Who Misses Charge Attacks? Returning Confirmed-Edition + Poll

[Othergrunty]

I can only speak for my own experience but it's pretty rare for me to see anyone using channeling and i can understand why.

Channeling just doesn't cut it. It takes away energy which is better spend on abilities for a marginal bonus in weapon damage. Not to forget that energy is now constantly in jeopardy thanks to new enemies who can suck away all energy just by being in our proximity.

It's also not worth using mod slots for channeling mods since, that space is better spend on basic damage increasing or elemental mods. To make matters worse except for the basic damage and efficiency increasing mod all other potentialy benefitting mods decrease the channeling effeciency which makes them even more a waste of energy.

The only time i ever use channeling is in connection with livestrike since that one is actualy greatly worth spending energy on.

 

Sure i bet a few players have based their entire melee buildup around channeling and will advocate that it's better than charge attack, but my own experience shows me that hardly anyone, especialy in high level missions is willing to give up a solid normal attack builds for an energy consuming channeling build, just for a few points of extra damage per hit.

Unless it's a Valkyr who can reliably recover energy with Rage and health with livestrike.

 

What channeling also caused was the decline of heavy melee weapons. Heavy melee used to be the king of melee damage in Warframe thanks to their high charge damage. The problem however was that the charge attack heavy weapons were the only melee weapons who could actualy harm most enemies past Jupiter and therefor became the prefered weapon for many builds. It simply paid off more to have a weapon that could kill a strong enemy in one slow blow than many small ones. Hence why the Galatine became the most popular weapon.

 

Which led to the now ironic statement of "The Galatine of Buffing" as counterpart to the Nerf Hammer. Guess what the Nerf Hammer won!

 

Heavy melee weapons now slow you down a lot when equipped, are painfully slow to strike, have combos which also take too long for too little damage and their damage is only marginaly above that of the quick melee weapons.

Also the Glaive just isn't as good anymore without the ability to buff their charge damage and speed up (at least they increased the natural charge speed).

 

Now i can understand why some people don't want charge attacks back, since back in the melee 1.0 times it was charge attack or no attack for most weapons. But removing it completely was just fighting a sympton not solving the problem of weak melee.

 

Charge attacks should come back perhaps only in quick melee strikes and only for heavy melee weapons and a few selective others to make them comptetive to the small and medium melee weapons again.

Perhaps also adjusting the heavy melee combos. Oh and in case of the glaive, finaly being able to throw it when equipped without having to do some other strikes first and needing that stupidly rare combo.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Othergrunty

[SteelBlade17x]

To me the best part about the Charge attack was that it doesn't use energy, and it's faster to execute.

Edited August 21, 2014 by SteelBlade17x

[Tiqalicious]

I won't try to claim that the channelling system is worth it or anything as it clearly needs a LOT of work but abandoning it and reverting back to charge attacks because it hasn't come out of the gate perfect would just be trading one broken system for another. A lot of people in this community need to wrap their heads around the fact that new gameplay additions to warframe are always going to be an extensive work progress that may take some time of ironing out the wrinkles before it's satisfactory. Crying out for the way things where because you don't like change may honestly be a sign that this game isn't for you.

[RainDreamer]

I prefer a heavy attack button that goes along with the normal attack to extend current combo system.

[Dalawantahr]

I won't try to claim that the channelling system is worth it or anything as it clearly needs a LOT of work but abandoning it and reverting back to charge attacks because it hasn't come out of the gate perfect would just be trading one broken system for another. A lot of people in this community need to wrap their heads around the fact that new gameplay additions to warframe are always going to be an extensive work progress that may take some time of ironing out the wrinkles before it's satisfactory. Crying out for the way things where because you don't like change may honestly be a sign that this game isn't for you.

Wow dude, we're saying we just missed charged attack and if possible get it back again. Melee 2.0 and charged attack would be great.

[Rakshal]

I can only speak for my own experience but it's pretty rare for me to see anyone using channeling and i can understand why.

Channeling just doesn't cut it. It takes away energy which is better spend on abilities for a marginal bonus in weapon damage. Not to forget that energy is now constantly in jeopardy thanks to new enemies who can suck away all energy just by being in our proximity.

It's also not worth using mod slots for channeling mods since, that space is better spend on basic damage increasing or elemental mods. To make matters worse except for the basic damage and efficiency increasing mod all other potentialy benefitting mods decrease the channeling effeciency which makes them even more a waste of energy.

The only time i ever use channeling is in connection with livestrike since that one is actualy greatly worth spending energy on.

 

Sure i bet a few players have based their entire melee buildup around channeling and will advocate that it's better than charge attack, but my own experience shows me that hardly anyone, especialy in high level missions is willing to give up a solid normal attack builds for an energy consuming channeling build, just for a few points of extra damage per hit.

Unless it's a Valkyr who can reliably recover energy with Rage and health with livestrike.

 

What channeling also caused was the decline of heavy melee weapons. Heavy melee used to be the king of melee damage in Warframe thanks to their high charge damage. The problem however was that the charge attack heavy weapons were the only melee weapons who could actualy harm most enemies past Jupiter and therefor became the prefered weapon for many builds. It simply paid off more to have a weapon that could kill a strong enemy in one slow blow than many small ones. Hence why the Galatine became the most popular weapon.

 

Which led to the now ironic statement of "The Galatine of Buffing" as counterpart to the Nerf Hammer. Guess what the Nerf Hammer won!

 

Heavy melee weapons now slow you down a lot when equipped, are painfully slow to strike, have combos which also take too long for too little damage and their damage is only marginaly above that of the quick melee weapons.

Also the Glaive just isn't as good anymore without the ability to buff their charge damage and speed up (at least they increased the natural charge speed).

 

Now i can understand why some people don't want charge attacks back, since back in the melee 1.0 times it was charge attack or no attack for most weapons. But removing it completely was just fighting a sympton not solving the problem of weak melee.

 

Charge attacks should come back perhaps only in quick melee strikes and only for heavy melee weapons and a few selective others to make them comptetive to the small and medium melee weapons again.

Perhaps also adjusting the heavy melee combos. Oh and in case of the glaive, finaly being able to throw it when equipped without having to do some other strikes first and needing that stupidly rare combo.

I agree with everything said in here.

[DJ_Redwire]

I won't try to claim that the channelling system is worth it or anything as it clearly needs a LOT of work but abandoning it and reverting back to charge attacks because it hasn't come out of the gate perfect would just be trading one broken system for another. A lot of people in this community need to wrap their heads around the fact that new gameplay additions to warframe are always going to be an extensive work progress that may take some time of ironing out the wrinkles before it's satisfactory. Crying out for the way things where because you don't like change may honestly be a sign that this game isn't for you.

 

People really need to understand that absolutely NOBODY is saying we should remove channeling/combos and bring back charge attacks to replace them. I think I speak for a decent number of people when I say we simply want both. Is that too much to ask for? Melee still needs a lot of changes and tweaks all across the board - and if charge attacks were brought back then they'd need tweaks as well to bring everything into balance. No system is perfect, but isn't diversity that caters to multiple play styles a good thing?

 

Like channeling and combos? Keep using them.

 

Like charge attacks? Use them.

 

Don't like channeling/combos? Don''t use them.

 

Don't like charge attacks? Don't use them.

 

 

There is something for everybody. I can totally respect anyone who found charge attacks to be lack luster. I get it - and there's nothing wrong with that at all. All we're asking is that people whom found charge attacks fun to use be allowed to do so. Nobody is forcing anyone else to play a particular way.

[pkfire.]

I do miss charge attacks. I enjoy melee 2.0 and it has made melee weapons feel more prominent. But, I also feel like charge attacks shouldn't of been removed and should be added back as an ADDITIONAL melee feature. Or, at least for heavy melee weapons cause they are quite a bit less useful currently.

[douglasdamm]

Charge attacks cant be too hard to impliment back into the systems as they are. Just add a new "combo" which is only the hold key - variant.

 

Problem solved.

this so much

[Phantasm98532]

I would like to see something to help bring the heavy melee's back into line with the smaller ones, I think the ability to use some of those vaunted charge attacks maybe with different attributes would be  a nice start (Looking at you Jat Kittag)

[BoomToon43]

People really need to understand that absolutely NOBODY is saying we should remove channeling/combos and bring back charge attacks to replace them. I think I speak for a decent number of people when I say we simply want both. Is that too much to ask for? Melee still needs a lot of changes and tweaks all across the board - and if charge attacks were brought back then they'd need tweaks as well to bring everything into balance. No system is perfect, but isn't diversity that caters to multiple play styles a good thing?

 

Like channeling and combos? Keep using them.

 

Like charge attacks? Use them.

 

Don't like channeling/combos? Don''t use them.

 

Don't like charge attacks? Don't use them.

 

 

There is something for everybody. I can totally respect anyone who found charge attacks to be lack luster. I get it - and there's nothing wrong with that at all. All we're asking is that people whom found charge attacks fun to use be allowed to do so. Nobody is forcing anyone else to play a particular way.

exactly.

[BoomToon43]

I can only speak for my own experience but it's pretty rare for me to see anyone using channeling and i can understand why.

Channeling just doesn't cut it. It takes away energy which is better spend on abilities for a marginal bonus in weapon damage. Not to forget that energy is now constantly in jeopardy thanks to new enemies who can suck away all energy just by being in our proximity.

It's also not worth using mod slots for channeling mods since, that space is better spend on basic damage increasing or elemental mods. To make matters worse except for the basic damage and efficiency increasing mod all other potentialy benefitting mods decrease the channeling effeciency which makes them even more a waste of energy.

The only time i ever use channeling is in connection with livestrike since that one is actualy greatly worth spending energy on.

 

Sure i bet a few players have based their entire melee buildup around channeling and will advocate that it's better than charge attack, but my own experience shows me that hardly anyone, especialy in high level missions is willing to give up a solid normal attack builds for an energy consuming channeling build, just for a few points of extra damage per hit.

Unless it's a Valkyr who can reliably recover energy with Rage and health with livestrike.

 

What channeling also caused was the decline of heavy melee weapons. Heavy melee used to be the king of melee damage in Warframe thanks to their high charge damage. The problem however was that the charge attack heavy weapons were the only melee weapons who could actualy harm most enemies past Jupiter and therefor became the prefered weapon for many builds. It simply paid off more to have a weapon that could kill a strong enemy in one slow blow than many small ones. Hence why the Galatine became the most popular weapon.

 

Which led to the now ironic statement of "The Galatine of Buffing" as counterpart to the Nerf Hammer. Guess what the Nerf Hammer won!

 

Heavy melee weapons now slow you down a lot when equipped, are painfully slow to strike, have combos which also take too long for too little damage and their damage is only marginaly above that of the quick melee weapons.

Also the Glaive just isn't as good anymore without the ability to buff their charge damage and speed up (at least they increased the natural charge speed).

 

Now i can understand why some people don't want charge attacks back, since back in the melee 1.0 times it was charge attack or no attack for most weapons. But removing it completely was just fighting a sympton not solving the problem of weak melee.

 

Charge attacks should come back perhaps only in quick melee strikes and only for heavy melee weapons and a few selective others to make them comptetive to the small and medium melee weapons again.

Perhaps also adjusting the heavy melee combos. Oh and in case of the glaive, finaly being able to throw it when equipped without having to do some other strikes first and needing that stupidly rare combo.

I agree, at least all the heavy weapons( orthos, galitine, scindo, fragor,jat kittag, magistar, gram) should get thete charge attacks back.

[Llyssa]

Nobody really misses charge attacks, this is mainly nostalgia.

 

However, the most-logical thing would be to ask for stances to get comboes that start with "hold E".

[BoomToon43]

Nobody really misses charge attacks, this is mainly nostalgia.

However, the most-logical thing would be to ask for stances to get comboes that start with "hold E".

instead of getting more combos with Hold E, why not just save the devs the work and just add the old charge atttacks back? Then our nostalgia will go away. Edited August 21, 2014 by BoomToon43

[Llyssa]

instead of getting more combos with Hold E, why not just save the devs the work and just add the old charge atttacks back? Then our nostalgia will go away.

Because adding a combo that starts with "hold e" is something that works in the current game engine, and would take maybe a day, as the animations still exist somewhere, they'd merely need to be transferred over.

 

Adding charge attacks back in, on the other hand, would require them to rewrite the ENTIRE melee code, AGAIN, to bring back something virtually everyone hated or ignored.

 

Which do you think they'd agree to? Which do you actually want?

[Rakshal]

Because adding a combo that starts with "hold e" is something that works in the current game engine, and would take maybe a day, as the animations still exist somewhere, they'd merely need to be transferred over.

 

Adding charge attacks back in, on the other hand, would require them to rewrite the ENTIRE melee code, AGAIN, to bring back something virtually everyone hated or ignored.

 

Which do you think they'd agree to? Which do you actually want?

I don't really remember anyone hating or ignoring charge attacks, and I have a feeling you don't know if they have to rewrite the melee code to do this. :/

Edited August 21, 2014 by Rakshal

[TDS0Spoderman]

The only combos I use are the ones that come with Valkyr's Hysteria, most melee stiff fell clunky 

[Llyssa]

I don't really remember anyone hating or ignoring charge attacks, and I have a feeling you don't know if they have to rewrite the melee code to do this. :/

They keep statistics on the damage we do, and how. They've counted every dead grineer.

 

Statistically, melee was very rarely used, and charge attacks were the least-popular melee style. It was much-maligned, for many reasons, by many people. So, although *you* might have really liked it, it was so incredibly unpopular that they did away with it entirely when they rewrote melee code.

 

The entire charge system, the mods that go with it, and so forth, were all removed or converted in the change. They altered the very way that melee weapons work, and just getting the glaive to be throwable again took 3 weeks.

 

So yes, they very much would need to rewrite all of the code if they were to re-instate charge attacks in anything resembling what they were. There are no mods for it, no stats for it, the new weapons don't even have animations for it. It's GONE, and fitting it back in would require stats+mods+animations to be made. It's very strange you don't believe that.

 

So no, it makes zero sense to call for charge attacks to come back.

 

However, it makes plenty of sense to request something resembling them that fits into the existing framework.

[BoomToon43]

They keep statistics on the damage we do, and how. They've counted every dead grineer.

 

Statistically, melee was very rarely used, and charge attacks were the least-popular melee style. It was much-maligned, for many reasons, by many people. So, although *you* might have really liked it, it was so incredibly unpopular that they did away with it entirely when they rewrote melee code.

 

The entire charge system, the mods that go with it, and so forth, were all removed or converted in the change. They altered the very way that melee weapons work, and just getting the glaive to be throwable again took 3 weeks.

 

So yes, they very much would need to rewrite all of the code if they were to re-instate charge attacks in anything resembling what they were. There are no mods for it, no stats for it, the new weapons don't even have animations for it. It's GONE, and fitting it back in would require stats+mods+animations to be made. It's very strange you don't believe that.

 

So no, it makes zero sense to call for charge attacks to come back.

 

However, it makes plenty of sense to request something resembling them that fits into the existing framework.

I think the other 46 out of 51 people would disagree with you, 1 are you that stupid think the don't have a data base for all the updates? Plus most of the charge attack animations are in combos, the longswords is the first attack of crimson deverish, and the third attack of the 2nd combo's of stalking fan have the charge attacks.

[RSITH]

The only charge attack I missed was galantine.

[LukeAura]

Statistically, melee was very rarely used, and charge attacks were the least-popular melee style. It was much-maligned, for many reasons, by many people. So, although *you* might have really liked it, it was so incredibly unpopular that they did away with it entirely when they rewrote melee code.

 

The entire charge system, the mods that go with it, and so forth, were all removed or converted in the change. They altered the very way that melee weapons work, and just getting the glaive to be throwable again took 3 weeks.

I find this hard to believe when all people ever said about melee was how inferior the regular attack was to the charge attack. And that the favourite charge attack(Kittag power spin) actually became 'buffed' as one of the most powerful combos out of them all. 

I think this was an exactly opposite case actually. Statistically charge attacks were so frequent, comparatively of course several melee strikes would equal one charge so charge attacks would be used a lot less despite being more popular this would have to be accounted for, that this caused them to be removed in favour of the combo chains, or else, who would have used the new combo chains? 

People tended to spam melee attacks when bored as well like waiting at the ends of missions, not sure if DE accounted for that. It's much more likely they weren't properly accounting for these kinds of elements when looking at the melee usage statistics if what you say is true about the stats and charge attacks were disproportionately small compared to regular. 

[Dasmir]

As far i remember people just want charge attack for the exgerated amound of damage from it abusing heavy weapons, De removed it for the reason i was making any other stats useless. Im sure if DE puts charge attacks but with a heavy nerf people will still complaining.

 

Really i dont want to go back where everyone was saying "CHARGE DAMAGE ! CHARGE REDUCTION TIME ! MUSTARD RACE !"

Edited August 21, 2014 by Dasmir

[BoomToon43]

They keep statistics on the damage we do, and how. They've counted every dead grineer.

 

Statistically, melee was very rarely used, and charge attacks were the least-popular melee style. It was much-maligned, for many reasons, by many people. So, although *you* might have really liked it, it was so incredibly unpopular that they did away with it entirely when they rewrote melee code.

 

The entire charge system, the mods that go with it, and so forth, were all removed or converted in the change. They altered the very way that melee weapons work, and just getting the glaive to be throwable again took 3 weeks.

 

So yes, they very much would need to rewrite all of the code if they were to re-instate charge attacks in anything resembling what they were. There are no mods for it, no stats for it, the new weapons don't even have animations for it. It's GONE, and fitting it back in would require stats+mods+animations to be made. It's very strange you don't believe that.

 

So no, it makes zero sense to call for charge attacks to come back.

 

However, it makes plenty of sense to request something resembling them that fits into the existing framework.

another thing is they didn't remove them because the were"inpopular" it was because of balancing, when they first showed us melee 2.0 all they said they were doing was making your melee weapon equipable (because people were requesting that so much at the time.) And was said to launch at U12 but then after U12 launched)they told us about combos, the probably were afraid people wouldn't farm the stance and use the combos, so they removed them.

[BoomToon43]

The only charge attack I missed was galantine.

I miss it mostly for orthos.

[DJ_Redwire]

Nobody really misses charge attacks, this is mainly nostalgia.

 

I'm glad you know exactly what I do and do not want in terms of melee functionality and assuming that any and all of the points I've listed are baselessly grounded in 'nostalgia'. What would I ever do without your all-seeing knowledge?