Slight Change To Mod Slots Can Go A Long Way (Proposal)

[JalakBali]

First of all, I'm pretty sure someone else already had this idea before but I couldn't find it in the first few pages so I'm writing this post.

 

Currently, the mod set up for your warframe goes like this:

 

 

What I'm proposing is to change it to be something like this:

 

 

So what are the differences?

First, abilities get their own slots, which can only be filled with ability mods and they *do not* take up points.  Only the mods slotted in the slots below the aura slot takes up points and the used-to-be-ability slots get converted to clean no polarity slots.

 

Why the changes?

Because Warframes should be about using your abilities more than focusing on a single good ability. Most 'frames don't even bother with all 4 of their abilities since the slot points are better off used for something else. Are Ember, Nekros, Nyx, Rhino's first abilities bad? They're bad in the sense that they're taking up the space of other more worthy mods. So you ended up dumping the "not worth it" abilities. This should not be. Warframes should be played slightly more than pew pew and pressing 4 every 30 seconds. But we (us and the devs) are stuck with this set-up because it's tough to balance an ability that would be worth sacrificing a good mod but not overpowered.  So the solution is to simply take abilities out of the slot space competition.

 

What about the abilities?

They're still there, they can still be leveled up and be removed from their slots. But they cost nothing to equip now so there's barely any reason to not bring them to battle. Now you can have fun using them without having them be a libility due to taking up important mod slot/points.

 

How would this affect the game?

At first, it's simply making all your warframes better. You get 4 extra slots to add in whatever. Hey, now you can actually put in Master Thief! Maybe some resist mods! Yes, they have those! For high level players, this is just adding a little bit of knick-knacks to their builds.  You can Soul Punch all day long if you're bored from Desecrating!

 

But the real boon is for new players.

 

New players are limited by 4 things from making them stronger: lack of levels, lack of credits, lack of mods, lack of resources. They're also limited by being able to use only the piddly first ability. With this change, new players get access to all 4 of their warframe's abilities. You know, like that time in tutorial when Lotus superchanged your 'frame!. They'd get amazed by the awesome looking powers, only to have them locked away unless they grind for 10 hours (or get powerleveled by a Vauban and Nova). Warframe newbie experience is dismal. Newbie experience should have been the easiest until you hit the difficulty wall (like a boss or a hard level). But in Warframe, the difficulty starts second highest then gets exponentially easier until you get to T4.  Giving newbies all 4 abilities at the start will make them use it more while they gather loot to make better weapons and gain more levels.

 

Wouldn't this make newbies too strong and wipe out everything?

Not exactly. The tiny energy pool (due to lack of Flow), the lack of Energy Siphon and Streamline and energy gear limits how many times they can use their ultimate.  Also, there's no way they can easily upgrade their mods (without powerleveling). Not to mention they're still very squishy.  Newbie experience should be about being amazed at how flashy their warframes and their abilities are, and not about plinking rubber bullets from their MK-1 Braton at armored Grineer.

 

So, yeah, I hope DE would consider doing something like this, where the Warframes should have the abilities ready for battle at all times instead of sacrificing one ability to make room for a mod that would maximize another ability.  Warframes should be considered and weighed as the complete package and not because of 1 or 2 good abilities.

[LoopStricken]

Woah now. Ember's Fireball is decent. It's #3 that's naff, and Accelerant is... meh, bring back Overheat.

[Naftal]

I agree with abilities either having their own mod slots or them being removed from mods completely. They shouldn't cost nothing though. Either have them cost the same as they do now or tie them to warframe level.

[Scorpiokon]

Good idea.

[Shinobu_Scorpion]

Only thing I have to say about this is if the abilities cost nothing and have their own separate slots you might as well just take out ability mods and have them automatically on the warframe since there would be no reason not to have them on. Also, because of this I would have them tie into warframe level as Naftal suggested, maybe like every 10 ranks on a warframe their abilities rank up one.

[(NSW)LilVanu]

I like this; but I also think the abilities should still cost points.

It means you have to carefully consider what you're bringing but you still have enough slots for low

rank mods.

 

Otherwise it might become too easy to put on all the high level mods without thinking much about it effecting your skills.

[JalakBali]

Only thing I have to say about this is if the abilities cost nothing and have their own separate slots you might as well just take out ability mods and have them automatically on the warframe since there would be no reason not to have them on. Also, because of this I would have them tie into warframe level as Naftal suggested, maybe like every 10 ranks on a warframe their abilities rank up one.

 

I thought of this before and while that seems to be the proper format, it's limiting in potential expansion and customization. Maybe some abilities would need to be used at less than maximum level, who knows. Then there's also a possibility of adding even more ability than the 4 each warframes have but you're still limited to bring only 4.

 

But like I said, this would change nothing to high leveled, geared up players since they never needed to bring the other abilities to be optimal already. But this would be a great help in early levels where you're lacking good mods and mod capacity to make your super nuker ability efficient and powerful, but you can still use all abilities without sacrificing essential mods for survival like Redirection and Vitality.

[Varzy]

I'd limit the rest of the mod slots to 8 slots, but on the whole I like a lot of this. We should be encouraged to keep all our abilities, and the current situation inhibits that. I think ability mods should keep their cost, though.

[Naftal]

I'd limit the rest of the mod slots to 8 slots, but on the whole I like a lot of this. We should be encouraged to keep all our abilities, and the current situation inhibits that. I think ability mods should keep their cost, though.

The change shouldn't make any current build impossible, and there are 1 skill builds.

[LukeAura]

Only thing I have to say about this is if the abilities cost nothing and have their own separate slots you might as well just take out ability mods and have them automatically on the warframe since there would be no reason not to have them on. Also, because of this I would have them tie into warframe level as Naftal suggested, maybe like every 10 ranks on a warframe their abilities rank up one.

The advantage of having ability slots is the potential for future abilities to become choices. At one point De was considering 'generic' abilities, baking abilities right in to the warframe would make this difficult though.

[Yirktos]

Woah now. Ember's Fireball is decent. It's #3 that's naff, and Accelerant is... meh, bring back Overheat.

Accelerant is her best power.

[Varzy]

The change shouldn't make any current build impossible, and there are 1 skill builds.

Not sure what relevance that has to my comment, can you explain?

[JalakBali]

Not sure what relevance that has to my comment, can you explain?

I think he meant there are players who forma'd 3 ability slots for their build so limiting the mod slots to 8 instead of the current 10 would kill the build.

[LoopStricken]

Accelerant is her best power.

 

It's no Overheat, though.

[Naftal]

Not sure what relevance that has to my comment, can you explain?

1 skill build uses 9 other mods. 8 slots make using those builds impossible.

[Varzy]

I think he meant there are players who forma'd 3 ability slots for their build so limiting the mod slots to 8 instead of the current 10 would kill the build.

 

 

1 skill build uses 9 other mods. 8 slots make using those builds impossible.

Ah. Well.

 

In that case, they're out of luck. 10 free mod slots is way to much and completely inconsistent with the rest of the game's modding system.

 

If we're going to be making a change to how warframe modding works, it needs to be one that improves it to the level of weapon modding (8 free slots), and no furthur.

 

1 skill builds will only lose a single mod space, and can dry their tears on the 3 extra skills at their disposal. I can guarantee it'd be a better build at the end of the day.

Edited September 12, 2014 by Varzy

[Thaumatos]

Only thing I have to say about this is if the abilities cost nothing and have their own separate slots you might as well just take out ability mods and have them automatically on the warframe since there would be no reason not to have them on. Also, because of this I would have them tie into warframe level as Naftal suggested, maybe like every 10 ranks on a warframe their abilities rank up one.

Except for when they make general skills that can be applied to all frames.

[Naftal]

Ah. Well.

 

In that case, they're out of luck. 10 free mod slots is way to much and completely inconsistent with the rest of the game's modding system.

 

If we're going to be making a change to how warframe modding works, it needs to be one that improves it to the level of weapon modding (8 free slots), and no furthur.

 

1 skill builds will only lose a single mod space, and can dry their tears on the 3 extra skills at their disposal. I can guarantee it'd be a better build at the end of the day.

Don't compare weapon modding to warframe modding. Warframes have much more utility mods than weapons do and a bigger need for more slots than weapons that almost exclusively use the slots for more damage/dps.

[Trenggiling]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/191800-adaptations-to-the-mod-system/

I like my ideas better :L

But I like yours too :D

[Varzy]

Don't compare weapon modding to warframe modding. Warframes have much more utility mods than weapons do and a bigger need for more slots than weapons that almost exclusively use the slots for more damage/dps.

I'll compare them because they're comparable. The point of modding is to have certain limitations in place to make individual decisions matter -- the fact that Weapon mods have such a huge slant towards pure dps is a separate issue they have, not something that makes them incomparable.

 

8 mod slots for Warframe customization brings it in line with Weapons and Sentinels and Kubrows, giving players enough space to maximise certain aspects or experiment with different utility mods without totally handicapping yourself.

 

10 mod slots, on the other hand, is a humorous punchline.

[Naftal]

I'll compare them because they're comparable. The point of modding is to have certain limitations in place to make individual decisions matter -- the fact that Weapon mods have such a huge slant towards pure dps is a separate issue they have, not something that makes them incomparable.

 

8 mod slots for Warframe customization brings it in line with Weapons and Sentinels and Kubrows, giving players enough space to maximise certain aspects or experiment with different utility mods without totally handicapping yourself.

 

10 mod slots, on the other hand, is a humorous punchline.

Sentinels and Kubrows have 10 slots too.

 

10 slots would be fine, you could use existing builds and add some utility/quality of life mods.

[Varzy]

Sentinels and Kubrows have 10 slots too.

 

10 slots would be fine, you could use existing builds and add some utility/quality of life mods.

Sentinels and Kubrows also have 2 Precepts that you need to equip for them to attack or use abilities.

 

You could not equip those, but then your sentinel wouldn't attack and your kubrow wouldn't have any skills at all.

 

So, that's 8 mods remaining that are used to manage other utility, shields, health, damage, etc

 

8 slots should be standard. 10 slots, between the corrupted mods and all the various defensive mods, would remove any real decisions needed when making a new build. And that's assuming 10 mods could even fit in the 60+14 capacity Warframes get. I've run the calculations, even bringing just it up to 8 spare mod spots would need 4 or 5 forma to fill all the slots.

[Azawarau]

Not a bad suggestion at all

 

Still costs mod points to use abilities so the only changes are extra slots and possibly forma use

 

Im still kind of benched leaning towards this should happen but if it did this would be a good way to go about it

[Currystador]

Just make slots for now. Then the mod energy stuff, DE can worry about later. just see how it is with ability slots first.

[JalakBali]

Those worried that the extra 4 slots for random mods would make warframes too strong need to remember that there are builds where 3 ability slots are forma'd so they essentially have 9 slots and 1 slot for ability. It just takes a lot of work and forma to get to this, which is something out of reach of casual players.

 

It's also pretty obvious DE will keep introducing new mods so even 10 slots will not be enough to fill in everything by then.  Also with Corrupted mods, you can still have builds optimized for a single ability, just that you're no longer penalized to use your other 3, even if they're weaker than default due to the mods.