeping wounds etc.) while main mods like More dmg and so on work on both.

Long story short you have tho shove the redeemer in mobs' faces to take advantage of weeping wounds, same goes for sarpa(or whatever it's name was) it's not a bug it's a feature!

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

Through a bunch of damage, status and elemental mods on it with condition overload and destroy everything. 

[NoLazyShadow]

Just let us use dual wield it like you did it with glaves and pistols

[DjKaplis]

8 hours ago, EDM774 said:

The shooty bit of gunblades is a semi-separated thing where dedicated mele mods don't work (i.e. blood rush weeping wounds etc.) while main mods like More dmg and so on work on both.

Long story short you have tho shove the redeemer in mobs' faces to take advantage of weeping wounds, same goes for sarpa(or whatever it's name was) it's not a bug it's a feature!

Weeping wounds works with Sarpa. Blood Rush works with both Redeemer and Sarpa.  Please test things thoroughly before you comment :)

 

I didn't post this because i was uncertain about this, it's quite obvious that this is a bug / flaw - Weeping wounds not working and Saryn Toxic Lash not affecting Redeemer. Because with Sarpa it works just fine.

Edited April 25, 2018 by DjKaplis

[DjKaplis]

8 hours ago, (XB1)RDeschain82 said:

Through a bunch of damage, status and elemental mods on it with condition overload and destroy everything. 

Blood Rush + buffs from Arcane Avenger and / or kavat = red crits. It's still amazing weapon even with some things not quite working properly, no doubt about it.

Edited April 25, 2018 by DjKaplis

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

Use gladiator mods, works great!

[EDM774]

2 hours ago, DjKaplis said:

Weeping wounds works with Sarpa. Blood Rush works with both Redeemer and Sarpa.  Please test things thoroughly before you comment!

I never said those mods don't work with either of the two. I just said they don't apply to the shooting aspect of the weapon unless you have a combo timer increase mod, so you first build up the combo counter to get a few stacks on the mods and then shoot, but having to go in the face of mobs to build the combo counter in the first place defeats the purpouse of the shoot mechanic.

Blood rush and Weeping wounds are based off the combo counter and the shooting of gunblades does not affect it, only meleing does(duh).

As far as testing goes I have tested both and with a mod to keep your combo alive longer you can seriously buff your shots, but again having to go in and build that counter up and waste a mod slot on a combo timer increase?! ... yeah you're better off trying another build.

 

Edited April 25, 2018 by EDM774

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

3 hours ago, EDM774 said:

I never said those mods don't work with either of the two. I just said they don't apply to the shooting aspect of the weapon unless you have a combo timer increase mod, so you first build up the combo counter to get a few stacks on the mods and then shoot, but having to go in the face of mobs to build the combo counter in the first place defeats the purpouse of the shoot mechanic.

Blood rush and Weeping wounds are based off the combo counter and the shooting of gunblades does not affect it, only meleing does(duh).

As far as testing goes I have tested both and with a mod to keep your combo alive longer you can seriously buff your shots, but again having to go in and build that counter up and waste a mod slot on a combo timer increase?! ... yeah you're better off trying another build.

 

Its not a waste. The combo counter resets in 3s without a mod to extend it(5s with wukong). If your utilizing combo counter in any build whatsoever, u need a mod to extend it. Plus the combo counter in itself makes ur melee stronger by literally multiplying the dmg modifier.

Edited April 26, 2018 by (PS4)big_eviljak

[EDM774]

4 hours ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

Its not a waste. The combo counter resets in 3s without a mod to extend it(5s with wukong). If your utilizing combo counter in any build whatsoever, u need a mod to extend it. Plus the combo counter in itself makes ur melee stronger by literally multiplying the dmg modifier.

The thing is the gunblade playstyle here. I'm not saying don't use the combo counter to you advatage, but for gunblades the use case boils down to Mash their faces to get said combo then shoot from a distance but don't forget to go mash their faces some more to keep the combo going. See why whould I go through all this trouble when I can just mash their faces all day long with any mele I want and blow their guts off with a tigris for example(not like the gunblades are silent anymore thx for "fixing" that one DE). Gunblades have a very niche usecase and if you have to synergize the combo counter just to shoot at stuff to kill it faster there are far better weapons oriented at shooting stuff and even beter melees made for... *drumroll* meleeing

Edited April 26, 2018 by EDM774

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

6 minutes ago, EDM774 said:

The thing is the gunblade playstyle here. I'm not saying don't use the combo counter to you advatage, but for gunblades the use case boils down to Mash their faces to get said combo then shoot from a distance but don't forget to go mash their faces some more to keep the combo going. See why whould I go through all this trouble when I can just mash their faces all day long with any mele I want and blow their guts off with a tigris for example(not like the gunblades are silent anymore thx for "fixing" that one DE). Gunblades have a very niche usecase and if you have to synergize the combo counter just to shoot at stuff to kill it faster there are far better weapons oriented at shooting stuff and even beter melees made for... *drumroll* meleeing

To One to two shot sortie level vay hek for one. 

[EDM774]

I can go on and say I can already oneshot him with my lanka but I'm deciding to end this debate as it's going nowhere

[DjKaplis]

12 hours ago, EDM774 said:

I can go on and say I can already oneshot him with my lanka but I'm deciding to end this debate as it's going nowhere

Yea, sorry but your debate is deviating from original post while also giving others who see this false information - shots from Redeemer and Sarpa add combo multiplier: +1 combo counter per enemy hit. Since their shots have innate punch through, combo counter actually goes up quite fast.  But thanks for your input anyway :)

 

Again stating - Redeemer is just not quite working as it should with Saryn Toxic Lash and Weeping Wounds (while Sarpa is). My theory behind Weeping wounds not working as should is - either it simply doesn't affect it at all or the math for it is wrong (like for example 38%, with combo counter at 4 Weeping wounds should give +180% bonus [68,4% bonus] which would make weapons total status 38%+68,4%=106,4% but for some reason the math isn't applied in this way ingame (the problem is that we can't really find it out unless one of the programmers tells us how they calculate their in-game stats)).

 

Since Original Post was "Redeemer flaws" - maybe some of you guys know other aspects of it not quite behaving as it should? Don't have super high hopes that developers will now suddenly rush to fix them straight away but maybe.. maybe at some point they do come up with a fix which would be cool.

[Get_Singed]

I don't have a Redeemer atm so I can't test it myself, but are you certain that the charged shot of the Redeemer can proc status effects other than Blast? Iirc, the Redeemer firing mechanic deals purely blast damage, whereas the Sarpa firing mechanic does standard IPS damage. It's possible the Redeemer shot is designed not to proc any status effects other than Blast, or possibly that it cannot even deal damage other than Blast, which would explain why Toxic Lash doesn't work on it either. I'm not saying is SHOULD work like that where it can only use Blast damage, but it's possible that's how it was coded.

[DjKaplis]

11 hours ago, Get_Singed said:

I don't have a Redeemer atm so I can't test it myself, but are you certain that the charged shot of the Redeemer can proc status effects other than Blast? Iirc, the Redeemer firing mechanic deals purely blast damage, whereas the Sarpa firing mechanic does standard IPS damage. It's possible the Redeemer shot is designed not to proc any status effects other than Blast, or possibly that it cannot even deal damage other than Blast, which would explain why Toxic Lash doesn't work on it either. I'm not saying is SHOULD work like that where it can only use Blast damage, but it's possible that's how it was coded.

It can proc other elements too, just with the way it is currently working chances for it to proc something are low. Still with a little bit of status chance mods you can from time to time proc blast or other elements. It doesn't happen very often but can't also say it's completely incapable of doing any status.

Yea, I can only guess how it is coded...the weapon is still very nice just performs different than you would expect.  (as for toxic lash - with high status melee it can usually proc 2 statuses per hit if the weapon elements proc + the guaranteed toxin proc from toxic lash. Kind of like Glaive Prime always procs slash on thrown attacks + other modded elements sometimes so can proc 2 statuses at same time)