elele Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Really? I love how Mirage looks (as long as she's given believable colors). Mirage just doesn't fit with previous warframe's aesthetics. The biggest culprit is her "eyes". Other frames have "eye-like" structures (i.e. they look like sensors, but not eyes. Mirage literally looks like she's just wearing a mask, with a ninja scarf covering her mouth. It's all too obvious. I'm not complaining that Mirage looks ugly in herself -- I'm also a big fan of Keith Thompson who drew the concept art for Mirage (check it out in the Codex!). The porcelain-like mask is a recurring theme of his designs (e.g. Borderlands 1' aliens: ) Mirage just looks "wrong" compared to some earlier frames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble_Cactus Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) ^^I'm glad to see someone actually knew those were from BL1 Anyway, I get what the OP is saying, and I mostly agree. The new frames, for the most part, do have their place in the overall roster. And none of them are so glaringly bad that I turn my head in disgust when I see them. Yet it is true that they are more... literal now, for lack of a better term. Which is fine, and whether you think it's a good decision or not is subjective. I personally prefer the older frame designs (pre-Nova) because of their ambiguity. They suggest themes and icons rather than actually embody them. Frost, for example, has motifs that are associated with mountaineering – thick heavy boots, a coat, a neck warmer, a helmet that looks vaguely like a parka or a Siberian snow hat. Yet nowhere in his name or his design screams anything that says, "Look! I'm a mountaineer!" At least not to the degree that Limbo does with his top hat, or that Hydroid does with his eyepatch. For all of his simplicty, I actually like Excalibur's design. It's a less visually-busy version of a lot of scifi and anime power suits. Very sleek, and I'd imagine that seeing a faceless, featureless warrior bear down on you in combat would be terrifying. The new frame designs aren't abjectly bad. But in my opinion, they are just less visually-stimulating. They don't provide that layer of mystique that the older frame designs do, and they are more subtle in their cultural or symbolic references. They evoke a theme, rather than become it. As a smart man once said, they are "good for thinking." I kind of wish that future frames would go back to that aesthetic since they gave Warframe a unique look that no other F2P game has, though they probably wouldn't be as marketable as a man in a floating tophat. – I'll admit I have a soft spot for Mirage and the Harlequin mask. Edited November 18, 2014 by Noble_Cactus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaugahn Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) Yet it is true that they are more... literal now, for lack of a better term. Eh, that's somewhat iffy. While it's true the old frames are in general less literal, there are new frames like Mirage that have that ambiguity, and old frames like Volt and Ember that are quite literal. Edited November 18, 2014 by vaugahn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble_Cactus Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Eh, that's somewhat iffy. While it's true the old frames are in general less literal, there are new frames like Mirage that have that ambiguity, and old frames like Volt and Ember that are quite literal. Well, there's a bit of gray area as to what's being literal. I'll admit I didn't explain it very well. Volt and Ember represent electricity and fire as basic themes, but their designs flourish from them. This allows Volt to have his labcoat-thing (it could actually be any number of other kinds of coats, which I think is interesting!) and Ember to have phoenix motifs in her helmets and feet. Yet Ember is never actually called a phoenix, nor is she named Phoenix. Neither she nor Volt are supposed to be a vocation; their designs speak for themselves and they are, for the most part, ambiguous designs past the electricity generators and the chicken phoenix feet. Mirage, meanwhile, is clearly a Medieval court jester. That's pretty much the end of the road for her. I love her design, but she lacks that layer of depth and suggestiveness that Volt and Ember have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaugahn Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Well, there's a bit of gray area as to what's being literal. I'll admit I didn't explain it very well. Volt and Ember represent electricity and fire as basic themes, but their designs flourish from them. This allows Volt to have his labcoat-thing (it could actually be any number of other kinds of coats, which I think is interesting!) and Ember to have phoenix motifs in her helmets and feet. Yet Ember is never actually called a phoenix, nor is she named Phoenix. Neither she nor Volt are supposed to be a vocation; their designs speak for themselves and they are, for the most part, ambiguous designs past the electricity generators and the chicken phoenix feet. Mirage, meanwhile, is clearly a Medieval court jester. That's pretty much the end of the road for her. I love her design, but she lacks that layer of depth and suggestiveness that Volt and Ember have. It depends on your definition of literal. Volt is clearly the electricity frame, and Ember is clearly the fire frame. In that way, those designs are literal. I suppose you could argue that they maybe could be something else, but especially with Volt you'd have to do a bit of a changeup on his design. He even has ambient lightning effects around him. I wouldn't say there's much suggestiveness there. A frame like Excalibur or Loki would be better for the purposes of that comparison, as they don't have any clear theme on first glance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homiedudemanguy Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 i think it brings personality honestly to the frames. not saying its not impossible if they didnt have these "whimsical" themes but i think its a different taste to warframes and maybe eventually itll change again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DemonHybrid Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 honestly the first time i started playing warframe was in early october, but then i stopped playing for a week, and then update 15 came out, and i saw limbo for the first time. i thought to myself:"that is going to be my second warframe" of course it wasnt my second warframe valkyr was but still im on the way to get him and he is still hella rad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HolidayPi3 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Mirage just doesn't fit with previous warframe's aesthetics. The biggest culprit is her "eyes". Other frames have "eye-like" structures (i.e. they look like sensors, but not eyes. Mirage literally looks like she's just wearing a mask, with a ninja scarf covering her mouth. It's all too obvious. I'm not complaining that Mirage looks ugly in herself -- I'm also a big fan of Keith Thompson who drew the concept art for Mirage (check it out in the Codex!). The porcelain-like mask is a recurring theme of his designs (e.g. Borderlands 1' aliens: -snip- Mirage just looks "wrong" compared to some earlier frames. I totally forgot about Mirage's original helmet. I think it's atrocious. To me, Mirage's look is more similar to Mag / Excal / Nyx in the sense that she just looks like a chick in an armored bodysuit. But, to each their own. I'm like, the one person that thinks that Zephyr just looks like melted icecream given form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzaruth Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I think Saryn looks like a spider, Valkier looks like a fox, Rhino looks like a hawk, Loki looks like a hammerhead shark, Zephyr looks like a bird, Rhino Prime looks like an executioner, Mirage looks like a clown, Nekros looks like a grim reaper, Ember looks like a chicken, Nyx also looks like a chicken, Frost looks like a crab, Vauban looks like an ugly, Ember Prime looks like a phoenix, Loki Prime looks like a bull, Limbo looks like a gentleman thief, Hydroid looks like a cthulu pirate, Oberon looks like an elf, and Trinity looks like a lobster. I cannot place anything for anyone else sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yazeth Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 People will love it, and people will hate it. I'm fine with whatever, really. :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burnoutsniper Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I love pretty much all of the frames designs, except for Nova and the base Ember. (Ember Prime is fine tho :P) All to their own I guess. Along with that, I would say that let the devs have their fun with the designing of the frames for the game itself is designed to be fun for the players, why not the devs have fun making the game as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimril Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Yes the hydroid is a half davy jones cliche, and yes, limbo is a stage magician cliche. It is a little gimmicky, but it doesnt bother me. As for oberon, I think hes great. As a druid themed frame named after the king of faeries, the "goat aestetic" u reference is actually a satyr facade. Satyr are fey that have goat legs and horns on an otherwise human body. I dont think this one is gimmicky at all. They are designing the new gunslinger as we speak and they did specifically reference that they were avoiding a gimmicky approach to her, so no cowboy hats bandanas spurs etc. idk if im in favor of this or not cause id personally have fun goin wild west in space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) i personally would like to see another "skin tight" frame; or a frame with armor but no dangly pullables, or popping out energy stuff, or concrete skirts after the gunslinger. s just me tho Edited November 18, 2014 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDRLOz Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I personally feel the well is running dry on originality or that the art team is not given enough time to move away from the original inspiration. The next frame is so close to a cowboy (minus a hat) that its getting a tad silly. Even looks like its wearing a jacket and trousers. As pointed out earlier frost looks like he is wearing clothes. However these are carefully merged so is distinctly different. Limbo and the gunslinger this has not happened and they look really close to their original concept source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanicPrime Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) I personally feel the well is running dry on originality or that the art team is not given enough time to move away from the original inspiration. The next frame is so close to a cowboy (minus a hat) that its getting a tad silly. Even looks like its wearing a jacket and trousers. A long while back I did start to wonder when something like that would happen. To their credit they've mostly been keeping on top of it. As for the gunslinger frame: (http://i.imgur.com/biJoQJn.jpg) I think it looks absolutely fantastic. Except for the jacket. Warframes should not have underboob jackets. It looks like a tacky stripper costume on top of a warframe. I know, my criticism seems like a gross over-reaction, and it probably is. I'd say get rid of the lower half of the jacket, leaving the collar/shoulder pads aesthetic. That will still convey the mexican gunslinger motif that's being invoked here, without the tackiness. Unless of course it has stripper powers. Then it's fine I guess. But other than that, it looks great. I like the bandana thing going on. Hope it has flappy cloth physics. Edited November 18, 2014 by ChasePanic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fadeinlight Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) I think I've heard the most complaints about Hydroid. I like his torso and helmets, very much in keeping with the theme, but the lower body looks like he's been struck with elephantiasis. I will say that his abilities are probably the best thematic expression of any warframe. Limbo and Vauban are the ones that throw me off, mainly because their look is tied to something that is a little too close to reality. Vauban reminds me of a railway baron from the late 1800s, and Limbo reminds me of some dirty magician they just pulled out of a gin mill during the same period, crossed with a Bee Gee. I don't know what it is about those last two, but they bother me. It's not so about their clothing, because Frost looks to be wearing a suit and I actually like his stoic look...but I think Vauban and Limbo get too far into that "uncanny valley" between reality and fantasy. The concept art for the new frame looks fantastic, Nyx Prime and Mirage are masterpieces. I'm hoping that they kind of stay the course with the next ones. Edited November 18, 2014 by fadeinlight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndantony Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 ... The next frame is so close to a cowboy (minus a hat) that its getting a tad silly. Even looks like its wearing a jacket and trousers. ... This here, too, is true and sad. DE Art team and director should stand-fast on their designs. Cowgirl with her own helmet-hat like would look a lot better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-SLX-J3tAc3 Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 (edited) (quote) I see what you mean here. I agree with this, but then, this game is geared more towards a general audience, and has become...more teen-friendly, let's say that. I think I've heard the most complaints about Hydroid. I like his torso and helmets, very much in keeping with the theme, but the lower body looks like he's been struck with elephantiasis. I will say that his abilities are probably the best thematic expression of any warframe. Limbo and Vauban are the ones that throw me off, mainly because their look is tied to something that is a little too close to reality. Vauban reminds me of a railway baron from the late 1800s, and Limbo reminds me of some dirty magician they just pulled out of a gin mill during the same period, crossed with a Bee Gee. ... This post had me laughing! Edited November 20, 2014 by -SLX-J3tAc3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePresident777 Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 This is about my Movember moustache collection, isn't it? Nope, you can't have them back. They make me laugh and I will not let go of them. Nope. You can't take my candy cane scythe either. Hmm, I'll have to put it on now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspari Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I have to agree here. Limbo's design is really pushing it, even though I think he's a lot of fun to look at. I wanted to like Oberon but his body mesh is just weird. I don't mind the goat-ish look, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s7n7a7k7e Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Your are no OK with Hydroid, but you are OK with Zephyr...? Zephyr...? Literally Warframe's version of Big Bird to me is the least fitting of all the frames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanicPrime Posted November 21, 2014 Author Share Posted November 21, 2014 Your are no OK with Hydroid, but you are OK with Zephyr...? Zephyr...? Literally Warframe's version of Big Bird to me is the least fitting of all the frames. It looks agile and light, representing its intended personality. The colour pattern is a little hard to work with but I've never cared much about colour customization. When concept art was originally posted, nobody really knew what it was. Some even went so far as to suggest a female Volt. Looking at it now, it's clearly a bird. It has the aerodynamic wings and various bird-like features. But that's the power of hindsight. We can look at it, knowing what it is, and make the connection to its source material and influences, but those influences aren't immediately obvious. They don't pop out of the screen and beat you over the head with the hammer of +1 subtlety. That's the main aspect of what I like and why I would point at it as a good example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s7n7a7k7e Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) It looks agile and light, representing its intended personality. The colour pattern is a little hard to work with but I've never cared much about colour customization. When concept art was originally posted, nobody really knew what it was. Some even went so far as to suggest a female Volt. Looking at it now, it's clearly a bird. It has the aerodynamic wings and various bird-like features. But that's the power of hindsight. We can look at it, knowing what it is, and make the connection to its source material and influences, but those influences aren't immediately obvious. They don't pop out of the screen and beat you over the head with the hammer of +1 subtlety. That's the main aspect of what I like and why I would point at it as a good example. It literally has a gaping beak head head of a vulture or a newly hatched bird. Don't get me wrong, it's an awesome frame. It's one of the most powerful of the female frames IMO and is my daughter's favorite frame out of all the ones she has. To each his or her own... but in my opinion, Zephyr is one the ugliest frames in Warframe. Even if the design makes sense, looking like a bird and having a lot of arial movement abilities, etc, but it is still really ugly. Saryn is another frame where her overall theme is overwhelming. Her shoulder pads are bulbous. Her right leg looks like she caught the infestsation virus, and while her original helmet looks ok, her alternate helmets look horrendous. Her Hemlock Saryn helmet looks like a Super Mario Bros 2 radish. Limbo I don't care for his lanky tuxedo design, with an awkward Abraham Lincoln top hat that exposes his brain when removed, and bell bottom pants. I almost expect him to have goldfish inside platform pimp shoes. All he needs is Mirage's disco ball ability and he'd be the pimp from the movie "I'm Gonna Get You Sucka." Even the enemies are extremely over-the-top. Greneir ships, look very "orgranic..." The Derelict Ships look like giant prawns floating through space. Captain Vor has robot chicken legs and weird kidneys straped to his head like an old lady bonnet. The Drahk Master looks like a Power Ranger villain reject. And the Corpus wear metal shoeboxes over their heads. Being a designer myself, I've wonder what it's like in the art department of Warframe. I imagine really gross or odd looking objects like entrails, and the art director saying "Stare at this stuff until you can find a way to make it look like a badass new Warframe." It would be fun in a way because the creative freedom must be through the roof in their department, which is the best way to get results. But all in all, Warframe is Warframe. The aesthetics across the board are very over-the-top and unique. That's one of the things that makes it stand out from other games. You've got all this really really weird stuff that at first glance makes you think WTF, but at the same time it's so awesome you look past all the ugly and see the badass underneith it all. Edited November 21, 2014 by s7n7a7k7e Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s7n7a7k7e Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Also, Volt looks like a seahorse Also: Exactly. As much as players like to complain, ultimately they just want to complain, they don't care what a frame they never use looks like. Fake outrage is all the rage. lol now that you mention Volt, that is so true, lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innocent_Flower Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) The new gunslinger frame they released the concept art of... There's a very clear Indian-cowboy theme going on. It's a lot better than framey jones, a magician and a jester. (mirage is awful) But it's about about as bad as oberon. Oberon wasn't terrible, it just wasn't great. Edited November 21, 2014 by Innocent_Flower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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