Morec0 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 But the thing I don't get, why can Vor only take damage to the glowy bit, but we (and I presume the Sentients, but that remains to be seen) take damage anywhere? Because Vor, unlike the Tenno and Sentients, is not relying on anything other than pure Oro to power himself. The Sentients have their own bodies, physical forms that adapt naturally to what harms them, and we have our Warframes that can be damaged and, as seen in The Profit and Zanuka/Valkyr in general, cut apart and destroyed. Oro is but one part of the both of us. But Vor seems to have fully embraced it as his whole. Vor likely couldn't care less if his arm was cut off or, as he addresses himself, if he is cut in half, as long as the Oro remains he can keep fighting. That's why we have to attack it, attempt to extinguish it, force him to fall back After looking at the trailer in HD I'm more of the opinion that the energy flares at the core of the Oculist-like sentients are not "balls" at all just "flares" nothing like the energy-ball in-between the halves of Void-Vor. I'll have another look in my codex tonight To me they look similar - albeit that the Sentients we see have blue and more meager-looking Oros, but that would be fitting with a race that can't fully use it without hurting themselves to some extent, it's possible they simply can't risk harnessing too much of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Because Vor, unlike the Tenno and Sentients, is not relying on anything other than pure Oro to power himself. The Sentients have their own bodies, physical forms that adapt naturally to what harms them, and we have our Warframes that can be damaged and, as seen in The Profit and Zanuka/Valkyr in general, cut apart and destroyed. Oro is but one part of the both of us. Vor is more similar in that sense to Sentients than to Tenno. We know that Sentients are formless. Sentietns in Natah quest said that he had taken the form similar to Lotus only to relate to her. That suggests that he was without body, just like cephalons. You are right that they have bodies but not that they permanently ocupy one. Sentient bodies are drones. We will fight with those drones as they will fight with our frames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morec0 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Vor is more similar in that sense to Sentients than to Tenno. We know that Sentients are formless. Sentietns in Natah quest said that he had taken the form similar to Lotus only to relate to her. That suggests that he was without body, just like cephalons. You are right that they have bodies but not that they permanently ocupy one. Sentient bodies are drones. We will fight with those drones as they will fight with our frames. To some extent I agree, but not fully. I think that the Sentients do have physical forms but, to some extent, they are able to switch them or even perhaps operate some kind of puppets - after all, I'm still of the mind that Lotus' "throne" looks suspiciously like a different version of that thing in the Tombs trailer. I also think that when he said those lines he was speaking to Regor, Regor being the first character he saw within the Tomb, hence the "who have you become?" line; he thought Regor was Natah in a different form. And we STILL know that the Sentients, for some unknown length of time, just flat-out couldn't interact with the Void, they had to build up immunity to it and even then it still damages them in ways. And I also think it's a mistake to assume those Drones aren't Sentients themselves - different kinds of Sentients, like a drone bee is different from the Queen (albeit in a more extreme, Sci-Fi way), but still born of them. I suppose only time will tell in that regard, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 But Vor seems to have fully embraced it as his whole. Vor likely couldn't care less if his arm was cut off or, as he addresses himself, if he is cut in half, as long as the Oro remains he can keep fighting. That's why we have to attack it, attempt to extinguish it, force him to fall back I want to destroy his Oro. I'm sick of his face. And voice. And lightning ball-things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morec0 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 I want to destroy his Oro. I'm sick of his face. And voice. And lightning ball-things. If Void Assassinations become a thing, we MIGHT get that chance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 If Void Assassinations become a thing, we MIGHT get that chance... Still waiting for a response as to why Megan has 17,999 Void assassination keys... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) I'll just cut straight to the short version: Right at the end, Warframes are Warframes, Tenno are the operators inside the Warframes, not the Warframes themselves. Limbo and Mirage couldn't revive because A: Mirage disintegrated. B: Limbo made a miscalculated jump, and ended up in several different places. Lol that's not what my theory said at all. You really like to assume things ain't you? Yes and its very inconsistant. You dismiss changeing frames as game machanic with no lore atached. Why would we have quests for frames? Killing bosses to get frames is not a good proof IMO and I wont use it. I will use quests instead. Why would you build frames from the lore perspective? You cant dismiss is as game machanic now. From lore perspective we do it and you cant ignore the lore whenever you want. The theory that doesnt defend itself in any way by ignoring one evidence and using another is a joke to me. Theory should take into account all eveidence and make use of them, this is the base of speculations. Not one fact but all. First of all, I didn't "dismiss" it, I strictly said "I still believe..." in between a parenthesis, not a statement of fact like "It's not...". I also said right behind to that line: "What separate them is the Tenno are able to change their "shells" and snails cannot", does that seems like an act of dismissal to you? My thoughts are strictly separated from my theory using parenthesis in-between. You're the one dismissing my sentences from the others and jump onto the boat one second later, does that make you a joke to me? (No). Edited August 17, 2015 by AlphaWolf003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) First of all, I didn't "dismiss" it, I strictly said "I still believe..." in between a parenthesis, not a statement of fact like "It's not...". I also said right behind to that line: "What separate them is the Tenno are able to change their "shells" and snails cannot", does that seems like an act of dismissal to you? My thoughts are strictly separated from my theory using parenthesis in-between. You're the one dismissing my sentences from the others and jump onto the boat one second later, does that make you a joke to me? (No). You missed the point. You think that is only a game mechanic not relayted to lore. Your own words : "I still believe the reason why we are able to switch between our warframes is only because the devs give us the freedom to and not lore-related, why would they make you unable to play a frame because you choose your gender as a male/female?". I made it clear that it is. If you belive that it is not, it is a dismissal. Dismissal is: the act of treating something as unworthy of serious consideration; rejection. Thats exacly what you did, treated it as not relayted to lore in any way. Edited August 17, 2015 by Xardis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) You missed the point. You think that is only a game mechanic not relayted to lore. Your own words : "I still believe the reason why we are able to switch between our warframes is only because the devs give us the freedom to and not lore-related, why would they make you unable to play a frame because you choose your gender as a male/female?". I made it clear that it is. If you belive that it is not, it is a dismissal. Dismissal is: the act of treating something as unworthy of serious consideration; rejection. Thats exacly what you did, treated it as not relayted to lore in any way. Yes, but I also took the lore aspect of it into consideration, following the previous sentence before that (which let me remind you, the one you quoted was/is put into a parenthesis and act as my second thought of it). So if I taken both game mechanics and lore aspect into consideration, it's therefore, not a dismissal, or a rejection. Edited August 17, 2015 by AlphaWolf003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Yes, but I also took the lore aspect of it into consideration, following the previous sentence before that (which let me remind you, the one you quoted was/is put into a parenthesis and act as my second thought of it). So if I taken both game mechanics and lore aspect into consideration, it's therefore, not a dismissal, or a rejection. No. You can take something into consideration but you can either ignore it or use it. Not the superposition of both. It could only exist if you didnt state your theory at all. You stated that you belive that its not lore relayted. I presented that it is. Thats exacly my point. You asked for feedback and thats what I tell you: you based your thesis on a wrong assumption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) No. You can take something into consideration but you can either ignore it or use it. Not the superposition of both. It could only exist if you didnt state your theory at all. You stated that you belive that its not lore relayted. I presented that it is. Thats exacly my point. You asked for feedback and thats what I tell you: you based your thesis on a wrong assumption. If I take something into consideration, it means it's NOTED, not ignored. It could exist whether I state my theory or not, since, obviously, it's a damn theory, its existence (whether real or not) doesn't get affected by theories, that's plain stupid to say that. Read my sentence, since I (obviously) included it as a part of my theory as well and not dismissing it, whether I like it or not. It's not the superposition of both, it's called possibilities, I simply included my thought about it that it's just possibly a game mechanics, and since it's a theory, there is no 100% fact in it. Here's my 50cent: "What separate them is the Tenno are able to change their "shells" and snails cannot" - how you view this as a dismissal is beyond me. Here's my other 50cent: "(I still believe the reason why we are able to switch between our warframes is only because the devs give us the freedom to and not lore-related, why would they make you unable to play a frame because you choose your gender as a male/female?)" Get it? o.o Edited August 17, 2015 by AlphaWolf003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 "What separate them is the Tenno are able to change their "shells" and snails cannot" You just killed your own theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 You just killed your own theory. I used snails as the main comparison because of their similarities, I didn't say they're exactly like snails o.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 I used snails as the main comparison because of their similarities, I didn't say they're exactly like snails o.0. Then fix the title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Then fix the title. Well if the majority of people in this community still have any common sense left then there's no need to fix the title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrbrngr Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Eh just one question guys... how do Tenno change gender when swapping from a Rhino to a Nova? (just giving an example). P.S. This "Energy" theory doesn't sound very plausible, but I dont know how the game explains the fact that one user can use any warframe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 Eh just one question guys... how do Tenno change gender when swapping from a Rhino to a Nova? (just giving an example). ...We don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakcal Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Eh just one question guys... how do Tenno change gender when swapping from a Rhino to a Nova? (just giving an example). P.S. This "Energy" theory doesn't sound very plausible, but I dont know how the game explains the fact that one user can use any warframe... We are flesh creatures made right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 If I take something into consideration, it means it's NOTED, not ignored. It could exist whether I state my theory or not, since, obviously, it's a damn theory, its existence (whether real or not) doesn't get affected by theories, that's plain stupid to say that. Read my sentence, since I (obviously) included it as a part of my theory as well and not dismissing it, whether I like it or not. It's not the superposition of both, it's called possibilities, I simply included my thought about it that it's just possibly a game mechanics, and since it's a theory, there is no 100% fact in it. Here's my 50cent: "What separate them is the Tenno are able to change their "shells" and snails cannot" - how you view this as a dismissal is beyond me. Here's my other 50cent: "(I still believe the reason why we are able to switch between our warframes is only because the devs give us the freedom to and not lore-related, why would they make you unable to play a frame because you choose your gender as a male/female?)" Get it? o.o Your theory is based on assuption that switching frames doesnt exist in lore. Dont tell me those lines as i didnt understand them. I used them against you. You included your thought about this fact from the stand point of your theory. Oh it doesnt match up, its probably not lore related. This fact undermines you theory and you tell me that it includes it. What we try to do here is to make theory that fits all facts, that changes if new facts arrive to suit them. You asked for feddback and you got it: your theory is selfcontradicting in our opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Your theory is based on assuption that switching frames doesnt exist in lore. Dont tell me those lines as i didnt understand them. I used them against you. You included your thought about this fact from the stand point of your theory. Oh it doesnt match up, its probably not lore related. This fact undermines you theory and you tell me that it includes it. What we try to do here is to make theory that fits all facts, that changes if new facts arrive to suit them. You asked for feddback and you got it: your theory is selfcontradicting in our opinion. You're the one assuming and keep saying I ignored the fact where they are able to switch frames, when me, the one who made the theory, saying I'm not (???). You didn't use it against me, you used what you assumed you think it is against me, which is what making this conversation sounding really stupid right now. Tell me, when you make a statement, and your boss says it's good but you wanted to add more to the statement accordingly to what you think would be good, but you couldn't/don't want to afterward, does that make the statement invalid? I didn't tell you that I includes it, lmao the last 2 pages I'm telling you it's not, and you're like "F*** what you says it's what I say that makes sense", then afterward you told me that I told you I include it? Yes I asked for thoughts, and I am addressing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_Gohae Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Eh just one question guys... how do Tenno change gender when swapping from a Rhino to a Nova? (just giving an example). P.S. This "Energy" theory doesn't sound very plausible, but I dont know how the game explains the fact that one user can use any warframe... If you are energy you can reshape yourself and enter any warframe no matter how it's shaped. You are not changing genders you are just putting on a machine that was built to look like a girl or a dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted August 18, 2015 Author Share Posted August 18, 2015 If you are energy you can reshape yourself and enter any warframe no matter how it's shaped. You are not changing genders you are just putting on a machine that was built to look like a girl or a dude. And since we're not energy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 (edited) You're the one assuming and keep saying I ignored the fact where they are able to switch frames, when me, the one who made the theory, saying I'm not (???). You acknowledge that fact. Thats true and im not saying you didnt. I dont see that it is a part of your theory. If you did include that fact in your theory show me how. In original text there isnt a single line adressing it as it was a part of theory. There is in fact a statment that views that as only a game mech. Regardless if you adress it or not, lets agree to disagree on your theory being false. And since we're not energy? We dont know that. There is evidence that we could be energy. There are beings in Warframe universe that can be clasifed as "energy". I belive that there are no such things as beings of pure energy. Instead I belive that Sentients, Janus, Vor, Tenno, Lotus and Cephalons are virtual beings, some were created and some evolved into this state. Edited August 18, 2015 by Xardis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 You acknowledge that fact. Thats true and im not saying you didnt. I dont see that it is a part of your theory. If you did include that fact in your theory show me how. In original text there isnt a single line adressing it as it was a part of theory. There is in fact a statment that views that as only a game mech. Regardless if you adress it or not, lets agree to disagree on your theory being false. I already said that "the differences that separate them is the Tenno are able to change their "shells" and snails cannot", which is primarily what my entire theory is pretty much about - comparing and contrast between the Tenno and the snails. There are other mollusks, however, that can change their shells. Just a quick fact I feel like including .-. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted August 19, 2015 Author Share Posted August 19, 2015 I already said that "the differences that separate them is the Tenno are able to change their "shells" and snails cannot", which is primarily what my entire theory is pretty much about - comparing and contrast between the Tenno and the snails. There are other mollusks, however, that can change their shells. Just a quick fact I feel like including .-. Why snails? Why not lobsters, or snakes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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