To Help People Understand The Logic Of Changed In Patch 9.8

[VKhaun]

WTF else are you supposed to use? Answer that for me.

 

Your choices as a newbie, are Braton, Strun, and MK1-Braton, and that is ALL you have until AFTER Earth.

 

Did you somehow miss that part!?

 

And what if the person took Mag instead of Excalibur?

 

And again with the Slash Dash.... less energy orbs dropping = LESS SLASH DASH.

 

What are you doing?

 

You keep quoting me to post the same questions with obvious answers that don't trip up any new players, and you don't seem to have a point to make even if they were demonstrated to be valid pointed questions without answers.

[Xylia]

What are you doing?

 

You keep quoting me to post the same questions with obvious answers that don't trip up any new players, and you don't seem to have a point to make even if they were demonstrated to be valid pointed questions without answers.

 

Just answer the question, already. Oh wait, that's right, you can't.

 

You kept saying "Don't use those guns on Earth".... the point is, the guns I listed _ARE_ the only guns an honest-to-God newbie CAN use on Earth. And then you go "you have no point why do you keep asking" ... are you trying to troll me or something?

 

And how do you know Newbies aren't having trouble?

 

Quite odd, just last week I had plenty of newbies talking about how ridiculously difficult of a time they had getting started, and one of the developers said that they agreed that the Newbie Experience needs attention.

 

When one of the Developers says this, then you Know something is up.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[VKhaun]

Just answer the question, already. Oh wait, that's right, you can't.

 

You kept saying "Don't use those guns on Earth".... the point is, the guns I listed _ARE_ the only guns an honest-to-God newbie CAN use on Earth. And then you go "you have no point why do you keep asking" ... are you trying to troll me or something?

 

You are going back and forth between posting the whole list and then assuming they bring the regular Braton. I have answered you more than once, and the answer here is really obvious anyway.

 

 

 

 

And how do you know Newbies aren't having trouble?

 

I didn't say they weren't having trouble, I said they didn't have a problem picking the square peg for the square hole when it came time to fight grineer and they had to pick a weapon.

 

 

 

 

Quite odd, just last week I had plenty of newbies talking about how ridiculously difficult of a time they had getting started, and one of the developers said that they agreed that the Newbie Experience needs attention.

 

When one of the Developers says this, then you Know something is up.

 

No one said the new player experience was perfect. I'm arguing that it's not 'hell' and in other places I've argued the mod situation isn't good and that they need a wider weapon selection.

[FoxyKabam]

I did 5,687 Damage to a level 60 infested with a 25 power ability with Ember. Please for the love of god don't start complaining about her lmao

pics plz

[Xylia]

You are going back and forth between posting the whole list and then assuming they bring the regular Braton. I have answered you more than once, and the answer here is really obvious anyway.

 

Again, it is either:

 

Braton

MK-1 Braton

Strun

 

Given the MK-1 does a LOT LESS damage than the regular Braton... why would you want to bring the MK1? Or are you saying one should bring a Strun to Grineer? lol. And even then, the regular Strun costs 75,000 credits. A GOOD Venus run (if you know where the hidden loot rooms are) MIGHT give you 3k credits. Maybe.

 

I think at this point you're just trolling especially when you're refusing to answer a simple question.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[VKhaun]

Again, it is either:

 

Braton

MK-1 Braton

Strun

 

Given the MK-1 does a LOT LESS damage than the regular Braton... why would you want to bring the MK1? Or are you saying one should bring a Strun to Grineer? lol. And even then, the regular Strun costs 75,000 credits. A GOOD Venus run (if you know where the hidden loot rooms are) MIGHT give you 3k credits. Maybe.

 

I think at this point you're just trolling especially when you're refusing to answer a simple question.

 

 

The answers to this are just as obvious as all your other posts. No one is trolling you, you're just closed minded.

[Ced23Ric]

The answers to this are just as obvious as all your other posts. No one is trolling you, you're just closed minded.

 

Stop giving him the run around and either answer or stop your display of veiled arrogance. This is painful to read.

 

Aside: The regular Braton is one of the better rifles in the game. Slapping some mods in there and she's good to rock. Same with the Strun, which is in it's own right a decent weapon. I am not entirely sure what the problems with these two are - or, supposed to be.

[theasl]

One solution is to make resources to be sold at the market for credits, not just for platinum. In this way newbies can buy some resources (for example, 100.000 credits for 1.000 ferrite, something like that) to make better guns and then beat higher levels. This will also solve the problem of stacking credits which now will serve for nothing since there will be no more ammo boxes to buy (for me even with the ammo boxes, since I have more than 2 million credits which is used for nothing). In this way a newbie can repeat missions in Mercury, stack credits and then buy the resources that he cant get at Earth or Mars.

Did you forget? The only reason most vets have millions of credits is because they overdosed on void runs. I've been here since U7, have used almost every frame and weapon (minus the dumb alert melees), and have sunk hundreds of hours and dollars into this game, but I still have credit shortages. It was hard already for newbies to get 100k credits - I only did so after buying the old "Stay Frosty" pack which included much better gear than I had at the time and a credit booster, and that was back in U7 - and now you want them to spend it on something they can farm in 10 minutes? Seriously, I get 300-700 ferrite per run of Caloris, which I'd say is the easiest mission in the entire game.

 

That said, I do agree that credits for resources is a good idea. Let's take a look at the prices. The plat-to-credit bundle is 30 for 9k. Using this scale, rares would be 3k each, clantech resources 4500 each, uncommons (rubedo, plastids, and p bundles, apparently) 9k for 450 or 300, respectively, and commons 9k for 1500 or 3000. These prices are a lot more reasonable for newbies and people like me who don't run voids a lot.

[Xylia]

Stop giving him the run around and either answer or stop your display of veiled arrogance. This is painful to read.

 

Aside: The regular Braton is one of the better rifles in the game. Slapping some mods in there and she's good to rock. Same with the Strun, which is in it's own right a decent weapon. I am not entirely sure what the problems with these two are - or, supposed to be.

 

My point in this thread is simple:

 

With no damage mods until After Earth, the Braton and Strun are not effective enough against the legions of Grineer a newbie faces if they are forced to solo missions on Earth.

 

The Braton only does 20 damage a shot; one Napalm or Heavy Gunner alone takes nearly two entire clips to take down. That's 90 bullets. With modest mods you might have 675-700 ammo maximum if you stick maxed out Ammo Drum (because again, it is either that or Fast Hands, and that's about the only Rifle Mods you can get by the time you're in Earth).

 

This was bad enough.

 

NOW, with the Ammo Drop nerf in 9.8, this is only going to make the problem much worse.

 

Yes, Braton and Strun are awesome guns..... with mods. Mods that don't drop until after Earth in Mod Drop 2.0. Also, try to remember Redirection won't drop until after Earth, either. Good luck with that 300 shields and guns that do 20 damage a shot.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[VKhaun]

Stop giving him the run around and either answer or stop your display of veiled arrogance. This is painful to read.

 

Why? The choice to use an accurate weapon to fight the headshot faction should be straightforward. It's like using fire on the ice mob in an RPG. This should be an absolute BASIC choice that requires almost no thought but they're inventing they're own problem by assuming the wrong weapon for the job, used incorrectly, and used in an area they can't handle yet. Look at their reply to you... they don't want to be given the answer they want someone to pretend they're right. 

 

 

Call me all the names you like but if you're not trying to make them rethink the position then you're not doing them any favors and you can't do that by being super friendly rainbows and unicorns. At some point you have to make a stubborn person re-examine something themselves.

Edited September 7, 2013 by VKhaun

[Ced23Ric]

Why? The choice to use an accurate weapon to fight the headshot faction should be straightforward. It's like using fire on the ice mob in an RPG. This should be an absolute BASIC choice that requires almost no thought but they're inventing they're own problem by assuming the wrong weapon for the job, used incorrectly, and used in an area they can't handle yet. Look at their reply to you... they don't want to be given the answer they want someone to pretend they're right.

 

Call me all the names you like but if you're not trying to make them rethink the position then you're not doing them any favors and you can't do that by being super friendly rainbows and unicorns. At some point you have to make a stubborn person re-examine something themselves.

 

For the sake of getting somewhere here: Do you suggest they use the Mk1. Braton or the Braton? Are you taking about the Lex? Please clarify and elaborate.

[Lord.Finster]

I'm talking about newbies who are new to the game, they already get swamped by 10-12 mobs per room on Mercury... they have to fight Commanders on Apollodorus, Napalms on Earth... and now they're being asked to do so with a lot fewer ammo drops?

 

LESS Health? God, Health is scarce already in Grineer Galleons.

 

I can do that stuff, sure. But what about newbies, who are the lifeblood of Warframe?

Once they pass Mercury they are no longer newbies. Killing off Vor with low tier equip and skills is quite challenging but once they master that challenge they shouldn't have any problems with the game.

[Xylia]

Once they pass Mercury they are no longer newbies. Killing off Vor with low tier equip and skills is quite challenging but once they master that challenge they shouldn't have any problems with the game.

 

Until they run smack into a Napalm in E Prime after going through the smooth Venus levels.

 

You go from reasonable (though a bit too much pew pew at times) Corpus Maps to E Prime.... 15 seconds in...

 

"Warning: Heavy Grineer Approaching."

 

Turn around the corner, and this large dude in red smacks the ground and throws you on your butt.

 

He then kills you before you stand up because his napalm blasts tear through your shields and health faster than any enemy in the game has done before, except Jackal's sticky grenades (which are easily avoidable if you just stay away from him).

 

If you miraculously survive it and get away from him, you now have an enemy that will take 80+ shots from a Braton to kill who can kill you through walls, crates, and other objects and the blasts are so large, they are nigh-unavoidable. As a newbie you'll think you can put a wall between him and you......nope! you're taking 40-50 damage every 3 seconds while trying to figure out just WTF you're supposed to do about this insurmountable brick wall that smashes you to pieces in seconds.

 

And you have to fight up to 10 of those. Per mission. With NO Damage Mods for your Primary Weapons.

Edited September 8, 2013 by Xylia

[CloudPies]

Suggestion: Give noobies a set of mods: Redirection, Vitality, Serration, Hornet Strike after they clear Mercury the first time.

The RNG is pathetic on these essential mods, especially for new players without any actual means to farm for them.

[Xylia]

Suggestion: Give noobies a set of mods: Redirection, Vitality, Serration, Hornet Strike after they clear Mercury the first time.

The RNG is pathetic on these essential mods, especially for new players without any actual means to farm for them.

 

I'm pretty sure it is DE's intentions for players to NOT have these. On paper, Mod Drop 2.0 makes sense -- we don't wnat to hand newbies ridiculously powerful guns.

 

But yet... they went too far in the OTHER direction. IMO, Piercing Hit should drop on Venus. If we had JUST Piercing Hit, then Earth would be 3x more bearable, even with the Napalms.

 

And Redirection...... yeah bad idea restricting that to Lv20+. And Vitality already drops by the loads on Mercury and is also a reward from Raid/Capture.

Edited September 8, 2013 by Xylia

[CloudPies]

I'm pretty sure it is DE's intentions for players to NOT have these. On paper, Mod Drop 2.0 makes sense -- we don't wnat to hand newbies ridiculously powerful guns.

 

But yet... they went too far in the OTHER direction. IMO, Piercing Hit should drop on Venus. If we had JUST Piercing Hit, then Earth would be 3x more bearable, even with the Napalms.

 

And Redirection...... yeah bad idea restricting that to Lv20+. And Vitality already drops by the loads on Mercury and is also a reward from Raid/Capture.

Its not like they'd have the cores to fuse those up to ridiculous powers. They'll be rank 4-5 max.

If you wont give them damage mods: GIVE THEM REDIRECTION, incorporate into a tutorial or something.

[Jefftiffy]

Okay I see all these complaints about the beginning of the game being hard. I started Warframe post-U9. Mercury was laughably easy in solo until I got to Vor. Vor is too much of a bullet shield to noobs. Solo he is impossible as a noob. Luckily by then I had caught up with my friends who also started at the same time as me. We made a Squad of a Loki, Mag, and Excalibur and killed Vor relatively easily but we had to use 1 ammo box each (not really that expensive).

 

Then we started Venus and were fine until we hit a defense mission. We failed it 2 times and decided to go back to Mercury and level and search for mods. When we returned we had each built a Chronus. The defense mission had went from hard to passable within 12 hours when we only played for about an hour of that. After that we breezed through the next few missions and hit the next defense on Venus. This one we failed due to lack of mods. We realized that defense was a good mod farm and went back to the low level one which was much easier because we had leveled a bunch since then. After we felt like we had improved enough we returned to the higher level defense and slaughtered our way to wave 5. We didn't go past it because at the time we thought "Fight on" implied a boss fight.

 

Whenever we had a question we used the Warframe wikia which was easy to find using Google.

 

Now, the real problem is when we hit infested. Infested were a pain due to Ancients being so OP for low levels to fight because their abilities remove the only way for them to fight them efficiently. Combine this with their high spawn rate and we weren't able to beat them for a long time.

 

And just look now, I am a Loki that runs T3 MD missions Mastery 4, and I have become much better at the game. I don't have a second frame yet because I was holding out for Frost Prime, but I recently decided to finally make Trinity to at least try it while I grind for FP.

 

The problem with this game right now is the noobs who think they should push on Solo in a Co-op game and refuse to backtrack to improve.

 

Also, Damage and AP mods do show up in the low levels, defense missions tend to award them relatively often (compared to killing for them).

Edited September 8, 2013 by Jefftiffy

[Xylia]

Its not like they'd have the cores to fuse those up to ridiculous powers. They'll be rank 4-5 max.

If you wont give them damage mods: GIVE THEM REDIRECTION, incorporate into a tutorial or something.

 

You kiddin me? I've gotten plenty of Rare 5s from Venus, lol.

 

My Newbie Account had more Cores than I could possibly use, because of the 3-5k credit cost to actually fuse them. Right now, my Newbie Account has some 20 cores sitting in its mod pool because I'm trying to save up for a shade blueprint (8k a mission takes Forever).

[CloudPies]

You kiddin me? I've gotten plenty of Rare 5s from Venus, lol.

 

My Newbie Account had more Cores than I could possibly use, because of the 3-5k credit cost to actually fuse them. Right now, my Newbie Account has some 20 cores sitting in its mod pool because I'm trying to save up for a shade blueprint (8k a mission takes Forever).

I'm admit I can't argue with numbers because I haven't experienced a new player's perspective since the new drop tables came in. But the way I see it is, these are pretty much the essential mods that everyone is almost required to have to have a chance at higher level enemies. Relying on RNG for that is cruel...

[Xylia]

I'm admit I can't argue with numbers because I haven't experienced a new player's perspective since the new drop tables came in. But the way I see it is, these are pretty much the essential mods that everyone is almost required to have to have a chance at higher level enemies. Relying on RNG for that is cruel...

 

*nods* I can confirm that......

 

1). Redirection will not drop until Lv20. (I've seen it from Infested and Grineer, and never before 20)

2). Cryo Rounds, Corpus on Mars (I've done lots of Venus, never saw a single one)

3). Stormbringer, I've seen on Vay Hek's level, haven't seen another since. Wouldn't be surprised if it were like 15+

4). Haven't seen a Hellfire yet...

5). Piercing Hit, Mars.

 

So it LOOKS like Rifle Damage mods are all Level 15+ with either 0% or ridiculously small chance to drop earlier than that and Redirection is 20+.

[NalkorRN]

At this point, I would not recommend Warframe to anyone who doesn't already play it and have access to the required mods. If they were still fresh and didn't have them, I'd tell them to leave so they could avoid the headaches.

[Xylia]

At this point, I would not recommend Warframe to anyone who doesn't already play it and have access to the required mods. If they were still fresh and didn't have them, I'd tell them to leave so they could avoid the headaches.

 

Or get carried.

 

But then, IMO, getting carried isn't very fun, but it would allow one to skip the headaches. Get a carry to Metis (for Redirection), and to Saturn/Mars for a couple Rifle Mods and then let em start lol.

 

But yeah, that's not very fun. Better than trying to slog through Earth with unmodded rifles tho.

 

But at least Scott has said that he knows the whole mess needs attention. Hopefully that makes u10 or sooner.

[JustDont]

I love how these threads always go towards "But we MUST protect the poor solo newbie player who won't EVER play with other people, who suck at FPSes, and who makes bad in-game decisions! God forbid that the game could've even appear hard to such a player!"

[CloudPies]

I love how these threads always go towards "But we MUST protect the poor solo newbie player who won't EVER play with other people, who suck at FPSes, and who makes bad in-game decisions! God forbid that the game could've even appear hard to such a player!"

The main problem is that 4 of them sucking together isn't going to bring in more players... this game is not linear in that when you level up, you get more power.

To get more 'powerful', you have to sacrifice a goat and pray you get a good mod <- that's where the problem is.

[icosta27]

Okay I see all these complaints about the beginning of the game being hard. I started Warframe post-U9. Mercury was laughably easy in solo until I got to Vor. Vor is too much of a bullet shield to noobs. Solo he is impossible as a noob. Luckily by then I had caught up with my friends who also started at the same time as me. We made a Squad of a Loki, Mag, and Excalibur and killed Vor relatively easily but we had to use 1 ammo box each (not really that expensive).

 

Then we started Venus and were fine until we hit a defense mission. We failed it 2 times and decided to go back to Mercury and level and search for mods. When we returned we had each built a Chronus. The defense mission had went from hard to passable within 12 hours when we only played for about an hour of that. After that we breezed through the next few missions and hit the next defense on Venus. This one we failed due to lack of mods. We realized that defense was a good mod farm and went back to the low level one which was much easier because we had leveled a bunch since then. After we felt like we had improved enough we returned to the higher level defense and slaughtered our way to wave 5. We didn't go past it because at the time we thought "Fight on" implied a boss fight.

 

Whenever we had a question we used the Warframe wikia which was easy to find using Google.

 

Now, the real problem is when we hit infested. Infested were a pain due to Ancients being so OP for low levels to fight because their abilities remove the only way for them to fight them efficiently. Combine this with their high spawn rate and we weren't able to beat them for a long time.

 

And just look now, I am a Loki that runs T3 MD missions Mastery 4, and I have become much better at the game. I don't have a second frame yet because I was holding out for Frost Prime, but I recently decided to finally make Trinity to at least try it while I grind for FP.

 

The problem with this game right now is the noobs who think they should push on Solo in a Co-op game and refuse to backtrack to improve.

 

Also, Damage and AP mods do show up in the low levels, defense missions tend to award them relatively often (compared to killing for them).

 I applaud you, tears of joy for a fellow noob Tenno with a brain =D