Vauban, suggested changes and feedback

[Rhundis]

So after giving Vauban's new "changes" a spin I've discovered a few things...

 

He still needs work.

 

Below i'd like to suggest some changes and feedback regarding his current kit, and some possible new changes that should be looked into. Starting off with...

 

Passive: It's good. 25% increase to damage vs incapacitated enemies is fairly useful. Now if we could figure out if this 25% is either before mod calculation or after would be fairly appreciated.

Armor: To be fair he's not really "tanky" enough as you would expect him to be, but at the same time he's not the least armored frame in the game so with some skill it shouldn't be too much of a hindrance. But a small bump in base armor would be helpful.

Abilities:

1) Tesla: The charge mechanic has some merit, but in its current alliteration its no more than a hindrance and the amount of energy consumption per Tesla is too much. With a cost of 25 energy per Tesla you can get a maximum of 9 Teslas on the field before you need to scour for more energy.

     Suggestion: Keep the charge mechanic, reduce the time it takes to "charge" a Tesla, and increase the amount of affected enemies within a certain radius of the Tesla based upon how "charged" the Tesla is. (similar to Vauban's Prime trailer where he throws one Tesla and affects all nearby Crewman) This would warrant using the charge mechanic to get a wider area of effect while also keeping with the original concept of quick throwing uncharged Teslas.

In regards to energy efficiency, i would suggest cutting the base cost of his Tesla by 1/2. Making it cost 15 energy per cast. Giving him 15 Teslas at max energy vs the 9 he can currently deploy.

2) Minelayer: To be honest, almost all of the deployables in this ability need to be looked into. The multiple ability cycle is still useful but the abilities themselves need work. Also, as stated in the Tesla section, the energy per mine cost is too high. For a frame who's considered a "Master of Traps" he cant have very many traps out on the field. Reducing the cost of energy per mine would be more beneficial in this scenario.

Bounce: Is no longer as useful as it once was and is more used for a "troll" tactic with other players than a useful ability vs enemies.

     Suggestion: Change Bounce to a Concussive force grenade which rag dolls enemies (Blast Damage) within its radius of effect and is also capable of propelling Vauban like bounce originally could while simultaneously removing its effect on allies.

Trip Laser: For what it is, its not very helpful. A 10m long laser that basically forces a Blast proc on an enemy knocking them over if moving at a run sounds useful, until you realize its only 10m long and almost completely useless in a large open area. 

     Suggestion: Replace Trip Laser with an area Slow or Root effect. Causing enemies that are effected to have slowed movement speed or prevented from moving entirely until its duration expires. 

Shred: One of the more useful abilities, until again you realize that its armor stripping abilities are only temporary. How does an enemy regain armor that's supposedly been punctured by thousands of tiny shrapnel pieces?

     Suggestion: Simply remove the temporary armor stripping and make it permanent. Change the Blast proc to a Corrosive Proc and you've got a pretty decent ability. Making the armor debuff stack wouldn't be to bad of an idea either.

Concuss: You've basically got a grenade that makes people deaf. Banshee does it better.

     Suggestion: Change this grenade entirely. Make it into an EMP grenade that causes a Magnetic Proc and deals bonus damage to shields and robotics, while also having a chance to jam enemies weapons. 

Bastille: Still good, Vauban's basic staple ability and one of the most useful CC abilities to date. Even with his current changes.

     Suggestion: To counteract his overall "squishy-ness" add a synergistic effect to this ability where Vauban will gain armor % equal to the number of enemies currently affected by his Bastille while inside its radius of effect.

Vortex: Nothing wrong here. The base ability is second to none and again one of the staples of Vauban's kit. The problem here resides with its Augment. (Perpetual Vortex) Perpetual Vortex is supposed to increase the duration of a currently deployed Vortex by 70%. However, there is no cost reduction to do so and the hit-box to actually apply this ability is more likely to deploy a second Vortex than actually increase the duration of the first. In retrospect, why would you ever need to use this augment? Its more cost efficient to simply throw out a new Vortex with 100% of its duration than to try to extend the duration of one that's already deployed.

     Suggestion: Change the effect of Perpetual Vortex to instead of increasing the duration of a currently deployed Vortex, to increase its size and damage at a reduced cost of the original cast. Add a larger hit box to the area of how close you need to throw out another Vortex to proc this effect, (so you don't accidentally throw out another Vortex instead) and you got yourself a usable augment.

 

Sorry for the wall of text but i hope that i got my points acrossed for Vauban's current state.

 

 

 

[(XBOX)ChiefWasabi1]

I agree with most of what you said here but I think a great change for Vauban's tesla would be to give it a chromatic buff on the charged version. If your energy color is blue it'll give you and your allies energy. If it's red it'll give you and your allies health. If it's green it'll give you and your allies ammo, etc.

[Rhundis]

1 hour ago, (XB1)Ninja6468 said:

I agree with most of what you said here but I think a great change for Vauban's tesla would be to give it a chromatic buff on the charged version. If your energy color is blue it'll give you and your allies energy. If it's red it'll give you and your allies health. If it's green it'll give you and your allies ammo, etc.

I agree thats a cool ability. But my suggestions are to keep Vauban more in line with his original kit. That being CC and more CC. He doesn't need to be a support frame. We already have Trinity and Oberon for that.

[(XBOX)ChiefWasabi1]

1 hour ago, Rhundis said:

I agree thats a cool ability. But my suggestions are to keep Vauban more in line with his original kit. That being CC and more CC. He doesn't need to be a support frame. We already have Trinity and Oberon for that.

As much as I would like that as a Vauban main myself. Unfortunately his tesla will never really be worthwhile unless they give it absolutely $&*&*#(%&ed amounts of damage in the current meta of warframe, and if we're trying to make him relevant in warframe without giving him absurd amounts of damage. There needs to be a change that's more tactical to his kit and the kind of change that I suggested definitely brings that, and it even does so without changing anything within his base kit.

[notHunky]

On the opposite end of the spectrum here, I think he needs a total rework and some abilities just need to be flat out replaced with something better. At the moment, Mag does everything Vauban can, except better. Her magnetize is better than Vauban's Vortex or Bastile once you figure out how to use it. Magnetize can trap enemies in a choke point the same way Vortex can, while having the added bonus of absorbing enemy fire and increasing damage. If enemies happen to be a bit further away from the magnetize bubble, all you have to do is pull them into it. Even if you're out in the open, Magnetize can be used defensively as a barrier against enemy fire with proper positioning. She even has an augment which allows her to interrupt enemy fire for a brief period, which allows her to turn the situation around. My point is Mag's rework was so good and underrated, that a skilled user can turn unfavorable battle conditions upside down and use them against the enemy. This is an essential ability which Vauban sorely lacks in many situations.

My biggest problem with Vauban isn't entirely that he's squishy, but that he has no viable means to deal with being flanked by enemies in the open. When I think of engineers on a battlefield, what comes to mind is someone who is able to build temporary fortifications and defensible areas able to withstand an onslaught of enemies. While Vauban has great area denial capabilities, he cannot construct fortifications on the fly like Volt, Mag, Frost, or Gara. Vauban can't really create defensible positions; all he can really do is make choke points easier to control (until you get flanked from another side).

What we need is a way for Vauban to create a defensible area out of anything (maybe have some deployable fortifications like walls or barriers and have the ability to lay an entire minefeild?), then have something capable of dealing with the advancing enemy forces from all sides (maybe mountable turret which can be modded as an exhalted weapon?!).

 

Not sure if this would work but I'd like to see some sort of ability changes something like this:

1. Minelayer/Tesla: are combined into one ability. Instead of throwing just one mine or tesla, you throw a ball which jumps up and disperses a bunch of mines in an effective radius (similar to how tentacle swarm works). Casting the ability a second time would detonate all remaining mines. The current augment would still make slash inducing beams between each mine.
2. Vortex: Moved to the 2nd ability slot and has the added ability to absorb enemy projectiles. Can be used as deployable cover to help Vauban in more open areas.
3. Bastile: No changes.
4. Trebuchet: Calls down a mountable turret with front facing shields like a grineer rampart, except this one is an explosive hurling autocannon which can be modded as an exhalted weapon.

Edited August 12, 2018 by notHunky

[Rhundis]

I admit i like most if not all the current changes mentioned by those above. My changes were just something to follow along with his original feel or abilities. This way DE can focus more on numbers rather than trying to create new, untested abilities that may or may not work. Its easier to continue to "tweak" existing abilities because it doesn't require as much work as designing a completely new ability, and as you know with their release of Fortuna and Rail-jack they have plenty on their hands already.