[Dear De] So 20 Oxi-Nonsense For...

[Tails-san]

Really, did you really just say that? So, a person gets a deathmark, and because the game is so poorly balanced, they should just halt all progress on frames and weapons they want to work on so they can wait until they are attacked enough times that all deathmarks are removed? You do know that is the way deathmarks work, right? It is not just 1 deathmark then you are done, they accumulate; unless DE has made the G3 different from Stalker and Harvester, which is unlikely.

 

So, you are basically telling players, "Wait for the RNG to bless you by always being in your best equipment for an unknown number of times —remember, there is no way for a player to know how many deathmarks they have— which could take anywhere from an hour to months, while making no actual progress on different equipment." That is some brilliant advice.

 

I really hope that is not DE's attitude as well. The game needs to be properly balanced; saying, "Just stay in your best equipment 24/7," is not the answer.

The accumulating death mark thing is wrong on all accounts. I can out-right farm bosses and only receive ONE stalker mail, encounter the stalker ONE time later, and then receive the mail upon killing a boss after that encounter, with no stalker encounters before that boss kill (excluding encounters from other people's marks).

 

The difficulty in the Grustag Three is that unlike the stalker and harvester, all players receive messages, leaving you rather clueless as to if you're still marked or not. It also appears that they, unlike the Stalker and Harvester, are fully hostile to, and can apply their special punishment to all members of the squad rather than just the person whose mark triggered, meaning that even if you aren't marked, you can still get the bolt if squadmates are marked.

[Onisa]

The accumulating death mark thing is wrong on all accounts. I can out-right farm bosses and only receive ONE stalker mail, encounter the stalker ONE time later, and then receive the mail upon killing a boss after that encounter, with no stalker encounters before that boss kill (excluding encounters from other people's marks).

 

And yet I've only ever gotten one letter from the Stalker since it was added but still been stalked 5 times. *shrugs*

[NalkorRN]

Bolt removal recipe serves as punishment. You failed to survive and you have to pay.

Maybe instead of whining about costs think about your mistakes and stop making them.

As you said already if you cant trust pugs then dont run with them.

I was in my Banshee earlier with Redirection and Vitality inserted, sporting just under 500 shields and about 600 or so health. Just one of the G3 managed to take me out in two shots from that weapon of his and even my Despair modded to shred up Napalms was doing precisely jack squat against just one of them.

 

Edit: To those saying go with your best mods equipped: Someone in my team thanked me for getting on the hate list of the G3 earlier (run 1 of the Reactor invasion) because they had finally gotten a Hell's Chamber to drop for them. That tells me that prior to me logging on and the G3 showing up, that person was lacking an essential shotgun mod. Bear that all in mind next time. It's not surprising that most of the people saying to the newbies to bring their best are founders who probably have everything already and never really had to deal with farming specific enemies in one faction for essential mods.

Edited March 4, 2014 by NalkorRN

[Davoodoo]

Really, did you really just say that? So, a person gets a deathmark, and because the game is so poorly balanced, they should just halt all progress on frames and weapons they want to work on so they can wait until they are attacked enough times that all deathmarks are removed? You do know that is the way deathmarks work, right? It is not just 1 deathmark then you are done, they accumulate; unless DE has made the G3 different from Stalker and Harvester, which is unlikely.

 

So, you are basically telling players, "Wait for the RNG to bless you by always being in your best equipment for an unknown number of times —remember, there is no way for a player to know how many deathmarks they have— which could take anywhere from an hour to months, while making no actual progress on different equipment." That is some brilliant advice.

 

I really hope that is not DE's attitude as well. The game needs to be properly balanced; saying, "Just stay in your best equipment 24/7," is not the answer.

What im saying is that if you know that such thing may happen at least bring 1 leveled weapon. Sure it will slow your progress a bit but its worth it. Really thats more than enough to beat g3.

 

 

I was in my Banshee earlier with Redirection and Vitality inserted, sporting just under 500 shields and about 600 or so health. Just one of the G3 managed to take me out in two shots from that weapon of his and even my Despair modded to shred up Napalms was doing precisely jack squat against just one of them.

 

Edit: To those saying go with your best mods equipped: Someone in my team thanked me for getting on the hate list of the G3 earlier (run 1 of the Reactor invasion) because they had finally gotten a Hell's Chamber to drop for them. That tells me that prior to me logging on and the G3 showing up, that person was lacking an essential shotgun mod. Bear that all in mind next time. It's not surprising that most of the people saying to the newbies to bring their best are founders who probably have everything already and never really had to deal with farming specific enemies in one faction for essential mods.

 

Mine encounters with them looked slightly different, since they arent immune to cc use it to your advantage, you probably gonna have rhino, nyx, zephyr, vauban even ember in your team. 

Go with your best mods still stands, these are boss after all you cant go with unranked weapon and expect to succed, fact that this guy had no hells chamber changes nothing, he might have brought his best gear and as long as he had other mods he was fine.

Edited March 4, 2014 by Davoodoo

[NalkorRN]

What im saying is that if you know that such thing may happen at least bring 1 leveled weapon. Sure it will slow your progress a bit but its worth it. Really thats more than enough to beat g3.

 

 

 

Mine encounters with them looked slightly different, since they arent immune to cc use it to your advantage, you probably gonna have rhino, nyx, zephyr, vauban even ember in your team. 

Go with your best mods still stands, these are boss after all you cant go with unranked weapon and expect to succed, fact that this guy had no hells chamber changes nothing, he might have brought his best gear and as long as he had other mods he was fine.

You don't get it, but as someone who blew about $100 to support a game that still only offers crazy levels of Grinding and RNG after almost a year of playing, I can understand why. Due to Mods 2.0, drop-rates nerfs, etc, sometimes a person's best mods will be crap like Ammo Drum, Fast Hands, Magazine Wrap, Cryo Rounds, maybe a couple ranks of Serration.

 

As for spamming CC, it's not easy to do that when everyone had just started the mission and lacked the energy needed.

 

They are bosses yes, but as a veteran of Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, Demon's Crest (look it up), Earthbound, Dragon Mage: Origins, Fallout 1, 2, New Vegas, and the old Mega Man games, you tend to know exactly when and where a boss will be. Whether it be past a fog gate, two doors and a hallway where you can jump through the second one, a bright shining star stationary at the end of a long dungeon, whatever, that is where a boss will be. You can prepare for bosses in most games because the game more or less tells you in advance where they are and when you'll have to face them, allowing you to prepare. The G3, like Stalker and Harvester however, do not follow those rules and are more like Invaders in DkS, you get a quick text warning with some visuals and text to act as a warning to someone about to screw you over because of how min-maxed they are and the usual recourse is to either hope you kill them, just Alt+F4/Disconnect, or have your teammate deal with them, none of those indicate a really good design.

 

You keep saying everyone should bring their best, but people have been farming invasions for hundreds of runs to try and get them to spawn at all. You're like every other person who says to build around the stalker for every mission and bring top level stuff but guess what? Sometimes we're leveling stuff or just not in the mood for trying to grind invasions for getting them to spawn and then they appear, with the RNG laughing at us from behind them.

 

TL;DR because you probably require it: They are boss-grade characters that only appear outside of boss missions and do so randomly and thus cannot properly be prepared for.

[Davoodoo]

You don't get it, but as someone who blew about $100 to support a game that still only offers crazy levels of Grinding and RNG after almost a year of playing, I can understand why. Due to Mods 2.0, drop-rates nerfs, etc, sometimes a person's best mods will be crap like Ammo Drum, Fast Hands, Magazine Wrap, Cryo Rounds, maybe a couple ranks of Serration.

 

As for spamming CC, it's not easy to do that when everyone had just started the mission and lacked the energy needed.

 

They are bosses yes, but as a veteran of Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, Demon's Crest (look it up), Earthbound, Dragon Mage: Origins, Fallout 1, 2, New Vegas, and the old Mega Man games, you tend to know exactly when and where a boss will be. Whether it be past a fog gate, two doors and a hallway where you can jump through the second one, a bright shining star stationary at the end of a long dungeon, whatever, that is where a boss will be. You can prepare for bosses in most games because the game more or less tells you in advance where they are and when you'll have to face them, allowing you to prepare. The G3, like Stalker and Harvester however, do not follow those rules and are more like Invaders in DkS, you get a quick text warning with some visuals and text to act as a warning to someone about to screw you over because of how min-maxed they are and the usual recourse is to either hope you kill them, just Alt+F4/Disconnect, or have your teammate deal with them, none of those indicate a really good design.

 

You keep saying everyone should bring their best, but people have been farming invasions for hundreds of runs to try and get them to spawn at all. You're like every other person who says to build around the stalker for every mission and bring top level stuff but guess what? Sometimes we're leveling stuff or just not in the mood for trying to grind invasions for getting them to spawn and then they appear, with the RNG laughing at us from behind them.

 

TL;DR because you probably require it: They are boss-grade characters that only appear outside of boss missions and do so randomly and thus cannot properly be prepared for.

You dont get it, they arent any hard at all(they are easier than stalker at u8) and most commonly seen frames have enough cc for them, even without it, 1 barely even modded weapon will be enough for them, just serration/hornet and 1 combined element will probably be enough to obliterate them with few shots, even if everything else fails, how long will it take to get all materials to get that bolt off?? 30 mins?? 40?? 50?? 1 hour top.

 

As for your invasion argument, yes you can prepare for that. You go into human form and you know that such thing may happen, so you prepare in advance, same thing with deathmark mail. "hey that guy really wants to kill me, maybe i should pack something better than unranked set this time". You dont need giant flashing neon just to tell you that hard encounter might wait ahead.

 

TL;DR theyre easier than you think, price for failure is low enough, you pay price for your carelessness nothing else.

Edited March 5, 2014 by Davoodoo

[Onisa]

You dont get it, they arent any hard at all(they are easier than stalker at u8) and most commonly seen frames have enough cc for them, even without it, 1 barely even modded weapon will be enough for them, just serration/hornet and 1 combined element will probably be enough to obliterate them with few shots, even if everything else fails, how long will it take to get all materials to get that bolt off?? 30 mins?? 40?? 50?? 1 hour top.

 

As for your invasion argument, yes you can prepare for that. You go into human form and you know that such thing may happen, so you prepare in advance, same thing with deathmark mail. "hey that guy really wants to kill me, maybe i should pack something better than unranked set this time". You dont need giant flashing neon just to tell you that hard encounter might wait ahead.

 

TL;DR theyre easier than you think, price for failure is low enough, you pay price for your carelessness nothing else.

 

You're still missing the point. Where is a semi-new player going to get that serration/hornet strike? Where are they going to get the elemental mods to make anything other than blast/gas on primary or radiation on secondary? If you think that those combos are enough go look at their wiki pages for resistances and weaknesses.

 

And I'm glad you've had consistent good luck with them to have such an attitude. Mine has been either they lag out and I drop them or I lag out and they drop me.

[Neutralred]

As for your invasion argument, yes you can prepare for that. You go into human form and you know that such thing may happen, so you prepare in advance, same thing with deathmark mail. "hey that guy really wants to kill me, maybe i should pack something better than unranked set this time". You dont need giant flashing neon just to tell you that hard encounter might wait ahead.

a) It isn't predictable because you don't know who else is marked in the mission.

b) They don't appear consistently after the mail. It's completely random when they'll show up, much like the Stalker or Harvester, who take weeks for some people - my first stalker took 2 weeks. And you don't know when you lose your mark since it isn't announced who they're after in the mission, so you don't know when it's 'safe' to wear low level gear again.

 

These are obvious points. At this point you're arguing nonsense out of sheer ego.

 

Edit: okay, after your response I'm upgrading that to either wilfully ignorant or trolling, and no longer going to dignify your bullS#&$ with responses.

Edited March 5, 2014 by Neutralred

[Davoodoo]

You're still missing the point. Where is a semi-new player going to get that serration/hornet strike? Where are they going to get the elemental mods to make anything other than blast/gas on primary or radiation on secondary? If you think that those combos are enough go look at their wiki pages for resistances and weaknesses.

 

And I'm glad you've had consistent good luck with them to have such an attitude. Mine has been either they lag out and I drop them or I lag out and they drop me.

Semi new player without serration and elemental mods probably havent even done enough invasions to meet g3.

 

And tbh yes i forgot how is to die against stalker and such, even when stalker was able to oneshot me i managed to kite him trhough few rooms while my teammates killed him, that was 1 time when i wasnt prepared at all having rank14 mk1 without potato and no ammo to decently modded secondary. 

 

a) It isn't predictable because you don't know who else is marked in the mission.

b) They don't appear consistently after the mail. It's completely random when they'll show up, much like the Stalker or Harvester, who take weeks for some people - my first stalker took 2 weeks. And you don't know when you lose your mark since it isn't announced who they're after in the mission, so you don't know when it's 'safe' to wear low level gear again.

 

These are obvious points. At this point you're arguing nonsense out of sheer ego.

a) if youre going with the pug then you again should be prepared cause god knows what idiots will you meet right? if you still insist that you dont know that such thing may happen then just hide and let the one who spawned deal with g3.

b) If they appeared consistently it would again be flashing neon supporting your carelessness.

 

They dont need any special gear, a gun which can handle 30lvl heavy gunner/bombard will be more than enough to beat them and you should bring that 1 decently modded weapon into mission anyway. Ive also seen them die from single world on fire with accelerant on.

Edited March 5, 2014 by Davoodoo

[Tatchi]

That great, all I need to do is a kappa run to get the resources to get rid of this. 

Only I am nowhere near unlocking kappa. 

 

This is really lame. I don't mind a challenge but it really stretches the imagination to find the fun in this....

 

I didn't even know I would run into these. Was just doing a normal mission as far as I could tell. Just when I decided to PUG because my friends were offline...sigh...

Edited March 6, 2014 by Tatchi

[Tails-san]

That great, all I need to do is a kappa run to get the resources to get rid of this. 

Only I am nowhere near unlocking kappa. 

 

This is really lame. I don't mind a challenge but it really stretches the imagination to find the fun in this....

 

I didn't even know I would run into these. Was just doing a normal mission as far as I could tell. Just when I decided to PUG because my friends were offline...sigh...

Kappa isn't the only place you can get Oxium. Venera on Venus is also a fairly decent source if you go for 15-20 waves. Not quite as good as cappa, but still shouldn't take you more than 2 runs at most.

[NikolaiLev]

Good luck in Online. "I already have Brakk, not fighting them" - and they run off. And "veterans" wonder why new players don't think they're deserving of respect.

 

And yes, the requirement for a neural sensor and neurode seems much more annoying.

 

Wow.  A neural sensor and a neurode, just for failing an RNG-based gear test?

 

Better hope you didn't forma!

 

This is really awful game design.  Good job, DE.

[Endorphinz]

I don't know what you expected to hear from this forum. You know that everyone's going to just mock you for not being able to kill them easily. That's all I hear, is "stalker too easy. hunter too easy. G3 too easy." The veterans will obviously find it easy.

[Xylia]

So, cute.

 

They decided that a permanent debuff is somehow OK when these things spawn randomly, even if you're in lowbie gear?

 

I guess that's what Alt-F4 is for.

 

Pretty sad when they add a mechanic that makes me Alt-F4, but whatever.

 

This is just pure annoyance and I'm not going to deal with it.

[Warriorrogue]

Permanent?

It isn't.

By the 4th planet, you can obtain all the materials needed

How often are there invasions before that? The only reason they'll get tagged is if a higher level person joins, and brings down the pain on their head.

[Xylia]

Permanent?

It isn't.

By the 4th planet, you can obtain all the materials needed

How often are there invasions before that? The only reason they'll get tagged is if a higher level person joins, and brings down the pain on their head.

 

Well, gee.

 

If you're a newbie who freshly arrived at Mars, then you probably have:

 

1). A Braton

2). <Rank2 Serration (if any Serration at all!)

3). A Frame with ~300 Health/Shields

 

This presents several problems:

 

1). You have practically no chance against the Grustrag brothers.

2). You can't kill Oxium Ospreys with a Braton very well at all (takes several dodges before you can kill the stupid thing, and if you mess up once, you might not see another Osprey until... God-Knows-When).

3). Neurodes almost never drop on Earth.

4). Neural Sensors you have to go all the way to Jupiter to, and Gas City Tileset is not only mazy but full of mobs that downright hurt (Detron Crewmen, for example).

 

Consider the newbie who slaved through Earth and freshly got to Mars. He sees a CvG conflict, and sees the Corpus offering 20,000 credits vs Grineer offering 10,000 credits.

 

Oh, this Tenno has NO idea what's coming to him until AFTER he does the 5 missions. Then he gets the mail from Vay Hek and he probably just shrugs it off.

 

Then, later, he goes to Earth to level a lowbie weapon or something and WHAM. Grustrag Brothers.

 

He of course loses because he just plain cannot handle this kind of crap. Let's say he was on some random Exterminate or something and he had 1-2 other Newbies (because veterans don't usually run random Exterminates unless they need Scans or something) and they all die. The two newbies who were with him had no clue as to what was going on, and he himself never knew this was going to happen.

 

Guess what?

 

He now has this permanent punishment he has no means of getting rid of on his own. He can't kill Oxium Ospreys very well at all, Neurodes are such a stinking rare drop on Earth.....oh wait, he has the Grustrag Bolt. He ain't killing no Grineer solo, is he? Nope!

 

Well, he could try for Jupiter..... oh, yeah, right. Half of Mars is taken over by the Grineer, which means again he needs someone to carry him.

 

And if the general in-game community is anything like the forum community, God Help Him. He's probably going to get hosts leaving him, he's going to get ridiculed for not being good enough (despite the fact he has no access to decent gear or mods), etc, etc because he has a visible shame placed upon him.

 

There's a reason why naming&shaming is usually banned on the forums. Oh wait, the Developers are now doing it by placing very visible elements on your Warframe, so everybody can know you lost a battle against the Grustrag Brothers.

 

At least with the Harvester punishment, all you have to do is do an escape mission and you're back to normal. The Grustrag Brothers, though? Oi. Neurodes, Neural Sensors..... *sigh*

 

This is just plain ridiculous.

Edited March 7, 2014 by Xylia

[Onisa]

Semi new player without serration and elemental mods probably havent even done enough invasions to meet g3.

 

And tbh yes i forgot how is to die against stalker and such, even when stalker was able to oneshot me i managed to kite him trhough few rooms while my teammates killed him, that was 1 time when i wasnt prepared at all having rank14 mk1 without potato and no ammo to decently modded secondary. 

It only takes one set to earn a mark from either.

So that potato invasion that you taxi your friend to so they could get the battle pay? It comes with a little something extra now.

And it's not like the credit rewards are a joke to anyone not just starting out, right? [/sarcasm]

[Xylia]

It only takes one set to earn a mark from either.

So that potato invasion that you taxi your friend to so they could get the battle pay? It comes with a little something extra now.

And it's not like the credit rewards are a joke to anyone not just starting out, right? [/sarcasm]

 

^^

This.

 

A newbie who JUST arrived at Mars might see a 20k vs 10k Battle Pay and go "woah! Awesome!"

 

Of course, a few missions later, he gets roflstomped by the Grustrag Brothers and is now unable to do anything in 75% of the Solar Map Missions until he gets 2 rare materials and 20 Oxium which he has no reasonable means of gathering on his own.

[(PSN)ariaandkia]

This. Kappa is the only reasonable place to farm Oxium...otherwise it's hell trying to get that stupid 600 for Zephyr.

...not even including the cost to actually research it.

I tried Kappa. 1 Oxium in 3 runs. This is with me murdering like everything in sight with maxed out gear.

I tried a basic defense mission on the second planet again murdering everything in sight. Got like 20 in 6~7 minutes (about 1/2 a kappa run).

I'll stick with defense.

On the PS4 version, it is much less of a problem with people ditching the group.

"Oh, hey, [this enemy] spawned." / "Ooh! FLICKERING LIGHTS! WHO HAS IT!?"

"Oh, I have like a million of those blueprints, but heck, why not get another, where you at?"

"Ooh, where did it spawn? I'll help!"

"Eh? It spawned, I suppose since I have to test this new setup anyways, I'll help you, but it isn't like I'm doing it for you or anything."

Neural sensors are definitely a pain. I have like 900 of all the other rare resources (aside from oxium which just came out and I haven't been in a hurry to farm for) but only like 20 neural sensors.

IF I am still playing when PS4 players get the brothers, I will be MORE than happy to help anyone who is marked get their resources if they have trouble.

Edited March 7, 2014 by (PS4)ariaandkia

[Gio21]

at a pug kappa run yesterday got 12 oxium. allmost all spawn doors closed(red) 

haha

[(PSN)vivan000]

I tried Kappa. 1 Oxium in 3 runs. This is with me murdering like everything in sight with maxed out gear.

Forget about MD on PS4, they are all glitched. MD alerts are fine, though.

[(PSN)ariaandkia]

Forget about MD on PS4, they are all glitched. MD alerts are fine, though.

 

Two lines after the one you quoted, I said I'll be sticking to defense, lol.