Frost Feedback / Discussion

[AlphaHorseman]

I just posted on the next Devstream thread! AND THE FIRST COMMENT IS ASKING FOR A FROST ADDITIONAL CC BUFF! GO GO GO!

 

Linking this thread in your posts would be awesome too!

Edited February 18, 2015 by AlphaHorseman

[Dancli]

I just posted on the next Devstream thread! AND THE FIRST COMMENT IS ASKING FOR A FROST ADDITIONAL CC BUFF! GO GO GO!

 

Linking this thread in your posts would be awesome too!

 

Ninjas Play Free

We are Frost

We are Ice

We do not tolerate Nerfs

We do not run fast

Buff us.

 

Gotta spam this again xD

[XxMAGGOTxX]

YOOOOOOOOOOO OMG BEST TIME TO COME BACK! I'm spamming and linking this thread in there. I'ma put in a helluva long post in there man. This needs to happen.

[XToxinator]

Ninjas Play Free

We are Frost

We are Ice

We do not tolerate Nerfs

We do not run fast

Buff us.

 

Gotta spam this again xD

Lol yeah! Until DE cann't tolerate it they will have their attetion more on frost

[XToxinator]

Man wonder when is update 16 gonna come out.

[Ragnarlee_Prime]

Ninjas Play Free

We are Frost

We are Ice

We do not tolerate Nerfs

We do not run fast

Buff us.

Gotta spam this again xD

Edited February 23, 2015 by Dr.Schanbel

[AlphaHorseman]

Man wonder when is update 16 gonna come out.

Apparently Mid-March, as per the last Devstream.

 

Sadly, they did not mention Frost. BUT they are looking to rework Mag's Crush to make it more than just a damage number. Additionally, what caused them to look at Mag (Scott apparently already was) was a well written thread that also had gifs and pictures depicting how dysfunctional Crush was in action. Now, Mag's Crush is receiving not one instance of damage, but a total of 3 damage instances. Each time she raises her hands during the Crush casting animation, damage is applied to targets and new enemies are picked up, should new enemies enter the radius. In addition, her ult now leaves enemy units ragdolled onto the ground after the animation, thus giving it a CC stun that helps it to scale into later games.

 

If we can construct a similar thread that can depict how Frosts Avalanche is in need of some serious love, we may be able to ensure that Scott also looks at his other abilities within the kit to help them along in scale ability. I will try to find the thread with the post about Mag's Crush.

 

Edit:

 

I found the thread!

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/361891-crush-has-two-big-problems-mag-no-stun/?hl=%2Bmags+%2Bcrush#entry4344211

Edited February 21, 2015 by AlphaHorseman

[XxMAGGOTxX]

Devstream 3 or 4 of no attention to Frost despite this thread clinging on to dear life. Supplies are running low. The gods have abandoned us.

 

As for the detailed post, I may find time to do something similar. However I shouldn't need to. If they actually looked at this thread, just for the first five comments on it, they'd understand. We've already explained everything wrong with it, I don't know why we should have to make this into a picture-book to get noticed. I apologize for my strong wording, but to be quite frank with you all this is just too much. The Devs don't care at all. Not a single bit. If they did, they'd show it. Seems every time Frost is brought up, they just ignore it or change the subject. 

 

"Uhm, excuse me, Frost needs a buff prett-" "OH WE'RE BUFFING MAG!" 

 

"Frost hasn't been touched in over 8 months, and that buff wasn't even really effective so I'd suggest-" "OH WE'RE REVAMPING PVP."

 

"Frost can't scale with" "WE'VE GOTTA WORK ON THE NEW FRAME."

 

This is how I as a player am experiencing Warframe currently. An issue has not been addressed in over 8 months. That's an issue in and of itself. As soon as this thread dies, I'm starting another one. 

[AlphaHorseman]

We just have to keep voicing our opinions on why Frost isn't in a good spot at the moment. You could (we all could) even message this thread to DERebecca and have her talk to Scott about it. Heck, message her and Scott (Grineeer on the forums). Tell them that there's literally 27 pages of info that they could look at and see why Frost is in need of some serious buffs. Just like how Mag is now being looked at.

 

Not to mention that Mag has 3 already solid abilities (although magnetic does suffer against a lot of enemies), they all scale well and have multifaceted usability. Now, her kit is going to be fleshed out with a fourth ability that also has scale ability.

 

If we can continue to voice our opinions, hopefully we can also achieve this with Frost.

Edited February 21, 2015 by AlphaHorseman

[XToxinator]

AlphaHorseman is right. We have to keep it alive, until they finaaly think of buffing frost next.

[Dancli]

I have to say this Devstream was poor, except for the Raids and Mag's buff. They've shown content that we have seen in the last Devstream for a considerable period of time, and I could have made a summary of ten minutes on that video. Also, they have answered just a few questions, and one stupid question about Rebecca's hair, which took about five or ten minutes -.-"

So don't be sad about this Devstream, because it was in part a waste of time. There were awesome stuff but... some things could have been shorten a lot.

We will be victorious. Keep up with this :D

Edited February 22, 2015 by Dancli

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

Frost Prime Is my 1st built and most used warframe. And after all the hours spent on using frost I agree. I think his abilities are alright with the exception of avalanche. Freeze is fine, Ice Wave with the augment is awesome.

 

SnowGlobe needs some sort of rework. They should have kept it to timer only. Ever since they added health to globe, I have seen a dramatic decrease in frost players,  it's just not good enough imo.

 

Avalanche is garbage and i'm being nice here.

 

I think frost needs and armor boost. Considering how slow he is and the fact that hes mainly a defensive frame he needs ALOT more armor. Frost is one of those frames that is not meant to die often. And if DE can rework his abilities so that they are all defense oriented, i think the armor boost would fit nicely.

[Tymerc]

I can't stand people who say "X ability is fine!", or "X ability with it's augment is great!".

 

Freeze is probably the worst skill in the game. If it was similar to Soul Punch or something, I would consider using it and it's Augment more.

 

Ice Wave is a mediocre CC, and it's Augment does what the ability should naturally be doing. Augments should not be the means to fixing/buffing Abilities. There's a whole thread dedicated to that argument, so I will leave it at that.

 

I do miss Snow Globe being duration-based only, but it was admittedly overpowered, simply because you could spam giant ones for major CC. I think that maybe they should remove the timer so it's health-based only. It should not be on a timer and health bar. As it is, it is too demanding in regards to Mods to make it tolerable. They should also give it both unique visual, and unique sound effects to show how close it is to breaking. 

 

Avalanche is just a mess. Sure it can kill low-leveled enemies, as all abilities can, but it's biggest problem is how it's damage is executed, and how it falls off scarily fast. It sucks horribly at CC, which is very ironic because it does not live up to it's namesake at all. I like the suggestion people have made to have it do damage first, and then a massive freezing CC that actually provides decent CC afterwards.

Edited February 22, 2015 by Tymerc

[Ragnarlee_Prime]

I agree that FROST's abilities really need reworks. I think he needs more CC, his ice wave does damaged and slows, but it feels very underpowered. I main FROST and has and will always be my favorite frame, but I NEVER hit the ‘2’ key… I mean at least I can pump out some decent damage with my ‘1’ but I don’t touch my 2 or 4 key later game, the damage of both abilities is WAY less than stellar, and the CC from ‘Avalanche’ just isn’t enough. Imagine if LOKI’s ‘radial disarm’ only disarmed enemies for the duration of the casting animation, or NOVA’s ‘molecular prime’ only increased the damage during the animation of the cast, my iron-skinned brethren what if you enemies only floated as long as the stomp animation continued? You would be as nerfed as FROST. This is why I think that, he needs his abilities to lean more towards defense rather than offense. His description reads as follows,

”Frost creates formidable defenses and lethal attacks from sub zero conditions.”

I see no lethal attacks that aren’t from my weapons. He needs to be more utility defender than damage dealer. If his ice wave was instead an area denial tool instead of a long range cold proc. imagine an ice-wall that stops enemies from coming in from one entry or possibly protecting himself and others during a retreat. His avalanche definitely loses all use except being a very expensive panic button that only stops local damage for a few seconds, with underwhelming damage at later levels. It needs to be a HARD CC, being a better and much more expensive’ freeze’.

[Ulyx]

I found all Frost abilities to have their use. The only ability that seem to really be lacking as some have noted is Avalanche. Since Frost is a defensive frame most of his energy need to be kept to fill that purpose. Spamming 4 will deplete his energy very fast which will let his team defenseless... I would change Avalanche to be a defensive ability with a different purpose than his 3 others. I would make it freeze the ground in a larger area that Avalanche covers actually but instead knockdown mobs that enters the area for X secs as if the ground was ice and mobs would fall on their backs.

 

One of the weakness of Frost defensive setup is that whithout loki to disarm mobs at higher waves, Snow Globe do not cut it and mobs just stay out of range to shoot it down. With this new 4, the mobs could be controled in a larger area to prevent the globe from being taken down until mobs are dealt with. The dmg could be removed or diminished since its not Frost main area of expertise anyway. He is a very specialized defensive frame. For a more offensive frame with damaging 4 people should pick another warframe (they already do).

[traybong111]

If Frost should be kept as slow as he is right now, I really think his armor should be buffed to something in 300 to 400 range and stamina to 150. Well the entire stamina thing in this game needs a rethinking but that's a post for another thread.

His 1 could and should be one of the best CCs in the game, it IS an AoE freeze after all, but with how slow the projectile is I'm never sure if it'll go where I tell it to go. There's no reason for it to be so much slower and unreliable than Ember's Fireball or Volt's Shock. If DE's worried about it being too good and too cheap, there's always a way to give his 4 the prolonged AoE freeze while making his Freeze only slow down enemies like Icewave.

I've never used his 1 until I started playing Icewave Impedance/melee-oriented Frost and I KID YOU NOT EVEN IN MELEE RANGE HIS 1 IS UNRELIABLE. This is unacceptable. A simple buff to its projectile speed would bump it up to Shock-level useful.

Icewave isn't so bad; I can choose to entirely ignore its damage or mod for its damage, and its cold proc offers not-too-terrible CC. And yes I agree its augment is bad. The slow trail effect should be innate (the range and duration toned down a bit from current augment version), with another, improved augment allowing Frost to 'slide' over any ice trails he created. With the augment ice trails (can be created by both Freeze and Icewave) would grant Frost increased movement speed & shield/stamina recovery, and a slight buff to ice damage/status of the whole team. Oh and changing its range to a slight cone rather than a straight line would be great, too. Range mod would affect how wide the cone spreads out, potentially covering an entire front line in ice trails of slow painful death.

This is probably just me but Icewave also needs a slight buff in casting animation speed, or some way to do away with that inexplicable 0.6 second gap between the end of Icewave cast and getting back to murdering things with giant axe.

I think DE's effort at scaling Snow Globe (the 4-sec invinc&absorb) was well done. I agree it could use some tweaks (and maybe an augment that allows Frost to move around with it with some HP/range penalty) but overall I think it's the last Frost ability that needs a change.

Avalanche just needs to be an AoE freeze. That's what it's described as so that's what it should be doing. It freezes an entire area, forcing cold status on anything that survived the initial damage. Also enemies inflicted with cold status from Avalanche are left more susceptible to other status procs.

Edited February 24, 2015 by traybong111

[Ragnarlee_Prime]

I also should say this that his SG needs either a timer or a health bar, not both. I have said this and I will say it again, his SG just can’t do what it’s supposed to do late game, protect those inside it. It would be great if the timer was removed while FROST was inside the SG. If he gets a minute to return to his SG that gives him enough time to run to a downed teammate pop another SG over the two of them and get back to the pod before the SG on the pod ‘dissipates’ from the lack of its AC unit nicknamed ‘FROST’.

I found all Frost abilities to have their use. The only ability that seems to really be lacking as some have noted is Avalanche. Since Frost is a defensive frame most of his energy needs to be kept to fill that purpose. Spamming 4 will deplete his energy very fast which will let his team defenseless...

Yeah sorry, I should have included my SG revamp idea in the original post. If SG was revamped to work like this he wouldn’t need so much energy for his 3 and would have enough energy to use a very taxing AoE Freezing ability. In retrospect, I think that my idea for a new avalanche is a terrible one so… forget about it :] . I think your idea of it being an AoE freeze is a good one. It makes Avalanche a shorter range AoE freeze that does less damage.

[Ragnarlee_Prime]

I've never used his 1 until I started playing Icewave Impedance/melee-oriented Frost and I KID YOU NOT EVEN IN MELEE RANGE HIS 1 IS UNRELIABLE. This is unacceptable. A simple buff to its projectile speed would bump it up to Shock-level useful.

HE IS NOT KIDDING it’s probably harder to hit enemies with ‘freeze while they are IN melee range. It is sniper rifle yes, but its projectile hitbox is the size of the tip of a thumbtack, plus the delay of the cast which is like maybe a fraction of a second is HUGE deal when you’re firing a bb at moving enemies.

Edited February 24, 2015 by Dr.Schanbel

[Grand-Dozer]

For the love of the Lotus DE please fix Frost. Warframes are the entire premise of the game, if one thing is to be balanced I'd hope it'd at least be the player characters. 

[XxMAGGOTxX]

For the love of the Lotus DE please fix Frost. Warframes are the entire premise of the game, if one thing is to be balanced I'd hope it'd at least be the player characters. 

Starting to seem like that's just a fantasy world right there.

[XToxinator]

Starting to seem like that's just a fantasy world right there.

yeah

[(PSN)Mofojokers]

I agree with the OP.

I like both Frost and Frost Prime...and although I use him a decent amount, I can't help but think that there's a ton of potential squandered.

Frost isn't the frame I think that needs the *most* attention, but he could still definitely use some attention/tweaks when DE gets the chance.

Nah lol after using most frames poor old frosty needs the most attention. All of his abilities are just not on the same level. I did create a thread on how to possibly fix it. But yeah up to de and i do hope they show him love because who doesn't wanna sing jack frost while freezing the enemies lol. Edited February 25, 2015 by (PS4)Mofojokers

[(PSN)Mofojokers]

If Frost should be kept as slow as he is right now, I really think his armor should be buffed to something in 300 to 400 range and stamina to 150. Well the entire stamina thing in this game needs a rethinking but that's a post for another thread.

His 1 could and should be one of the best CCs in the game, it IS an AoE freeze after all, but with how slow the projectile is I'm never sure if it'll go where I tell it to go. There's no reason for it to be so much slower and unreliable than Ember's Fireball or Volt's Shock. If DE's worried about it being too good and too cheap, there's always a way to give his 4 the prolonged AoE freeze while making his Freeze only slow down enemies like Icewave.

I've never used his 1 until I started playing Icewave Impedance/melee-oriented Frost and I KID YOU NOT EVEN IN MELEE RANGE HIS 1 IS UNRELIABLE. This is unacceptable. A simple buff to its projectile speed would bump it up to Shock-level useful.

Icewave isn't so bad; I can choose to entirely ignore its damage or mod for its damage, and its cold proc offers not-too-terrible CC. And yes I agree its augment is bad. The slow trail effect should be innate (the range and duration toned down a bit from current augment version), with another, improved augment allowing Frost to 'slide' over any ice trails he created. With the augment ice trails (can be created by both Freeze and Icewave) would grant Frost increased movement speed & shield/stamina recovery, and a slight buff to ice damage/status of the whole team. Oh and changing its range to a slight cone rather than a straight line would be great, too. Range mod would affect how wide the cone spreads out, potentially covering an entire front line in ice trails of slow painful death.

This is probably just me but Icewave also needs a slight buff in casting animation speed, or some way to do away with that inexplicable 0.6 second gap between the end of Icewave cast and getting back to murdering things with giant axe.

I think DE's effort at scaling Snow Globe (the 4-sec invinc&absorb) was well done. I agree it could use some tweaks (and maybe an augment that allows Frost to move around with it with some HP/range penalty) but overall I think it's the last Frost ability that needs a change.

Avalanche just needs to be an AoE freeze. That's what it's described as so that's what it should be doing. It freezes an entire area, forcing cold status on anything that survived the initial damage. Also enemies inflicted with cold status from Avalanche are left more susceptible to other status procs.

I suggested

First ability

Why not change this to a more cc style let him freeze targets around him for x amount of time and not broken by a simple sneeze lol.

Snow globe

Take away the health and leave the timer. Its just a good shield to help yours allies out.

The silly "line of ice"

Simply change it to a cone effect other wise its fine

The ultimate

Probably one of the worst abilities i have seen yet next to that psychic bolt one lol. Simply make it more like novas ultimate large radius no damage but when the enemy dies he freezes all nearby for x amount of time.

Also increase the amount of damage they take before breaking the freeze. It feels like if i sneezed on them it would break lol.

Also id love to see it changed so frost is not affected by the frost tiles in the void. The idea of frost not been able to handle the cold is funny but sad.

As well i think they should let frost move faster while in snow globe and ice effects. Or buff his armor and stamina to make up for it lol.

Edited February 25, 2015 by (PS4)Mofojokers

[XxMAGGOTxX]

Sooooo... DE? You guys listening in?

[Grand-Dozer]

Perhaps someone should collate all the player feedback and PM Scott with an overview of the most popular Frost changes in this thread as well as a link to this thread (and any others related to Frost ability/stat re-balance) for reference.

Edited February 25, 2015 by Grand-Dozer