Warframe Is Too Hard For New Players With New Gear.

[Ronyn]

Hi Guys,
 

Just so its clear-

I'm not talking about making the game easier overall.

I'm talking about creating an easier entry point for those who need it.

One of the basic rules of getting people engaged is to not frustrate them. First levels tend to be too easy in games because the player is still getting use to basic things like what the commands are and how the game works.
Challenge should come after the player has had a chance to get at least somehwat use to those basics.

In Warframe that is not the case. I fear this will turn off many new players before they get the chance to see how great the game is once you get rolling.

To clarify-I'm talking about Solo play.

 

EDIT:

LOL. This thread popped back up and suprised me.

 

Guys, In one of the recent videos DEsteve said that they feel warframe was too hard early on and too easy later on.

In a recent update the implemented a change in the systrem where less enemies will be in a room simoultaneously on solo play.

In some recent posts by DEsteve he confirmed that they want to add different difficulty levels so players can find one that fits them.

 

Warframe is meant to be playable either solo or coop. That is the developers intention and honestly its wisest considering the nature of gamers.

Holding on to the "Its co-op" argument is a waste of time.

 

Some new Warframe players are actually veterans of other action shooters and ready for hard stuf.

Some new Warframe players are actually pretty new to action shooter games in general.

They arent likely to do well in the current early missions.

 

A new player should ideally have a mode that doesnt tax them or require them to group up if they dont want to.

In any situation we can say that a gamer not doing well in a mission is there own fault not the games fault.

However a well designed game puts itself in a situation where the clusmy new player has a mode they can get into that allows them more mistakes.

Its just smart to make it easy to get into it for those who need and make it so those seeking challenge can find it.

 

Ah yes, for those suggestion that I must suck and thats why I say this...lol

newsflash=I'm not always worried about myself.

Like many of you I am a long time, hardcore gamer. What is easy for me isnt always easy for others. and then there are others who outplay me with no problem. Point is that I want warframe to succeed and it needs a wide player base to do that.

 

Edited April 17, 2013 by Ronyn

[LordofTibera]

Games fine on mercury. The game reset us all to lv 1 basicslly so we just have to deal with it like when we first started. All the open beta newcomers have to deal as well...

[Lunaticked]

The game is SUPER EASY in Mercury/Saturn/Venus even with totally new frames/weapons. It is by no means too hard for anyone with new gear. At all.

[Ronyn]

Games fine on mercury. The game reset us all to lv 1 basicslly so we just have to deal with it like when we first started. All the open beta newcomers have to deal as well...

This isnt about the reset.

The game is SUPER EASY in Mercury/Saturn/Venus even with totally new frames/weapons. It is by no means too hard for anyone with new gear. At all.

I disagree. A solo player who is not yet use to the game will often have a lot of trouble.

[neKroMancer]

Even on Earth, new frames can clear it if players play it carefully and not play the map overly aggressive.

Not that hard, just play carefully like ME3MP.

[JHarlequin]

The issue is that new players haven't learned how to avoid the damage, stay alive and run away well. There are quite a few things you have learned from playing when your stats could go up quickly to help you during any mistakes. Without a lucky drop of a shield, or several damage mods for their weapons, new players might have trouble getting through the first five levels. If they have trouble there, why would they really try to go any farther.

Modern gamers are mostly impatient especially when they have other choices. The new system won't throw off players often, but if the player doesn't learn quickly and doesn't get a mod or two that work well, then they will probably hit that solid wall that will tell them that the game isn't going to get better.

As it is, right now, everyone has hit that wall. We all have to find some of those specific mods to really get out of the early planets. Most of the experienced players really can go pretty far, but they certainly weren't on pluto before they upgraded some mods.

[StarKnight]

What I learned after I played 3 round of mission in level 20+ ....

Should buy a New frame and new weapon and start from the begining to collect New Mods.....

Totally cannot play with your level 30 Frame and Weapon as there is no Mods and No Bonus point in your weapons..

[Ronyn]

The issue is that new players haven't learned how to avoid the damage, stay alive and run away well.

yep. Its because theyre new.

[LordAsmolicious]

The best thing for new guys to do is either. Play with friends, or play online before they solo. I gained my skills the hard way being stubborn and soloing missions I still dont always avoid damage but -shrug- thats what health pick ups are for hehehe

[DalaiLlama]

True, when I started out I could not finish Terminus without the help of a full party, and we were practically all new.

What is frustrating now is that the level 30 supercharged latron that would chop down enemies like a chainsaw with a sweettooth at a sugar plantation and the level 30 supercharged fast swinging flaming scindo that would do pretty much the same now feel like a peashooter and a plastic knife. I'm sure that with a great deal of time, the system will settle itself out, but for now, it rests uneasily. The difficulty is definitely back, and it is for certain pushing people away.

[Mak_Gohae]

The problem with the system now is that you need to get mods, cores, and money to upgrade your frame and at low levels the random mods may not be any help at all and the money isnt flowing either.

To start, most people are just putting abilities into their frames so they are not going to have space for other things. In my case which i did have space my first Warframe mod were power duration, imagine a new player with that as one of thier first mods..... that is really not that helpful in low levels with those starting frames besides Loki. Maybe Ex with Blind but i dont think folks would have enough cash or cores to put it pass the first couple of levels so the duration is not going to be noticable. Imagine getting shield recharger or stamina recharger, those things are not low level friendly either. At low levels you get hit hard and your shield recharges fast anyway because they are so low. You get the point.

My first rifle mod was crit damage, with a MK1 that is the most minimal of help. With my pistol i got crit chance which is better, and with melee i got melee dmg which is good. So putting all this stuff together i got some average dmg stuff for my weapons but frame survival i got nothing. And i havent played this thing at all so i dont know how the drops are but if mods are the same random chance that they have always been.... you might get a few folks ending up with some bad luck picking crappy to no mods at all for a while. And that is really going to affect how they play the game, forward progress alone is going to be very hard.

[Mampara]

What I think they should do with the Warframe and Weapon leveling is, keep the same "add more mods slots stuff" but have it that for weapons for example Reload, Damage, Crit Chance/damage, Firerate etc, Go up +2.5 per level I think that make the odds better on the weapons without having to rely on mods as much.

Just an idea...

[Zakalwe]

I disagree. A solo player who is not yet use to the game will often have a lot of trouble.

This is primarily a co-op game with the option to solo.

You should co-op until you get the hang of it, /then/ solo.

It's absolutley fine as it is.

[MagpieOAO]

This is primarily a co-op game with the option to solo.

You should co-op until you get the hang of it, /then/ solo.

It's absolutley fine as it is.

This. Also I've solod some pretty tough bits in the first zone without issue. Infestation is far more difficult than gineer simply due to poison ancients who can drain your HP just by being near you (not shields, they bypass shields ffs D:)

Ultimately it's more difficult but you alone reap the rewards if I'm not mistaken.

[Ronyn]

This is primarily a co-op game with the option to solo.

You should co-op until you get the hang of it, /then/ solo.

It's absolutley fine as it is.

DE made some pretty clear statements about their need and want to balance the game for both the co op AND the single player.

[Brasten]

Not that hard, just play carefully like ME3MP.

And this is how you know something is wrong. Don't get me wrong, playing Warframe like a Cover Shooter is a fun (to me) and a viable tactic, however if the player is forced to this style in what was otherwise a fluid Leap&Shoot&Hack game that you'd expect from a Space Ninja themed game... it seems to me there is a flaw that needs fixing. Which has been identified, the lack of Frame/Weapon passive boosts that were a part of the old system.

I was actually saying this to myself all yesterday. With barly 100 shields and health I felt very much like I was back playing Mass Effect 3 MP. Only without the cover system and power on a cool down system (so they could be spammed). Also without OperationsPacks (full instant shield and health restore) and Medigel (instant revive) on hot keys and 6 each every mission.

[Davante]

Games fine on mercury. The game reset us all to lv 1 basicslly so we just have to deal with it like when we first started. All the open beta newcomers have to deal as well...

Exactly.

[neKroMancer]

And this is how you know something is wrong. Don't get me wrong, playing Warframe like a Cover Shooter is a fun (to me) and a viable tactic, however if the player is forced to this style in what was otherwise a fluid Leap&Shoot&Hack game that you'd expect from a Space Ninja themed game... it seems to me there is a flaw that needs fixing. Which has been identified, the lack of Frame/Weapon passive boosts that were a part of the old system.

I was actually saying this to myself all yesterday. With barly 100 shields and health I felt very much like I was back playing Mass Effect 3 MP. Only without the cover system and power on a cool down system (so they could be spammed). Also without OperationsPacks (full instant shield and health restore) and Medigel (instant revive) on hot keys and 6 each every mission.

Who use cover in ME3MP? Cover is a lie. Buy more consumables do hlep the game a lot. However, we need hotkey for them.

BTW, the game got much easier from farming mods on venus, kiliken.

[Brasten]

Who use cover in ME3MP? Cover is a lie. Buy more consumables do hlep the game a lot. However, we need hotkey for them.

BTW, the game got much easier from farming mods on venus, kiliken.

Anyone who knows the underlying mechanics of ME3MP? Dat 40% damage reduction for just being stuck to cover :P Plus even in ME3MP you can get some befits from just leveling. Even though you have to grind for Gear and Guns which add the big kill'um power.

I think it's been said in many other places, framing RNG drops does not a leveling system make. Again something to point to things being 'worng', compare an unmoded unpotatoed U6 level 15 Frame with a similarly leveled gun to its equivalent under U7. One is functional beyond framing Mercury's boss and the Venus infinate defense mission. Prior to update I was working on level several frames at once and often went for those shield and health buffs over mod slots because they actually game a bigger boost then mods of that level.

I don't disagree that the game is getting easier with framing... again. But we are talking about the flow of the game for new players. It's not a very good one right now.

[neKroMancer]

Anyone who knows the underlying mechanics of ME3MP? Dat 40% damage reduction for just being stuck to cover :P Plus even in ME3MP you can get some befits from just leveling. Even though you have to grind for Gear and Guns which add the big kill'um power.

Soft cover is your friend. Players who visit th forum should know that hard cover is useless. 40%damage reduction? Soft cover + right hand advantage give you 100%damage reduction while allowing you to shoot non-stop at your target.

However, back to the topic concerning newbies. I don't think many of them are going to have much trouble passing through the first level of the game since half of the community already take a semi-permanent residence in Mercury. However, I agree that level should offers us mor than mod points. Some basic stat increase of our choosing would be cool. Lv30 frame without mod should be definitely better than lv1 frame without mod.

[Mak_Gohae]

This is primarily a co-op game with the option to solo.

You should co-op until you get the hang of it, /then/ solo.

It's absolutley fine as it is.

Not everyone is playing at the same time and not everyone is doing the missions you want to do.

Luckily i had Loki as my first frame so i could invis the whole way through a mission to open up the map but if i didnt have him half of the stages would probabl STILL be closed off because it couldnt find people doing missions i needed to open up more of the map.

Hek, i still have 2 missions in Pluto closed because for those i needed people cause of the high level of enemies.

[chuuburg]

The current state of the game is kind of absurd. I have played for about 8 hours since release and have yet to get a shield mod, I got one vitality in the early stages which kept me from dying every 3 seconds.

I can only imagine there are those out there who are stuck without a shield and vitality mod, hey look at the badass level 30 frame supercharged with orokin reactor with 100shields and 100hp!

Plus me being an experienced player, done quite alot of defense runs since U7 was out which gave me a insignificant amount of the new mods.

Currently I already have over 150+ of the new mods.

I can only imagine new players with tough luck would be stuck in mercury for days or risk playing at higher levels with 100 shields and 100hp dying every 3 seconds they come under fire.

They should at least sell the neccessary mods like health and shields in the shops for credits, or heed the advise of others and give minor hp/shield boost per lvl.

Edited March 19, 2013 by chuuburg

[FIAMMA95]

Even on Earth, new frames can clear it if players play it carefully and not play the map overly aggressive.

Not that hard, just play carefully like ME3MP.

Yup

[Dgaussian]

I was just grinding out mercury solo. Feels the same and the drop rate is pretty decent. This game has never been easy for solo play and thats what makes it more interesting and fun. Running around god mode everywhere would cut the replayability of this game and then our community would die off faster.

Its not like it is hard to find people to play with anyways. Just hit the online option and run through the levels with some pugs. Even with everything level 1, if you have 2 people you will run through the early levels pretty quick.

[Ronyn]

I was just grinding out mercury solo. Feels the same and the drop rate is pretty decent. This game has never been easy for solo play and thats what makes it more interesting and fun. Running around god mode everywhere would cut the replayability of this game and then our community would die off faster.

There is a lot of room between hard and god mode.

Also remember that those of us who have been reset arent new players.

We have the experiance ond skills one builds up after playing the game.

Our gear may be low but our personal understanding of the game is still high.

Edited March 19, 2013 by Ronyn