K-Drive Discussion

[OrionSincoat]

Disclaimer:
This Suggestion is not the most optimal, the only and one truth or the almighty correct way to do things, it's just a not tested, collective of thoughts, that i put together while i was unlocking the 1000000m k-drive achievement.
That said, i love Skeit games and i wish to share with the Devs/Community what's in my mind right now.

1st, i understand the reason k-drive is so simple, it's to make accessible to anyone that wants to rank up.
I think a good mechanic is nice when it has a simple easy to enter floor, but have a high enough ceiling for the ones to dare to go full into it.

It there's one thing i learned in my 10 years of warframe is:
"Big numbers make my ape brain happy"

So, this suggestions is intended to make the k-drive more enjoyable like other "Famous Skeit games" that i will not name.

_________________
Mechanics:

Intrincics
 The proposal here, is to add some quality of life and teach new players how to play with k-drive
   -> Combat
       * Focused in survive against the ambient, Rank 10 Unlocks the Course Challenges*
   -> Style
       * Unlocks different Markers, rank 10 lets the Tenno to ride the k-drive (Why not? xD)
   -> Proficiency
       * Unlocks K-drive mechanics, Energy efficiency, boost efficiency, make tricks faster, etc.
   -> Master Driver
       * Requirement, maxed out all intrincics above: unlocks the World Track**

Necramech modding
 k-drive have a plethora of mods that can alter your play style, but right now 8 mods is too little.
 
 Core mods (10 status type):
   K-drive speed, Boost speed, Grind Speed, Grind Magnetism, Jump Height, Jump charge time, Double jump, Air time (Gravity), Combo counter, Combo multiplier, Combo Cap
 Ability mods (many):
   Slam modifier, Boost Modifier, Trick Modifier, chance to resist to fall... and goes on
 
 I think the mod variety is very good, but the lack of space make it so cumbersome.

Maps/Tracks and trick points/score
 - Remove the limit of points
 - More rails, air time and combos.
 - The tracks could be circled, making easy to start the course again
 - Have a **World track, that makes through parts of all races on the map and rewards with all reputation from the day (locked behind intrincics)

K-drive
 Energy:
 - K-drive should have a energy pool
 - Energy will be used when using a boost, slamming and hovering
 - Energy is restored doing tricks and earning scores
 Parts:
 - K-drive parts should alter the base stats from the k-drive.
 - Parts skins, k-drive true warframe endgame.
 - Challenge Parts*** part's 20% stronger(?) than normal ones.

Hold to Hover (bind to heavy atk button - configurable)
 - on Ground, elevates the k-drive from the ground enough to avoid rough terrain, it still can ramp up speed.
 - on Air, maintain the height (stops you from falling AND going too far up, uses energy)

Speed meter
 - Visual indication of how fast you are is always trilling.
 - The longer you don't jump, you accelerate up to a max velocity.
 - gotta go fast:
   -> Segments of the track should have a no jump part that ramp up speed to make a really long jump in the end.
   -> If this get fast enough, it would make players think about using it instead a archwing all the time.

Dedicated Markers
 - Precision marker: the more accurate you are, more points it will wield
 - Jump marker: a cylinder marker that make it easy to get when you are mid air
 - Boost marker: rump up speed

_________________
Quality of life

Uphill Climbing
 - there's some slopes that catch on the k-drive, making it lose all speed when going uphill.

*Course Challenge
 - Tracks modifiers from steel path (Make challenges like nightmare modification)
    Examples:
     -> Changes all normal markers to Precision markers
     -> Speed challenge, cuts down the time
     -> Ground is lava, you take damage while on the ground, Recover HP by doing tricks
     ... and do on.
 - Challenges rewards players with k-drive riven (rare), ***Challenge k-drive parts(uncommon), k-drive challenge mods(guaranteed).

Squad Challenge
 - 1x1x1x1 PvP
 - 4PvE, all players must make X points in the track

[(PSN)Unstar]

I love K-drives, but I kind of hope that DE leaves them the way they are.  They're enjoyable, non-meta fun that in my opinion hit a sweet spot for their level of in-game complexity and build strategy.

 

8 minutes ago, OrionSincoat said:

Energy:
 - K-drive should have a energy pool
 - Energy will be used when using a boost, slamming and hovering
 - Energy is restored doing tricks and earning scores

Most of this is already in the game, actually!  The Vapor Trail mod gives you a very fast boost but expends energy, while the Juice mod lets you regain energy by doing tricks.  It's a really fun way to mod your K-drive!

[OrionSincoat]

15 minutes ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

Most of this is already in the game, actually!  The Vapor Trail mod gives you a very fast boost but expends energy, while the Juice mod lets you regain energy by doing tricks.  It's a really fun way to mod your K-drive!

Yea, but it's only used with those 2 mods, i think the energy could be the balancing/limiting factor for expanding the system

[--Leyenda-yight6]

hace 8 horas, (PSN)Unstar dijo:

I love K-drives, but I kind of hope that DE leaves them the way they are.  They're enjoyable, non-meta fun that in my opinion hit a sweet spot for their level of in-game complexity and build strategy.

but if they are in a sorry state: they have a crude movement, the primary cannot be used, they do not have abilities like the horse or the archwing, they have no other use beyond being something curious.
I support any idea that adds something to k-drives, because honestly anything is better than what we have now.

[FishMcCool]

All I want is a K-Zero Grand Prix where I get to race on each planet across the Origin System over a season against Clem, Maroo, Vor, Nef Anyo...

[OrionSincoat]

11 hours ago, FishMcCool said:

All I want is a K-Zero Grand Prix where I get to race on each planet across the Origin System over a season against Clem, Maroo, Vor, Nef Anyo...

This would be awesome!
Or if it save a ghost of the next player in the track rank for you to go against

Edited July 8, 2023 by OrionSincoat

[(PSN)Unstar]

12 hours ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

but if they are in a sorry state: they have a crude movement, the primary cannot be used, they do not have abilities like the horse or the archwing, they have no other use beyond being something curious.

I think whether they're in a "sorry state" or not depends on what you want from them.  If you want a skateboard, they're great.

12 hours ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

they have a crude movement

Do they?  They move like a skateboard in skateboard games.  Feels good to me at least.  What problems are you having?  If you share your K-drive build, I'd be happy to try to help you overcome them.

Now, if you want a skateboard to compete with the efficacy of Archwings and Kaithes as a mode of rapid transportation, it's just never going to happen.  In short, things that fly through the open air can go incredibly fast without downsides, while the same will never be true for a land-based vehicle that has to allow players the time required to react to things like trees and rocks and geometry.

12 hours ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

they do not have abilities like the horse or the archwing

This is simply false; with the right mods, a K-Drive has abilities that are arguably more valuable than a Kaithe's.

And if we're being honest, the majority of people aren't getting much use out of the abilities from Archwings, Kaithes, or K-Drives in ground missions, because they're generally not that impactful compared to any number of less cumbersome alternatives that are available.  Archwing abilities are the most impactful, but a gentle tap will end your Archwing ride, making it much nicer in theory than in practice.

[(PSN)Unstar]

22 hours ago, OrionSincoat said:

Yea, but it's only used with those 2 mods, i think the energy could be the balancing/limiting factor for expanding the system

It could, but I also think this could end up scaring off a lot of players.  At least the way the system currently is, I like that players can opt into whether they're up for this level of additional micro-management in their skateboard experience.  But if things changed maybe it would make more sense to have it be default.

[OrionSincoat]

2 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

It could, but I also think this could end up scaring off a lot of players.  At least the way the system currently is, I like that players can opt into whether they're up for this level of additional micro-management in their skateboard experience.  But if things changed maybe it would make more sense to have it be default.

This is just a game design problem, this is why i suggested to use the intrincics as a way to teach new players.
And thats why i said that we need a low skill floor and a high skill ceiling =p
New players can play the game and level up the k-drives for mastery, but if you wish to learn how to make tricks, combos and see big numbers, you could by mastering the K-drive, the same goes with real live Skeit, it's easy to ride the board (you could even sat on it), but it's really hard to do tricks

Edited July 8, 2023 by OrionSincoat

[--Leyenda-yight6]

hace 4 horas, (PSN)Unstar dijo:

I think whether they're in a "sorry state" or not depends on what you want from them.  If you want a skateboard, they're great.

Do they?  They move like a skateboard in skateboard games.  Feels good to me at least.  What problems are you having?  If you share your K-drive build, I'd be happy to try to help you overcome them.

Now, if you want a skateboard to compete with the efficacy of Archwings and Kaithes as a mode of rapid transportation, it's just never going to happen.  In short, things that fly through the open air can go incredibly fast without downsides, while the same will never be true for a land-based vehicle that has to allow players the time required to react to things like trees and rocks and geometry.

This is simply false; with the right mods, a K-Drive has abilities that are arguably more valuable than a Kaithe's.

And if we're being honest, the majority of people aren't getting much use out of the abilities from Archwings, Kaithes, or K-Drives in ground missions, because they're generally not that impactful compared to any number of less cumbersome alternatives that are available.  Archwing abilities are the most impactful, but a gentle tap will end your Archwing ride, making it much nicer in theory than in practice.

the mods i have are: juice, air time, pop top, extreme velocity, venerdo hoverdrive, poppin vert, nitro boost, inertia dampeners.
I'm not asking that the k drive have the maneuverability of an archwing, I'm just asking that it doesn't feel like it's driving a tank and that it has more uses than just being an energy restorer.

[(PSN)Unstar]

18 hours ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

I'm not asking that the k drive have the maneuverability of an archwing, I'm just asking that it doesn't feel like it's driving a tank

When you say tank, do you mean that it feels slow, or that it has difficulty turning, or that it feels like it's using actual "tank controls" the way Resident Evil did on the first Playstation?  Hopefully if I better understand your issue I'll be able to provide some better advice.

You may already know this, but on the off-chance you don't: tapping the sprint button toggles the K-Drive between two different movement modes.  One mode is slower and keeps the K-Drive aligned with the camera (so that left and right movement result in strafing), while the second mode is faster and makes it so the K-Drive will aim in any direction you press, regardless of the camera.  Depending on what I'm doing, I switch modes to get the kind of control that seems best-suited for my current situation.  As a sidenote, the mod Extreme Velocity only increases speed in the slower mode, while the mod Nitro Boost only increases speed in the faster mode; so deciding whether or not to have one or both of these in your build might impact how the K-Drive feels, especially if you'd like one of the two modes to allow you more precise control (which may be helped with a lower speed, depending on what you want to accomplish).

That said, some of this might be different depending on your controls?  I use a controller, so if you're using a mouse and keyboard it might make the experience different in ways I've never had to deal with?

[(PSN)Unstar]

18 hours ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

I'm not asking that the k drive have the maneuverability of an archwing, I'm just asking that it doesn't feel like it's driving a tank and that it has more uses than just being an energy restorer.

I do think that its energy-building feature is one of the K-Drive's most universally accessible and useful feature, but it also has some other abilities you can take advantage of:

• Becoming invulnerable for 5 seconds (Quick Escape)
• Creating heat trails like Nezha (Trail Blazer)
• Stunning enemies (Sonic Boost)
• Knocking down enemies + Blast (Thrash Landing)
• Slam Shockwave (no longer requires modding, but can be boosted by Bomb the Landin')
• Electric damage/procs to enemies (Kinetic Friction)
• Cold damage/procs to enemies (Cold Arrival)

Some of these are effective on their own.  For example, some Tenno use Quick Escape as part of their Eidelon strategy, because 5 seconds of invulnerability is an easy way for any frame to stay safe from an anticipated attack.

Other abilities are more nuanced and aren't as transparently powerful, but I would be surprised if enterprising players weren't finding compelling ways to use them that fit their playstyle.  They likely aren't for everyone, though.

At least from what I've seen, the abilities of the K-Drive seem to meaningfully outclass those of the Kaithe (no shade to Kaithe, I love my horsie!)

[OrionSincoat]

10 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

Trail Blazer

40 heat damage does anything at all? o.O

10 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

Sonic Boost

10 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

Thrash Landing

Stuns/Knockdown enemies in 4 meters

All the k-drive abilities could do something, but they are just underwhelming
The only ones i could agree is the invencibility, boost and energy restoring, @--Leyenda-yight6 is not wrong

Edited July 10, 2023 by OrionSincoat