Breeding A Kubrow With A Specific Pattern Should Unlock That Pattern For All Your Kubrows

[Sunder]

Pretty much what the title says

 

It's all genetics and DNA. You can even buy a "Gene Masking Kit" from the market for credits!

It seems only logical that if I have the genes of a Kubrow with a pattern I want, alive in stasis, should I not be able to simply transfer that data over to a new Kubrow to alter the fur pattern?

 

============================================

Kubrow 1 - "Fenrir" - Sunika

This Kubrow is black with gray stripes

 

Kubrow 2 - "Sif" - Raksa

This Kubrow is brown with black Lotus styled fur

 

Kubrow 3 - "Eloa" - Huras

This Kubrow is brown and black with the Hound style

============================================

 

With how the masking kit works, and since I have the previous first two Kubrows, one would be led to believe that "Eloa", my third Kubrow should have access to both the "Stripes" pattern and "Lotus" pattern from either of my older Kubrows that're already stored safely in stasis. 

 

- - -

 

Note: My suggestion requires you have a live, grown kubrow with the pattern of your choice in your inventory/stasis in order for its pattern to be utilized on other Kubrows that you already own. Get rid of the  Kubrow who's default is the wanted pattern? You lose the option to change your other Kubrows to that particular pattern

Edited September 17, 2014 by Smac

[(PSN)BKLadyLuck]

Then there would be less people bothering with imprints.

[PhoenixElite]

That's what I was hoping when DE said we could customize our kubrows :/

Edited September 17, 2014 by PhoenixElite

[Brettsta]

Yes you should.

[Brettsta]

Then there would be less people bothering with imprints.

Does anyone actually bother with imprints now?

[(PSN)BKLadyLuck]

On ps4 yes very much so. Pc not sure because I don't bother looking at the trade when my bf goes on there to play.

[Wynn]

God yes I have a 7 forma Kubrow that I like to have lotus on someday

[Sunder]

Then there would be less people bothering with imprints.

Imprints don't guarantee anything.

For example, I had one large bulky male Raksa imprint with stripes

A second Large skinny male Raksa imprint with Domino or Hound pattern

What did I get?

A female Sunika with splotches.

 

 

Personally I feel my suggestion would make sense logically. It seems only natural

[pooptaco]

Nope!

[Sunder]

Nope!

Could you provide a reasoning as to why you disagree?

Perhaps contribute to the conversation with your opinion on the matter?

[(PSN)BKLadyLuck]

Imprints don't guarantee anything.

For example, I had one large bulky male Raksa imprint with stripes

A second Large skinny male Raksa imprint with Domino or Hound pattern

What did I get?

A female Sunika with splotches.

 

 

Personally I feel my suggestion would make sense logically. It seems only natural

But those were two different patterns, what were you expecting?

[RahuHordika]

But those were two different patterns, what were you expecting?

Either of those? Did you even read the post?

I myself have had a few kubrows where neither the colors or the sizes matched either of their parents. Right now prints are a lean towards success but are essentially worthless and are just as bad as the random scrambler that they originally had. Except that, of course, instead of being 10 plat per try is whatever the seller feels like, twice, plus the farming for the power core materials, egg and a wait time of 24-48 hours.

If anything at least make a print you have unlock the stuff but the current system only benefits those who have gotten lucky with RNG to rip off those who haven't as much in hopes they get their dreamed kubrow.

[Wynn]

Yeah I had the parents of my last Kubrow with the breed I want and the lotus fur pattern was from one imprintx2, the puppy of the copy was of another breed. :(

[Loswaith]

Then there would be less people bothering with imprints.

The better use would be to make the imprints unlock these features.

 

In that if you imprint the natural state of a kubrow (it's default scheme) you can use that imprint to unlock that feature within a pallet that then enables you to add/use it like cosmetics for warframes.  IE. the imprint is used up to unlock one kubrow feature from the imprint, be it colour or pattern at this stage but later could even include body type, ear design or nose design (physical features aside from sex and breed).

[NutritionalValue]

This will never happen. The chances of more patterns being sold in the market that can only be bought with plat is higher than having the player unlock it themselves.

[pooptaco]

Could you provide a reasoning as to why you disagree?

Perhaps contribute to the conversation with your opinion on the matter?

Sure I could.

 

I find the breeding/imprint system interesting: You can settle for what you get randomly, or you can spend extra plat to customize something unique.

 

At best, a "fix" should guarantee the traits come from either parent instead of involving RNG/random mutation.  But the answer is not "give us all the things free!"  If you could just "unlock" the lotus-pattern once and use it forever, everyone would have it, and it wouldn't be cool or special.

 

Anyways, I have no horse in this race: I've RNG'd all my kubrows to-date, and don't plan on entering them into any pageants any time soon. lol  And the people who DO enjoy that aspect would be cheated out of their time and plat if we just gave them out like candy.

 

Topics like this are what happens when players get jealous.  If it's worth getting jealous over, then don't cheapen it.

[RahuHordika]

This will never happen. The chances of more patterns being sold in the market that can only be bought with plat is higher than having the player unlock it themselves.

Essentially player greed over anything it seems. This has been the only reply I've seen as to why unlocking patterns one way or another 'shouldn't' happen, it is stupid.

Yeah less prints would be sold, but the Kubrows being exploited as plat making machines is what I believe not DE's intent. This is no different from the random scrambler, but with more materials and effort for a potential failure, it is still a bad system but of course people are making money off this so naturally there are those who are going to defend their wallets. Basically lucky players ripping the unlucky ones for hopes of something that might not even happen.

[Archistopheles]

Does anyone actually bother with imprints now?

I wanted one of each puppy, so I sold/traded prints until I got them all.

[Sunder]

But those were two different patterns, what were you expecting?

I was expecting to get a Male Raksa Kubrow.

Both "parents" being Male, Raksas, and big? Just seemed like a sensible outcome

 

Sure I could.

 

I find the breeding/imprint system interesting: You can settle for what you get randomly, or you can spend extra plat to customize something unique.

 

At best, a "fix" should guarantee the traits come from either parent instead of involving RNG/random mutation.  But the answer is not "give us all the things free!"  If you could just "unlock" the lotus-pattern once and use it forever, everyone would have it, and it wouldn't be cool or special.

 

Anyways, I have no horse in this race: I've RNG'd all my kubrows to-date, and don't plan on entering them into any pageants any time soon. lol  And the people who DO enjoy that aspect would be cheated out of their time and plat if we just gave them out like candy.

 

Topics like this are what happens when players get jealous.  If it's worth getting jealous over, then don't cheapen it.

If traits and certain genes were guaranteed from imprints? I'd agree with you. But like I mentioned above with my example

Two kubrows that are both Raksas

Both large (One skinny but tall, the other tall but bulky)

But my result was a Kubrow with a completely different pattern, different breed, and female.

Everything I wasn't looking for.

 

As for the Lotus pattern being "special"? I don't know what's so special about it other than its rarity. I just like the design, have it already on one of my current Kubrows. I'm not saying to just give them out like candy, but that you'd need to have a Kubrow that's alive and well that physically has that pattern in order for it to be unlocked for other Kubrows. It still means people would buy imprints trying to breed a Kubrow that has that pattern in order to "unlock" it for their other Kubrows and people would still be paying platinum for it

 

As for this being a topic based on "Jealousy"? As previously mentioned, I already have one with that pattern. I personally  just think it looks cool and would like to have it for my other Kubrows.

 

This will never happen. The chances of more patterns being sold in the market that can only be bought with plat is higher than having the player unlock it themselves.

 

What's wrong with keeping the current patterns trade-able and unlocked via owning a live Kubrow with said pattern and just releasing new ones on the market? It's like the armour sets. You may have one that you think looks cool but often enough I see when a new one's released people buy it solely for a piece or two. Why? Sometimes to collect them, sometimes to guarantee the ability to customize their Warframe however they wish.

 

========================================

 

To note:

 

 - My suggestion requires you have a live, grown kubrow with the pattern of your choice in your inventory/stasis in order for its pattern to be utilized on other Kubrows that you already own.

 

 - This wouldn't stop imprint sales seeing as how people who want specific patterns would be encouraged to buy imprints in order to attempt breeding a kubrow with a desired pattern.

 

 - Players who have the 4 main breeds and have put their time/forma/plat into would be encouraged to purchase stasis slots for more Kubrows if they want a particular pattern available to their main 4.

 

 - And of course with more Kubrows being wanted/bred the sales of Kubrow starting kit, eggs, power source and such would no doubt see a rise if only a little.

[NutritionalValue]

Essentially player greed over anything it seems. This has been the only reply I've seen as to why unlocking patterns one way or another 'shouldn't' happen, it is stupid.

Yeah less prints would be sold, but the Kubrows being exploited as plat making machines is what I believe not DE's intent. This is no different from the random scrambler, but with more materials and effort for a potential failure, it is still a bad system but of course people are making money off this so naturally there are those who are going to defend their wallets. Basically lucky players ripping the unlucky ones for hopes of something that might not even happen.

 

What's wrong with keeping the current patterns trade-able and unlocked via owning a live Kubrow with said pattern and just releasing new ones on the market? It's like the armour sets. You may have one that you think looks cool but often enough I see when a new one's released people buy it solely for a piece or two. Why? Sometimes to collect them, sometimes to guarantee the ability to customize their Warframe however they wish.

 

I'm not saying that it shouldn't happen because it will stop people from trading rare pattern combinations (well it's also one of the valid reason I suppose), what I was implying is that if a pattern collection system is available, DE would probably rather make you buy them directly from the market with plat rather than letting the player trade for them with each other, similar to how they locked warfame/weapon skins and colors and can only be bought from the market with plat.

Edited September 17, 2014 by NutritionalValue

[-AR.D2]

I was expecting to get a Male Raksa Kubrow.

Both "parents" being Male, Raksas, and big? Just seemed like a sensible outcome

 

If traits and certain genes were guaranteed from imprints? I'd agree with you. But like I mentioned above with my example

Two kubrows that are both Raksas

Both large (One skinny but tall, the other tall but bulky)

But my result was a Kubrow with a completely different pattern, different breed, and female.

Everything I wasn't looking for.

 

The breeding system that DE has implemented is akin to a very basic dominant/recessive gene system. This means that some traits are guaranteed as long as it is dominant, but if both imprints just happen to contain a recessive trait that you don't want, you could end up being screwed (which unfortunately happened to you).

 

A better case to be made here would be to make the system completely transparent (i.e. displaying the dominant and recessive traits each kubrow has). This would give players a much better idea of what they would end up with.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Deetwo

[Wynn]

Hell rather have the scrambler back just make it cost plat or credits.

 

I'm on my 8th Kubrow trying to get a Sunika with a Lotus symbol, keep in mind that I've use Imprints with them failing to get the pattern+ breed. My Sunika is max out with Forma and don't see how unlocking a pattern with breeding would ruin the rarity.

 

I even be fine with once we find a pattern we have to do some crazy crafting item to save the pattern for other Kubrow. 

 

I mean I went forma crazy on my Sunika after Shelden went on about us being able to customize our Kubrow, right now older Kubrow you can't really do anything for the older dogs other than get some new colors off the Market. 

[Taranis49]

The breeding system that DE has implemented is akin to a very basic dominant/recessive gene system. This means that some traits are guaranteed as long as it is dominant, but if both imprints just happen to contain a recessive trait that you don't want, you could end up being screwed (which unfortunately happened to you).

 

A better case to be made here would be to make the system completely transparent (i.e. displaying the dominant and recessive traits each kubrow has). This would give players a much better idea of what they would end up with.

 

Supposedly the system was updated to only take dominant genes into account a while back - hence the description of the imprints themselves: "copies the dominant genes..." I'm honestly not sure if it actually ever actually modeled recessive traits, (I'm inclined to think it was just DE's justification for completely random results that made no sense).

 

And if breed isn't a dominant trait, I don't know what could be - granted, I don't breed dogs myself (I'm in the reptile trade) but I've never heard of anyone breeding a pair of mastiffs and getting a poodle from the exchange.

 

As I've noted elsewhere (I've bred animals professionally, still do so as a hobby), the imprint system needs some work for it to ever be practical. As said, it needs to disclose what qualifies as a transferable trait (information a breeder kinda needs to make informed choices) - color/pattern apparently do, but breed, body type, size are crapshoots far as I can tell.

 

Now the excuse might be we're meant to experiment to find out, but the two imprint limit nips the viability of that in the bud - a key part of experimentation is being able to replicate results. Roll snake eyes twice, and the entire bloodline's effectively extinct with no way to continue, which is especially silly since encouraging a given trait necessitates basically involves breeding it with itself until it becomes apparent in the offspring.

[(PSN)devan675]

I love the breeding subject I believe we should have a more transparent way to see what will get by showing the dominant traits I mean to be honest I am sunika guy I love them and am dying to breed a big bulky white one with blue stripes but I don't wanna give my plat away gambling whether or not the imprint works so I think a clearer system should be displayed to help other in the breeding process

[-AR.D2]

Supposedly the system was updated to only take dominant genes into account a while back - hence the description of the imprints themselves: "copies the dominant genes..." I'm honestly not sure if it actually ever actually modeled recessive traits, (I'm inclined to think it was just DE's justification for completely random results that made no sense).

 

And if breed isn't a dominant trait, I don't know what could be - granted, I don't breed dogs myself (I'm in the reptile trade) but I've never heard of anyone breeding a pair of mastiffs and getting a poodle from the exchange.

 

I'm aware of the change, but the description from the patch notes was cryptic at best.

 

As I've noted elsewhere (I've bred animals professionally, still do so as a hobby), the imprint system needs some work for it to ever be practical. As said, it needs to disclose what qualifies as a transferable trait (information a breeder kinda needs to make informed choices) - color/pattern apparently do, but breed, body type, size are crapshoots far as I can tell.

 

Now the excuse might be we're meant to experiment to find out, but the two imprint limit nips the viability of that in the bud - a key part of experimentation is being able to replicate results. Roll snake eyes twice, and the entire bloodline's effectively extinct with no way to continue, which is especially silly since encouraging a given trait necessitates basically involves breeding it with itself until it becomes apparent in the offspring.

 

Agreed. The current system is far too cumbersome.