Thoughts on Vauban

[NuclearCoffeePot]

I've already made several posts on Vauban's abilities and proposed several concepts, all of them didn't quite feel complete though so i'm trying again with this rough concept that's shaping in my mind. Feel free to criticize and give me any ideas on how you think it should be fleshed out. Don't get huffy about what i put though, its annoying.

p-

1-Mine-layer i believe to be a poorly implemented take on a cool concept- the idea of cycling between options for each situation is pretty unique to Vauban(shut up Khora) and id love to see it implemented in a better way. To that end i propose to you 2 different takes on that cycling idea

1. take 1-augmented firepower- Augmented firepower allows Vauban to cycle between the 4 base elemental mods. On activation he and all allies will receive status chance and bonus damage of that elemental type-  the bonus damage is of course affected by power strength but i think the status chance should be based on a static number that increases per level. This is because with the augment i propose Vauban could combine 2 of the elemental mods in his orbiter, reducing the options to three and giving him a more specialized elemental type. If he could boost status chance incredibly high it might get a wee bit crazy but in the end that's up to DE.
2. take 2-Rather then argue about which grenades to keep and what should be a mine or a grenade i propose a throw-able device with three modes. Grenade mode, Mine mode, and seeker mode
   1. In mine mode the device sticks tosurfaces and lies inactive until an enemy comes within range. Upon activation the mine will begin pulling enemies within range into its epicenter much like vortex while draining their shields, and armor and adds it as bonus damage to the vortex. attacking the vortex will send an electric shock to enemies in its grasp- the mines base range is higher then the grenade though its initial damage is lower
   2. In grenade mode the device is thrown like one of Vauban's classic softballs. upon landing at a location it activates dragging in nearby enemies and swiftly draining shields and armor before detonating, shredding the max armor and shields of enemies caught in the blast- the drain will increase the shred effect
   3. I feel this option isn't required but i like it nonetheless. In seeker mode your grenade will be thrown lightly and activate upon hitting a surface- it will then seek out the nearest enemy, prioratizing heavy enemies- THe seeker will stick itself to its target and drain health and shields for a minimum duration- the seeker only detonates if there are nearby enemies so if there are none it will continue to drain. When the seekers host comes near another enemy the seeker activates releasing a multi target electric shock that arcs between targets, the drained shields increase the status chance and damage of the shock

Alternatively this could be replaced by an ability that cycles through elemental types. Activating gives you and nearby allies that elemental type plus status chance. With augment you can combine the elemental mods in orbiter to create things like viral or corrosive for your team. This works individually as a balls basic buff but with a coordinated squad you can fill in gaps in weapon modding 

2-Bolster- Vauban releases nanomachines into the environment around him, causing allies to gain a magnetic shield that repells a percentage of enemy attacks at rank one, gives their firearms bonus velocity and damage at rank 2, and applies a long range loot vacuum to them at rank 3

 

3-Bastille- It's Bastille- with a higher base enemy cap or even no cap at all. Vauban's Bastille as is, is quite low and even if you full mod for range you sacrifice the power needed to pick up large groups of enemies. Vaubans mine and bolster will gain significantly more range while inside Bastille- 

4-I played around with this idea in my head and eventually decided screw it, i like it, its cool, and it fits with the theme i wanted this kit to play around, versatility. Hence for your reading pleasure- Reinforcements-Designed to play to the needs of his team reinforcements provides Vauban with a sort of augmentation- in order to avoid stigma over multiple cycle abilities in a single kit the type of reinforcement you can call will be decided before the battle. Or else when you press the binding for 4 you will be able to select it from a menu without having to cycle like normal. There are three types of reinforcements that allow Vauban to fit three different roles at his discretion-

1. Available at Reinforcements first level is guardian- Provides Vauban with bonus personal defenses as well as two osprey like sentinels that boost nearby allies armor and shields-
2. At Reinforcement level 2 Blitz becomes available- Centered around offensive play Blitz increases Vauban's movement and attack speed while 2 jackal like drones follow at his heels- these jackals shock the closest target with a high status chance before attacking normally in melee
3. At Reinforcements final level Tactical becomes available- Tactical gives Vauban more usage in missions like spy- The sound of all weapon fire and death  screams within a certain radius of him is muted and enemies more then 15 meters away cannot see him- this increases to 25 while he is bullet jumping however. Each one of Vauban's allies will be followed by a small drone that increases their crit chance and finisher damage.

Reinforcements is a bit of a weird ability so i doubt it will be liked by many of you. It is a pretty far departure from what Vauban has been for much of his existance, a softball dispenser. An additional thought is that upon calling reinforcements vauban will be enclosed in an invinvible capsule of sorts. WIthin the capsule he can pick his reinforcements as well as modify his currently active kit. THis gives him even greater versatility as he can switch up his weapons and mods if he wants to change his playstyle or if he's leveling equipment he can switch to another when hes finished leveling. It promotes the idea of vauban as an efficient and versatile frame.

Edit-As someone suggested Reinforcements could call down capsules and then you could select one to activate it and recast it later to bring remaining capsules to your location- its an interesting thought- If Reinforcements also gives him the ability to change weapons and mods then he would have to create preset options for each capsule so that this idea could work.

Edited August 3, 2019 by NuclearCoffeePot
Alterations

[Jax_Cavalera]

Regarding Vauban Bastille, If you use the repelling bastille augment power strength matters very little since it pushes everything it couldn't freeze away. As you may remember it originally had no limit on how many enemies you could freeze in it till that got a nerf. It's difficult to strike a balance with a powerful CC ability like that and sadly limiting the number of enemies it can hold just ruined his kit as it made power strength a wasted point of focus for anyone trying to max out on his 3 and 4's potential.

Vortex also has great synergy with this ability, where it has no cap and power strength on both is just a waste of mod points... wasn't always this way, back when there was no bastille limit, his 4th could deal some real dmg with power strength. As we've seen more and more open areas, with more and more ability immune mobs... combined with that bastille limit.. power strength has become an issue. His abilities are at best average CC and certainly any killing being done will be from your weapons.

The real parts of his kit that are utterly useless would be his 1 and 2.  I will add that like most warframes, vauban's abilities are becoming quickly useless against the corpus where every 2nd enemy is now walking around with some form of nullifier bubble.

So regarding his 1st ability, switchables are clunky, you often wind up throwing the wrong thing out when the pressure is on coz it's hard to quickly spam it. I like your approach though for making it an offensive type ability. If it can work better with bastille that would be ideal, something like: drains enemy shields => armor => hp (starts at shields and works to hp once none of the others are left).

With all that being said and done here's where I've kind of landed at:

1. Savage Drain - At a rate of X%/s drains enemy shields -> then armor -> and finally their HP for X duration.
   • Enemies under the influence of Bastille have X% of drained shields, armor and hp transferred to Vauban and allies standing inside the range of Bastille
2. Bastille - Increased base ability range by 3x the current one so players can push points into pwr strength for better overall kit synergy
3. Vortex - No change
4. Reinforcements - as described in OP (really like this idea and believe with those changes his entire kit becomes more useful)

 

[NuclearCoffeePot]

18 minutes ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

Regarding Vauban Bastille, If you use the repelling bastille augment power strength matters very little since it pushes everything it couldn't freeze away. As you may remember it originally had no limit on how many enemies you could freeze in it till that got a nerf. It's difficult to strike a balance with a powerful CC ability like that and sadly limiting the number of enemies it can hold just ruined his kit as it made power strength a wasted point of focus for anyone trying to max out on his 3 and 4's potential.

Vortex also has great synergy with this ability, where it has no cap and power strength on both is just a waste of mod points... wasn't always this way, back when there was no bastille limit, his 4th could deal some real dmg with power strength. As we've seen more and more open areas, with more and more ability immune mobs... combined with that bastille limit.. power strength has become an issue. His abilities are at best average CC and certainly any killing being done will be from your weapons.

The real parts of his kit that are utterly useless would be his 1 and 2.  I will add that like most warframes, vauban's abilities are becoming quickly useless against the corpus where every 2nd enemy is now walking around with some form of nullifier bubble.

So regarding his 1st ability, switchables are clunky, you often wind up throwing the wrong thing out when the pressure is on coz it's hard to quickly spam it. I like your approach though for making it an offensive type ability. If it can work better with bastille that would be ideal, something like: drains enemy shields => armor => hp (starts at shields and works to hp once none of the others are left).

With all that being said and done here's where I've kind of landed at:

1. Savage Drain - At a rate of X%/s drains enemy shields -> then armor -> and finally their HP for X duration.
   • Enemies under the influence of Bastille have X% of drained shields, armor and hp transferred to Vauban and allies standing inside the range of Bastille
2. Bastille - Increased base ability range by 3x the current one so players can push points into pwr strength for better overall kit synergy
3. Vortex - No change
4. Reinforcements - as described in OP (really like this idea and believe with those changes his entire kit becomes more useful)

 

Thanks for the feedback. Im glad you liked some of my ideas and i will take your comment into account when i next update this concept. I was wondering what you though of the idea of making other abilities gain bonus range while inside bastille. It came from another concept i had which did nothing but change the 2 and made tesla more like arc traps, as well as add that feature. The 2 would cause a damage instance to all enemies currently within teh range of your traps so the idea was to synergize by using the enhanced range insisde bastille to overlap multiple trap radius's and proc multiple damage- What do you think of that concept?

[Jax_Cavalera]

2 minutes ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

I was wondering what you though of the idea of making other abilities gain bonus range while inside bastille.

Yes love this.. I believe vortex should extend to fill the range of bastille if cast inside of it.. so it kind of "stickies" to the middle of the bastille.. gives a way to combine the 2 if you want to draw everything into the middle.

[(PSN)yandelyandel2000]

17 minutes ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

Yes love this.. I believe vortex should extend to fill the range of bastille if cast inside of it.. so it kind of "stickies" to the middle of the bastille.. gives a way to combine the 2 if you want to draw everything into the middle.

But I don't see a vortex here 😥 

Would be even better if Vortex spreads its damage (damage from weapons) to all enemies affected by considering how Bastille and Vortex CCs enemies and causing Vauban go to where they're stuck/immobile

Competes very well with Strangledome+ that whip ability. Although at least with Vortex, allies can shoot enemies without much hinderances. 

Edited July 28, 2019 by (PS4)yandelyandel2000

[Jax_Cavalera]

On 2019-07-29 at 8:34 AM, (PS4)yandelyandel2000 said:

But I don't see a vortex here

I was more so hoping vortex would be put back in based on my posted feedback 😛

[NuclearCoffeePot]

7 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

I was more so hoping vortex would be put back in based on my posted feedback 😛

Ill see what i can do with vortex. I'd like to incorporate it more as well

[NuclearCoffeePot]

13 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

I was more so hoping vortex would be put back in based on my posted feedback 😛

Ive incorporated vortex's function more- please have a look and give me your opinion.

[Jax_Cavalera]

Below are concerns / potential fixes for abilities:
1. (Concern) clunky multi-mode abilities. (Fix) take 2 mine mode sounds like more than enough on it's own.. just make it a sticky mine so it could be on ally or boss drawing mobs to the target.

2. (Concern) vauban is more a mechanic than sorcerer..(fix) Have it as an aoe that deploys from a throwable nade releasing nano-bots that temp add those fx to ally n vaub if in range.
 

[NuclearCoffeePot]

15 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

(Concern) vauban is more a mechanic than sorcerer..(fix) Have it as an aoe that deploys from a throwable nade releasing nano-bots that temp add those fx to ally n vaub if in range.

Or create a cloud of said nanites originating from vaubans position- 

[NuclearCoffeePot]

15 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

1. (Concern) clunky multi-mode abilities. (Fix) take 2 mine mode sounds like more than enough on it's own.. just make it a sticky mine so it could be on ally or boss drawing mobs to the target.

My decision to make a grenade mode as well spawns from vaubans lack of aggressive options in his current form. Many reworks stick with this trend and focus heavily on his defensive options. The three modes are meant for three different opportunities of playstyle- Mine is for extra defensiveness- Grenade is for damaging groups and reducing defenses- allowing you and your team to kill them more easily- Seeker is a more tactile option for seeking out enemies you cannot see- allowing vauban to remain at a location while his seeker takes care of enemies out of his line of sight- while i agree multi mode is generally clunky at least with current minelayer i dont see the problem with this- set up mines before the start of a wave or keep it hovered on grenade mode during offensive missions- seeker is not necessarily necessary and just having mine and grenade works- just switching between two already reduces clunkiness

[NuclearCoffeePot]

On 2019-07-28 at 6:34 PM, (PS4)yandelyandel2000 said:

But I don't see a vortex here 😥 

Would be even better if Vortex spreads its damage (damage from weapons) to all enemies affected by considering how Bastille and Vortex CCs enemies and causing Vauban go to where they're stuck/immobile

Competes very well with Strangledome+ that whip ability. Although at least with Vortex, allies can shoot enemies without much hinderances. 

I have altered the 1st ability with you and others comments in mind- you may like it more now as it focuses on vortex mechanics

[Jax_Cavalera]

2 hours ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

Or create a cloud of said nanites originating from vaubans position- 

Yep that works even better nice 🙂

2 hours ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

Mine is for extra defensiveness- Grenade is for damaging groups and reducing defenses- allowing you and your team to kill them more easily- Seeker is a more tactile option for seeking out enemies you cannot see

I agree with you that he needs the ability to go offensive as well as be defensive. I believe his 2 ability gives him substantial offensive abilities, similar to how mesa can use her 3rd ability with her 4th.. vauban just uses that new 2 ability at max rank and it enables him and allies in range to have that dmg reduction + boosted dmg output.  when combined with that 1st ability it creates a synergy where by enemies are drawn to a kill zone, while their drops are drawn to the team and the team mitigate dmg as they deal harder dmg to those enemies.

I'm ok with him not having a stealth stealth type mode simply because we have other frames that are good for that work but no one is as good at laying tactical CC like vauban can since most other frames have their CC attached to themselves and that's a big adnvantage. Octavia has that same benefit with her abilities as well for the most part.
 

47 minutes ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

I have altered the 1st ability with you and others comments in mind- you may like it more now as it focuses on vortex mechanics

Sweet, just taking a look now.
What if the 1st ability is just the land mine mode but it works mostly like the grenade mode so:

• Vauban throws the mine (base max mines are 4, affected by pwr strength.. likely tops out at 8 mines)
• Mine lands and waits for an enemy to come in range (no duration meter)
• Enemy comes in range and the mine activates (duration starts to run)
• On activation the mine explodes dealing X blast dmg (affected by pwr strength)
• Blast creates a vacuum at the epicenter which forms the vortex that starts to draw in enemies absorbing their shields and armor
• When the duration expires, the vortex releases X% of the absorbed shields and armor as blast dmg (affected by pwr strength)

In this regard, it can work as both the offensive and defensive tools depending on what cycle it's at and how the player has modded their kit out..

• If the player mods for range and duration, it will have less dmg output and provide really good CC.
• If they mod for dmg and range, it will have decent range and great damage.
• If they mod for dmg and duration, it can be used as uniquely placed CC that completely wipes enemy armor and shields on choke-points in the map
• If they mod for pure dmg, it will have small range and be very lethal.. so you count on having 8 of them vs the normal 4 due to pwr strength synergy.

[(PSN)yandelyandel2000]

Implementation of the vortex mechanic is good 😀

[NuclearCoffeePot]

14 minutes ago, (PS4)yandelyandel2000 said:

Implementation of the vortex mechanic is good 😀

Thx 🙂

[NuclearCoffeePot]

26 minutes ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

Vauban throws the mine (base max mines are 4, affected by pwr strength.. likely tops out at 8 mines)

This was already what i was thinking. all the modes have a different shape- mine is a disk so it would be thrown with frisbee like animation.

26 minutes ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

I'm ok with him not having a stealth stealth type mode simply because we have other frames that are good for that work

I agree with that- The stealth mode is not there because he so much as needs it but to fit with the theme of being a tacticale, versatile, engineer, with options for any scenario

 

26 minutes ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

• f the player mods for range and duration, it will have less dmg output and provide really good CC.
• If they mod for dmg and range, it will have decent range and great damage.
• If they mod for dmg and duration, it can be used as uniquely placed CC that completely wipes enemy armor and shields on choke-points in the map
• If they mod for pure dmg, it will have small range and be very lethal.. so you count on having 8 of them vs the normal 4 due to pwr strength synergy.

Precisely what i had intended😍versatility

 

I added a thought for his 4 idea- I considered the idea of having 4 call a "remote arsenal" pod around him that lets him change his weapons or mods to let him change playstyle mid mission

Edited July 31, 2019 by NuclearCoffeePot

[(PSN)yandelyandel2000]

On 2019-07-28 at 5:08 PM, NuclearCoffeePot said:

1. Available at Reinforcements first level is guardian- Provides Vauban with bonus personal defenses as well as two osprey like sentinels that boost nearby allies armor and shields-
2. At Reinforcement level 2 Blitz becomes available- Centered around offensive play Blitz increases Vauban's movement and attack speed while 2 jackal like drones follow at his heels- these jackals shock the closest target with a high status chance before attacking normally in melee
3. At Reinforcements final level Tactical becomes available- Tactical gives Vauban more usage in missions like spy- The sound of all weapon fire and death  screams within a certain radius of him is muted and enemies more then 15 meters away cannot see him- this increases to 25 while he is bullet jumping however. Each one of Vauban's allies will be followed by a small drone that increases their crit chance and finisher damage.

Reinforcements is a bit of a weird ability so i doubt it will be liked by many of you. It is a pretty far departure from what Vauban has been for much of his existance, a softball dispenser. An additional thought is that upon calling reinforcements vauban will be enclosed in an invinvible capsule of sorts. WIthin the capsule he can pick his reinforcements as well as modify his currently active kit. THis gives him even greater versatility as he can switch up his weapons and mods if he wants to change his playstyle or if he's leveling equipment he can switch to another when hes finished leveling. It promotes the idea of vauban as an efficient and versatile frame.

The reinforcements are not bad either. Also the ability could just bring down 3-4 capsules to open with an image on each to solve the cycle. Where holding it would re-position the remaining capsules to Vauban if needed.   

[Jax_Cavalera]

On 2019-08-01 at 7:54 AM, NuclearCoffeePot said:

I added a thought for his 4 idea- I considered the idea of having 4 call a "remote arsenal" pod around him that lets him change his weapons or mods to let him change playstyle mid mission

I like the idea of his ultimate calling in a "remote arsenal" pod and then the entire squad can restock, re-mod, etc from it. As powerful as that might be in some scenarios, it may need to do a little more than just provide a restocking.

• Not affected by duration - Only one "remote arsenal" can be deployed at a time. Recasting once cooldown is over replaces the previously deployed one.
• Cooldown timer is affected by duration (higher duration..shorter the cooldown period)
• Deploys Aura boosting nano-bots
• Launches 2 Osprey sentinels that follow Vauban, providing armor and shield boosts to him + any nearby allies in radius.
  • Ospreys lock onto enemy weak-points delivering a (max capped) 300% crit-chance boost to Vauban's primary and secondary weapons
  • Osprey's power cell runs down based on Vauban's duration -> Power cells recharge while in range of the "remote arsenal"
  • If Ospreys completely run out of power or HP they self-detonate sending out an EMP shotckwave (radius based on range) that disables all machines for X seconds knocking down enemies in range of the shockwave (Vauban must go back to the "remote arsenal" to get new Ospreys (osprey respawn cooldown is reduced based on duration) 

Maybe it could be something like that? or were you thinking it might be a little different to that?

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jax_Cavalera

[NuclearCoffeePot]

5 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

Launches 2 Osprey sentinels that follow Vauban, providing armor and shield boosts to him + any nearby allies in radius

This is already a part of the guardian reinforcement suit

5 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

Deploys Aura boosting nano-bots

DO you mean they boost aura mod effectiveness

5 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

Ospreys lock onto enemy weak-points delivering a (max capped) 300% crit-chance boost to Vauban's primary and secondary weapons

Doesn't seem necessary- I was thinking of changing bolster from a fire rate increase to a crit chance bonus- then if the alternative version of his 1 with the elemental cycle ischosen for the final concept he can provide teammates with massive weapon boosts

5 hours ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

Maybe it could be something like that? or were you thinking it might be a little different to that?

I dont think it should do a lot of things. In this game we have frames who press 4 and everything dies or everyone is healed. Giving vaubans new 4 this many features would be like "hey, press 4, now all of your problems are solved, dmg, ammo, mod changes, weapon changes, survivability- not to mention after some discussion with some community members they all shared the same concern at the pod idea, it would take time to change things on you making it clunky to use and you don't often change your mod selection and when you do you could just change it inorbiter, so i'll probably scrap the remote arsenal ability but I think making sure every  reinforcement suit has equally impactful buffs works well- The crit chance drones could be tied on to the assault suit-the osprey sentinels are alreeady kind ov part of the guardian suit, and the stealth suit is already capable of muting sounds and visuals so an active compponent like drones may not work, possibly the aura boost for that

[Gruiz]

Bolster/Nano machines somehow doesnt fit him

He is engineer not scientist or researcher

[Jax_Cavalera]

6 hours ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

DO you mean they boost aura mod effectiveness

Yeah that was the idea behind it so whatever auras the squad was running get a boost while in radius of the Ospreys.
 

6 hours ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

I dont think it should do a lot of things. In this game we have frames who press 4 and everything dies or everyone is healed. Giving vaubans new 4 this many features would be like "hey, press 4, now all of your problems are solved, dmg, ammo, mod changes, weapon changes, survivability

I was more just trying to confirm what it was that you were thinking it would ultimately do. I agree it shouldn't be a press 1 button to fix all your problems, Without it being some sort of utility based ability at the core that can scale to increase his chances of survival I don't know how well it would pan out.
 

3 hours ago, Gruiz said:

Bolster/Nano machines somehow doesnt fit him

Depending on how the nano-tech is generated in this futuristic world, it's quite possible and most likely the nano technology would be engineered not biological considering their unfortunate history with bio tech ... infested.

The main things are

• His kit needs to move away from switchables as that kind of mechanic is clunky in the heat of battle. Ivara's arrow switching to the wrong thing has been a real pain point of her kit (main reason i prefer not running ivara) and it was an unwelcome change to Vauban's kit, considering it simply increased the complexity and the benefits of each throw-able were a gimmick at best.
• Nullifier-like enemies are one of the big reasons why his kit went from really useful to garbage as all his abilities that depend on being deployed start getting despawned in high-end content against corrupted and corpus.

[NuclearCoffeePot]

5 hours ago, Gruiz said:

Bolster/Nano machines somehow doesnt fit him

He is engineer not scientist or researcher

It wasn't originally nano machines that was put in because of a suggestion. Also take note he is not literally an engineer. Its his theme sure and nano machines are tiny machines. In our world engineers design them. Also to be fair we have frames that make scarabs out of thin air and create radioactive grass. Void powers can do just about anything. How the ability gets done doesn't matter. Its the end result. Ill change it if it becomes an issue with more people

[NuclearCoffeePot]

1 hour ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

His kit needs to move away from switchables as that kind of mechanic is clunky in the heat of battle. Ivara's arrow switching to the wrong thing has been a real pain point of her kit (main reason i prefer not running ivara) and it was an unwelcome change to Vauban's kit, considering it simply increased the complexity and the benefits of each throw-able were a gimmick at best.

Aye thats true. I decided on the type of switching i did because of this. You can use whatever you need for the mission- mines for defense- grenade for offense- seeker for whatever you need that for(seeker i feel could easily be removed) the idea is that you can pick whatever type you prefer and use that exclusively in the mission- because they all perform multiple roles tou won't be switching though them. With minelayer you pick based off of the effect which means you have to cycle a lot or else not bother- with this version youpick based on the delivery mechanic-

 

1 hour ago, Jax_Cavalera said:

ullifier-like enemies are one of the big reasons why his kit went from really useful to garbage as all his abilities that depend on being deployed start getting despawned in high-end content against corrupted and corpus.

You are right- Nullifiers are a pain for a lot of frames not just vauban- Limbo has to leave rift to deal with them making them the worst enemy- I think he should have some method to deal with that- Thats one reason i thought up the alternative cycle which adds bonus elemental damage to your allies and bolster increases crit chance and attack speed- this is a more offensive focused idea that could help him get rid of nullifiers. Perhaps having grenades detonate on the surface of nullifier bubbles rather then be cancelled by them

[Jax_Cavalera]

22 hours ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

Aye thats true. I decided on the type of switching i did because of this.

I do like that it is more simplified being only 2 different modes, that's far more manageable and they have a good number of scenarios covered without becoming too generalized or watered down in overall effectiveness.

 

22 hours ago, NuclearCoffeePot said:

You are right- Nullifiers are a pain for a lot of frames not just vauban- Limbo has to leave rift to deal with them making them the worst enemy- I think he should have some method to deal with that-

I would love to see deploy-able abilities like vauban's (everything), mag's magnetize, limbo's rift, etc. treated differently by nullifier fields.

Instead of removing the ability, make enemies inside the nullifier field immune to the effects of it.  Killing the nullifier restores ability effectiveness and it's only a minor deviation in terms of balance. That's the trickiest part though right now is where one little shield drops your entire ability (often the thing giving that frame some kind of defensive protection). Other tank frames can just face the onslaught head on a lot easier to deal with the nullifiers, but for frames depending on that cast ability to keep them safe.. having it insta removed when a nullifier field touches it (even through a wall) it's just too unforgiving.