Remove Zoren-Coptering And Increase Movement Speed

[Hueminator]

I was actually under the impression that coptering was a key part of PvP for both evasion and gap-closing.

Like OP concern, people will use weapons that are copterable to PvP.

 

Has anyone notice that new weapons are not as good to copter?

Edited August 18, 2014 by Hueminator

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

There's nothing to learn, i never said that iwasn't able to copter.

But i think it's just plain ridiculous that you are able to fly across a whole tileset in a single 'copter'

If you want to get technical, you did.

I can't copter myself, nor can i keep up with sprint mods.

 

If you don't like doing it then don't.  If you don't want to get left behind then just play with people that feel the same or play solo. You don't have to play with randoms.

[Ryouhi]

If you want to get technical, you did.

 

If you don't like doing it then don't.  If you don't want to get left behind then just play with people that feel the same or play solo. You don't have to play with randoms.

okay that was bad choice of words on my part, i apologize

i meant i can't copter with the weapons i usually choose - aka heavy weapons, or stuff like kogake

 

Getting left behind is only one of the problems with coptering though.

It mostly invalidates any other form of movement.

Why use a rush mod, why use parkour, why use shortcuts, why use a warframe that has special movement abilities (valkyr, zephyr, etc), when a copter weapon does all of the former stuff better - basically being able to skip whole rooms because you chose Copter weapons is pretty silly imho

 

and the whole "play solo" argument never made much sense in a Co-op game.

"just play with people that feel the same" - true to an extent, but my friends/clanmates aren#t always online or in the mood to play mission X, so sooner or later i will have to play with randoms^^

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

It mostly invalidates any other form of movement.

Why use a rush mod, why use parkour, why use shortcuts, why use a warframe that has special movement abilities (valkyr, zephyr, etc), when a copter weapon does all of the former stuff better - basically being able to skip whole rooms because you chose Copter weapons is pretty silly imho

 

and the whole "play solo" argument never made much sense in a Co-op game.

"just play with people that feel the same" - true to an extent, but my friends/clanmates aren#t always online or in the mood to play mission X, so sooner or later i will have to play with randoms^^

It doesn't invalidate it. Valkyr and Zephyr can use their abilities to go straight up.  Coptering can only, legitimately, go horizontally, for the most part.  Parkour also allows for vertical movement at times.

 

It's not a co-op game. The game has a solo mode and PvP as well as co-op.

 

No, you can just play solo if there is no one on that you want to play with. The only missions that are a bit difficult to solo are defense style (including interception) style missions. 

[SgtFlex]

Completely ruins the immersiveness of the game, and the utility of frames such as volt. Even tiles, gigantic gaps are suddenly crossed with ease. I wish DE would put it back on their radar and think about it a bit more, rather than just a "I've come to like it myself" statement

 

Even then, I see other people coptering, I try to catch up with them, only to realize I have a jat kittag so I just gotta stay behind and walk across the tiles of corpses that the zoren copters have left behind, and I didn't get to kill any of them.

Edited August 18, 2014 by SgtFlex

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

If your weapon can't copter then:

Sprint → butt-slide → flip → dive kick → repeat

 

Instead of complaining about other players' behavior; adapt your own.  Nothing will ever change if you simply demand change in others while refusing to change yourself.

 

Completely ruins the immersiveness of the game, and the utility of frames such as volt. Even tiles, gigantic gaps are suddenly crossed with ease. I wish DE would put it back on their radar and think about it a bit more, rather than just a "I've come to like it myself" statement

 

Even then, I see other people coptering, I try to catch up with them, only to realize I have a jat kittag so I just gotta stay behind and walk across the tiles of corpses that the zoren copters have left behind, and I didn't get to kill any of them.

WRONG!  You have never coptered while under the affects of Speed.

[(PSN)immanks102]

150% disagree turtles like Excalibur need the sculiac to get places.

[atom]

Getting left behind is only one of the problems with coptering though.

It mostly invalidates any other form of movement.

Why use a rush mod, why use parkour, why use shortcuts, why use a warframe that has special movement abilities (valkyr, zephyr, etc), when a copter weapon does all of the former stuff better - basically being able to skip whole rooms because you chose Copter weapons is pretty silly imho

 

and the whole "play solo" argument never made much sense in a Co-op game.

"just play with people that feel the same" - true to an extent, but my friends/clanmates aren#t always online or in the mood to play mission X, so sooner or later i will have to play with randoms^^

so you see a mechanic a huge portion of the playerbase likes and uses on a regular basis and somehow you think its a good idea to remove it because you don't like how it looks. wow .. 

 

as for rush, frame abilities, parkour and shortcuts they do NOT get invalidated by coptering ... they are, same as coptering, mechanics that allow you to go fast and that for many players is FUN. use any one or combination of elements you like and let others do the same. i for one sometimes use all of them when i do capture or assassination missions for example, yes even the rush mod.

 

like other have pointed out you can use parkour and shortcuts to keep up with coptering. i know this for a fact because i use heavy and sparring melee on occasion and granted its not as easy as using ONLY coptering but it works and i can keep up.

 

the argument for "play solo or with friends" makes sense in any MP game including this one because on public servers theres always a higher chance you will meet differences of opinion on playstyle and *gasp* they are all valid. same goes for the real world really ... maybe take this as an opportunity to exercise tolerance? have you seen ninja movies? if normal earth bound ninjas can fly around like crazy why you trying to keep us space ninjas down? have i mentioned coptering is fun?

[grillv20]

If your weapon can't copter then:

Sprint → butt-slide → flip → dive kick → repeat

 

Instead of complaining about other players' behavior; adapt your own.  Nothing will ever change if you simply demand change in others while refusing to change yourself.

 

WRONG!  You have never coptered while under the affects of Speed.

 

your pro tip isnt as fast as coptering though sir

[grillv20]

so you see a mechanic a huge portion of the playerbase likes and uses on a regular basis and somehow you think its a good idea to remove it because you don't like how it looks. wow .. 

 

as for rush, frame abilities, parkour and shortcuts they do NOT get invalidated by coptering ... they are, same as coptering, mechanics that allow you to go fast and that for many players is FUN. use any one or combination of elements you like and let others do the same. i for one sometimes use all of them when i do capture or assassination missions for example, yes even the rush mod.

 

like other have pointed out you can use parkour and shortcuts to keep up with coptering. i know this for a fact because i use heavy and sparring melee on occasion and granted its not as easy as using ONLY coptering but it works and i can keep up.

 

the argument for "play solo or with friends" makes sense in any MP game including this one because on public servers theres always a higher chance you will meet differences of opinion on playstyle and *gasp* they are all valid. same goes for the real world really ... maybe take this as an opportunity to exercise tolerance? have you seen ninja movies? if normal earth bound ninjas can fly around like crazy why you trying to keep us space ninjas down? have i mentioned coptering is fun?

 

Its not a mechanic its an exploit. Saying its a mechanic is implying that they meant for it to be there in the first place lol. No amount of anything allows somebody to keep up with a coptering person unless you're using the volt ability. If you're on a slower frame you might as well just leave the game and play solo because you're not going to be keeping up. 

 

There are SO many reasons why coptering is bad besides the fact that it looks tacky. If you can't see why its bad then I will copy/paste them for you from an earlier post in this thread.

Edited August 18, 2014 by grillv20

[atom]

Its not a mechanic its an exploit. Saying its a mechanic is implying that they meant for it to be there in the first place lol. No amount of anything allows somebody to keep up with a coptering person unless you're using the volt ability. If you're on a slower frame you might as well just leave the game and play solo because you're not going to be keeping up. 

 

There are SO many reasons why coptering is bad besides the fact that it looks tacky. If you can't see why its bad then I will copy/paste them for you from an earlier post in this thread.

maybe you misunderstand the meaning of the terms "mechanic" and "exploit" ... in any case using slow frames and weapons and then complaining they are not fast is nonsense, they are meant to be different.

maybe i missed something reading the topic but really the SO many reasons why coptering is bad turn out to be just particular preference of said player that is trying to enforce he's playstyle on others.

i agree the animation could use an update.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

 

your pro tip isnt as fast as coptering though sir

 

It let's me keep up well enough.

[grillv20]

maybe you misunderstand the meaning of the terms "mechanic" and "exploit" ... in any case using slow frames and weapons and then complaining they are not fast is nonsense, they are meant to be different.

maybe i missed something reading the topic but really the SO many reasons why coptering is bad turn out to be just particular preference of said player that is trying to enforce he's playstyle on others.

i agree the animation could use an update.

 

I think you're the one thats mistaken. I was not responding to the topic. I was responding to you. Weapons should have no bearing on how fast you move. I was simply pointing out that if you're using a slow warframe and you're in a game with people coptering around and you're a legitimate player that doesn't copter your chances of keeping up are slim to none. People that choose to actually play the game as it was intended don't see much of a problem in this department because the difference isn't as great. Sure, you're still slower but it doesn't take long to catch up if you're lagging behind. 

 

I'm not trying to "force" my playstyle on others as much as I'm trying to actually make the point of it being completely broken and stupid in general. Why would the devs bother putting parkour in the game if it was just going to be completely and utterly shut down by one broken game mechanic that people abuse to death. What you seem to think is a matter of preference is an utter complete strawman argument when you analyze everything thats being mitigated in the process of using this method. If you absolutely can not see why its broken and garbage then you're either absolutely oblivious or you're just ignoring the problems and being part of them.

Edited August 19, 2014 by grillv20

[atom]

I think you're the one thats mistaken. I was not responding to the topic. I was responding to you. Weapons should have no bearing on how fast you move. I was simply pointing out that if you're using a slow warframe and you're in a game with people coptering around and you're a legitimate player that doesn't copter your chances of keeping up are slim to none. People that choose to actually play the game as it was intended don't see much of a problem in this department because the difference isn't as great. Sure, you're still slower but it doesn't take long to catch up if you're lagging behind. 

 

I'm not trying to "force" my playstyle on others as much as I'm trying to actually make the point of it being completely broken and stupid in general. Why would the devs bother putting parkour in the game if it was just going to be completely and utterly shut down by one broken game mechanic that people abuse to death. What you seem to think is a matter of preference is an utter complete strawman argument when you analyze everything thats being mitigated in the process of using this method. If you absolutely can not see why its broken and garbage then you're either absolutely oblivious or you're just ignoring the problems and being part of them.

"Weapons should have no bearing on how fast you move"

why not? u know IRL they do right?

 

"I was simply pointing out that if you're using a slow warframe and you're in a game with people coptering around and you're a legitimate player that doesn't copter your chances of keeping up are slim to none."

first off coptering IS legitimate at this point so stop your Q.Q and deal with it.

​secondly like i said before using a slow frame and not all movement options at your disposal and expecting to be as fast as others that use fast frames and more movement mechanic elements then you is nonsense.

 

"I'm not trying to "force" my playstyle on others as much as I'm trying to actually make the point of it being completely broken and stupid in general. Why would the devs bother putting parkour in the game if it was just going to be completely and utterly shut down by one broken game mechanic that people abuse to death."

thats your opinion and you're entitled to it but if you don't like coptering noone is forcing you to do it instead you are trying to remove it thereby forcing your opinion on others.

like i said coptering, abilities AND parkour go very well together and combine in awesome ways. neither part of movement mechanics invalidates the other.

 

now if you still insist maybe procure some of those many reasons to remove it because really i see no good reason to remove coptering. all i see is personal preference and lack of adaptability

 

*edited for clarity

Edited August 19, 2014 by ..atom..

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Moved to a more appropriate section.

[Garuda112]

I personally (and ironically) find it too useful to seem right in the game. I feel like I and others abuse it, and it doesn't feel "right" in the context of the game universe and physics. With that, and sliding, I would figure that swinging a sword/axe/whatever wouldn't be capable of increasing one's velocity than the speed they are already moving.

 

If anything, coptering and sliding should have the same speed as sprinting, in my opinion.

[Methanoid]

Me on the other hand, i usually get left behind with my Heavy Weapons.

being a "heavy weapon" means nothing in regards to coptering, the amphis gives the highest coptering ability and its a huge heavy stave.

 

yeah ppl cba with team play and only look out for themselves, removing coptering wont magically fix that, ppl would still just leave you alone for dead either way, also coptering is a nice unintended game mechanic that makes the game more fast paced which a lot of people do like.

 

your choice to not copter etc is just your own personal preference, personally i always use a melee wpn that copters well as i have zero interest in melee'ing at all so i use my melee weapon for the next best useful thing, at least we have the choice to do either, currently both opinions are catered too atm, your suggested changes would annoy a huge crowd of people only to please the other.

 

the current method is best, let individuals do what they prefer.

[grillv20]

This is warframe now. OH LOOK I CAN PROPEL MY BODY FROM 0-60 MPH ACROSS THE MAP FROM A STANDSTILL.

 

This is what warframe used to be.

 

I remember when I used to play and figure out cool parkour things. Meanwhile in babbycopter-land you zoom past obstacles, ignoring whatever cool devices the map devs made. I will say that parkour in general needs an update but with more and more people coptering each day parkour becomes more and more useless. Why wall-run when I could just as easily shoot myself across the tile-set all-together? 

 

derp

[Alphafox]

This is warframe now. OH LOOK I CAN PROPEL MY BODY FROM 0-60 MPH ACROSS THE MAP FROM A STANDSTILL.

 

This is what warframe used to be.

 

I remember when I used to play and figure out cool parkour things. Meanwhile in babbycopter-land you zoom past obstacles, ignoring whatever cool devices the map devs made. I will say that parkour in general needs an update but with more and more people coptering each day parkour becomes more and more useless. Why wall-run when I could just as easily shoot myself across the tile-set all-together? 

 

derp

Please don't try to make us believe that the parkour system was great when it always had HUGE FLAWS.

Zoren copter is now a feature of the game now(confirmed by the mouths of the devs), coptering doesn't make parkour more and more useless each day,the Devs are.

 

When players will find wallrunning interesting,trust me they will use it alot.

Edited August 19, 2014 by Alphafox

[grillv20]

Please don't try to make us believe that the parkour system was great when it always had HUGE FLAWS.

Zoren copter is now a feature of the game now(confirmed by the mouths of the devs), coptering doesn't make parkour more and more useless each day,the Devs are.

 

When players will find wallrunning interesting,trust me they will use it alot.

 

If its a feature then why isn't it in the tutorial there smart guy? They confirmed that they were keeping it  it in the game months before update 14 came around. 

Edited August 19, 2014 by grillv20

[Alphafox]

If its a feature then why isn't it in the tutorial there smart guy? They confirmed that they were keeping it  it in the game months before update 14 came around. 

Wallrunning is not in the tutorial either(from what I remember), doesn't make it less of a feature. Making the backflips,rolling on the sides while aiming are not in the tutorial either. Where is the rule that say's that everything must be in the tutorial?

Edited August 19, 2014 by Alphafox

[grillv20]

Wallrunning is not in the tutorial either(from what I remember), doesn't make it less of a feature.

 

It is in the tutorial though. I played it the day update 14 came out.

[Alphafox]

It is in the tutorial though. I played it the day update 14 came out.

Read the rest of the post please.

[grillv20]

 

8:50 seconds

[Alphafox]

Wallrunning is not in the tutorial either(from what I remember), doesn't make it less of a feature. Making the backflips,rolling on the sides while aiming are not in the tutorial either. Where is the rule that say's that everything must be in the tutorial?

 

8:50 seconds

Look like you missed this the bolded part. Once again everything in the game doesn't need to be in the tutorial.