Coptering Discussed In Depth (Like Really In Depth) And Arguments On Why It Needs To Change.

[Tr1ples1xer]

Don't bother. He's just derailing this thread. Let's focus on more constructive things shall we?

 

Like wall-slinging for instance. My opinion is that it should be made into a feature and given a visual overhaul.

Maybe the new one will allow us to:

- Choose our direction

You can already choose your direction when wall slinging btw looky here:

[SoulEchelon]

Oh FFS, I just said my opinion is not better than any one elses, regardless of the amount of money I spent, you also can't read.

 

Of course coptering is not the ONLY reason I paid but its what I prefer doing in the game.

 

If you mean that, NEVER sit there and hide behind how much money you put into a game to fuel your argument. It will ALWAYS go bad for you.

 

 

 

Because every change proposed has some kind of nerf/limit to it, and I don't want that.

 

Every game I try these days I try to butt slide but I can't , I try to wall vault but I can't, I think I got used to it so much I need it now, I have trouble enjoying anything else that doesnt have the fluidity of WF.

 

I guess I could live with some kind of animation for it but nothing else.

 

Nobody's asking for it to be nerfed to the ground. However being able to propel yourself literally football fields away, totally negating any environmental obstacles as well as making specialty warframe abilities redundant is not a good thing.

 

I think this is the problem. People seem to believe Warframe should strictly be an arcade game with no limits and no balances. Quite a few people who raged about launcher ammo also advocated how ammo in general shouldn't even be in the game. I'm so damn glad DE seems to be going the completely opposite way.

[Kestral9999]

Because every change proposed has some kind of nerf/limit to it, and I don't want that.

 

Every game I try these days I try to butt slide but I can't , I try to wall vault but I can't, I think I got used to it so much I need it now, I have trouble enjoying anything else that doesnt have the fluidity of WF.

 

I guess I could live with some kind of animation for it but nothing else.

Well I hate to inform you but that really isn't up to you. Nor is it up to any of us, it's worth discussing though. So maybe consider dropping this charade that you're coptering's ultimate and last defender and that we are the enemy wanting to take away or to massively nerf your precious copter. If nothing else, it needs to be balanced and reworked. You can still achieve the same result, but it would look flashier and work much better if it were shown a bit of love. The fact that the Devs are even acknowledging it shows promise that they plan on working on it.

 

DO NOT delude yourself into believing that it is fine as is. Until it is balanced it cannot be fine.

 

As a matter of fact it's one of the biggest complaints from new players because anyone who has learned to do it rushes off miles ahead of them and leaves them to fend for themselves.

 

I'd personally love to see them make all weapons copter the same distance and then add a melee mod that increases the range of your slide attacks. Then they can add some special utility skills/ combos into each weapon/stance's slide attack.

 

On a sidenote, what weapons are you using to copter. If they aren't the ultra fast ones, then those aren't really the ones we are talking about.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Kestral9999

[Tr1ples1xer]

Well I hate to inform you but that really isn't up to you. Nor is it up to any of us, it's worth discussing though. So maybe consider dropping this charade that you're coptering's ultimate and last defender and that we are the enemy wanting to take away or to massively nerf your precious copter. If nothing else, it needs to be balanced and reworked. You can still achieve the same result, but it would look flashier and work much better if it were shown a bit of love. The fact that the Devs are even acknowledging it shows promise that they plan on working on it.

 

DO NOT delude yourself into believing that it is fine as is. Until it is balanced it cannot be fine.

 

As a matter of fact it's one of the biggest complaints from new players because anyone who has learned to do it rushes off miles ahead of them and leaves them to fend for themselves.

 

I'd personally love to see them make all weapons copter the same distance and then add a melee mod that increases the range of your slide attacks. Then they can add some special utility skills/ combos into each weapon/stance's slide attack.

 

On a sidenote, what weapons are you using to copter. If they aren't the ultra fast ones, then those aren't really the ones we are talking about.

Sure I agree with you on that but I will still defend it, and if one day they nerf it or remove it then I guess it'll be time to pack up my things. All I ever heard from the devs about parkour stuff is coptering is staying in, they never said theyll look into it or want to change it, but its true that the game wil keep changing so we'll never know.

 

I don't believe noobies really have a problem with coptering tho, I always play as a team and revive everyone but yet I still copter like a madman, trying to balance things because others go too fast is not a good idea either imo. If you choose your team mates and have clans that argument is moot. All I'm hearing is this guy goes too fast nerf his speed, NO leave him fly and change server imo.

[Mama_Sasha]

 

I don't believe noobies really have a problem with coptering tho,...

From my experience, they do. I once joined a mission where it was 1 guy choptering, and 2 newbies who just started playing the game. I stayed alongside with the newbies for them to catch-up while the choptering guy was already at the locked gate that needs 2 people to bypass it.

As i was walking alongside with the newbies, the choptering guy was spitting cursewords and name callings, and called me a Founder Elitist and whatnot. I gotta say, alot of Choptering people have zero patience just becasue new players cant catch up with the speed.

[Tr1ples1xer]

From my experience, they do. I once joined a mission where it was 1 guy choptering, and 2 newbies who just started playing the game. I stayed alongside with the newbies for them to catch-up while the choptering guy was already at the locked gate that needs 2 people to bypass it.

As i was walking alongside with the newbies, the choptering guy was spitting cursewords and name callings, and called me a Founder Elitist and whatnot. I gotta say, alot of Choptering people have zero patience just becasue new players cant catch up with the speed.

Ok then is the problem coptering or the guy ?

 

I always help newbies because I want this game to succeed. Don't penalize the people that like coptering because some fools are being $&*^s, thats a whole different story.

[Mama_Sasha]

Ok then is the problem coptering or the guy ?

 

I always help newbies because I want this game to succeed. Don't penalize the people that like coptering because some fools are being $&*^s, thats a whole different story.

Every last one i met was like that, so hearing that you help new players is a suprise for me (atleast you didnt tell me to ''go back to the ktichen'' insult -_- ).

 

EDIT: Ninjad some typos

Edited August 21, 2014 by Cebius

[Lukap99]

You can already choose your direction when wall slinging btw looky here:

You can't choose your direction when wall slinging. You can choose the direction of your copter, but you can't choose the direction of a wall sling.

He wouldn't have been able to pull that stunt off without a weapon that can copter.

[Tr1ples1xer]

Every last one i met was like that, so hearing that you help new players is a suprise for me (atleast you dont tell me to ''go back to the ktichen'' insult-_-).

My experience with noobies is they want to go as fast also...

 

It might be because I'm old haha, let say i'm not a teen anymore, sure I am stubborn and passionate about about this game but I'm not an idiot. I never force my views on anyone, I like coptering but I'm not a $&*^ about it, I'll solo if I want to go realll fast.

[Kestral9999]

Ok then is the problem coptering or the guy ?

 

I always help newbies because I want this game to succeed. Don't penalize the people that like coptering because some fools are being $&*^s, thats a whole different story.

A little bit of both. You're still acting like everyone here wants coptering removed or massively nerfed, neither of which is the case. It's all about balance.

 

Had DE balanced the copter distance, Cebius could have informed the newer players how to copter and they all could have taken off together. However, as it stands, that person probably had a copter oriented weapon and would have been miles ahead of them regardless, only to leave him still stuck at the door and slinging curse words at the team.

 

Do you see wherein the problem lies? I'll go ahead and tell you if not.

 

There isn't an actual advantage to coptering. Only a perceived advantage. The game urges everyone to stick together as much as possible with actual features such as a range for shared EXP and dual bypass doors. Coptering in and of itself is not the problem it's the solo player mindset that it breeds which is totally contradictory to everything else the game emphasizes on. Many players rush off into the sunset, spinning like a top, only to reach an obstacle that they cannot circumvent and then they turn and either blame the other players, harrass them, or troll them with whatever means they have. Coptering caters towards the solo mindset and isn't advantageous to anyone in the squad, not even the person coptering.

 

Regardless of whether or not this has been your experience, looking at the mechanic from a logical outsider standpoint should provide the insight required to realize that it needs a rework of some sort or another. It's simply not conducive to the coop gameplay WF prides itself on.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Kestral9999

[Tr1ples1xer]

You can't choose your direction when wall slinging. You can choose the direction of your copter, but you can't choose the direction of a wall sling.

He wouldn't have been able to pull that stunt off without a weapon that can copter.

OMG you're so right, I forgot that a copter right after a sling  but still another reason why copter is so cool, you can acheive what he wants already.

[Feallike]

TBH idc if coptering stays or goes. It doesn't effect me whatsoever. ;/

 

If coptering stays then whatever i will still be using DNikana, Ichors, and Jat kittag.

 

if it goes whatever i will still be using Dnikana, Ichors, and Jat kittag.

 

 

 

Also everyone saying its a feature. Its not. The DE has changed their minds on Maaaannnnyyyy things. Just because they said it was going to stay doesn't mean it is. :/

 

The people who host the Dev streams are not the bosses of DE, so they know Inside Info but they don't have the final say on what happens. (atleast the regulars on the Dev stream don't have the final say)

 

 

So please all this, its a features stfu, is wrong. Unless the CEO of the DE or the lead designer of warframe comes up and says its a feature. Its not a feature.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Feallike

[Kestral9999]

The people who host the Dev streams are not the bosses of DE, so they know Inside Info but they don't have the final say on what happens.

Exactly! That's PWE's job!

 

Jk jk... let's not get off on that tangent.

 

You're definitely looking at this from the right perspective though, rather than "If they takes mah copter or nerfs it I'mma RAGEQUIT!!!1!!11!eleven!"

[Tr1ples1xer]

TBH idc if coptering stays or goes. It doesn't effect me whatsoever. ;/

 

If coptering stays then whatever i will still be using DNikana, Ichors, and Jat kittag.

 

if it goes whatever i will still be using Dnikana, Ichors, and Jat kittag.

 

 

 

Also everyone saying its a feature. Its not. The DE has changed their minds on Maaaannnnyyyy things. Just because they said it was going to stay doesn't mean it is. :/

 

The people who host the Dev streams are not the bosses of DE, so they know Inside Info but they don't have the final say on what happens. (atleast the regulars on the Dev stream don't have the final say)

 

 

So please all this, its a features stfu, is wrong. Unless the CEO of the DE or the lead designer of warframe comes up and says its a feature. Its not a feature.

I promise this is my last post on this thread

 

I believe Steve (Director) has the last word on how the game will go but yes it could still change completely.

 

I'll leave you guys thread now, sorry about my ramblings.

[Arunafeltz]

All I really want for this are new animations. I would probably slingshot less and actually use my Zorens more if they look fast enough.

[Kestral9999]

I promise this is my last post on this thread

 

I believe Steve (Director) has the last word on how the game will go but yes it could still change completely.

 

I'll leave you guys thread now, sorry about my ramblings.

I'd have at least liked a reply to my last post to you... Oh well, far be it from me to actually give someone some understanding on the core issue of a "mechanic".

Edited August 21, 2014 by Kestral9999

[Lukap99]

I'd have at least liked a reply to my last post to you... Oh well, far be it from me to actually give someone some understanding on the core issue of a "mechanic".

 

... And now that he's gone, can we finally begin to discuss things related to the OP?

[Feallike]

It really doesn't matter, if you look at the statistic.... More people agree Coptering should be changed/Removed then disagree.

 

Like a 60%/40% I highly doubt it won't be removed/changed in Parkour 2.0.

Edited August 21, 2014 by Feallike

[Kestral9999]

... And now that he's gone, can we finally begin to discuss things related to the OP?

Admittedly, to a certain degree that was actually rather pertinent to the OP and also gave us some insight on the "other side's" views.

 

Ultimately, and unfortunately it just boiled down to "I love coptering! Don't take it or change it a bit, it's perfect as is! The devs said that it's staying and their word is infallible, not subject to change and also the word of the Gods themselves! I spent money on this game, if you take my coptering I quit!"

 

And then, you know, the logical rebuttals. But still, I feel like it was a learning experience... sort of.

[Lukap99]

Admittedly, to a certain degree that was actually rather pertinent to the OP and also gave us some insight on the "other side's" views.

 

Ultimately, and unfortunately it just boiled down to "I love coptering! Don't take it or change it a bit, it's perfect as is! The devs said that it's staying and their word is infallible, not subject to change and also the word of the Gods themselves! I spent money on this game, if you take my coptering I quit!"

 

And then, you know, the logical rebuttals. But still, I feel like it was a learning experience... sort of.

I guess you're right.

I seem to have forgotten that this is a thread about coptering. My apologies.

[Kestral9999]

I guess you're right.

I seem to have forgotten that this is a thread about coptering. My apologies.

Quite alright. Honestly I wish he would have raised more points in favor of coptering so that we could have had a legitimate debate, but sadly there aren't terribly many supporting facts for coptering. I mean he pretty much made them all. 

 

1. It's already in the game

2. A lot of people like it

3. Don't like it don't use it

4. I payed money my opinion matters

5. If it ain't broke don't fix it

6. Shut up and copter

[Lukap99]

...Is thread kill?

[grillv20]

Quite alright. Honestly I wish he would have raised more points in favor of coptering so that we could have had a legitimate debate, but sadly there aren't terribly many supporting facts for coptering. I mean he pretty much made them all. 

 

1. It's already in the game

2. A lot of people like it

3. Don't like it don't use it

4. I payed money my opinion matters

5. If it ain't broke don't fix it

6. Shut up and copter

 

if your opinion mattered then the founders section would actually mean something.

Edited August 21, 2014 by grillv20

[Kestral9999]

if your opinion mattered then the founders section would actually mean something

Hmm, not sure if that was actually directed towards me since I was paraphrasing another user's counterpoints on this issue...

[SoulEchelon]

Quite alright. Honestly I wish he would have raised more points in favor of coptering so that we could have had a legitimate debate, but sadly there aren't terribly many supporting facts for coptering. I mean he pretty much made them all. 

 

1. It's already in the game

2. A lot of people like it

3. Don't like it don't use it

4. I payed money my opinion matters

5. If it ain't broke don't fix it

6. Shut up and copter

 

I kinda stopped trying to answer him when I realized my posts were being ignored.

 

But anyways, I just really don't see why we should be doing a sliding attack in the air anyway. It rarely if ever hits anything - including flying enemies. It's not a viable attack in the slightest (not to mention, DE has stated they're planning on adding some sort of aerial attack for melee so you can actually hit flying enemies/cameras. But who knows when that'll happen).

 

I think coptering itself really should be removed and be only activated while on the ground, since attack-wise it's only viable in that situation. As for in air, I think it should be some sort of elongated dash that fits a warframe's abilities.

 

For instance, Ember's could have a firey aura that leaves flames in her wake. Awesome looking as well as viable for some DoT damage. Other frames could have their particular element shown in some way or fashion. And, during the dash, if you're using melee you can do some sort of aerial strike that's far more viable than the current coptering, which, as stated earlier, rarely hits anything.

 

You can "charge up" your dash to make you go farther. Not as far as a football field, but enough to where it's fun but balanced....AND has more uses than bypassing everything.

 

And one more change, would be to let you not only dash forward, but to dash in any direction (sans vertically. Let's keep the specialty warframe abilities still viable, shall we?) This would not only make the game far more faster paced, but you'll be able to actively dodge bullets, special boss attacks, and so on.

 

Now the thing is, all of this awesomeness may need to be reigned in by way of making it melee only. I think this'd be perfect. Again, more ability to dodge, chase, create new and interesting weapon combos, etc.

 

 

Nope, but I'm just generally &!$$ed because of all these crybabies

 

If you're going to pull the "i payed money" card well I payed money too and coptering is $&*&*#(%& and stupid and I don't want it in the game. Also, if it wasn't broken then DE wouldn't have tried to ninja fix it several times ages ago before giving in to entitled whiners like yourselves.

 

Tired of the entitled idiot masses.

 

I agree with you though I think your ire is slightly misplaced. If I'm reading your posts right, you think Kestral9999 is one of those folks you're talking about. He was stating the person he quoted was acting like that.