Why Different Dual Weapon Stats? Makes No Sense, Even In Warframe.

[Grulos]

Lex: 15% crit chance, 10% status chance

AKLex: 20% crit chance, 15% status chance

 

Magnus: 20% crit, 20% status

AKMagnus: 25% crit, 25% status

 

Bronco Prime: 139 damage, 2,5% crit, 17,5% status

AK Bronco Prime: 105 damage (WHAT), 2,5% crit, 30% status

 

 

Other Dual or AK weapons are consistent with their single counterparts (except for reload speed, magazine size and firerate, but this makes sense).

 

 

I would want to use a SINGLE weapon, even when it is the AkLex. By making that choice, I only take 1 (in words: ONE) weapon, which is still the SAME weapon, so it should not do any more or less damage because I did not change anything. The firerate should be halved, as well as the reload time, because I can only reload and operate a single gun at a time. Makes sense, doesn't it? But this ISN'T the case.

 

 

 

AKLex has higher crit and status, just by holding 2 weapons of the same kind at once. How does the dual version do this?

Same for Magnus. It gets better by holding 2 of them.

 

 

By this logic, if I hold 2 beers with 5% alcohol, they suddenly have 7% or more alcohol EACH, just because I hold 2 of them at the same time?

 

or this:

 

I have a drill with 10mm diameter. It drills 10mm holes. If I hold 2 drills, each 10mm in diameter, I suddenly can drill 2 holes with 15mm diameter EACH.

 

Again, sense?

nopenopenope

 

 

The other side is the Bronco Prime. It gets WORSE damage wise, but gets nearly DOUBLED in status chance.

I .... I cant even make up an example for that.

 

 

 

 

Please DE, flip some switches to bring the dual versions on par with their single counterparts. I don't want to be forced to pick up the dual version, just because they magically have better stats. Having a single weapon has its gameplay and visual benefits. Don't take these decisions from us because of powercreep that does not even make sense.

 

 

 

 

TL;DR:

Dual weapons should have the same damage stats (damage, crit chance, crit damage, status chance) as the single version because that makes sense.

Edited August 8, 2014 by Grulos

[Brandr_]

You have higher status and crit chance BECAUSE you're holding two guns. Your damage is lessoned BECAUSE you're holding two guns which makes It more difficult to aim properly and to land a decent shot

[AandOE]

By this logic, an AkLex should have 30% Crit chance and 20% Status chance, combined from the total of adding two individual Lexes together, yeah? AkMagnus should then be 40% crit, and 40% status. Building on this, all dual weapons should also have double the clip size, double the damage, at least twice the length for reloading, half the accuracy, and double the mod slots. (two different, individual weapons put together)

 

I can see why they didn't choose that route, but making a balanced set of sidearms (with this setup) would be easier in the long run once the rules for producing doubling or singling them are established.

[TheCornerMan]

Well, lato actually has higher base damage than aklato as well as a slightly higher crit multiplier, oh right i forgot no one uses either...

[Wurdyburd]

It USED to be fairly straightforward: having an AkLato meant faster shooting, and slower reloading, and that was pretty much it. Each bullet launched from each separate lato was the same as if you weren't dual wielding, and the penalty to reloading speed was a good trade for being able to fire twice as fast.

The problem is, that's boring. Nobody wants to spend the resources crafting a dual version of weapons just to shoot twice as fast. It doesn't guarantee that you kill something faster, So they made it have more damage to give incentive to actually get it.

But now there's so many weapons and such out there that they have to do something to change it up. It's not enough to deal more damage, no; dual versions have to have better crit damage, crit chance, or status chance. 

 

Tbh there's no solution to this problem that would leave everyone happy, or be fun to play.

[Yastin]

You have higher status and crit chance BECAUSE you're holding two guns. Your damage is lessoned BECAUSE you're holding two guns which makes It more difficult to aim properly and to land a decent shot

 

Accuracy is/should be affected. Damage is/should not be. A bigger or smaller hole is not made because you hold two weapons. The holes are simply closer or further together/apart. Also, for crit and status, dual weapons should have a disadvantage there, too, by your logic, right? If you cannot aim properly, how can you hit the critical points of an enemy's anatomy?

[Grulos]

You have higher status and crit chance BECAUSE you're holding two guns. Your damage is lessoned BECAUSE you're holding two guns which makes It more difficult to aim properly and to land a decent shot

Damage != accuracy

And how can I have higher crit chance by just holding two weapons?! You didn't read my examples, did you? This makes absolutely no sense.

 

2 just for you:

 

1 weapon has 100% strenght (all things combined that affect damage per shot)

the other weapon has also 100% strenght.

 

Then, by just holding 2 of them, EACH suddenly has 115% strenght (this means every weapon just got 15% BETTER just by holding 2 of them).

 

 

When you hold 2  pistols in each hand, the bullets suddenly fire at much higher velocity (!= firerate) than the caliber would let them.

Edited August 9, 2014 by Grulos

[Xenoraptor]

Yes, the differing stats are... confusing, to say the least. The Dual Kama is another example; less damage, same attack speed and higher status chance and a completely different stance pool from its singular form.

[Azamagon]

Yes, the differing stats are... confusing, to say the least. The Dual Kama is another example; less damage, same attack speed and higher status chance and a completely different stance pool from its singular form.

With the dual MELEE weapons, that can at least make some sense (not that the Dual Kama vs Single Kama is a perfect example though), as a singlewielded weapon can be held with BOTH hands, giving it more force with each strike, although that should come with a slower attack speed (All which is done horribly wrong in Warframe of course *sigh*) And of course dual vs single uses different fighting styles, that's following real world martial arts and logics.

 

But yeah, when it comes to single vs dual pistols it really oughta be more simple:

Single pistols have their stats

Dual pistols should then have increased fire rate, reduced accuracy, half the reload speed, double the magsize (even this simple thing is messed up sometimes lol!) and probably higher recoil too (since you hold each pistol with just one hand)

 

^ If that simple and completely logical rule isn't followed, the game's number-manager can easily be considered ... less "gifted" >_>

[DSpite]

I'll give you all a hint. It's a game, and DE can pull numbers out of their asses as they see fit.

 

"dual-weapon-stats-makes-no-sense-even-in-warframe"

 

I see no one is asking why Antimatter Prime manages to coat enemies in antimatter while not covering players, the entire level or exploding every container in sight. Would also love to hear theories on why Radial Blind works through floors and ceilings.

 

It's not meant to make sense, DE had to decide on reasons for people to get something or not, and make balance tradeoff by messing with numbers in a database.

 

PS: To the OP, way to go with the beer and drill examples. It was the most idiotic way I have seen all week to try and justify the mechanics of a video game.

Edited August 9, 2014 by DSpite

[Azamagon]

I'll give you all a hint. It's a game, and DE can pull numbers out of their asses as they see fit.

 

"dual-weapon-stats-makes-no-sense-even-in-warframe"

 

I see no one is asking why Antimatter Prime manages to coat enemies in antimatter while not covering players, the entire level or exploding every container in sight. Would also love to hear theories on why Radial Blind works through floors and ceilings.

 

It's not meant to make sense, DE had to decide on reasons for people to get something or not, and make balance tradeoff by messing with numbers in a database.

 

PS: To the OP, way to go with the beer and drill examples. It was the most idiotic way I have seen all week to try and justify the mechanics of a video game.

There is a difference.

 

People can accept a certain amount of gameyness and mysterious mechanics. You could easily shrug off those mentioned powers with "it's mysterious unknown space magic" (which is actually how they are explained in the game ITSELF that they are!) or it could simply be due to something as simple like a limitation to the game's engine. We can't really explain them, nor can we relate to having void powers. Thus, we can suspend our disbelief in this fiction.

 

But when there are illogical additions "just because", things that we can relate to (as in, that's how it does or does not work in real life) that's when people starts asking questions. Why is a single pistol dealing more damage than when dualwielded? The OP's examples are justified. There is no space magic nor even game balance involved in those numerical flaws, just good ol' plain stupidity.

Edited August 9, 2014 by Azamagon