Start From Scratch.

[Naqel]

PVP in it's current form is absolutely unsalvageable.

 

It highlights everything that is broken about warframe, such as the nonsensical melee, inconsistent exploit-based mobility and broken powers that take no effort or skill to use, while also gutting the only redeeming quality warframe has: the mod system.

 

The entire game being poorly balanced in general dosen't help any.

And the PvP specific balancing dose nothing to combat that, with stupid ideas like the MK-1 weapons being included in it.

 

 

At this point, the only valid solution is to start from scratch, again, before it's too late to change direction, and we end up with another melee 2.0.

[Burnthesteak87]

Disagree.

It would be enough to: 
☻ stop people from spamming skills or reducing drastically their damage / adding a cooldown, so it's not a press a key to win; actually the last patch energy spawn limitation isn't enough;
☻ allowing stamina to limitate coptering, melee and exagerate mobility;
☻ stick tightly to the logic of reducing oneshots.
☻ allow players to create premade and private games.

The actually state of the game isn't that bad.

 

[Stratego89]

Uhm... I find the current PvP rather enjoyable when there aren't toxic players involved.

[(PSN)Saddler01]

"broken powers that take no effort or skill to use"

I don't understand, do want minigames to pop up every time you use an ability?

Warframe abilities as a whole are pretty broken and require no skill to use effectivley.

Pvp works just fine for the time being and to say it's unsalvageable is incredibly ridiculous.

[SanguineSavant]

Uhm... I find the current PvP rather enjoyable when there aren't toxic players involved.

 

You know how sometimes you live in a nice area and they move in some asshat who got kicked out of the city?

This is what happens when CoD dies. They migrate to good games and ruin good communities.

[r0ckwolf]

- deleted- /** too many tabs open posted in the wrong THread! sry:)

Edited April 27, 2015 by r0ckwolf

[Buzkyl]

PVP in it's current form is absolutely unsalvageable.

 

 

I had to stop reading there. If you certainly think this iteration of pvp is horrible i wish you saw the last version

[oinkah]

Actually, many things that make Warframe broken are omitted from PvP. These include: energy efficiency, perpetual ultimate or cc spam, armor scaling, damage scaling, bleeding and poison procs, overreliance on damage mods, dumb enemies, afk farming and many more.

PvP only needs few weapon and frame tweaks, balance between time to kill and mobility, improved energy management and better UI. No need for complete overhaul.

Even in it's current state PvP is far more balanced than PvE ever was.

Edited April 27, 2015 by oinkah

[rockscl]

what is the problem with mk1 weapons?

[Naqel]

PvP only needs few weapon and frame tweaks, balance between time to kill and mobility, improved energy management and better UI. No need for complete overhaul.

Even in it's current state PvP is far more balanced than PvE ever was.

 

Less S#&$ is still S#&$.

 

PvE is at least mildly fun S#&$, because at least you get to make things die in large numbers(which is fun in doses small enough not to overstay it's welcome).

 

If you look at the "few tweaks" you speak of that's basically every component of the entire game that needs a dedicated PvP re-do.

If everything is broken and needs a fix, then it's better they start over, instead of applying the DE brand of band-aid fixes we know and love hate.

 

what is the problem with mk1 weapons?

 

They were introduced as a completely backwards way to give new players the ability to chose a starting different weapon over the MK-1 Braton.

 

A reasonable decision would be to remove the useless MK-1 Braton, and let new players pick a normal weapon.

What DE did was create more useless ones, because of people that live only to farm their meaningless mastery rank wanted more XP.

[rockscl]

i hadnt seen the mk1 braton`s dps, it clearly is ridiculously under average, but i cant say every mk1 weapon sucks, at least i did not feel underpowered when i ranked them, and i ranked all of them in pvp, the worst thing was the kunai, but thats not only in its mk1 version

Edited April 27, 2015 by rockscl

[oinkah]

If you look at the "few tweaks" you speak of that's basically every component of the entire game that needs a dedicated PvP re-do.

If everything is broken and needs a fix, then it's better they start over, instead of applying the DE brand of band-aid fixes we know and love hate.

You're exaggerating.

I can only speak about primaries since I own most of them, but they seem to be fairly balanced to each other. Karak, Mk1 Braton, Boars and bows need a few boosts to become competitive. Strun Wraith overpowers other Struns. But overall, most primaries are decent.

Secondaries and melee seem to be more problematic, but I have too few of them to compare.

Frame balance is tricky. Many first abilities are too strong and ult spam still exists. Developers need to be bolder and start tweaking stats and abilities more independently from PvE. However, there is no evidence that their mindset would change after big restart.

Energy management has been addressed partially by doubling orb respawn rates.

Any changes to movement will have to wait till Parkour 2.0. Starting from scratch wouldn't change that.

Ui needs to show cephalons and their carriers.

Matchmaking and lack of dedicated servers are separate problems and restart would not fix them.

So overall, I really don't see what full restart would accomplish. They can perform weapon and frame tweaks within current build. Anything else doesn't depend on PvP team alone.

Edited April 27, 2015 by oinkah

[Ashnal]

Less S#&$ is still S#&$.

 

PvE is at least mildly fun S#&$, because at least you get to make things die in large numbers(which is fun in doses small enough not to overstay it's welcome).

 

If you look at the "few tweaks" you speak of that's basically every component of the entire game that needs a dedicated PvP re-do.

If everything is broken and needs a fix, then it's better they start over, instead of applying the DE brand of band-aid fixes we know and love hate.

 

 

They were introduced as a completely backwards way to give new players the ability to chose a starting different weapon over the MK-1 Braton.

 

A reasonable decision would be to remove the useless MK-1 Braton, and let new players pick a normal weapon.

What DE did was create more useless ones, because of people that live only to farm their meaningless mastery rank wanted more XP.

I think you misunderstand the purpose of Mk1-Weapons.

They're a staple feature in most F2P games where the stuff you start out with is junk, in order to purposefully limit your progression. Combine that with the time it takes to gather resources for better weapons, and the craft time, and you have a decent nudge at a new player to convince them to buy and spend plat on better weapons or rushing their foundry.

 

The new Mk1-Weapons were not meant to break this philosphy, instead, they were meant to give a playstyle choice to new players while keeping it intact.

 

It has exactly 0 to do with players wanting more mastery, and everything to do with platinum sales and F2P staple mechanics.

[Auramaru]

The only point I agree with op: mobility. I'm actually quite fond of the idea of copterring being hindered, so long as directional melee and quick flips remain. ;)

Other than that, you really need to chill. Compared to conclave 1.0, this PVP is quite good and I'm glad to see many new players enjoying it. You are dramatic, Op

[JonBenj]

The only point I agree with op: mobility. I'm actually quite fond of the idea of copterring being hindered, so long as directional melee and quick flips remain. ;)

Other than that, you really need to chill. Compared to conclave 1.0, this PVP is quite good and I'm glad to see many new players enjoying it. You are dramatic, Op

 

You surprise me.

[Auramaru]

You surprise me.

I say this only in the sense of balance and attracting/retaining newcomers

[JonBenj]

I say this only in the sense of balance and attracting/retaining newcomers

 

I see. I've noticed alot of dead regions recently in PVP 2.0.

 

I defer to you, as i would imagine you have played a great deal more of the new PVP than I and seem to care a great deal about the game; but i still feel it is no better than it was before - except its slower, more exploitable, ability based and somewhat more toxic.

 

DE seems to have ignored the strengths of the game - Mobility and the mod system.

Edited April 28, 2015 by JonBenj