Damage 2.0 Spreadsheet

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Warframe PC Build: 11.8.0 (Surfaced Calculations update in progress though)

 

As many of you may know, I made a gargantuan spreadsheet for damage 1.0. I've been working on a new one for Damage 2.0, but I've been waiting for the storm to die down a bit and for us to get a better handle on the new mechanics before publishing it.

While it doesn't have quite everything yet, I feel I'm ready to put this out there.

In general there are some color coding elements that you should pay heed to if you intend to download a copy and keep it up to date (or if I fall off the map and someone else decides to maintain it instead).

Color Coding
- Blue: elemental statistic
- Light Blue: non-elemental statistic
- Red: resistance statistic
- Green: Mods or other variable to be modified by the user
- Yellow: holder statistic (columns containing these are hidden)
- Dark Grey: calculated statistic
- Red Berry: critical calculated statistic (these are all at the far right of sheet 1)

 

Terms Used

- Physical Total: the total amount of physical (impact+puncture+slash) done by the weapon

- Total Base: total base damage (physical+elemental)

- Procs/Minute: the average number of status effects per minute (assuming no more than one proc per bullet in the case of rifles or trigger pull in the case of shotguns)

- Proc Odds: the chance that a given ammo expenditure will impart a status on the target

- Mag Life: the time it takes to empty the magazine when firing at the maximum rate

- Crit Modifier: averaged effect of critical hits

- Unsurfaced: the effect of a weapon's damage assuming a hypothetical enemy that took exactly 100% from all elemental types

- Surfaced: the effect of a weapon's damage on a given enemy type (shield, armor, flesh, infested, or robotic)

- DPS: damage per second; in the vast majority of cases, the main measure of a weapon's performance (exceptions include things like snipers and burst rifles which specialize in being able to kill the target very rapidly).

- BDPS: when someone says DPS, they usually mean BDPS which is "burst damage per second."  BDPS is the average damage dealt to a target per second as long as the magazine lasts or assuming an infinite magazine.  Useful to determine rates of killing normal enemies.

- SDPS: sustained damage per second; this is what happens when you start accounting for reload times.  Useful for determining the effectiveness against high-health enemies like bosses.

- Average Damage: average total unsurfaced damage dealt per click.  Also known as "Ammo Efficiency."  Usually the secondary measure of a weapon's performance.

- DPS Rank: the rank of a given weapon in regards to unsurfaced BDPS when considered from descending order.  Higher is better.

- Ammo Efficiency Rank: the rank of a given weapon in regards to ammo efficiency when considered from descending order.  Higher is better.

- Mod Efficiency: a measure of the amount mods have improved the weapon's Unsurfaced BDPS (final_UBDPS-initial_UBDPS)/initial_UBDPS)

- Mod Efficiency Rank: the rank given as above only for mod efficiency.  Not displayed in any graphs as this is not a meaningful statistic in regards to how well a weapon will perform in-game.  It is only relevant for build development.

 

Damage 2.0 Spreadsheet

 

Best Equipment

Rifle: Soma

Sniper: Lanka (for single-target damage) or Snipetron Vandal (for general use)

Bow: Dread

Shotgun: Boar Prime

Primary: Boar Prime

Secondary: Brakk

Melee: Galatine

 

Sheets
1. Weapon Stats: Raw damage calculations (don't look at it unless you really want to see lots of numbers)
2. Graphs: contains graphs for DPS, ammo efficiency, and more
3. Rank Graph: meant as a general indication of which equipment is best. I have it set up to be such that higher is better.
4. Resistances by Element: shown in a way that closely matches the way the wiki displays them. Very human-readable.
5. Element by Resistances: used in internal calculations. Less human-readable.
6. Steve's Sheet: a sheet containing the implications of Steve's original system that he posted to the design council. The numbers may be very different than they were in that image, so this sheet is merely for posterity.

Regarding Mod Builds
1. I have chosen builds that in most cases attempt to maximize DPS.
2. Note that there are crit-based pistol builds, but as I found in Damage 1.0 in general, those are not any more viable than their traditional counterparts. I have not seen sufficient evidence thus far to adjust pistols as a whole to crit builds. That said, the Brakk and a couple others (Magnus perhaps?) may get a crit build once I get the chance to do the math.
3. If you don't like a build I have, please download a copy and toy with the green values to find a better build. Please respond in the thread with the reasons and the numbers that support your claim, preferably using the aforementioned "critical calculated statistics."

Known Issues
1. Some cells say "NEED DATA."  This is because I'm waiting on others to perform the necessary tests/datamining to determine what these stats are.
2. Elemental Procs do not factor into damage done. This is because we do not yet understand them well enough.

Other Notes
1. I will update cells that have "NEED DATA" as I become aware of what the numbers are.  If you'd like to expedite the process, you can post in the thread saying that one of the weapons with "NEED DATA" now has data and giving me a source.
2. If you notice an issue with my math that is not covered above, please let me know. Sans-rage is preferable.
3. Feel free to download a copy and play with the green columns to try out different builds. Beware that there is no prohibition on impossible builds!
4. If I don't update it for more than a month, someone can PM me. If I don't respond within a week, the person is free to take over and republish it on google docs so others can see it and so that it can be under their control. (Due to trolls, there's no way I'm just going to open up the spreadsheet for just anyone to modify.)
5. I base the statistics on what I find in-game and on the wikia. I try to avoid using the testing of others until I have verified it or they have submitted pictures/videos of it.
6. Some statistics cannot be accounted for without making assumptions about the conditions of the scenario! The Ignis and Ogris have AoE. The Miter and Glaive-type weapons can bounce.  Shotguns have falloff.  The Torid is off in its own little world.  The Gorgon, Supra, and Cestra have spool times. Accuracy is ignored.

7. Because I am a PC player, I will do my best to keep it up to date according to the PC build update schedule.  There is the possibility that information may be slightly off around the time of updates for PS4 players.  At the time of this writing, the Brakk's damage was reallocated today on the PC build.  I don't know and don't care to keep track of when this change will happen on PS4.

Current Status
- Weapons: waiting on dataminers/testers to find out the numbers for the nine remaining weapons.
- Abilities: incomplete

Edited January 22, 2014 by Volt_Cruelerz

[biggles1y3]

True it is best for robotic, infested, and armor.

Sure you can.  Any Corpus mission.  No armor at all.  Now, Blast+Corrosive gives 175 vs shields, 225 vs flesh, and 250 vs robotic. Total 650. Viral+Rad 200 shields, 300 flesh, 200 robotic. Total 700. Mag+Gas 275 shields, 225 flesh, 200 robotic. Total 700.  Add to this that all Corpus units have shields and Mag+Gas becomes the most effective elements to use vs Corpus.

 

I Haven't gotten to procs yet either.

To clarify I did mean a "situtation with shielded enemies that does not include robotic enemies" so All corpus missions doesn't contradict that. It does look like more damage overall with mag though as you showed.

 

Here is a list of status chances: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlBC6SiIWOSjdHpRdEhqNngwV1ptMlN6MXdJR2laU0E&usp=sharing

Note: Aklato appears to be missing from the spreadsheet

 

This may not be useful to the dps sheet but I'll be plugging it in my copy personally :p

[Volt_Cruelerz]

To clarify I did mean a "situtation with shielded enemies that does not include robotic enemies" so All corpus missions doesn't contradict that. It does look like more damage overall with mag though as you showed.

 

Here is a list of status chances: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlBC6SiIWOSjdHpRdEhqNngwV1ptMlN6MXdJR2laU0E&usp=sharing

Note: Aklato appears to be missing from the spreadsheet

 

This may not be useful to the dps sheet but I'll be plugging it in my copy personally :p

Added Aklato into the data sheet.  I must have missed that one when doing pistols.

[biggles1y3]

Just noticed you have status chance column as proc chance so my keyword search "Status" before writing my own list failed haha no harm done.

Paris, Soma, Embolist, Detron, Fang Prime, Dual Ether, Dual Skanas, Lecta, Galatine, Gram  all have different status' to the Codex.

-----

For shield shredding do three new colums, [ =1/(Y3/60) ] [ =1/((X3*1.15)*V3*W3*AA3) ] [ =FK3-FL3 ] for Seconds until proc, seconds until proc modded, how many second status mods shave off, you'll have to filter only primary and add the X3*1.55.

I'd say anything over 1 second is far too slow to be gaming a -75% shields magnetic proc so we're left with a little over 20 weapons. Of that, top dps by a large margin is Bronco(Dual), Brakk, Bronco Prime, Bronco, Boar Prime.

Edited December 10, 2013 by biggles1y3

[Haree]

Wouldn't Lancers be Armor type, not Flesh type and thus not have that weakness though?

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/89592-unofficial-weapon-benchmark/?p=1674271

Ok check this post, there is some conversation around it but testing showed that Viral out performs Corrosive on these armoured Grineer.

Lancers are flesh type who have armour.

Pretty sure no Infested have armour and if Fusion MOA have armour they are the only corpus and Corrupted MOA don't have armour.

Edited December 10, 2013 by Haree

[Volt_Cruelerz]

So toxin goes past shields, but still has to go through armor, right?

Likewise with viral?

[Haree]

So toxin goes past shields, but still has to go through armor, right?

Likewise with viral?

My understanding is they do 100% damage to shields and health, but against Grineer they will do 150%/200% to health damage once shields are down. Corrosive does 100% to health damage once shields are down but doesn't get reduced by armour as much. This only gets better than Viral when armour gets to massive values.

[biggles1y3]

Corrosive is hitting harder/doing more dps but kill times are shorter with viral due to -50% health on the target.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Corrosive is hitting harder/doing more dps but kill times are shorter with viral due to -50% health on the target.

Only if you proc once at the beginning and never again though :/

[Haree]

Corrosive is hitting harder/doing more dps

What are you basing this on? Videos I have seen, theory maths and my own experience has shown me that Viral just performs better against armoured Grineer. What is your statement based on?

[biggles1y3]

What are you basing this on? Videos I have seen, theory maths and my own experience has shown me that Viral just performs better against armoured Grineer. What is your statement based on?

your own link https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/89592-unofficial-weapon-benchmark/?p=1680841

[Haree]

Ok that makes sense. But the conclusion then is stick with the Viral as far as I can see, it's going to drop stuff faster. So Viral and heat might not get you the highest in dps charts but real world application is going to yield better results.

The Viral proc is also applicable to all enemies, where the Corrosive is only applicable to a few.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Ok that makes sense. But the conclusion then is stick with the Viral as far as I can see, it's going to drop stuff faster. So Viral and heat might not get you the highest in dps charts but real world application is going to yield better results.

The Viral proc is also applicable to all enemies, where the Corrosive is only applicable to a few.

But once you get the Viral proc, you necessarily have to stop firing which costs you DPS as you wait for the effect to take effect.

[Haree]

But once you get the Viral proc, you necessarily have to stop firing which costs you DPS as you wait for the effect to take effect.

Beware wall of text

I don't understand, why do you say you need to stop firing for the proc to take effect? When the proc occurs the enemy instantly has half hp.

Perhaps the nonsense posted on the wiki is what is confusing you? It does not take 6 seconds for the proc to effect, it is instant.

This has been shown in the thread I linked, and backed up by the speed of the kills of Corrosive vs Viral with Viral the clear winner against Lech Krill, an armour based enemy.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/89592-unofficial-weapon-benchmark/?p=1687747

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/89592-unofficial-weapon-benchmark/?p=1689631

Most enemies get their hp back that they lost when dropping by half as well as their max hp doubled once the proc wares out, this isn't the case with Lech Krill for some reason, his max goes up but he stays on the same as he was during the proc but he is a special case. I think the Lech Krill special case is what is making people think the enemy loses hp after the 6 seconds, when actually they are just seeing Lech double his max hp while keeping the same hp.

An important note for you to understand future examples and what you are seeing with testing. An enemy health bar is the same size no matter the max hp, the max hp being the far right of the bar, when viral procs, this max changes but the max is still at the far right of the bar. So what was 100 hp on the far right now indicates 50 hp after the viral proc.

You can for example see some enemies once the proc occurs it looks like they are on the same hp, they are not, if they were on 70% they are now actually at 35% and the bar now represents 50% of the hp it did before the proc. Then if you hurt them a little they will go down to say 20% real, 40% visually, after the proc finishes they will jump back up to 55% (that's 70% when it procced, minus the 15% they lost, this will look like a jump from 40% to 55% visually because the 20% is shown with half max hp)

You can also see that an enemy recovers all hp lost from the proc because if you take an enemy to 70% then proc Viral with very little damage they will look like they stay at 70% during and after the proc.

An example, here you will see the viral proc at around 90% hp, it's almost instant, he will take the enemy down to around 30% hp after that. However that was with normal max hp a drop of about 30% of normal hp, not a drop of 60% like it looks visually. After the proc wares out the enemy jumps back up to 90% - 30% = 60% hp.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB3jcpaA5Vs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB3jcpaA5Vs

So in numbers:

Enemy hp = 100

10 damage occurs hp = 90

Viral proc, enemy hp = 45 (45 lost from viral) but still looks like 90

30 damage occurs, enemy hp = 15 but visually hp looks like 30

Proc wares out, 45 hp is recovered hp = 15 + 45 = 60, and is visually 60

The Lech Krill special case, this does not occur on other enemies, which you can easily go test yourself, I have done.

Edited December 10, 2013 by Haree

[Phoenix86]

the only place where i found Corrosive performing better than Viral are against Grineer // Armored Corrupted past lvl 55-60

[Haree]

Just for reference as I mentioned it here, Lech Krill has been fixed since that video, I have tested with Viral and his hp goes back up to previous values like any other enemy.

[Definitegj]

Just for reference as I mentioned it here, Lech Krill has been fixed since that video, I have tested with Viral and his hp goes back up to previous values like any other enemy.

I made the Lech Kril video in the previous hotfix. Now still working, just not everytime. Wasn't 100% in the first place. Usually need to destroy the cryotube once first.

Unless you mean the fiery stage which i didn't try this hotfix.

Edited December 10, 2013 by Definitegj

[AllenJayVash]

So toxin goes past shields, but still has to go through armor, right?

Likewise with viral?

 

Yes, toxin bypasses shields but still gets reduced by armor. Viral does not bypass shields and gets reduced by armor.

My understanding is they do 100% damage to shields and health, but against Grineer they will do 150%/200% to health damage once shields are down. Corrosive does 100% to health damage once shields are down but doesn't get reduced by armour as much. This only gets better than Viral when armour gets to massive values.

Massive isn't that high really.  Here are the elemental multipliers against a Lvl 34 corrupted lancer. The -30% armor aura was not used, and no procs where implemented either.

heat 0.196 cold -0.471 elect 0.039 toxin 0.157     blast 0.392 corrosive 0.824 gas 0.392 mag 0.059 radiation 0.059 viral

0.235

 

Also Fusion Moa's have no armor  =).  You might be thinking that, Volt, because when Update 11 first launched they did as well as leapers but it got fixed.

Edited December 10, 2013 by AllenJayVash

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Beware wall of text

I'd been looking at the wiki and had seen that video of the heavy gunner, but was confused so I figured I must be missing something.

 

Viral then it would seem would be the health equivalent of the magnetic proc, yes?

[druindo]

This is absolutely wonderful! Even though we do not fully understand the system, this is still extremely helpful! I love the fact that you give us as many stats as possible, so we can look and decide for ourselves on what is "best" if we so choose. I look forward to reading these updates and fully plan on helping out with this endeavor. 

 

Thank you!

 

 

[-IX-]

Soma Crit Damage is 300% not 200% base afaik.  It is listed as 200% in the spreadsheet.

 

This is the reason the supra is looking better than the soma in the spreadsheet.

[biggles1y3]

I'd been looking at the wiki and had seen that video of the heavy gunner, but was confused so I figured I must be missing something.

 

Viral then it would seem would be the health equivalent of the magnetic proc, yes?

yep but mag reduces 3/4 

as a side note jackal with 2k shields results in a mere 3k dps gain if you proc mag in 0.5sec, seems like a sub-optimal effect for dps as shields don't have any damage reduction. CMiIW

 

Soma Crit Damage is 300% not 200% base afaik.  It is listed as 200% in the spreadsheet.

 

This is the reason the supra is looking better than the soma in the spreadsheet.

supra is at 50% cd, it's how the spreadsheet calculates

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Soma Crit Damage is 300% not 200% base afaik.  It is listed as 200% in the spreadsheet.

 

This is the reason the supra is looking better than the soma in the spreadsheet.

It's correct for the spreadsheet.  The value you see is how far above 100% the crit does.  So a weapon that does 200% crits (10 base damage crits for 20 damage) would be entered as 100% because 200%-100%=100%.

[-IX-]

It's correct for the spreadsheet.  The value you see is how far above 100% the crit does.  So a weapon that does 200% crits (10 base damage crits for 20 damage) would be entered as 100% because 200%-100%=100%.

 

 

Thanks for the clarification, bout would that not cause problems with mods?

 

Soma does 300% damage on crit.  With Crit damage mods that increase the damage, this goes up to 660% (afaik) not 440%.  This can also be seen in the in-game display.  Soma with vital sense has 6.6x damage multiplier not 4..4

Edited December 11, 2013 by -IX-

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Thanks for the clarification, bout would that not cause problems with mods?

 

Soma does 300% damage on crit.  With Crit damage mods that increase the damage, this goes up to 660% (afaik) not 440%.  This can also be seen in the in-game display.  Soma with vital sense has 6.6x damage multiplier not 4..4

My system is based on testing done by individuals back in damage 1.0 regarding crits.  It's the same math that I used in my Damage 1.0 spreadsheet.

 

That math was also verified with the build calculator for 1.0 as well.

Edited December 11, 2013 by Volt_Cruelerz

[-IX-]

Thanks for the info.

 

Guess crit damage being wrongly displayed should be added to another thing that is wrong with the in game information displayed in the arsenal for weapons.  

 

I would have thought that crit damage would have been displayed correctly at the very least in the arsenal.