Why People Hate Melee 2.0

[Agent_of_Change]

I'd like a chance to play it before i decide anythign about it.

 

Fact is this is one of those situations where a new player has this from day one and will grow and develop with it, vets who are left with this as the only thing are frustrated because they can't have it now.  Tweaks will almost certainly be made, but I do think it's a major oversight that players weren't even given 1 stance that works with the skana... you know what a new player would start with?

[Casval_Rouge]

Loved Melee 2.0 since launch, until the hotfix that broke my stance mods of course.  That aside, I have very few negative things to say about it.  But before that, my god the "complains" in the OP is just ignorance.  Take your time to experiment and learn the mechanics...It''s not that hard.  Don't know how to equip melee?  Read the damn changelog, or check the options.  In an incomplete game like this, you can't expect scripted tutorials and voice overs to teach you everything.  The information are there for you to find in-game, in those menus.  Not exactly hard to find.

 

Channeling efficiency is not clear?  It is exactly like what it sounds.  Channeling efficient reduce channeling cost per swing, just like how power efficiency reduce cost.  Again, it is quite obvious, doesn't take more than a second to understand.  We have efficiency in this game before, its not the first time we see this.

 

Also not knowing you have to hold to use Channeling?  Really?  Press Channel, then swing.  You see any glow? No? Now hold and swing, bam now you see the glow everywhere you swing.  How hard is that? 

Edited April 10, 2014 by Casval_Rouge

[VelenoHargreaves]

The Nerf on Fury Mod, for me was the worst thing they could have done... Most weapons that suppose to be fast (AKA daggers, dual swords) and have less damage now are the opposite. They are hitting like a Nuclear Bomb (My Fang Prime is dealing 2,150 Channel damage with mods at a 1.1 attack speed...). I think DE could have put some thought before dropping the nerf hammer once more on weapons... Now melee 2.0 is around, once more (as always) build up MORE DMG as possible, channel up and hit...

[Feallike]

Loved Melee 2.0 since launch, until the hotfix that broke my stance mods of course.  That aside, I have very few negative things to say about it.  But before that, my god the "complains" in the OP is just ignorance.  Take your time to experiment and learn the mechanics...It''s not that hard.  Don't know how to equip melee?  Read the damn changelog, or check the options.  In an incomplete game like this, you can't expect scripted tutorials and voice overs to teach you everything.  The information are there for you to find in-game, in those menus.  Not exactly hard to find.

 

Channeling efficiency is not clear?  It is exactly like what it sounds.  Channeling efficient reduce channeling cost per swing, just like how power efficiency reduce cost.  Again, it is quite obvious, doesn't take more than a second to understand.  We have efficiency in this game before, its not the first time we see this.

 

The only thing i mad about is the fact that i have fought Jackle 20x and not gotten the Hammer stance. -.- I NEED A STANCE FOR MY JAT KITTAG MAN! :(

[ENDER357]

About the channel efficiency thing, done some testing and it only drains energy when you hit an enemy. Think it drains 5 energy at base, although Reflex Coil gives you a 60% reduction and Focus Energy gives you 40%. 100% efficiency means every hit while channeling only takes 1 energy.

 

its drains stamina not energy, when you hold down the channel button it drains stamina and drains more when you attack with melee

[(NSW)Omgwtfl9lbbl]

The stance part is really the whole point, and pretty much singlehandedly justifies the anger of the community.

 

Oh and the 275 plat costing katana with a ridicioulsly high resource cost in the dojo research, which all an attempt to tempt you into buying it

What was ridiculously high cost about the Katana? I literally just went in and started it with no issue other than the Argon Crystal. I already have it researching after getting my first Argon Crystal. I legit curious, my idea of "expensive" research costs are kind of skewed because I didn't bother to start researching anything until like 350+ hours in and I solo funded all my research in one go. My idea of "expensive resources" is kind of nonexistent.

[sedu13]

Not understanding all the hate. Already got a variety of stances from a few boss runs and some transmutations, sold cheap the ones I didn't care about and got the ones I wanted. Quick melee works almost exactly like before, only it doesn't have charge anymore.

 

Equiping melee without stances is quick melee with the ability to channel, making up for the loss of charge attacks with energy infused hits. They are faster than charging, too. With stances, the combos change to have certain properties, but you don't need a very specific combo all the time. It's there to be flashy or rack up more multipliers, which give great scalling to melee.

 

Block doesn't suck anymore! Overall, melee is improved. DE mentioned we would have a stance that doesn't have flashy combos, but I guess people figured it would be a stance mod, not the default melee we have. So, again, Melee 2.0 made melee viable, made block not suck and gave us flashy animations. The grind to Hek is a much bigger deal, go cry about that.

[FlyDungas]

But yeah people don't hate melee 2.0 they hate grind, they always have and always will in every game, this update is waaaay to heavy with it

[Beas7ie]

Personally I feel that melee has been nerfed more than buffed.

 

Hey cool, we can get new combos and upgrades.

 

Oh wait they're mods.

 

I've trained in martial arts for over 15 years and once have I heard any instructor say anything about having to put a mod on your weapons to use more attacks.  Must be a space thing.

 

Charge attacks were removed.  I understand how people were spamming charge attacks but a better solution would have been something like maybe nerf the CDs of Charge attacks, or decrease the damage they do if spammed over and over.

 

I've played quite a few missions and haven't gotten a single melee stance mod.

 

 

The new cutlass and dagger suck because they're dual wield only and the crappy dagger is the main hand weapon.

[DocHolliday13]

that's the communities fault really. i've told people multiple times they overhyped the S#&$ out this, saying that it would completely change the game and bring hordes of new players to the game. now it's released and guess what? it's a gimmick, just like we could have expected if people thought wih their brains instead of their e-peens

 

I'm not talking about community hype. I'm talking purely about hype straight from DE, in livestreams and videos.

[cinnabunni]

I for one love melee 2.0 so what we don't get free stance mods and have to go farm them this is what the game is about boo freaking hoo. Also you can change your key-bindings to set it up for mouse atk just throw shoot on e and you can shoot while the gun is out or charge when you have the sword out.

Granted the switch time could be a bit faster but meh no biggie as now i play sword only unless on corpus then I bring a sidearm that again I barely use. So far melee 2.0 gave me every thing i wanted I'm having fun my friends are having fun and we are having fun together so mission accomplished de.

[Joos]

I mentioned in another thread the S#&$ty controls being unable to bind M1 (w/o it removing itself from primary fire) to my melee attack while my melee is in my main hand which makes no friggin sense imo.

[ensignvidiot]

I for one love melee 2.0 so what we don't get free stance mods and have to go farm them this is what the game is about boo freaking hoo. Also you can change your key-bindings to set it up for mouse atk just throw shoot on e and you can shoot while the gun is out or charge when you have the sword out.

Granted the switch time could be a bit faster but meh no biggie as now i play sword only unless on corpus then I bring a sidearm that again I barely use. So far melee 2.0 gave me every thing i wanted I'm having fun my friends are having fun and we are having fun together so mission accomplished de.

 

 

Seriously, dispite what is going on with all of the bugs... This is still pretty frakken Rad.

 

I really hope DE doesnt get discouraged by all of the scathing hate we are putting out here on the forums. Last thing we need are members giving up on Warframe. Then NOTHING will ever get fixed.

[koolen]

Personnaly I love melee 2.0, I just don't loki the grind for the stances

[MixterFox]

I wouldn't have as much of a problem with melee 2.0 if melee did enough dps to be comparable to a gun. as is now my fang prime is hitting for about half as hard as my braton prime using the same elementals against the same lvl enemies and is hitting less per second and i cant aim melee attacks at weak spots.

As is melee has terrible base stats, terrible mods, and the combo system takes too long to get a multiplier I should care about. And if I do get a multiplier it disappears by the time I get into melee range again.

If melee did like 3x the damage it might be worth using but it gets hard to kill a lvl 30 enemy that I could easily kill at 60 with a gun.

Some people are complaining that all people did before was charge attacks, but thats cuz those weren't totally worthless as you could stack a bunch of mods on them. Now the best we have is channel and that only seems to do +50% base which is meh.

Now it was like 4am when I got these numbers so correct me if I'm wrong but melee is meh now.

[Beas7ie]

I for one love melee 2.0 so what we don't get free stance mods and have to go farm them this is what the game is about boo freaking hoo. Also you can change your key-bindings to set it up for mouse atk just throw shoot on e and you can shoot while the gun is out or charge when you have the sword out.

Granted the switch time could be a bit faster but meh no biggie as now i play sword only unless on corpus then I bring a sidearm that again I barely use. So far melee 2.0 gave me every thing i wanted I'm having fun my friends are having fun and we are having fun together so mission accomplished de.

 

 

Farming them would be fine IF THEY WOULD ACTUALLY DROP!

 

The whole point of this change was to give us more options and open up new things for melee.  Well so far all they did was limit us with forcing us to find these super rare mods that never drop.  I've been playing most of the day and the only mod Ive gotten so far was a staff one from Xini

 

And even then all it does is add 2 combos.  I basic, smash E lots of times one.  And then a Press E twice then pause and press E again one, and that doesnt even work properly all the time.  We need more combos, more attacks and more options!

 

Melee 2.0 was great on paper and on the livestreams when we saw it, but this release has been one huge fuckup.

[Schwood]

I take back my earlier statement. The grind isn't so bad. I was able to get 4 stance mods in 2 survival missions (Sedna first, got Swirling Tiger and Reaping Spiral), then a Ceres survival (got Crimson sword one and a dual machetes one). In the second one we were farming the napalms. We had a Nekros, Trinity, Rhino P (me). I mostly played with my Dual Ichors and Swirling Tiger stance. Towards the end (level 43+) it took quite a bit of time to hack down the Napalms and Bombards. Walked out of one Ceres Survival run with 2 stances and a bag of frequencies for the Hek key. 

 

Now that I got to try the stances/combos;

F F F F ? Ok, I was doing that before. 

F F F + something + F ? It does the same thing as F F F F. Or it's not working, or the animation difference is too subtle. 

 

Am I missing something?

[Psychosist]

I take back my earlier statement. The grind isn't so bad. I was able to get 4 stance mods in 2 survival missions (Sedna first, got Swirling Tiger and Reaping Spiral), then a Ceres survival (got Crimson sword one and a dual machetes one). In the second one we were farming the napalms. We had a Nekros, Trinity, Rhino P (me). I mostly played with my Dual Ichors and Swirling Tiger stance. Towards the end (level 43+) it took quite a bit of time to hack down the Napalms and Bombards. Walked out of one Ceres Survival run with 2 stances and a bag of frequencies for the Hek key.

Now that I got to try the stances/combos;

F F F F ? Ok, I was doing that before.

F F F + something + F ? It does the same thing as F F F F. Or it's not working, or the animation difference is too subtle.

Am I missing something?

You actually have to wait for the swing animation end before you may put the next command.

E, wait for anim, E, wait for anim, E, wait for anim, pause, E.

Edited April 11, 2014 by Psychosist

[TheDoctah]

I feel like you might want to change your title. I don't think anyone hates Melee 2.0, they're just confused and mildly irritated by the sheer amount of RNG now needed.

This. This is my only real gripe with this update. DE claims they want to ease up on the rng and they put all of update 13 behind rng. So I'm a little concerned about DE's honesty with these updates. Melee 2.0 seems like a fun system, would love to try it, not gonna torture myself through walls of rng just to try it though.

 

I feel like the stances could have been a gateway to open warframe up a little more. Since the tenno race is supposed to be the masters of the sword and whatnot. I think DE could have been a little more creative with the stances rather than just "lol just throw it all in the rng pool" but this could have been a great chance for DE to introduce some new npc's that could possibly teach you the stances or give them to you through a series of quests, and of course receiving the stance at the end of the quest chain. Rather than leaving our fates to mindless grinding and the silliness that is rng. This could have created a real clan type of feel where the top Tenno (the npc's) are giving a "master to pupil" type of feel. This is just an example but I'm honestly ready for DE to stop relying so incredibly heavily on rng and start making this game feel like it has some purpose and not just being super geared up farmers! 

Edited April 11, 2014 by TheDoctah

[-----God-----]

"i also don't understand the whole dragon nikana deal, superior stats with no excess work, surely they could have done something like, uh i don't know perhaps made a regular nikana "graduate" at level 30 into a dragon

don't mean to sound passive agressive"

Very good idea. Wish they would have thought oft it. The day it released I went and built it in the lab. Now it's a bootprints? Huh? I didn't get the resources back.

Edited April 11, 2014 by -A-ZigZagZig-A-

[Wolfstorm18]

I bound the melee mode in the button I used for blocking before. No problem with that. 

 

What I found annoying is that theres no option to bind melee (in melee mode) in the same button you use to shoot (in shooting mode), you still have to use the melee key which, in my configuration, has always been the middle mouse button. So, it got awkward, when I have to charge the weapon with the first mouse button, and use the middle finger in the middle mouse button to beat the opponents, whereas in shooting mode I used the index finger in the middle mouse button to melee, and had no problem to charge attacks using that same button. 

 

I thought they were to keep the charging mechanic as it was before, using the same button for melee, but holding it to charge the weapon. 

 

I thought that they were to use the shooting button for melee, and then the current melee button (in my case, the middle mouse button) were to be used for a new heavy attack with the weapon. That is, while in 'melee mode', you were to use the light melee attack in the shooting button, and the heavy melee attack in the melee button, whereas in 'shooting mode' the light melee attack was to be in the melee button, that is the 'quick attack'. They even announced we were to keep a quick attack in shooting mode, so I thought they were going to implement a new heavy melee to combine with light melee in combos. Instead we got more RNG, with 'stance mods' in a slot similar to the aura slot in warframes, and an awkward button configuration (at least in my case). 

[Beas7ie]

You actually have to wait for the swing animation end before you may put the next command.

E, wait for anim, E, wait for anim, E, wait for anim, pause, E.

 

 

No one has time for that crap.  This is Warframe where everything is supposed to be fast.  What they need to do is add a couple of melee variations like have the R key do a different type of attack so then you can go.  E, E, E, R, E, R and so forth.  

 

So far most of the time when I've tried a combo like E, E, E, pause, E it doesn't work or even if it does work, a teammate will shoot the guy and kill him by the time I can get the combo off.  

[Raze4573]

The whole combo system is a joke, no idea who in their right mind in DE thought "this is gonna work for sure".
The combo/stance feature makes melee fighting dull. Prime example is taking the Dragon Nikana and fighting with it.

Without stance/combo mod its just left right left right left right left right.
275 plat for Nikana, Argon Crystal and Catalyst to have a boosted Dragon Nikana.

All I have after that is left right left right.
THIS ISNT FUN AT ALL!

[ShadowFighter88]

The whole combo system is a joke, no idea who in their right mind in DE thought "this is gonna work for sure".

The combo/stance feature makes melee fighting dull. Prime example is taking the Dragon Nikana and fighting with it.

Without stance/combo mod its just left right left right left right left right.

275 plat for Nikana, Argon Crystal and Catalyst to have a boosted Dragon Nikana.

All I have after that is left right left right.

THIS ISNT FUN AT ALL!

Have you added a Stance mod to the Nikana?  Because that's what you need on it to be able to do combos.  Without it, the attacks are literally the same sort of stuff we did in Melee 1.0.

[Luckyo]

To me, the saddest realisation was that this is the first major gameplay change patch after PS4 release, and the game got a severe case of consolitis with the patch.

 

Hold down left mouse button to channel? Hold down weapon swap to select a different weapon? What?

 

Ah yes, that's how it's done on controllers where these things are both functional and to extent needed because of controller limitations. And PC controls where this system is utterly dysfunctional are just an afterthought.

Of course, PS4 players didn't even get the patch yet. So it's consolitis for the sake of consolitis with no benefits for console players and a nice finger towards PC crowd.

 

Cringeworthy.