Before We Rework Oberon/nekros Can We Please Rework Ember

[Vargras]

Also:

 

The new power i have in mind is something between Hydroid Undertow and Vauban Bastille i shall call it the Floor is Lava .That abilitie will do excactly that Ember will make the ground molten lava and enemies will be submerged up to their waist and it will be dealt on them consntant fire damage and it would also have high status chance to be set on fire while they are in there and with Accelerant they will take even more damage .

We already have an area-of-effect ability that goes on the ground and deals damage over time. It's called Hallowed Ground, belongs to Oberon, and is utter garbage. He's getting reworked first for a reason.

 

no.   Ember needs a rework because of her 4 skills. only one works correctly.

 

Fireball.

 

 

Accelerant is a random on its stun time. 1-4 secounds based on animation. and its close range which isn't ideal for ember.

 

Fireblast is USELESS.

 

World on Fire has no AoE, no 100% stagger, no 100% proc chance, and requires ember to stay in close range. not ideal.

 

her stats dont let her survive for the role she is made for.

 

 

 

Necros has armor(65), speed, and its skills give it a wall of meatshields to defend it on its job of farming mods.

 

yes it needs more appeal, but it works right now.

 

Oberon has 65 armor, and 125 hp. so above average hp.

its skills work for its purpose, which is a dual purpose healer and DPS

its first skill uses radiation, leading to a Nyx Chaos like effect

as does its ultimate. which also creates hp orbs for more heals.

 

with its extra HP, the heals create it even more survivable.

 

it could use more focus on dps or healing.  but it can work as a good healer in high levels. unlike Ember who can't.

Ember is a damage dealer, much like Nova -- you get more straight-up damage at the cost of survivability. Just because she had Overheat does not mean she was meant to be tanky. It was removed for a reason. Not only that, but:

 

Fireball: Guaranteed proc, radial damage

Accelerant: Stun, heat damage modifier uses a percentage which allows Ember to scale into higher level content (which is more than can be said for several other frames)

Fireblast: Probably the only ability of hers that needs a buff. Meant for area-of-denial and/or defense, but the damage is rather low even with a power strength build. Upped proc chance would be nice.

World on Fire: Actually has AOE and will hit multiple enemies at once if they're close enough to a single blast. It's also fire-and-forget (press the button and it does the work while you can use other abilities), and if you actually had any range mods at all, Ember isn't required to get close to anything.

 

Ember might need a slight buff, but is quite fine. Just because you're using a screwed up build doesn't mean that she's in dire need of a rework. Let's compare that to Oberon and Nekros, hm?

 

Oberon has:

-A lackluster single target ability which is more or less a gimped Soul Punch (and that itself isn't very good for a 1). Compare this to Ember's Fireball, which has a guaranteed proc and deals AOE damage around it.

-A laughably weak second ability that produces a damage-over-time ground effect that does... nothing else. Fireblast deals more damage.

-A heal-over-time which is still outclassed by Blessing (Blessing restores full health and shields, and is global), has a traveltime, and had the one unique mechanic bugfixed into non-existence. Also heals a static amount of health, meaning multiple heals are required in order to top someone off.

-An ultimate that CCs and has a chance to spawn heal orbs on kill. It's not even guaranteed, and the skill has to be the killing blow.

 

You're also trying to say that because many of his abilities have a chance at a radiation proc, that he is fine. He's not. A proc that has a chance to go off, and then also has a chance to actually cause the confusion state is not good enough. Radiation procs aren't guaranteed confusion.

 

Nekros has:

-A meh first ability. Poor damage, poorly explained secondary effects. It at least ragdolls.

-A crowd control that causes enemies to run away. Also still potentially bugged in that you can't use it again until all previously affected enemies are dead.

-A skill that rolls for more loot and spawns health orbs. The only reason he's brought to high-level content.

-An ultimate that spawns braindead AI clones. You can't control which clones spawn, nor can you control where they go or what they do.

 

TL;DR - You are still wrong if you think Ember needs a rework before Oberon or Nekros, and you are still wrong if you think Oberon and Nekros are fine and Ember isn't.

[Nyxcha]

Also:

 

We already have an area-of-effect ability that goes on the ground and deals damage over time. It's called Hallowed Ground, belongs to Oberon, and is utter garbage. He's getting reworked first for a reason.

 

Ember is a damage dealer, much like Nova -- you get more straight-up damage at the cost of survivability. Just because she had Overheat does not mean she was meant to be tanky. It was removed for a reason. Not only that, but:

 

Fireball: Guaranteed proc, radial damage

Accelerant: Stun, heat damage modifier uses a percentage which allows Ember to scale into higher level content (which is more than can be said for several other frames)

Fireblast: Probably the only ability of hers that needs a buff. Meant for area-of-denial and/or defense, but the damage is rather low even with a power strength build. Upped proc chance would be nice.

World on Fire: Actually has AOE and will hit multiple enemies at once if they're close enough to a single blast. It's also fire-and-forget (press the button and it does the work while you can use other abilities), and if you actually had any range mods at all, Ember isn't required to get close to anything.

 

Ember might need a slight buff, but is quite fine. Just because you're using a screwed up build doesn't mean that she's in dire need of a rework. Let's compare that to Oberon and Nekros, hm?

 

Oberon has:

-A lackluster single target ability which is more or less a gimped Soul Punch (and that itself isn't very good for a 1). Compare this to Ember's Fireball, which has a guaranteed proc and deals AOE damage around it.

-A laughably weak second ability that produces a damage-over-time ground effect that does... nothing else. Fireblast deals more damage.

-A heal-over-time which is still outclassed by Blessing (Blessing restores full health and shields, and is global), has a traveltime, and had the one unique mechanic bugfixed into non-existence. Also heals a static amount of health, meaning multiple heals are required in order to top someone off.

-An ultimate that CCs and has a chance to spawn heal orbs on kill. It's not even guaranteed, and the skill has to be the killing blow.

 

You're also trying to say that because many of his abilities have a chance at a radiation proc, that he is fine. He's not. A proc that has a chance to go off, and then also has a chance to actually cause the confusion state is not good enough. Radiation procs aren't guaranteed confusion.

 

Nekros has:

-A meh first ability. Poor damage, poorly explained secondary effects. It at least ragdolls.

-A crowd control that causes enemies to run away. Also still potentially bugged in that you can't use it again until all previously affected enemies are dead.

-A skill that rolls for more loot and spawns health orbs. The only reason he's brought to high-level content.

-An ultimate that spawns braindead AI clones. You can't control which clones spawn, nor can you control where they go or what they do.

 

TL;DR - You are still wrong if you think Ember needs a rework before Oberon or Nekros, and you are still wrong if you think Oberon and Nekros are fine and Ember isn't.

did you read ANY of the 4 active ember threads going on.

 

accelerant is NOT working.

 

the stun?  keep in mind she has NO ARMOR OR BONUS HP.  she's slow. 

 

lets see her "stuns"

 

1 second stun

1.8 second stun

2 second stun

3 second stun

4 second stun

 

 

 

World of Fire vs Nova's ult.  you think ember is better at dps than nova?  nova does 1.8K DMG ON EACH ENEMY PLUS ALL ENEMYS AROUND PLUS ALL WHO DIE TO THE 1.8K

 

in addition to slowing them down by 75%

and causing bonus dmg to them of 200%

and having a massive range.

 

 

READ THE THREADS BEFORE YOU SPAM YOUR OPINION.  we've discussed multiple reasons ember is in need of a buff.  we have discussed MANY possible buffs.

 

have you made a suggestion for how to fix oberon or necros. or have u jsut said it needs a buff.

 

a tip. GIVE THE DEVELOPERS IDEAS IF YOU WANT IT BUFFED.

don't just say thsoe 2 need a buff when we are spending all this work creating ideas for our frame. 

 

devs have alot of ideas for changes from us.

 

what do they have from you other than "buff"  buff how. dmg? duration.  change the skills? change them to what. 

you didn't say. all you said was buff.  you didn't help them at all.

 

all they hear from you is "i want a buff, but i'm not going to point out what part of it needs to be buffed or how to buff it"

 

 

you want your frames buffed first. help the devs think.  so they have somewhere to start. just saying its lackluster doesnt work.   give ideas for changes.

 

this guy did.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/244085-oberons-role-and-rework/

 

you just *@##$ed.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Amberpaw

[Vargras]

did you read ANY of the 4 active ember threads going on.

 

accelerant is NOT working.

 

the stun?  keep in mind she has NO ARMOR OR BONUS HP.  she's slow. 

 

lets see her "stuns"

 

1 second stun

1.8 second stun

2 second stun

3 second stun

4 second stun

 

 

 

World of Fire vs Nova's ult.  you think ember is better at dps than nova?  nova does 1.8K DMG ON EACH ENEMY PLUS ALL ENEMYS AROUND PLUS ALL WHO DIE TO THE 1.8K

 

in addition to slowing them down by 75%

and causing bonus dmg to them of 200%

and having a massive range.

 

 

READ THE THREADS BEFORE YOU SPAM YOUR OPINION.  we've discussed multiple reasons ember is in need of a buff.  we have discussed MANY possible buffs.

 

have you made a suggestion for how to fix oberon or necros. or have u jsut said it needs a buff.

 

a tip. GIVE THE DEVELOPERS IDEAS IF YOU WANT IT BUFFED.

don't just say thsoe 2 need a buff when we are spending all this work creating ideas for our frame. 

 

devs have alot of ideas for changes from us.

 

what do they have from you other than "buff"  buff how. dmg? duration.  change the skills? change them to what. 

you didn't say. all you said was buff.  you didn't help them at all.

 

all they hear from you is "i want a buff, but i'm not going to point out what part of it needs to be buffed or how to buff it"

 

 

you want your frames buffed first. help the devs think.  so they have somewhere to start. just saying its lackluster doesnt work.   give ideas for changes.

 

this guy did.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/244085-oberons-role-and-rework/

 

you just *@##$ed.

At no point did I say that Ember was better than Nova. I was simply saying they're meant to fill the same role, I.E. a caster.

 

In addition, all of the arguments about how poor Accelerant is all have the same flaw -- they ignore its biggest strength, which is the heat damage boost. The CC effect is secondary and is just a bonus, but depending on mods, you can have upwards of +500% heat damage, which applies to both abilities and weapons. Please stop ignoring this, as you continue to do.

 

Oberon's rework is already underway. This has been confirmed repeatedly in developer streams, and it was confirmed several streams ago that he would be the first (and there are currently no plans to rework Ember in any way, shape, or form). Simple buffs would be much more realistic.

[Nyxcha]

At no point did I say that Ember was better than Nova. I was simply saying they're meant to fill the same role, I.E. a caster.

 

In addition, all of the arguments about how poor Accelerant is all have the same flaw -- they ignore its biggest strength, which is the heat damage boost. The CC effect is secondary and is just a bonus, but depending on mods, you can have upwards of +500% heat damage, which applies to both abilities and weapons. Please stop ignoring this, as you continue to do.

 

Oberon's rework is already underway. This has been confirmed repeatedly in developer streams, and it was confirmed several streams ago that he would be the first (and there are currently no plans to rework Ember in any way, shape, or form). Simple buffs would be much more realistic.

ok then.

 

accelerant. required for all abilitys then.

 

1. requires her to be close range to cast.  not invicible during cast animation.  no armor. no extra hp.

2. cause you say its esentially required, that means she has 3 skills. not 4.  cause her 2 skill is required.

so her 1 skill costs 75 energy. 2 skill costs 125 energy.  and 3 skill costs 150 energy.   all cause accelerant is 50 energy and has to be used for all.

 

 

 

btw, if oberon's rework is underway. why are you in this thread.  you think they will stop to work on ember?

 

if so, then you aren't very confident and apparently believe our argument is strong enough to convince them.

 

 

if you really believes we were arguing something that isn't urgent, then you wouldnt be worrying about them making ember a priority.    and you would have ignored this thread.

 

 

 

 

 

eat that. logic

[Vargras]

ok then.

 

accelerant. required for all abilitys then.

 

1. requires her to be close range to cast.  not invicible during cast animation.  no armor. no extra hp.

2. cause you say its esentially required, that means she has 3 skills. not 4.  cause her 2 skill is required.

so her 1 skill costs 75 energy. 2 skill costs 125 energy.  and 3 skill costs 150 energy.   all cause accelerant is 50 energy and has to be used for all.

 

 

 

btw, if oberon's rework is underway. why are you in this thread.  you think they will stop to work on ember?

 

if so, then you aren't very confident and apparently believe our argument is strong enough to convince them.

 

 

if you really believes we were arguing something that isn't urgent, then you wouldnt be worrying about them making ember a priority.    and you would have ignored this thread.

 

 

 

 

 

eat that. logic

On the topic of Accelerant:

 

The animation itself is rather deceptive, and with a simple Stretch mod, it can hit a fairly large area. Ember isn't required to be in close range, as you think she is. The debuff also applies to all heat damage dealt, including damage dealt by team mates, giving Ember some additional support. When mentioning energy costs, you've neglected to include any efficiency mods (and most everyone will have at least Streamline). You also think I said that it's "essentially required". At no point did I say that. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

 

I'm in this thread because I play all of the frames mentioned in the topic title. Though Oberon gets most of my attention, I still bust out Ember and Nekros, depending on what I'm in the mood for.

 

So, in your own words:

 

eat that. logic

[Nyxcha]

On the topic of Accelerant:

 

The animation itself is rather deceptive, and with a simple Stretch mod, it can hit a fairly large area. Ember isn't required to be in close range, as you think she is. The debuff also applies to all heat damage dealt, including damage dealt by team mates, giving Ember some additional support. When mentioning energy costs, you've neglected to include any efficiency mods (and most everyone will have at least Streamline). You also think I said that it's "essentially required". At no point did I say that. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

 

I'm in this thread because I play all of the frames mentioned in the topic title. Though Oberon gets most of my attention, I still bust out Ember and Nekros, depending on what I'm in the mood for.

 

So, in your own words:

and yet you still reply.

 

 

so why are you arguing with me if you believe oberon will recieve a buff first?

 

if you are confident. then stop wasting KB in this thread.

 

since you keep replying saying Oberon will recieve it first.  you show your not confident and some part of you believes its possible  Ember will be made the higher priority.

 

 

otherwise you would stop replying to this thread.

 

 

 

 

so lets see. prove if your confident, or if you secretly believe Ember might get buffed first

 

 

 

P.S. Ember Prime will also need a buff. as it is she's essentially jsut ember with a skin.

 

looking at Rhino Prime, Loki Prime. it appears Ember Prime needs a change on it somewhere stat wise to make it different to Ember

Edited July 7, 2014 by Amberpaw

[Vargras]

and yet you still reply.

 

 

so why are you arguing with me if you believe oberon will recieve a buff first?

 

if you are confident. then stop wasting KB in this thread.

 

since you keep replying saying Oberon will recieve it first.  you show your not confident and some part of you believes its possible  Ember will be made the higher priority.

 

 

otherwise you would stop replying to this thread.

 

 

 

 

so lets see. prove if your confident, or if you secretly believe Ember might get buffed first

I fail to see what you're trying to get at here. I already said I'm in this topic because I play all frames involved in the topic title (Oberon, Ember, and Nekros). That, and Oberon is already getting reworked first. It's been confirmed in developer streams repeatedly. I don't think Ember will get buffed first, though it'll likely happen eventually.

 

The vast majority of the Ember topics are, at their core, about Overheat, and this one continues to prove that it's much the same. "Ember is useless without Overheat" does not justify Overheat coming back -- if anything, it further proves that Overheat was horrendously broken and deserved to be removed, and that her other abilities (and possible stats) should be buffed to compensate. She was never meant to be tanky.

 

Ember will get her day, but Oberon and Nekros will very likely get theirs first.

 

EDIT: Editing to reply to your own edit.

 

P.S. Ember Prime will also need a buff. as it is she's essentially jsut ember with a skin.

 

looking at Rhino Prime, Loki Prime. it appears Ember Prime needs a change on it somewhere stat wise to make it different to Ember

I definitely agree with you on that. I've previously sent Rebecca a private message, noting the disparity between the older prime frames (Excalibur, Frost, Mag, and Ember) and the newer ones (Rhino and Loki). Ember especially got the shortend of the stick, given that she has the same number of polarities has her non-Prime version.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Vargras

[Nyxcha]

I fail to see what you're trying to get at here. I already said I'm in this topic because I play all frames involved in the topic title (Oberon, Ember, and Nekros). That, and Oberon is already getting reworked first. It's been confirmed in developer streams repeatedly. I don't think Ember will get buffed first, though it'll likely happen eventually.

 

The vast majority of the Ember topics are, at their core, about Overheat, and this one continues to prove that it's much the same. "Ember is useless without Overheat" does not justify Overheat coming back -- if anything, it further proves that Overheat was horrendously broken and deserved to be removed, and that her other abilities (and possible stats) should be buffed to compensate. She was never meant to be tanky.

 

Ember will get her day, but Oberon and Nekros will very likely get theirs first.

you replied.  so you do believe its possible ember will get a buff first.

 

 

as i said, if you replied, then you believe its possible she could get buffed first.

 

if you shut up and left this thread, then you would show your confident that nothing we do here will convince them to buff her first.

 

 

 

 

so, stop spamming noise and accept that ember has a chance to be buffed first.  you admit that when you replied.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Amberpaw

[Vargras]

you replied.  so you do believe its possible ember will get a buff first.

 

 

as i said, if you replied, then you believe its possible she could get buffed first.

 

if you shut up and left this thread, then you would show your confident that nothing we do here will convince them to buff her first.

 

 

 

 

so, stop spamming noise and accept that ember has a chance to be buffed first.  you admit that when you replied.

According to you, I either leave the topic (which more or less admits defeat and allows you to continue on without anyone challenging you), or I stay here, which is apparently me agreeing with you?

 

This isn't how debating works. You're failing miserably at it. Do yourself a favor and put the logical fallacies away.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Vargras

[Nyxcha]

According to you, I either leave the topic (which more or less admits defeat and allows you to continue on without anyone challenging you), or I stay here, which is apparently me agreeing with you?

 

This isn't how debating works. You're failing miserably at it. Do yourself a favor and put the logical fallacies away.

sure sure.

 

i'm going to bed.  keep posting in this thread with your logic. increases the chance the devs will be curious why this thread is getting so many views, looks at it.  and sees how many people want an ember buff compared to oberon

so far, i count 1 for oberon.  aka you

 

and 4.5 pages of people for ember.

 

 

and no, you leaving would mean you are confident in your position.

you staying means you feel the need to stay here and try to disprove me because you believe DE will be convinced by me.

 

either way, its in my favor.

 

either DE notices this due to you keeping it at the top of the page. 

or you shut up, leave, and let us continue to plan for a fix for ember to make her a great frame again.

 

 

 

your mistake was entering this thread, and proving you are worried in your own position enough to drag yourself to my level to argue.

 

 

 

enjoy staying at my level and arguing.  its hot in hell, and Ember is right at home here.

[Garuger]

did you read ANY of the 4 active ember threads going on.

 

accelerant is NOT working.

 

the stun?  keep in mind she has NO ARMOR OR BONUS HP.  she's slow. 

 

lets see her "stuns"

 

1 second stun

1.8 second stun

2 second stun

3 second stun

4 second stun

 

 

 

World of Fire vs Nova's ult.  you think ember is better at dps than nova?  nova does 1.8K DMG ON EACH ENEMY PLUS ALL ENEMYS AROUND PLUS ALL WHO DIE TO THE 1.8K

 

in addition to slowing them down by 75%

and causing bonus dmg to them of 200%

and having a massive range.

 

 

READ THE THREADS BEFORE YOU SPAM YOUR OPINION.  we've discussed multiple reasons ember is in need of a buff.  we have discussed MANY possible buffs.

 

have you made a suggestion for how to fix oberon or necros. or have u jsut said it needs a buff.

 

a tip. GIVE THE DEVELOPERS IDEAS IF YOU WANT IT BUFFED.

don't just say thsoe 2 need a buff when we are spending all this work creating ideas for our frame. 

 

devs have alot of ideas for changes from us.

 

what do they have from you other than "buff"  buff how. dmg? duration.  change the skills? change them to what. 

you didn't say. all you said was buff.  you didn't help them at all.

 

all they hear from you is "i want a buff, but i'm not going to point out what part of it needs to be buffed or how to buff it"

 

 

you want your frames buffed first. help the devs think.  so they have somewhere to start. just saying its lackluster doesnt work.   give ideas for changes.

 

this guy did.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/244085-oberons-role-and-rework/

 

you just *@##$ed.

I really respect your oprinion but can we be civil plz or else this thread will be locked D:

[Monolake]

Wow, the Overheat fan club doesn't stop!

Dude, read plz, instead of blindly reposting this bullcrap in every Ember thread. People are discussing all sorts of other issues, not begging DEL to make Ember back into a Rhino.

[Garuger]

Dude, read plz, instead of blindly reposting this bullcrap in every Ember thread. People are discussing all sorts of other issues, not begging DEL to make Ember back into a Rhino.

Yeah i agree on that i said it was broken because it had no cap and it should be around 50~60%  cap but that is just my opinion 

[Varja99]

l

 

you replied.  so you do believe its possible ember will get a buff first.

 

 

as i said, if you replied, then you believe its possible she could get buffed first.

 

if you shut up and left this thread, then you would show your confident that nothing we do here will convince them to buff her first.

 

 

 

 

so, stop spamming noise and accept that ember has a chance to be buffed first.  you admit that when you replied.

 

 

sure sure.

 

i'm going to bed.  keep posting in this thread with your logic. increases the chance the devs will be curious why this thread is getting so many views, looks at it.  and sees how many people want an ember buff compared to oberon

so far, i count 1 for oberon.  aka you

 

and 4.5 pages of people for ember.

 

 

and no, you leaving would mean you are confident in your position.

you staying means you feel the need to stay here and try to disprove me because you believe DE will be convinced by me.

 

either way, its in my favor.

 

either DE notices this due to you keeping it at the top of the page. 

or you shut up, leave, and let us continue to plan for a fix for ember to make her a great frame again.

 

 

 

your mistake was entering this thread, and proving you are worried in your own position enough to drag yourself to my level to argue.

 

 

 

enjoy staying at my level and arguing.  its hot in hell, and Ember is right at home here.

lol this is just sad

[RealPandemonium]

Dude, read plz, instead of blindly reposting this bullcrap in every Ember thread. People are discussing all sorts of other issues, not begging DEL to make Ember back into a Rhino.

What concerns me is that no one is even trying to make the current Ember work.  They're trying to press 4 and facetank the way they would have during the Overheat days and then declaring that Ember is useless.  Even if Accelerant always only gave a 1 second stun it would still be amazing.  You don't need to chain-cc enemies in this game at all, ever (btw Ember can still do this! It just costs energy.)  Players who demand long, on-demand, unconditional cc abilities are either lazy, bad at the game, or think that their frame has to be exploitable for infinite content.  The balance of this game should not cater to any of those players.  Nyx, Nova, and Rhino are available for those who want to snooze through content.  Leave Ember out of that group (stop comparing them ffs) and call to attention her real problems which are 3 being useless and 4 being duration-dependent. 

Edited July 7, 2014 by RealPandemonium

[RyojinOrion]

What concerns me is that no one is even trying to make the current Ember work.  They're trying to press 4 and facetank the way they would have during the Overheat days and then declaring that Ember is useless.  Even if Accelerant always only gave a 1 second stun it would still be amazing.  You don't need to chain-cc enemies in this game at all, ever (btw Ember can still do this! It just costs energy.)  Players who demand long, on-demand, unconditional cc abilities are either lazy, bad at the game, or think that their frame has to be exploitable for infinite content.  The balance of this game should not cater to any of those players.  Nyx, Nova, and Rhino are available for those who want to snooze through content.  Leave Ember out of that group (stop comparing them ffs) and call to attention her real problems which are 3 being useless and 4 being duration-dependent. 

 

While I more or less agree with what you are saying, I'd just like to note that I don't think 3 is useless at all. You just gotta know how to use it effectively. I do think that it could use a bit of a change so that enemies take some damage inside the ring of fire though.

[RealPandemonium]

While I more or less agree with what you are saying, I'd just like to note that I don't think 3 is useless at all. You just gotta know how to use it effectively. I do think that it could use a bit of a change so that enemies take some damage inside the ring of fire though.

For its cost and its duration-dependency it is kind of pointless, considering that you can spam 1 at your feet and have a similar, if not superior effect.  Believe me, though, I would love to see it in a state that objectively warrants equipping. 

[RyojinOrion]

For its cost and its duration-dependency it is kind of pointless, considering that you can spam 1 at your feet and have a similar, if not superior effect. 

 

I wouldn't say spamming 1 has a superior effect (due to being unable to freely shoot while doing such a thing), but even if it did, that doesn't make #3 completely useless. It just makes it not quite as useful as it probably should be.

Edited July 7, 2014 by RyojinOrion

[RealPandemonium]

I wouldn't say spamming 1 has a superior effect (due to being unable to freely shoot while doing such a thing), but even if it did, that doesn't make #3 completely useless. It just makes it not quite as useful as it probably should be.

You can freely shoot while casting Fire Ball, btw.  I'm testing out Fire Blast since I may have overlooked some of its usefulness.  So far, though, casting 1 does much more damage while hitting the same area, is more consistent, and costs much less energy.  Maybe 3 can be ok serving as a wall against Infested but even then it doesn't really open up any possibilities that weren't already there.  How are you using it?

[(PSN)Lord_Gremlin]

Thing about ember, she has abilites of a tank caster, like Saryn, but has stats of CC caster, like Nova or Vauban.

Either give Ember Saryn-like stats, or make her abilities do hard CC, like permanent stunlock with World on Fire.

[Garuger]

Thing about ember, she has abilites of a tank caster, like Saryn, but has stats of CC caster, like Nova or Vauban.

Either give Ember Saryn-like stats, or make her abilities do hard CC, like permanent stunlock with World on Fire.

Indeed Ember is a split personality that does not know were to fit 

Edited July 7, 2014 by Garuger

[RealPandemonium]

Thing about ember, she has abilites of a tank caster, like Saryn, but has stats of CC caster, like Nova or Vauban.

Either give Ember Saryn-like stats, or make her abilities do hard CC, like permanent stunlock with World on Fire.

Only Fire Blast is a "close range" ability and even then you can pre-cast it in anticipation of an enemy wave and you can just copter freely to place it anyway.  WoF has plenty of range; it's a damage supplement that makes you take a risk to increase your dps, which creates interesting gameplay.

[(PSN)Lord_Gremlin]

And lol Nekros? Nekros is perfect. I take him to 50 minutes of Void or Ceres survival and actively use all 4 abilities. I admit, Soul Punch is only useful for knocking heavy enemy on it's &#! to perform a ground finisher bleed proc resulting in kill, and as such Soul Punch is bad by itself, but as long as you have good melee.. Nekros's problems are minor things. Such as expening SoTD bank of souls and need to kill more for every cast. But overall he gets free health, free loot, mass CC, single target CC, and finally mass decoy. Ember is useless in Ceres survival.

Oberon can also be built to be perfectly fine. You do realize he can keep enemies CC pretty much infinitely with proper build? They just getting smacked over and over. You ever been to a T3 survival with 4 energy siphon and an oberon? Oh, and he can make a crowd go full Chaos without nyx with his first ability. And if someone gets a bleed proc on him he can heal himself.

Ember is the worst. I want to love her, but hell, even prime is screwed. I had to add an extra -, which she really needs, and rhino prime got that extra dash by default.

[Moderius]

Accelerant is a random on its stun time. 1-4 secounds based on animation. and its close range which isn't ideal for ember.

 

You keep hamming on with this, here. Accelerant has a 20 yard range just to start, with a very solid stun and damage increase. And honestly, if it never came into your head that you should also equip a weapon with high fire damage to take advantage of it, then you aren't really playing Ember well enough to even be commenting so voraciously on her effectiveness, because the major lack therein seems to lie with you.

 

Her range can be short, Fireball and WoF can both be cast while in the air so mobility is hardly a problem, and her fast stun gives her a great deal of flexibility in getting from cover to cover. If you stand numbly around spamming keys to try to make the bad guys fall down, that's a problem with you. The game's design provides plenty of cover for you to cast from behind.

 

The only thing that needs to be fixed on Ember is Fire Blast. Everything else isn't lacking in effectiveness, contrary to whatever exaggerated claims you're throwing around.

[Garuger]

And lol Nekros? Nekros is perfect. I take him to 50 minutes of Void or Ceres survival and actively use all 4 abilities. I admit, Soul Punch is only useful for knocking heavy enemy on it's @$$ to perform a ground finisher bleed proc resulting in kill, and as such Soul Punch is bad by itself, but as long as you have good melee.. Nekros's problems are minor things. Such as expening SoTD bank of souls and need to kill more for every cast. But overall he gets free health, free loot, mass CC, single target CC, and finally mass decoy. Ember is useless in Ceres survival.

Oberon can also be built to be perfectly fine. You do realize he can keep enemies CC pretty much infinitely with proper build? They just getting smacked over and over. You ever been to a T3 survival with 4 energy siphon and an oberon? Oh, and he can make a crowd go full Chaos without nyx with his first ability. And if someone gets a bleed proc on him he can heal himself.

Ember is the worst. I want to love her, but hell, even prime is screwed. I had to add an extra -, which she really needs, and rhino prime got that extra dash by default.

That is why i think Ember should be looked more than Nekros/Oberon