Tokophobia issue

[Vaalyah]

Good morning.

I suffer of severe Tokophobia. And even if I managed to do the quest with a lot of help, I would never, for the love of Heaven, be able to play a Warframe with visible PREGNANCY signs. And don't let me start with the animation! I'm feeling sick even while typing this.

Thanks to my friends for telling me in advance and saving me from the dreadful experience.

Please, please, please, give us an option to remove that part in the 3d model, as we can remove Kullervo's knives in the APPEARANCE section.

Have mercy of us, tokophobic players. Thanks.

[VENDOMINUS]

Excluding all the story stuff, isn't she just gathering storing and firing energy from her gut, like Grendel? You're probably overthinking it.

Remember, that the whole pregnancy thing is limited to the Jade warframe in the story that is no more. The one players are playing has nothing to do with her and is not pregnant. Her nuclear fusion reactor is just a bit too big and round for her figure to be like other warframes.

As far as an option to remove that part of the warframe, I see nothing wrong with it, if DE decided to add the feature.

[Vaalyah]

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/phobia

Just in case you didn't get it ;-)

[quxier]

I wonder how phobophobia people would feel.

 

Half-joking aside, it's yet another topic.

When it comes to phobia there are many. I wonder at which point they should listen. I mean if enough people are not ok with that they should at least consider but if we are going to with any phobia then this game will be like black boxes moving black boxes around black boxes.

[Vaalyah]

Or maybe, if there's an issue, the people without that issue should stop saying "it's not a big deal". I will not go to an arachnophobic telling them they should stop be bothered by spiders. I would support their need for a new skin without spiders on it. Because for me it's not precluding any game experience.

[3xt1inct]

4 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

Good morning.

I suffer of severe Tokophobia. And even if I managed to do the quest with a lot of help, I would never, for the love of Heaven, be able to play a Warframe with visible PREGNANCY signs. And don't let me start with the animation! I'm feeling sick even while typing this.

Thanks to my friends for telling me in advance and saving me from the dreadful experience.

Please, please, please, give us an option to remove that part in the 3d model, as we can remove Kullervo's knives in the APPEARANCE section.

Have mercy of us, tokophobic players. Thanks.

I get that this can cause problems, but if DE needed to change everything that has to do with a phobia, the game would simply not exist as there is something like heliophobia (fear of the sun) or hydrophobia (fear of water) and even aerophobia (fear of flying). These three fears combined, rule out all of railjack, all of archwing, lots of duviri, the earth tileset, PoE and the uranus tileset. It is a hard reality check, but phobia's are as much part of life as the thing the fear stems from. It sucks that you have this phobia, but yeah unfortunately that means you will be excluded from some experiences, unless you are willing to put the phobia aside and go for it.

I know that is easier said than done, but i have an associative fear of needles (yes clinical diagnosis), still i have to get my vaccinations, have to go donate blood, etc., it took a lot of therapy and i still feel anxious almost every time, even though it has gotten a lot better. I used to even feel anxious and got panic attacks just spotting a needle, fortunately that is no longer the case and i can finally learn how to sew. I hope you can work through your phobia in a way.

[Vaalyah]

It's a game with robots. No, I would have not expected to deal with a pregnant one. For obvious reasons.

Again, it is only an option on appearance menu. Why are you, people not facing any consequences from this, so eager to discuss a random request? I'm frankly surprised.

A community should say "we hope DE will listen, since this is an actual problem for you and others", not trying to brush everything off. It will change NOTHING to other players, but will surely help those with this issue. Support to other fellow players is the way.

[R3D_T1G3R1]

I Personally didn't even know about Tokophobia before before reading the post, and I'm not affected as a man. BUT this is just DE's double standards at its finest. They show support and tolerance towards LGBT people during the Pride month and people like and support it, but those comments really bug me. If Kullervo can hide his knives for cosmetic reasons entirely, jade should at the very least come with an alternative non-pregnant skin. And i do understand that there are a lot of phobias in the game, but this is a fairly easy avoidable one. Just requires an alternative skin and the issue is solved, while the issue @3xt1inct mentioned can't be solved that easily as removing the sun from the game would break the immersion, while adding an alternative skin to a frame doesn't break anything, its just some extra work, which is fair considering they also add LGBT related items into the game. and yes, a 3D model takes more time and effort compared to a LGBT display, But its totally reasonable to ask for it. Same goes for the other phobias said user mentioned. We can't just remove Archwing and water without breaking the game and immersion of the game, but we absolutely can add a alternative skin to a single frame to fix an issue. I prolly do have arachnophobia (not diagnosed), but I'm fine with unrealistic looking spiders in games like the Profittaker or Exploiter orb, but I'd still respect those people that feel very uncomfy when facing their phobias in a game. I'm not a medical professional, and I don't even know much about it, all i know is that there are more and less severe cases, so people who obviously don't suffer those conditions should just show a little bit more tolerance towards people with phobias that severe. Infact, I couldn't think of a single phobia that could be easier to fix than this one as it wouldn't take anything away and its a huge W for everyone. People with Tokophobia would have a way to play Jade with the Alternative skin, and everyone else would have 2 options to chose from. So stonks for everyone. I'd even be fine with a alternative skin that costs platinum but gets added into the game asap, but I'd still prefer to have a free alternative skin for those people. Infact, you can even be really lazy and just modify the affected are and make a non-pergnant variant of the default skin. This shouldn't take more than 1 Day and would be a great QoL addition.

[sorryh]

  

3 hours ago, VENDOMINUS said:

isn't she just gathering storing and firing energy from her gut, like Grendel? You're probably overthinking it.

I wouldn't call it personally overthinking it when her animation set makes her hold her belly in the most generic "soon to be a mother pregnant woman" imaginable so i could totally see how someone tokophobia can be beyond triggered at this point. I would say it's too obvious to ignore.

 

 

3 hours ago, VENDOMINUS said:

and is not pregnant.

Her whole animation set says otherwise. The issue here is not her being pregnant or not lore wise, or context wise.
The issue is her being visually visible of being pregnant or appearing to be so. 
at least when it comes to the animation set we have an option to chose something else to pretend that she is not pregnant. 
So I totally see how someone that has a huge fear and strong reaction against it could struggle playing the warframe.

I personally don't even have the phobia and I found it to be unsettling playing as someone pregnant or portraited as someone pregnant doing some serious physical ninja movement. So I simply just avoided playing the warframe all together until they add an option to tuggle it off and make it less visible. However that is my personal issue and take.


Like vaalyah mentioned when it comes to Kullervo having an option to make me look less stabbed. which was the first thing I was looking in the options for myself when I first got him.


 

 

49 minutes ago, quxier said:

When it comes to phobia there are many. I wonder at which point they should listen. I mean if enough people are not ok with that they should at least consider but if we are going to with any phobia then this game will be like black boxes moving black boxes around black boxes.

 

5 minutes ago, 3xt1inct said:

I get that this can cause problems, but if DE needed to change everything that has to do with a phobia, the game would simply not exist as there is something like heliophobia (fear of the sun) or hydrophobia (fear of water) and even aerophobia (fear of flying). These three fears combined, rule out all of railjack, all of archwing, lots of duviri, the earth tileset, PoE and the uranus tileset. It is a hard reality check, but phobia's are as much part of life as the thing the fear stems from. It sucks that you have this phobia, but yeah unfortunately that means you will be excluded from some experiences, unless you are willing to put the phobia aside and go for it.

I know that is easier said than done, but i have an associative fear of needles (yes clinical diagnosis), still i have to get my vaccinations, have to go donate blood, etc., it took a lot of therapy and i still feel anxious almost every time, even though it has gotten a lot better. I used to even feel anxious and got panic attacks just spotting a needle, fortunately that is no longer the case and i can finally learn how to sew. I hope you can work through your phobia in a way.

Here is the criticism I have as a counter argument against "if they listen then they have to listen to everyone"
kindly and please, it's pretty obvious the request here is not "REMOVE THIS NOW! I HAVE PHOBIA!!!" because if it was then yes, the game will have nothing left because there is phobia of literally everything that, could, doesn't and will exist.
if they remove all stuff based on phobia there will be nothing left.
The content can remain and should remain, DE should not bend the knee and remove content from the game and not be accessible to other players that has no phobia from some things just because a sub-group out there happened to have a strong medical/diagnosed reaction out of it.

The thing that is simply requested is an option to "hide" it for those that can not handle it.
For those that have no issue with it can just keep it on. your experience with the game remains intact as you left it it will stay.

There is an option I consider lovely in this game. the fact it has gore option. I loved it when I saw it. I have a choice and adjust the game to my liking. I could adapt to playing the game with gore but when I saw it I enjoyed the game better because it had the option to hide it for me. I had an option.

The point here is, it's good to have options not remove content from the game. I believe nobody get to have the right or feel entitled to order any developers to remove anything from their work due to personal issues. But it should be fine to ask for an option that allows those that struggle with issues to enjoy the game separately while the rest of those who have no issues still play the game no problem.

I personally suffer from SEVERE motion sickness in this game and I wish I have more options to adjust the FOV or POV more which reduces my struggle. I had to rush to the bathroom multiple times while playing railjack or duviri (i don't know why I can't last too long playing with the flying horse). I can not last longer than an hour and a half.
But if I am being told I am overthinking and nothing can be done because other people doesn't suffer as much as me or other people have problems too, is not exactly nice. I am fine if devs can't add more options that match my needs but to feel my issues is not validated as if it's not a "real issue" or "stand in line buddy, if they have to listen to you then they have to listen to everybody" does provoke a mocking sense of feedback towards a problem you are factually struggling with severely.

Warframe is not the type of game we would go "meh whatever" you reach like 5 or something hours in the story and then close it. 
It has a warning message letting us know we been playing for too long for a reason. Because it's a long experience, for months or years to play so your experience with the game is far more invested and what you might deal with that impacts your experience negatively might be something you wish to have an option for to hide. a solution that is simple and not asking it to be taken away from other players.

I do think jade should have an option to have that "aspect" of her hidden.
And I do think other people phobia also should be validated and receive options as well allowing them to enjoy the game equally as you. of course within rational thinking and what realistically can be done. as long it can have an option that toggles or adjust it in the settings somewhere without it affecting everyone else's experience with the game that suffers from no issues.
Realistically you can not please everyone and people will of course complain as the list is never ending of things they are phobic of. But consideration shouldn't be something impossible. Adding options once in a while that allows those with specific struggles to enjoy the game. Not an issue to you doesn't mean nobody should care about it. (not talking about anyone here in this post saying it, but just the mentality I see when people point out this sort of struggles)
The goal here should be everyone being able to enjoy the game, be part of the community, build memories and simply playing it like everyone else without feeling like they are missing out on the fun over something they can not help.

[Vaalyah]

I would like to better explain myself. Removing the bad area in the 3D model is just a matter of selecting some poligons and hiding them. We don't even need a new skin, just the same skin, with some polygons removed.

[VENDOMINUS]

2 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/phobia

Just in case you didn't get it ;-)

Yes I did google it before typing my reply.

 

31 minutes ago, sorryh said:

Her whole animation set says otherwise. The issue here is not her being pregnant or not lore wise, or context wise.
The issue is her being visually visible of being pregnant or appearing to be so. 

That's what changing you animation set is for. It's a bit silly how DE's recent decision to auto-equip animation sets is a cause for this. If it was the default then she would just stand there as any other warframe. Maybe we should push DE on that point.

 

Unfortunately imo I feel like OP is pretty much forcing herself to see the cause of her phobia.

The Jade Warframe we build and play lorewise and gamewise is not pregnant (with the exception of how her animation set makes her look, which can be changed). We're blowing nothing out of proportion.

 

That aside, I did say that I support OP's suggestion of having the option to remove that part of the warframe. Nothing wrong with having a 2nd Citrine.

[Eclipse2024Qc]

I have only 2 phobias, black holes and viruses. The black holes are there at the head of my favorite warframe: Wisp. I changed my helmet so I wouldn't see that black hole behind his head again. Luckily I'm happy because I can hide or change my style. Viruses look like mines look like a coronavirus, I have a nasty phobia of that. I have already shot the mines while keeping my distance to be able to continue the mission. Once destroyed I can continue the mission without trouble. I didn't like it. but no choice, Necralisk is much worse, I didn't like it, the only solution is to use the teleporter without looking at the big building in the shape of a funny virus. There will always be solutions to get around our phobias. You too should find workarounds like I did.

Edited Friday at 11:27 PM by Eclipse2024Qc

[(PSN)robotwars7]

TIL What Tokophobia is. 

I expected DE to say something on the last devshorts, or for chat to bring it up there, but nobody brought it up, so it still seems to only be a very vocal but very small minority that still see Jade's form as a problem. unless something changes, I imagine she will stay the way she is.

[3xt1inct]

14 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

It's a game with robots. No, I would have not expected to deal with a pregnant one. For obvious reasons.

Again, it is only an option on appearance menu. Why are you, people not facing any consequences from this, so eager to discuss a random request? I'm frankly surprised.

A community should say "we hope DE will listen, since this is an actual problem for you and others", not trying to brush everything off. It will change NOTHING to other players, but will surely help those with this issue. Support to other fellow players is the way.

You get me wrong here, I'm playing devil's advocate. I wish everything players wanted was realistic and immediatly attainable, but sadly that is not the case. Secondly a forum is inherently a platform for discussion and exchange of ideas, proof: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/forums, so by posting to a forum you invite discussion and exchange of views and opinions. What I'm trying to do is help you make your argument more solid. Questions, does your tokophobia get triggered by broodmothers (infested enemy with maggots) as well? Does the khora urushu skin trigger your fear as well? Do other players playing Jade trigger your phobia?

Finally warframe is not about robots, that is an assumption you made, could not find any mention in a description of the game where it said this game was about robots....

The game is also rated PEGI 18 which means that also "The glamorisation of the use of illegal drugs and of the simulation of gambling, and explicit sexual activity should also fall into this age category." source: https://pegi.info/what-do-the-labels-mean. Pregnancy falls under explicit sexual activity.

14 hours ago, R3D_T1G3R1 said:

I Personally didn't even know about Tokophobia before before reading the post, and I'm not affected as a man. BUT this is just DE's double standards at its finest. They show support and tolerance towards LGBT people during the Pride month and people like and support it, but those comments really bug me. If Kullervo can hide his knives for cosmetic reasons entirely, jade should at the very least come with an alternative non-pregnant skin. And i do understand that there are a lot of phobias in the game, but this is a fairly easy avoidable one. Just requires an alternative skin and the issue is solved, while the issue @3xt1inct mentioned can't be solved that easily as removing the sun from the game would break the immersion, while adding an alternative skin to a frame doesn't break anything, its just some extra work, which is fair considering they also add LGBT related items into the game. and yes, a 3D model takes more time and effort compared to a LGBT display, But its totally reasonable to ask for it. Same goes for the other phobias said user mentioned. We can't just remove Archwing and water without breaking the game and immersion of the game, but we absolutely can add a alternative skin to a single frame to fix an issue. I prolly do have arachnophobia (not diagnosed), but I'm fine with unrealistic looking spiders in games like the Profittaker or Exploiter orb, but I'd still respect those people that feel very uncomfy when facing their phobias in a game. I'm not a medical professional, and I don't even know much about it, all i know is that there are more and less severe cases, so people who obviously don't suffer those conditions should just show a little bit more tolerance towards people with phobias that severe. Infact, I couldn't think of a single phobia that could be easier to fix than this one as it wouldn't take anything away and its a huge W for everyone. People with Tokophobia would have a way to play Jade with the Alternative skin, and everyone else would have 2 options to chose from. So stonks for everyone. I'd even be fine with a alternative skin that costs platinum but gets added into the game asap, but I'd still prefer to have a free alternative skin for those people. Infact, you can even be really lazy and just modify the affected are and make a non-pergnant variant of the default skin. This shouldn't take more than 1 Day and would be a great QoL addition.

Welp i mentioned i have a phobia that includes needles, a lot of weapons use needles as projectiles.... Therapy made me playing this game and real life in general very manageable., That is how i chose to deal with my fear, by saying enough is enough and then starting to deconstruct it and learning to manage it in cooperation with a therapist.
Everyone can choose how they deal with fear, you don't have to do the same things i did, you can choose how you live with it, but every choice has some consequence.

There is a lot of players with fear of insects, so they cannot physically bring themselves to play nidus. There is a fear of drowning and water in general that makes hydroid unplayable, another one for hydroid is fear of tentacles. Fear of cats, what to do then, toggle a kavat to look like a kubrow, fear of dogs, fear of animals, there is a lot of fears that are more easily fixable or just require the same treatment being: the developper making another 3D model that can be toggled. 

Also can't break immersion of the jade shadows quest without a pregnancy.

Depending on the phobia this will have impact on a full lobby, in this case I do not know if OP's phobia gets triggered by other people playing Jade, but if that is the case should the whole lobby be automatically switched to playing not pregnant Jade? If the game starts selecting which form of cosmetic you are wearing this will receive a lot of backlash from players, etc etc. This would mean they would need to make a check script for cosmetics and toggled phobias, which would require a whole new system to be built into the spaghetti code that is warframe. There are a lot more questions than answers at this point.

And yes i do respect everyone's fears and limits, but you cannot built something that everyone is always happy with, such is life. Having the options to toggle off all of the existing phobias would be nice, but frankly unattainable at this stage of the game, due to the many toggles needing to be made for everyone's phobia. All while figuring out how to have contradicting phobia's in the same lobbies and how to render the game with phobia's etc., so there is not discussion or talk of matchmaking bias, or how DE gives preference to people with a certain phobia etc.  It is a really difficult topic, More so than would seem on first glance, and much more than a simple request.

Edited Saturday at 12:36 PM by 3xt1inct
incomplete and grammatical errors

[Vaalyah]

13 hours ago, VENDOMINUS said:

Yes I did google it before typing my reply.

Then you know it's not something you can not control with rationality.

13 hours ago, VENDOMINUS said:

Unfortunately imo I feel like OP is pretty much forcing herself to see the cause of her phobia.

Yes, because making a ROBOT having birth in a quest is me forcing to see my phobia. Or seeing a PREGGO BELLY in a ROBOT, that I had no idea how it was made, is me forching my phobia. Or seeing that animation randomly that I had no idea how it was is me forcing my phobia.

Look, I got it: you have zero emphaty. Again, giving people the possibility to remove that part of a 3D model will surely not affect your gameplay, since you can watch it all day long in your own frame. I still can't understand your point here: you're not interested? Good for you, why are you trying to convince me that I should accept it?

There's no point in your answers.

13 hours ago, Eclipse2024Qc said:

You too should find workarounds like I did.

Exactly. Mine is asking for a different 3d model, exactly as you could with Wisp. Wisp had 2 helmets. Jade is only 9 months in model.

 

49 minutes ago, 3xt1inct said:

Questions, does your tokophobia get triggered by broodmothers (infested enemy with maggots) as well? Does the khora urushu skin trigger your fear as well? Do other players playing Jade trigger your phobia?

Only the quest and the idea of playing her myself. When other plays her, she moves too fast to notice it.

 

Guys, let me be clear. I am posting this after sending a ticket, just because ticket told me "you have to post in forum, because tickets are only for technical problems or billing problems, post there, so 3d devs can see it". Nothing else. I wasn't asking you all to agree, I'm here so THEY can see it.

Of course I knew community is not a community and they don't care AT ALL about other players, as I saw many times in the past.

I still can't understand why you all can't just say "an extra option is good and will not damage anyone, let's ask for an extra options, then!". Instead you all come here trying to convince me that it's not a big deal. I expect none of you to be able to get pregnant, of course, because official stats are another thing, as you can easily find with some google https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.ijrcog.org/index.php/ijrcog/article/download/11108/7189/40746&ved=2ahUKEwj7p7_184CHAxUHgf0HHfdWAnQQFnoECDAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3mXRKP7cC07EkkUktITDcI

 

So, my question to you all: why you aren't supporting a chance to have a different 3D model as EXTRA? Because the only reason I can find is quite telling and not positive at all.

[sorryh]

@3xt1inct
I am a little bit confused at the aspect you are approaching as it sounds to me like a fear case of opening pandora's box.

When it comes to this sort of issues it can have 4 types 
1- problems than can be solved by a simple coding 
2- problems than can be solved by a different variant model option than can be selected + possible more purchases. (I don't even have the phobia and I would buy a different jade skin in a heartbeat that make her look normal than pregnant personally)
3- problems that can be toggled in the settings and bit more specific
4- complex problems that needs effort to be implemented depending on how large the amount of people suffering from it. like reworking whole map sections, or changing map elements or like that person phobia about viruses. that could be complex and possibly not receive an option for it.

But at no point i believe it's ok to say "if one get it then all should get it, if none can get it then you shouldn't and just accept it"
This is not just your approach and mindset but a lot of people apparently have it, it seems.

Matter fact, why not have all phobias considered? 
Nothing more amazing than a community and developers that consider what they can do to their player base and every voice deserve to be heard.
 
and again PLEASE do not confuse my sentence with "every voice should be obeyed and followed, every single thing suggested should be added" 

Being heard =/= Having your requests accepted and added by the devs asap just because you asked for something.

EVERYONE should be considered within logical reasoning and approach.
Is the solution is simple? in the sense of just turning off some effects in the settings? yes it should be asked for it
Is the issue is having a different model to hide the part that upsets you? yes it should be asked for

Request is not a demand and an order, I see no problem with this sort of thing because it's asking for options and settings.
Stuff that can not affect everyone else's experience. 
It's fine if they decide not to do it for whatever reason they deemed fit but not to be shut down as if they are not allowed to ask for anything.

 

2 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Finally warframe is not about robots, that is an assumption you made, could not find any mention in a description of the game where it said this game was about robots....

This is irrelevant. 
It feels like "the house will collapse! the sticks holding the building are going to break and it will down any second"
and someone show up "it's actually not "sticks", it's never mentioned anywhere there is sticks holding buildings, they are called pillars"
That's not the problem the building will fall! 😂

I have been playing this game for years and finished nearly all the quests, if someone told me "space ninja robots" I would think about warframe instantly. However we are in "this is actually called B not A" and not involved in the subject.

 

 

2 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

The game is also rated PEGI 18 which means that also "The glamorisation of the use of illegal drugs and of the simulation of gambling, and explicit sexual activity should also fall into this age category." source: https://pegi.info/what-do-the-labels-mean. Pregnancy falls under explicit sexual activity.

I am assuming this is part of argument to show that "pregnancy" should and can exists in the game?
I mean like, nobody arguing it should be removed from the game. and taken away from other people experience.
I can see this being brought up as a valid point if the OP said "REMOVE THIS CONTENT NOBODY SHOULD SEE IT BECAUSE I HAVE PHOBIA"
but all I see is the OP asking for an option to select like kullervo multiple times and made it clear it's separate from affecting other people experience. 

Like, it can stay no issue. just give an option for those that doesn't want to see it. if you are fine with it don't touch the option and you can see it as much as you please.



 

 

2 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Do other players playing Jade trigger your phobia?

We can apply this to the people that have gore phobia or apotemnophobia.
We have an option in the settings that only for the player he doesn't see it. other people playing the game and have no issue with the gore but from the other player perspective he sees none of it.
Let's say hypothetically this setting didn't exist, would we set here and try to convince the person with apotemnophobia how he should accept and play along then being dramatic about it?
Setting exists so the approach feels different.

 

 

2 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Welp i mentioned i have a phobia that includes needles, a lot of weapons use needles as projectiles.... Therapy made me playing this game and real life in general very manageable., That is how i chose to deal with my fear, by saying enough is enough and then starting to deconstruct it and learning to manage it in cooperation with a therapist.
Everyone can choose how they deal with fear, you don't have to do the same things i did, you can choose how you live with it, but every choice has some consequence.

People cope in different ways, you deal with yours this way.
Honestly YOU should also ask for an option to toggle weapons if they can shoot default shots with what they are designed with or make it "laser" or "regular bullets" in the appearance options. Because your phobia also SHOULD count and it's valid to express it. you might not realize that there might be thousands of people behind you wish for it too but probably can not even speak english or know how to reach developers to voice their issues so they just play the game silently. 
It shouldn't be an issue to ask than get a whole therapy session to cope in order to play a game. and honestly you should still ask for it because your phobia is valid.
Not cope, learn to play with it.

 

2 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Depending on the phobia this will have impact on a full lobby, in this case I do not know if OP's phobia gets triggered by other people playing Jade, but if that is the case should the whole lobby be automatically switched to playing not pregnant Jade? If the game starts selecting which form of cosmetic you are wearing this will receive a lot of backlash from players, etc etc. This would mean they would need to make a check script for cosmetics and toggled phobias, which would require a whole new system to be built into the spaghetti code that is warframe. There are a lot more questions than answers at this point.

I believe you are simply way overthinking it.
It could work, one step at the time and what can logically and reasonably be done.
Devs can not please everyone. But at least trying and hearing it out counts in my opinion even if they decided they can not do it.
And again like I mentioned in the gore example, it can be an option that toggles it off from only the player perspective doesn't see it. ain't nothing wrong with that.
You make it sound like you would be the one doing it and stressing how the coding would work 😅😂
But in the end, this is purely up to the developers to decide how it can work and again within logical reasoning and approach for a good solution.

 

 

2 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Also can't break immersion of the jade shadows quest without a pregnancy.

Again this is up to the player. if someone wants to enjoy the immersion, they can.
Having options never should be an issue.
This sort of counter arguments apply only if it's suggested to be stripped from everyone else in my honest opinion.
Other players get to decide for themselves what they would find adding to the immersion and enjoyment to the content.

 

 

2 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

but frankly unattainable at this stage of the game, due to the many toggles needing to be made for everyone's phobia.

We don't know.
You don't know. None of us know except for the developers.
None of us can speak to state something factually and with certainty is "unattainable" unless you are working on the game directly and looking at the source codes and what not yourself from a developers point of view to consider if something is unattainable or not.

This is strictly obtainable and possible and only up to the developers to see if it's reachable.
the argument is made here for option due to the fact there is options in the game that makes those that struggle enjoy the game.

Like gore option in the settings and alternative skins for frames with certain looks that appears disturbing to others 
and kullervo option to have less stabby look.

and such options invites and opens for requests for more options that could be suited for further players to enjoy their gaming experience. 
I just wish for more people to enjoy the game as I do and it would be sad they can not due to issues that could be solved by minor options in the settings and stuff to be toggled off.


a Little bit under the weather today healthwise, please if you see spelling or grammar errors kindly over look it. I hope I am understood. Thank you.

Edited Saturday at 03:15 PM by sorryh
grammar and spelling errors

[VENDOMINUS]

1 hour ago, Vaalyah said:

Then you know it's not something you can not control with rationality.

I having the feelin that you either can't read, or can't comprehend what I'm writing. I tried providing suggestions for you to try utilizing to get past your fear, by substituting the traumatic images with something that would take your mindset in a different direction, allowing you to possibly enjoy the game after the quest is done and dusted. Your outright defensive attitude show me, that you're set in your mind to be a victim, no matter what others say, as long it's not what you want.

I have sympathy for people with different fears, but I DON"T for people who don't even try to overcome them. Trying and failing is one thing, but refusing to acknowledge other peoples intentions is just even worse.

2 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

Look, I got it: you have zero emphaty. Again, giving people the possibility to remove that part of a 3D model will surely not affect your gameplay, since you can watch it all day long in your own frame. I still can't understand your point here: you're not interested? Good for you, why are you trying to convince me that I should accept it?

I did agree in both my replies with your suggestion. And you still insist on writing that I'm against it? Are you even reading past the first sentence in any reply? I normally don't insult people for being ignorant, but you're getting really close to being there.

[sorryh]

16 minutes ago, VENDOMINUS said:

I tried providing suggestions for you to try utilizing to get past your fear, by substituting the traumatic images with something that would take your mindset in a different direction, allowing you to possibly enjoy the game after the quest is done and dusted. Your outright defensive attitude show me, that you're set in your mind to be a victim, no matter what others say, as long it's not what you want.

No offense and kindly realize that you do sound like you are attacking the OP here for not putting more effort into overlooking the phobia.
 

20 minutes ago, VENDOMINUS said:

but I DON"T for people who don't even try to overcome them.

 

And you basically confirmed your intentions and attitude about this post right here. this is not about supporting the idea for having an option is about "play the game without having an option figure something out" like you arguing for the OP to just suck it up and play the game ill advising making posts about issues in a sense.


The OP clearly seeking options strictly this whole time in the following quotes:
 

23 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

give us an option to remove that part in the 3d model, as we can remove Kullervo's knives in the APPEARANCE section.

 

18 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

I would support their need for a new skin without spiders on it. Because for me it's not precluding any game experience.

 

17 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

Again, it is only an option on appearance menu.

 

2 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

giving people the possibility to remove that part of a 3D model will surely not affect your gameplay, since you can watch it all day long in your own frame.

which fully supports that the intention here is more "options" 
Despite all that you still approaching it with "yah ok i get it but like cope with it some more?".... You understand? It's confusing even to me let alone the OP point of view.



You claim the OP didn't even try to cope with the phobia and then the OP said:
 

2 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

because making a ROBOT having birth in a quest is me forcing to see my phobia. Or seeing a PREGGO BELLY in a ROBOT, that I had no idea how it was made, is me forching my phobia. Or seeing that animation randomly that I had no idea how it was is me forcing my phobia.

and 

23 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

Warframe with visible PREGNANCY signs. And don't let me start with the animation! I'm feeling sick even while typing this.

That the OP stated clearly it's too in the face and visible. It's hard to overlook it without asking for options to hide them added by the devs.
All attempts to overlook itor pretend it's not there apparently already been used and failed by the OP from what I have understood.

I would even add my own experience playing jade myself to say, it's pretty hard to ignore. I can't imagine how someone with phobia would react. But this is my personal opinion.

and yet your mind set is "well try more" or "work on it" 
in the category of "if you are getting cyberbullied, have you tried shutting down your screen?" to someone saying they are being bullied or insulted.

Sorry but I am fully siding with the OP here, you are under playing the struggle of the OP phobia and claiming they are not trying hard enough.

 

 

27 minutes ago, VENDOMINUS said:

that you're set in your mind to be a victim, no matter what others say, as long it's not what you want.

 

22 minutes ago, VENDOMINUS said:

I normally don't insult people for being ignorant, but you're getting really close to being there.

I think things are derailing big time here. and it's becoming far less about the topic at hand and far more personal feelings against the OP.
Kindly calm down. It's obvious your approach and mindset of "find ways to cope than ask for options" is not suited for the intentions behind the post and it's going off course into something less civil apparently. 
No need for threats now 😅

I highly suggest we stick to the topic here and be less about who is who as a person and more about possibly having options that makes everyone enjoy the video game we like. Warframe. 
 

[VENDOMINUS]

21 minutes ago, sorryh said:

No offense and kindly realize that you do sound like you are attacking the OP here for not putting more effort into overlooking the phobia.

You are indeed correct. As is commonly known "do to others, what you wouldn't mind people doing to you" and "What goes around, comes around". When someone takes on an offensive stance against you, it's only natural to return the same. Especially if you feel in good faith that they're wrong.

21 hours ago, VENDOMINUS said:

As far as an option to remove that part of the warframe, I see nothing wrong with it, if DE decided to add the feature.

 

17 hours ago, VENDOMINUS said:

That aside, I did say that I support OP's suggestion of having the option to remove that part of the warframe. Nothing wrong with having a 2nd Citrine.

 And this is where I agree with her.

I already explained in my first two replies why I feel, that there isn't much of phobias cause , if she could look into it from another perspective. As far as that goes, there is nothing I can't do if she can't see can't see it that way. It's just that her replies clearly indicate that she has no intention of even trying.

[sorryh]

13 minutes ago, VENDOMINUS said:

You are indeed correct. As is commonly known "do to others, what you wouldn't mind people doing to you" and "What goes around, comes around". When someone takes on an offensive stance against you, it's only natural to return the same. Especially if you feel in good faith that they're wrong.

You are taking for granted that people function the same way you do.

>"do to others, what you wouldn't mind people doing to you"

>"i wouldn't mind people slap me in the back of my head if I make mistake! because it helps me focus better and not make that mistake again it works for me!" 
"wait why everyone upset? i attacked someone? wait! that's how I would want it!"

that sort of saying is not for everyone.
I have that too mainly for myself of how others would feel if they spoke to me the same way I speak to them in some situations. for better behavior.

Maybe you appreciate if people approach with directly and harshly to shin up and face things up or you are not trying hard enough
doesn't mean everyone else share your approach to handle things.

The OP took a defensive stance from what I see because you dismiss her attempts to work around it and the OP should try harder.
This is not the point of this post.
The op didn't seek "hey everyone, can you all help me find ways to cope around this issue I have" 
and it's clearly "hey can the developers give us options to play the game around this phobia I happened to have and according to statistic I am not the only person who have this sort of phobia so an option like this could benefit others" 

I am paragraghasing here but this is the sense I understood.

I don't see aggressive that, ignorant this, "ohhh you tempt me to insult you" helping anything.
"he started it! no she started it!" school yard downgrade debate benefit anybody if not just a waste of time to everyone yours included.

it will just derail things to nothing imo.


 

 

17 hours ago, VENDOMINUS said:

Unfortunately imo I feel like OP is pretty much forcing herself to see the cause of her phobia.

This is a believe you accused the OP for and you still doubled down on it invalidating all the OP preview attempts.
You get my point? 
 

20 minutes ago, VENDOMINUS said:

And this is where I agree with her.

Yes, I could see you agreed.
But again you also fully believe "OP is forcing itself to see it" despite all the information the preview attempts to cope were in vain they had to make a post about it.
No matter how many times stated it's challenging to ignore and workaround it.

But like I said before 
it's this from my preview answer:
 

55 minutes ago, sorryh said:

Despite all that you still approaching it with "yah ok i get it but like cope with it some more?".... You understand? It's confusing even to me let alone the OP point of view.



You claim the OP didn't even try to cope

Which OP stated
 

3 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

I still can't understand your point here: you're not interested? Good for you, why are you trying to convince me that I should accept it?

 

22 minutes ago, VENDOMINUS said:

You are indeed correct.

Confirming of the desire to attack anyone will not benefit anyone anything. Whether you believe it's valid or not. This a post of a request suggestion for a solution. it's odd 😅
You shouldn't be proud of it in my honest opinion. (I am not ordering what you should or shouldn't do, just expressing my thought here)


I just personally find it super odd the stance for what personally translates to me as "well how about find a solution for yourself in place of asking for anything from the developers, the world doesn't revolve around you" sort of approach i see around whenever a suggestion is asked, it's a strange. not saying you said this like that but the core mentality usually.

There is a lot of things we don't understand about others. How they cope with something different from person to another.
Maybe it's easy from your point of view and the other person sounds like he or she is whining  like "if I were you I would do this and that then boom! no more of that problem"
which is not exactly nice. better to understand something we don't understand.
If we simply don't want understand it then better not engage with it than enforce again more coping solutions to face them than solutions to solve them. but this is my piece in this regard. 

I believe there is a massive miscommunication here that only leads to further conflict and personal feelings involved to the point it got nothing to do with "asking for options and toggles" 😅.
words not being reach with the intentions behind them as intended and both parties are defensive. It will just be going south further.

[VENDOMINUS]

1 hour ago, sorryh said:

I highly suggest we stick to the topic here and be less about who is who as a person and more about possibly having options that makes everyone enjoy the video game we like. Warframe. 

I feel like you're the one derailing the topic more than anyone else here.

4 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

Look, I got it: you have zero emphaty. Again, giving people the possibility to remove that part of a 3D model will surely not affect your gameplay, since you can watch it all day long in your own frame. I still can't understand your point here: you're not interested? Good for you, why are you trying to convince me that I should accept it?

This is what prompted me to be defensive.

From my perspective, I gave a possible solution and agreed with OP.

Then OP responded that I have no idea what I'm talking about.

Then I elaborated on my reply and said again that I agree with her suggestion.

Then OP again responded that I'm incapable of seeing things from her point of view.

And then I replied defensively and in confusion, because her reply seems to be misunderstanding mine.

-Imo that should be where things end. Either OP agrees and the topic continues into other people giving support for the option to change/remove Jade's nuclear reactor or she doesn't and the topic still continues with other people giving support for the option or not. Me continuing to repeat my point is not does not make for a productive discussion. Ofc if other people like yourself want to discuss further, I can help with that.

[quxier]

20 hours ago, sorryh said:

21 hours ago, quxier said:

When it comes to phobia there are many. I wonder at which point they should listen. I mean if enough people are not ok with that they should at least consider but if we are going to with any phobia then this game will be like black boxes moving black boxes around black boxes.

 

20 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

I get that this can cause problems, but if DE needed to change everything that has to do with a phobia, the game would simply not exist as there is something like heliophobia (fear of the sun) or hydrophobia (fear of water) and even aerophobia (fear of flying). These three fears combined, rule out all of railjack, all of archwing, lots of duviri, the earth tileset, PoE and the uranus tileset. It is a hard reality check, but phobia's are as much part of life as the thing the fear stems from. It sucks that you have this phobia, but yeah unfortunately that means you will be excluded from some experiences, unless you are willing to put the phobia aside and go for it.

I know that is easier said than done, but i have an associative fear of needles (yes clinical diagnosis), still i have to get my vaccinations, have to go donate blood, etc., it took a lot of therapy and i still feel anxious almost every time, even though it has gotten a lot better. I used to even feel anxious and got panic attacks just spotting a needle, fortunately that is no longer the case and i can finally learn how to sew. I hope you can work through your phobia in a way.

Expand  

Here is the criticism I have as a counter argument against "if they listen then they have to listen to everyone"
kindly and please, it's pretty obvious the request here is not "REMOVE THIS NOW! I HAVE PHOBIA!!!" because if it was then yes, the game will have nothing left because there is phobia of literally everything that, could, doesn't and will exist.
if they remove all stuff based on phobia there will be nothing left.
The content can remain and should remain, DE should not bend the knee and remove content from the game and not be accessible to other players that has no phobia from some things just because a sub-group out there happened to have a strong medical/diagnosed reaction out of it.

The thing that is simply requested is an option to "hide" it for those that can not handle it.
For those that have no issue with it can just keep it on. your experience with the game remains intact as you left it it will stay.

There is an option I consider lovely in this game. the fact it has gore option. I loved it when I saw it. I have a choice and adjust the game to my liking. I could adapt to playing the game with gore but when I saw it I enjoyed the game better because it had the option to hide it for me. I had an option.

The point here is, it's good to have options not remove content from the game. I believe nobody get to have the right or feel entitled to order any developers to remove anything from their work due to personal issues. But it should be fine to ask for an option that allows those that struggle with issues to enjoy the game separately while the rest of those who have no issues still play the game no problem.

I personally suffer from SEVERE motion sickness in this game and I wish I have more options to adjust the FOV or POV more which reduces my struggle. I had to rush to the bathroom multiple times while playing railjack or duviri (i don't know why I can't last too long playing with the flying horse). I can not last longer than an hour and a half.
But if I am being told I am overthinking and nothing can be done because other people doesn't suffer as much as me or other people have problems too, is not exactly nice. I am fine if devs can't add more options that match my needs but to feel my issues is not validated as if it's not a "real issue" or "stand in line buddy, if they have to listen to you then they have to listen to everybody" does provoke a mocking sense of feedback towards a problem you are factually struggling with severely.

Warframe is not the type of game we would go "meh whatever" you reach like 5 or something hours in the story and then close it. 
It has a warning message letting us know we been playing for too long for a reason. Because it's a long experience, for months or years to play so your experience with the game is far more invested and what you might deal with that impacts your experience negatively might be something you wish to have an option for to hide. a solution that is simple and not asking it to be taken away from other players.

I do think jade should have an option to have that "aspect" of her hidden.
And I do think other people phobia also should be validated and receive options as well allowing them to enjoy the game equally as you. of course within rational thinking and what realistically can be done. as long it can have an option that toggles or adjust it in the settings somewhere without it affecting everyone else's experience with the game that suffers from no issues.
Realistically you can not please everyone and people will of course complain as the list is never ending of things they are phobic of. But consideration shouldn't be something impossible. Adding options once in a while that allows those with specific struggles to enjoy the game. Not an issue to you doesn't mean nobody should care about it. (not talking about anyone here in this post saying it, but just the mentality I see when people point out this sort of struggles)
The goal here should be everyone being able to enjoy the game, be part of the community, build memories and simply playing it like everyone else without feeling like they are missing out on the fun over something they can not help.

TL;DR. Ok, I guess you want option not removal (those bolded part). My bad. It's ok to have some options.

[Eclipse2024Qc]

It useless, you have to face your phobias as is the case for me, I have no choice. If you want to add a new option or want to deactivate it, it seems that it is not pleasant to see black things on the image for example removing the belly (I don't like Jade's big belly, but I have not afraid of that) and turns into a big black belly as is the case with the bugs in the walls. i don't want to see many black thing in the game. I accept it as it is.

[3xt1inct]

6 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

Only the quest and the idea of playing her myself. When other plays her, she moves too fast to notice it.

Thank you for answering the question, this helps me ground my arguments a bit.

6 hours ago, Vaalyah said:

Yes, because making a ROBOT having birth in a quest is me forcing to see my phobia. Or seeing a PREGGO BELLY in a ROBOT, that I had no idea how it was made, is me forching my phobia. Or seeing that animation randomly that I had no idea how it was is me forcing my phobia.

I'm sorry OP but warframe is not about robots, I have not seen it mentioned anywhere that warframes are robots, everywhere i have looked they and the tenno were referred to as a race rather than robots (race implies of organic origin, robots don't have races). The question of what happens when people get turned into a warframe when pregnant is a question that has been lingering around the community since the second dream quest as a perpetuation of the theory warframes were humans turned steel, and then was a valid question once the sacrifice confirmed that warframes are turned humans. So we have known for about 6 years now that warframes are in fact not robots and the community has pondered what happens with pregnant persons who get "turned".

The quest also has a warning, but i admit, it is scummy to put up a warning, but not a way to get a possibility to evade the sensitive scenes by either obscuring/blurring or skipping the quest while still getting the chance to keep up with the lore, like some sort of text with what happens (dk if reading triggers it as well, sensitive pieces could maybe be redacted) and answer a few questions as a "proof of read" so you still have to do something. They indeed forced your phobia onto you, by locking major content behind it and I'm sorry for that.

Sure i'dd like another form for jade (no belly), should be easy enough, I feel extremely uneasy playing a warframe that is alluded to being pregnant into violent environments and feeding her to helminth made me feel even worse.

I don't know if or what you have already done to keep the impact of your fear on your live to a minimum, but i sincerely hope you find a way to be comfortable with all of it, does not matter how you get there, however i can't stress enough what therapy did for my fear of needles (therapy works on the emotional side of the fear, no rationale in therapy was the first rule me and my therapist established). 

I already thought you might have posted this from a ticket, which is why I took it upon myself of what DE will say when it is brought up in a devstream or smtn, simply because the devs are that predictable. By sending you to the forums they try to see how many people react to it, as a measurement to how relevant the problem is for the community, by having people react this issue will most likely get resolved and you don't get enough reactions by only having positive engagement (cfr. the guy who said that dante was too overpowered to be fun, he must be hated by a lot of the community).

 

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

@3xt1inct
I am a little bit confused at the aspect you are approaching as it sounds to me like a fear case of opening pandora's box.

But at no point i believe it's ok to say "if one get it then all should get it, if none can get it then you shouldn't and just accept it"
This is not just your approach and mindset but a lot of people apparently have it, it seems.

Matter fact, why not have all phobias considered? 
Nothing more amazing than a community and developers that consider what they can do to their player base and every voice deserve to be heard.
 
and again PLEASE do not confuse my sentence with "every voice should be obeyed and followed, every single thing suggested should be added" 

Being heard =/= Having your requests accepted and added by the devs asap just because you asked for something.

EVERYONE should be considered within logical reasoning and approach.
Is the solution is simple? in the sense of just turning off some effects in the settings? yes it should be asked for it
Is the issue is having a different model to hide the part that upsets you? yes it should be asked for

Request is not a demand and an order, I see no problem with this sort of thing because it's asking for options and settings.
Stuff that can not affect everyone else's experience. 
It's fine if they decide not to do it for whatever reason they deemed fit but not to be shut down as if they are not allowed to ask for anything.

First of all thank you for the wall of text and boredom therapy for me.

I invite you to read through all of the comments I posted, as I think i have already answered most of the first section in previous post, however i will reiterate for you.
Your writing style comes over as very aggressive, I do not know if this was intended or not but before trying to word your point, take a breather and refrain from using different styles to highlight words and trying to explain terms everyone is familiar with like the meaning of the word "request" (i know you will counter with "you put a link to the pegi site and explaination of forum", but that was because the person I responded to either showed unfamiliarity with the concept or a misunderstanding of meaning), these things make a text appear aggressive. I will consider this a mistake reading the footnote of your comment

I think you missed this line of mine:

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

You get me wrong here, I'm playing devil's advocate. I wish everything players wanted was realistic and immediately attainable, but sadly that is not the case.

With this I'm indicating I am not against a new jade model, I'm only giving headwind to make people think about how they present their argument, by mentioning arguments that might be used by opposition (developers). 

It is not a fear of opening Pandora's box, but it is almost inevitable unless you know a way to choose what phobias you will validate and which phobias you don't with logical reasoning, which for most will not suffice as fear is an emotional case.

Validating some fears by acting on them when popping up, while hearing but neglecting others, will make people feel betrayed and invalidated as a person by the developer, which counters the inclusion DE preaches. Hearing all phobias, while only acting on a few of them will cause rifts in your community. We can already see this with Homophobia and transphobia in a more real life setting, these fears polarize society, lgbtqia+ people feel invalidated by people with these fears existing and try to use logic against them, yet use the term to counter anyone who is logical against them, even in arguments that have nothing to do with who they are as a person. What i try to explain is that trying to solve issue cases that are emotional at their root with logic will almost always have the adverse effect of what you are trying to do, because if you consider p.e. fear of tentacles and decide its valid and make an option for saryn's hair and hydroid's ult, but then you consider fear of insects as unvalid and decide to leave the maggots in nidus ult or broodmother be, you can imagine the people with fear of insects to feel excluded and not heard at all.

I argue consistency, if you choose to validate one fear, you should accept every fear is as valid as others and find a solution for all other fears as well. What i do not want is Developers walking on eggshells while making a story, because it might trigger some phobias, they should offer alternatives for people, who still struggle with phobias or are not yet in the position where they want to face the phobia. However This way warframe can also be used as a relatively low effort way to challenge your phobias, as seeing them on a screen usually does not invoke the same level of fear as real life.

 

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Finally warframe is not about robots, that is an assumption you made, could not find any mention in a description of the game where it said this game was about robots....

This is irrelevant. 
It feels like "the house will collapse! the sticks holding the building are going to break and it will down any second"
and someone show up "it's actually not "sticks", it's never mentioned anywhere there is sticks holding buildings, they are called pillars"
That's not the problem the building will fall! 😂

I have been playing this game for years and finished nearly all the quests, if someone told me "space ninja robots" I would think about warframe instantly. However we are in "this is actually called B not A" and not involved in the subject.
 

No it was absolutely relevant, OP mentioned in the comment i quoted there (which you excluded) that warframe is a game about robots, it is not and never was, its humans turned into organic steel by a virus, how? no clue, but it is a sci-fi game everything is possible. It is just not robots. I understood where OP came from, if you think it is robots, i'dd be surprised by a pregnancy as well. The question of what happens to pregnant people being turned into warframes has been a question long lingering the community, but i explained this in the reply to OP earlier in this post.

Associating a game with a certain thing is something personal, sure you associate it with space ninja robots, however other people may not make that same association. 
Your association is valid, but that does not mean it resembles reality. The game is not about robots, that is a fact, you may try to ridicule an argument you cannot answer, but not reading or even evaluating the context of a statement reflects badly on the arguments that follow and again make your text more personal aggression towards me, caused by an emotion of yours, than a valid argument.

 

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

The game is also rated PEGI 18 which means that also "The glamorisation of the use of illegal drugs and of the simulation of gambling, and explicit sexual activity should also fall into this age category." source: https://pegi.info/what-do-the-labels-mean. Pregnancy falls under explicit sexual activity.

I am assuming this is part of argument to show that "pregnancy" should and can exists in the game?
I mean like, nobody arguing it should be removed from the game. and taken away from other people experience.
I can see this being brought up as a valid point if the OP said "REMOVE THIS CONTENT NOBODY SHOULD SEE IT BECAUSE I HAVE PHOBIA"
but all I see is the OP asking for an option to select like kullervo multiple times and made it clear it's separate from affecting other people experience. 

Like, it can stay no issue. just give an option for those that doesn't want to see it. if you are fine with it don't touch the option and you can see it as much as you please.
 

Again no, this was a continuation of OP not expecting pregnancy in a game about robots. First of all again, not robots, Secondly the game is rated PEGI 18+, which includes explicit sexual activity, which includes pregnancy, mentioned with source, so others can verify i got that quote from the pegi website itself. The game being rated PEGI 18+ is an argument the developers can bring up as to why they might not remove it or add a toggle/option, remember i'm playing devil's advocate as i mentioned in the post you were quoting.

 

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

 

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Questions, does your tokophobia get triggered by broodmothers (infested enemy with maggots) as well? Does the khora urushu skin trigger your fear as well? Do other players playing Jade trigger your phobia?

We can apply this to the people that have gore phobia or apotemnophobia.
We have an option in the settings that only for the player he doesn't see it. other people playing the game and have no issue with the gore but from the other player perspective he sees none of it.
Let's say hypothetically this setting didn't exist, would we set here and try to convince the person with apotemnophobia how he should accept and play along then being dramatic about it?
Setting exists so the approach feels different.
 

Allow me to display all questions asked, even those you did not include. It was just me asking for more info so i could comment more accurately on this case

For everyone reading this apotemnophobia is a fear of amputation or people with amputations (yes this should be clarified, not everyone knows all phobias).

I think you are talking about the enable gore setting under system, sure, but hemophobia (fear of blood) would be more apt., funnily enough i have a friend with apotemnophobia who plays warframe with gore enabled, it does not trigger his phobia, because the npc dies and the npc gets sliced in half, which does not include limbs, this is of course personal to him and in no way am i implying this is the only form that fear comes in. 

It is great this setting exist, again you forgot to read I'm playing devil's advocate. However fear of blood is a very common phobia, so common in fact multiple games have this option. Waframe is a looter shooter focussed on mass killings, it is actually a miracle they have this setting in the first place.
But yes if the option did not exist we would be having exactly the same argument, to validate this argument, go have a look at the mortal kombat and doom reddit forums (found via google) where they discuss this option. I'm not convincing anyone to accept and play along, I'm playing devil's advocate, i see a recurring pattern in your text, you forgot to read the first line of my message.

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Welp i mentioned i have a phobia that includes needles, a lot of weapons use needles as projectiles.... Therapy made me playing this game and real life in general very manageable., That is how i chose to deal with my fear, by saying enough is enough and then starting to deconstruct it and learning to manage it in cooperation with a therapist.
Everyone can choose how they deal with fear, you don't have to do the same things i did, you can choose how you live with it, but every choice has some consequence.

People cope in different ways, you deal with yours this way.
Honestly YOU should also ask for an option to toggle weapons if they can shoot default shots with what they are designed with or make it "laser" or "regular bullets" in the appearance options. Because your phobia also SHOULD count and it's valid to express it. you might not realize that there might be thousands of people behind you wish for it too but probably can not even speak english or know how to reach developers to voice their issues so they just play the game silently. 
It shouldn't be an issue to ask than get a whole therapy session to cope in order to play a game. and honestly you should still ask for it because your phobia is valid.
Not cope, learn to play with it.

In the first phrase you just reiterates my last in the quote.

With your explanation about what i should do, you are then dictating what i should do, contradicting your first sentence and the last sentence of my quote. I dealt with mine to a point I'm comfortable with so i do not need these options or toggles, which does not mean others need to do this as well. As for your remark that people not speaking English might face the same problem and don't have a way to express it, there is warframe forums in other languages than English, specifically so this does not happen.

Your last sentence again tells me what to do with my fear, at this point you don't accept my approach to my fear. It is not an issue to ask, again I'm playing devil's advocate. Therapy is helpful in general, you don't get it to play a game, get it to be more comfortable in general.

You dictating how i should live/cope/deal/communicate with my fear, is crossing a line, you do not have any moral authority over me or anyone else. I choose what, how and with what level of comfort I want to live, as others do. I will ask for help if i need it, i do not want to have to look at a placeholder because i could not face my fear, that is how i think about it and that is how i live and choose to live everyday. Handling fear, communicating it and asking for help with it is a personal matter and not something anyone can be "right or wrong" about. it is a choice, not a question of morality, ethics or even representation of others. Things you don't respect by telling me what I should do, claiming moral authority here is just showing how you don't think anyone who has an opinion differing from yours deserves any respect.

"not cope, learn to play with it" ~you, this is you stating the point you are arguing against, honestly what do you mean here? should OP not cope and play with fear?
will again chart this mistake up to the medication.

 

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

 

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Depending on the phobia this will have impact on a full lobby, in this case I do not know if OP's phobia gets triggered by other people playing Jade, but if that is the case should the whole lobby be automatically switched to playing not pregnant Jade? If the game starts selecting which form of cosmetic you are wearing this will receive a lot of backlash from players, etc etc. This would mean they would need to make a check script for cosmetics and toggled phobias, which would require a whole new system to be built into the spaghetti code that is warframe. There are a lot more questions than answers at this point.

I believe you are simply way overthinking it.
It could work, one step at the time and what can logically and reasonably be done.
Devs can not please everyone. But at least trying and hearing it out counts in my opinion even if they decided they can not do it.
And again like I mentioned in the gore example, it can be an option that toggles it off from only the player perspective doesn't see it. ain't nothing wrong with that.
You make it sound like you would be the one doing it and stressing how the coding would work 😅😂
But in the end, this is purely up to the developers to decide how it can work and again within logical reasoning and approach for a good solution.

Again No, I'm not overthinking, I'm throwing out hypotheses and their potential impact, aka I'm speculating. Yes ofcourse cosmetic checks can work, but already back in 2019 DE had a devstream about how difficult it is tying new content into the game due to it being spaghetticoded, this system would require manier years of work. On top of that lets say bob has a good fashion on a warframe or kavat that they would like to show off, but then dave has no cats toggled, bob will be mad his cat is now whatever DE turned it into. 

Devs are hearing ppl out about things they can change, that benefit community in general. What you need to understand is that DE is a Canadian company, in North America pregnancy, abortion and children are very significant friction points these days (even though they should not be, your body your choice, then again no reason to turn this page political). This will have impact in the NA catholic community, as they will potentially take it as a pro abortion stance from DE, or it will potentially resonate with pregnant women  (yes some play warframe) that their bodies are not desired, which will end in an issue with body positivity. In NA things like this get taken political very quickly and i think they are avoiding that bad publicity.

A potential reason they might have added a pregnant warframe, to make one of their currently pregnant employee, or pregnant persons in general feel seen and validated, if skinned without belly, they would take this as an offense equal to the fear of OP, being unjustifiably thrown in her (assumption, tell me if I'm wrong, pls) face, the logic and reasoning is which group will be hurt more and which of those groups guarantees more income.

I know how coding works, it is part of my job, i think you underestimate how complex coding functions like this is.

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

Also can't break immersion of the jade shadows quest without a pregnancy.

Again this is up to the player. if someone wants to enjoy the immersion, they can.
Having options never should be an issue.
This sort of counter arguments apply only if it's suggested to be stripped from everyone else in my honest opinion.
Other players get to decide for themselves what they would find adding to the immersion and enjoyment to the content.

This quote of mine was a response to a comment to my very first post in this forum, that comment mentioned how putting a toggle for all phobias in the game would ruin immersion, so the reply is simple, Jade not being pregnant breaks immersion for some players. @sorryh i recommend you backtrack and not make a comment on a quote you take out of context. I'm all for having people make their own choice with immersion, the person i responded to did not. He argued that some fears should be validated with an option (including tokophobia) because they do not break immersion and others that do break immersion should not, so i countered that every fear breaks immersion to some level and once again argued for consistency. You missed the point of the statement of mine you quoted.

 

 

5 hours ago, sorryh said:

7 hours ago, 3xt1inct said:

And yes i do respect everyone's fears and limits, but you cannot built something that everyone is always happy with, such is life. Having the options to toggle off all of the existing phobias would be nice, but frankly unattainable at this stage of the game, due to the many toggles needing to be made for everyone's phobia. All while figuring out how to have contradicting phobia's in the same lobbies and how to render the game with phobia's etc., so there is not discussion or talk of matchmaking bias, or how DE gives preference to people with a certain phobia etc.  It is a really difficult topic, More so than would seem on first glance, and much more than a simple request.

We don't know.
You don't know. None of us know except for the developers.
None of us can speak to state something factually and with certainty is "unattainable" unless you are working on the game directly and looking at the source codes and what not yourself from a developers point of view to consider if something is unattainable or not.

This is strictly obtainable and possible and only up to the developers to see if it's reachable.
the argument is made here for option due to the fact there is options in the game that makes those that struggle enjoy the game.

Like gore option in the settings and alternative skins for frames with certain looks that appears disturbing to others 
and kullervo option to have less stabby look.

and such options invites and opens for requests for more options that could be suited for further players to enjoy their gaming experience. 
I just wish for more people to enjoy the game as I do and it would be sad they can not due to issues that could be solved by minor options in the settings and stuff to be toggled off.


I am on medication while writing, please if you see spelling or grammar errors kindly over look it. I hope I am understood. Thank you.

Again i expanded your quotation of me to include the context it was written in.

Yes we know it is practically impossible for DE to implement brand new core game systems, they explained this 3x in dev streams over the past 11 years (cfr. empiryean update)

If one persons fear is validated, so should others fears, keep it consistent, because no logic or reasoning will make you able to get to a conclusion which fear option to include. Again fear is emotional, nothing rational about it. 

How do you enjoy the game? Do you have any fears that are in the game? the experience of enjoying and playing a game is highly personal as is life, sure you can wish your enjoyment on others, but everyone's experience is different. 

I think you underestimate how complex the gore option was to implement, it was there since the launch of the game, and remains one of the most demanding calculations the game has, did you know that?

anyway i have written an essay again. enjoy

[Vaalyah]

Guys, please, I didn't mean to start any battle, here.

I'm just saying "Devs, this thing in game is extremely problematic for me, and maybe for other players. Since the fix is super easy (selecting the polygons in that area and hiding them), can we have the option to remove them in the appearance menu?".

Now, let's avoid quarreling at each other. Since it's easy to be done and it doesn't remove anything from others' experience, please, support this request and maybe we, tokophobic players, will be able to play the new frame too.

Thanks.