Ash's Teleport: How It Should Also Be A True Travel Power For Next Movement 2.0

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

Tbh Soo what!?

Lokis invisibility is better than Ash soo why do we need Ash?

Trinity Heals better then Oberon

Vauban can CC better then Nyx 

etc...

 Free-aim Teleport should help alot, granting shorter range and higher energy cost should pacify the complaints of folks who feel as You do.

Remember Ash is a Shinobi you dnt see me trippin bout Valkyr having one of Ashs utilities (RipLine) remember ninjas use Grappling hooks to move around not Magical teleportations but hey, this is a VIDEO GAME

 

It wont hurt Zephyr players one bit

 

Trinity was specifically designed to have the best healing.

 

Loki was specifically designed to have the best stealth.

 

Zephyr was specifically designed to have the highest mobility.

 

Giving Ash a free aim Teleport would be like replacing Oberon's ult with a pre-nerf Blessing, thus making him a better support frame than the frame specifically designed to have the best support. A free aim Teleport with no other limitations would give Ash, who's not even a mobility focused frame, higher mobility than the frame that's specifically designed to have the highest mobility.

 

However, as I've already said, other limitations could be put in place to balance this. I thoroughly like the idea of Ash being able to teleport to his shurikens, although there are many viable possibilities.

Edited July 26, 2015 by 4G3NT_0R4NG3

[LeoCastillo]

Sounds pretty cool, make it happen DE. :)

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

Trinity was specifically designed to have the best healing.

Loki was specifically designed to have the best stealth.

Zephyr was specifically designed to have the highest mobility.

Giving Ash a free aim Teleport would be like replacing Oberon's ult with a pre-nerf Blessing, thus making him a better support frame than the frame specifically designed to have the best support. A free aim Teleport with no other limitations would give Ash, who's not even a mobility focused frame, higher mobility than the frame that's specifically designed to have the highest mobility.

However, as I've already said, other limitations could be put in place to balance this. I thoroughly like the idea of Ash being able to teleport to his shurikens, although there are many viable possibilities.

Not 100% true. Zephyr was actually designed to offer AIRmobility. Tailwind was supposed to make you float and was changed to a mobility tool last second for some reason.

The statement that he would beat zephyr as mobility frame is therefore flawed to the core. Zephyr was never meant to be what she became.

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

Not 100% true. Zephyr was actually designed to offer AIRmobility. Tailwind was supposed to make you float and was changed to a mobility tool last second for some reason.

The statement that he would beat zephyr as mobility frame is therefore flawed to the core. Zephyr was never meant to be what she became.

 

The Soldier in TF2 wasn't intended to have the highest mobility of any class. Rocket Jumping wasn't originally intended to be a thing. Giving Ash a free aim Teleport would be like giving the Spy a Rocket Jumper.

Edited July 26, 2015 by 4G3NT_0R4NG3

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

The Soldier in TF2 wasn't intended to have the highest mobility of any class. Rocket Jumping wasn't originally intended to be a thing. Giving Ash a free aim Teleport would be like giving the Spy a Rocket Jumper.

Dude, teleportation is part of the ninja mythology. He allready is able to teleport as well. Why would he even need a living target to teleport somewhere?

And wanna compare it to other games? Compare it to dishonored.

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

Dude, teleportation is part of the ninja mythology. He allready is able to teleport as well. Why would he even need a living target to teleport somewhere?

 

Because game balance takes priority over everything else.

 

Having Teleport be less limited is something I think is good, it just shouldn't rival or exceed Tail Wind's mobility. I've already proposed several possibilities for new Teleport mechanics, which you seem to have ignored. I thoroughly like the idea of Ash being able to teleport to the shurikens he's thrown, since it would act as a limiting factor for Teleport's mobility, as well as add utility to Shuriken and create synergy between the abilities.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

Tail wind was NOT supposed to give mobility. And will be best case reworked at some point.

Tailwind is simply irrelevant in this.

Not to mention that mobility is irrelevant for ash. You are able to fire his ultimate from any range.

He would not benefit that much! Aside from the option to escape...as alternative to simply becomming invisible or activating bladestorm...

This step would neather break any existing balance nor affect his. It would simply give him a fun gimmic. The possibility to teleport. On a frame that is able to teleport.

Edited July 26, 2015 by (PS4)CoolD2108

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

https://youtu.be/KcOED5hPfwA

This is what a teleportation user should be capable of!

[BalancedFury]

teleport to shuriken stuck on wall

[(PSN)Double991]

Ash's Teleport is his third ability. I'm fine with that being better than Zephyr's first ability.

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

Tail wind was NOT supposed to give mobility.

 

PFFFFFF

 

Oh wait, in the original fan concept? Zephyr as she is in-game was only inspired by the concept of a wind frame named Zephyr. Almost no design elements of the fan concept made it into the game. The only parts in common are the name and theme.

 

And will be best case reworked at some point.

 

Tweaks are definitely needed, and it could benefit from a rework. The thing I'd like to see most is Tail Wind and Dive Bomb getting merged into one ability.

 

Tailwind is simply irrelevant in this.

 

 And I suppose Nyx was irrelevant when Irraditing Disarm was created? Look at Nyx now.

 

This step would neather break any existing balance nor affect his.

 

You haven't been able to procure any solid evidence for this nor refute any of my evidence to the contrary.

 

 It would simply give him a fun gimmic. The possibility to teleport. On a frame that is able to teleport.

 

https://youtu.be/KcOED5hPfwA

This is what a teleportation user should be capable of!

 

I've already proposed many possibilities for Teleport that would allow Ash to do all of this in a way that doesn't break the game, all of which you've ignored.

 

Ash's Teleport is his third ability. I'm fine with that being better than Zephyr's first ability.

 

Radial Disarm with the augment is Loki's 4th ability and Chaos is Nyx's 3rd, but it still makes Nyx obsolete, doesn't it?

Edited July 27, 2015 by 4G3NT_0R4NG3

[(PSN)TrollyThyTrinity]

PFFFFFF

 

Oh wait, in the original fan concept? Zephyr as she is in-game was only inspired by the concept of a wind frame named Zephyr. Almost no design elements of the fan concept made it into the game. The only parts in common are the name and theme.

 

 

Tweaks are definitely needed, and it could benefit from a rework. The thing I'd like to see most is Tail Wind and Dive Bomb getting merged into one ability.

 

 

 And I suppose Nyx was irrelevant when Irraditing Disarm was created? Look at Nyx now.

 

 

You haven't been able to procure any solid evidence for this nor refute any of my evidence to the contrary.

 

 

 

 

I've already proposed many possibilities for Teleport that would allow Ash to do all of this in a way that doesn't break the game, all of which you've ignored.

 

 

Radial Disarm with the augment is Loki's 4th ability and Chaos is Nyx's 3rd, but it still makes Nyx obsolete, doesn't it?

loki disarm doesnt make nyx obsolete, it doesnt make  nyx ,Tons of people still use Nyx not just because of Chaos but because of everything else

 

The whole this warframe should be one thing and the other warframe shouldn't be the same take that up wit DE

augments were born 

 

your saying if loki the most stealth frame he should be the only one  but you cant say that when other frames have stealth elements

 

if a warframe has stealth of any kind  it has stealth on their resume same goes with mobility

 

im glad you brought up the Nyx Comment which makes this whole thread in bounds allowing other frames to mix and match powers and what not

 

every warframe will get looked at Zephyr is new compared to ash it will get there 

[muzashi1963]

yas plaize. +1

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

your saying if loki the most stealth frame he should be the only one

 

Where do I say this?

 

If this is to imply that I'm saying Zephyr should be the only frame with mobility, that's not the case at all. About 50% of the frames so far have some ability that allows them to travel, it's just that Zephyr's is the best, as intended by the devs. I've even proposed ways for Teleport to give Ash higher mobility without any negative repercussions.

[(PSN)TrollyThyTrinity]

Where do I say this?

 

If this is to imply that I'm saying Zephyr should be the only frame with mobility, that's not the case at all. About 50% of the frames so far have some ability that allows them to travel, it's just that Zephyr's is the best, as intended by the devs. I've even proposed ways for Teleport to give Ash higher mobility without any negative repercussions.

zephyr being the best mobility is by preference others are just as effective to get around the map except for one "ASH" and the only person talking negative repercussion Respectfully is you my Friend

 

Their is no best on warframe  but what you choose and how you choose to use it  Teleport is an Old Power with old restrictions

i know you saw recent parkour able to clear a decent distance without touching the ground even vertically.

we all will be able to mimic zephyr wed. the old zephyr rather

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

zephyr being the best mobility is by preference others are just as effective to get around the map except for one "ASH"

 

Are you saying Ash is the only frame with low mobility? About 50% of the frames have a power that helps them get around. That leaves 50% with no mobility power, and for a decent chunk of those 50% that do have a movement power, that power's primary use isn't movement. Hydroid's Tidal Surge is a good example. Ash's Teleport is one of them as well. Ash is actually on the higher end of the mobility spectrum.

 

Their is no best on warframe  but what you choose and how you choose to use it  Teleport is an Old Power with old restrictions

 

I agree that it's an old power, and I fully support revamping it, just not in a way that makes Ash the highest mobility frame in the game. I like the idea of Ash being able to teleport to his shurikens, and I know you do as well.

 

i know you saw recent parkour able to clear a decent distance without touching the ground even vertically.

we all will be able to mimic zephyr wed. the old zephyr rather

 

Parkour 2.0 will actually make Zephyr's mobility more different from the parkour system. Directional air melee is basically a nerfed Tail Wind. With the coptering and directional air melee nerfs, you'll be able to mimic Zephyr far less than you can currently.

Edited July 27, 2015 by 4G3NT_0R4NG3

[(PSN)TrollyThyTrinity]

Are you saying Ash is the only frame with low mobility? About 50% of the frames have a power that helps them get around. That leaves 50% with no mobility power, and for a decent chunk of those 50% that do have a movement power, that power's primary use isn't movement. Hydroid's Tidal Surge is a good example

 

hydroid modded right and travel and it can be done airborne.

 

 

I agree that it's an old power, and I fully support revamping it, just not in a way that makes Ash the highest mobility frame in the game. I like the idea of Ash being able to teleport to his shurikens, and I know you do as well.

 

well see what direction the Devs or gonna go im just letting you know it wont be a doom thread if they do 

 

 

Parkour 2.0 will actually make Zephyr's mobility more different from the parkour system. Directional air melee is basically a nerfed Tail Wind. With the coptering and directional air melee nerfs, you'll be able to mimic Zephyr far less than you can currently.

 

it will give zephyr more hang time and more floaty than currently, zephyr was the only floaty frame not any more vertical rocket jump looks exactly like tail wind

wont clear distances as face as zephyr but it will resemble 

Edited July 27, 2015 by (PS4)Nzza_News

[DrBorris]

But can't Nova teleport anywhere with Wormhole? "But it is a 75 energy ability, apples and oranges" (and let us not forget it can teleport an entire squad)

Radial Disarm with the augment is Loki's 4th ability and Chaos is Nyx's 3rd, but it still makes Nyx obsolete, doesn't it?

 

Seriously, how would it break balance? Whoop dee doo I can teleport wherever I want... but I still have to actually aim and use weapons to do anything productive. 

 

Tail Wind is COMPLETELY different. Why? Because, get ready... you go up. With teleport you need a solid surface to aim at, Tail Wind gives much more freedom in that you can go to any location, even locations not bound by a solid surface (like the air). Call me crazy but I find a lot of use in being able to fly above the battle field. And let us not forget, Zephyr is not "Mobility Frame", she is "Air Frame". Yes, she has some of the best mobility, but that is not her defining characteristic (not for me at least). 

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

But can't Nova teleport anywhere with Wormhole? "But it is a 75 energy ability, apples and oranges" (and let us not forget it can teleport an entire squad)

 

The main disadvantage of Worm Hole is that you have to actually walk through it, adding extra delay between casts and making the ability feel clunky and awkward to use. That's my experience with it, at least.

 

Tail Wind is COMPLETELY different. Why? Because, get ready... you go up.

 

...and smash your head into the ceiling or an out-of-bounds zone and get knocked/teleported back down. I literally can't think of a single situation in which I wouldn't want to jump before using Tail Wind.

 

With teleport you need a solid surface to aim at, Tail Wind gives much more freedom in that you can go to any location, even locations not bound by a solid surface (like the air). Call me crazy but I find a lot of use in being able to fly above the battle field.

 

While I do find this mildly useful, I can usually only get a few shots off while airborne, and I make myself a massive target. Parkour 2.0 should fix these things, but it still doesn't change the fact that the times I'm using Tail Wind to go to a point in midair are in the vast minority compared to the times I'm using it to move really fast from one point on the ground to another point on the ground.

 

I guess a free aim Teleport with no other limitations wouldn't make Tail Wind completely irrelevant. It would just make it mostly irrelevant.

 

And let us not forget, Zephyr is not "Mobility Frame", she is "Air Frame". Yes, she has some of the best mobility, but that is not her defining characteristic (not for me at least). 

 

I'm not entirely sure how Zephyr isn't a mobility focused frame. she's certainly the most mobility centered frame in the game, with Volt as a close second. Mobility is the only thing Zephyr does better than everyone else. The only other thing I can really think of are the insane people who build for Turbulence and never use any other abilities ever, but they're not really doing what I would consider to be using Zephyr, in the same way that standing in one spot and putting a paperweight on your 3 key isn't exactly using Nekros.

 

Seriously, how would it break balance? Whoop dee doo I can teleport wherever I want... but I still have to actually aim and use weapons to do anything productive. 

 

Mobility is really the only thing Zephyr does better than everyone else, and a free aim Teleport would make Zephyr not do that better than everyone else. It would remove her specialty, because another frame that doesn't even specialize in the same thing would be able to do it better.

 

I'm really not sure why anyone would possibly think that making Ash, a non-mobility centered frame, have higher mobility than the most mobility centered frame in the game is a good idea. It just doesn't make any logical sense, especially when there are ways to improve the mobility from Ash's Teleport without ruining Zephyr, many of which I've suggested, and all of which only a few of you haven't ignored.

Edited July 27, 2015 by 4G3NT_0R4NG3

[Acidulant]

This can both be good and bad.

 

It can be useful for situations where you want to have a quick travel without actually aiming at something,

 

but can also be bad if you miss your aim on an opponent and get randomly thrown into a group of enemies.

 

Maybe an augment?

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

PFFFFFF

Oh wait, in the original fan concept? Zephyr as she is in-game was only inspired by the concept of a wind frame named Zephyr. Almost no design elements of the fan concept made it into the game. The only parts in common are the name and theme.

Tweaks are definitely needed, and it could benefit from a rework. The thing I'd like to see most is Tail Wind and Dive Bomb getting merged into one ability.

And I suppose Nyx was irrelevant when Irraditing Disarm was created? Look at Nyx now.

You haven't been able to procure any solid evidence for this nor refute any of my evidence to the contrary.

I've already proposed many possibilities for Teleport that would allow Ash to do all of this in a way that doesn't break the game, all of which you've ignored.

Radial Disarm with the augment is Loki's 4th ability and Chaos is Nyx's 3rd, but it still makes Nyx obsolete, doesn't it?

Divebomb also roots in the fanconcept.

Tailwind->fly

Divebomb->land

ID is the most debated aug for a reason. ID is insanity building on insanity. Thers a slight difference between scaling enemys killing themselfs without the present lock and going from a to b. Noone will play zephyr for the sheer mobility mate. She has a working kit and would work WAY better and more interresting when DE actually comes around to give her wings.

This is in fact the only fanrequest that pops up evry now and then, on a frame that gets utterly ignored from the majority of the community

And we should not give ash mobility cause a unpopular perversion of a great fanconcept does it better? How about no? Also no to another switch teleport, aka shuriken on walls, what would not only be slightly more effective then just running to the location if you include the time you need to just target the spot, but also ruin the only benefit the shuriken have at the moment.

There is absolutely no actuall reason to deny the free aim concept.

Edited July 27, 2015 by (PS4)CoolD2108

[xLordKogax]

The main disadvantage of Worm Hole is that you have to actually walk through it, adding extra delay between casts and making the ability feel clunky and awkward to use. That's my experience with it, at least.

 

 

...and smash your head into the ceiling or an out-of-bounds zone and get knocked/teleported back down. I literally can't think of a single situation in which I wouldn't want to jump before using Tail Wind.

 

 

While I do find this mildly useful, I can usually only get a few shots off while airborne, and I make myself a massive target. Parkour 2.0 should fix these things, but it still doesn't change the fact that the times I'm using Tail Wind to go to a point in midair are in the vast minority compared to the times I'm using it to move really fast from one point on the ground to another point on the ground.

 

I guess a free aim Teleport with no other limitations wouldn't make Tail Wind completely irrelevant. It would just make it mostly irrelevant.

 

 

I'm not entirely sure how Zephyr isn't a mobility focused frame. she's certainly the most mobility centered frame in the game, with Volt as a close second. Mobility is the only thing Zephyr does better than everyone else. The only other thing I can really think of are the insane people who build for Turbulence and never use any other abilities ever, but they're not really doing what I would consider to be using Zephyr, in the same way that standing in one spot and putting a paperweight on your 3 key isn't exactly using Nekros.

 

 

 

Mobility is really the only thing Zephyr does better than everyone else, and a free aim Teleport would make Zephyr not do that better than everyone else. It would remove her specialty, because another frame that doesn't even specialize in the same thing would be able to do it better.

 

I'm really not sure why anyone would possibly think that making Ash, a non-mobility centered frame, have higher mobility than the most mobility centered frame in the game is a good idea. It just doesn't make any logical sense, especially when there are ways to improve the mobility from Ash's Teleport without ruining Zephyr, many of which I've suggested, and all of which only a few of you haven't ignored.

 

Your Tail wind topic obviously states you infiltrated this thread to sabotage Ash Teleport 

 

Relax fam your tail wind shall get Love

The rise of rework threads doesnt give us the right to compare other abilities 

Yall act as if Warframes gonna end and your fav frames will no longer be important or the worlds ending xP

 

Ash teleport free aim works well balanced with Shorter Range and a Higher Energy cost am i right?

Doesnt surpass your Precious Tail Feather (TailWind)

 

Shuriken+Teleport=Synergy was a Thread i made and i never seen you leave a comment

Its similar but more refined to your idea.

 

Cast Shuriken on enemies and the first enemy hit grants a free teleport cast without line of sight or targeted cast. 

Once the bleed proc ends on the target the teleport window is over.

Instead of teleporting to a random shuriken which is kinda pointless. why not teleport to a Heavy that was struck and dropped his Shields/Armor to execute him with a Finisher?

 

Makes more sense and Synergizes well right?

 

Ok you Hannyas and Tengus (Ashs) (Zephyrs)

 

I hope i was able to clarify this 

 

xKogax

Edited July 27, 2015 by ShadowsofKoga

[Soulden]

The only situation in which a free aim Teleport could possibly work is if it was only free aim in a specific situation that didn't come up very often. An idea I had was to make it free aim very briefly after teleporting to an enemy and performing a finisher on them. This would make it an escape tool rather than a Zephyr ruiner.

 

That would make for a great augment mod.

 

Edit: Yeah, new to Ash, only been playing with him for a few weeks, and using Teleport alot after getting bored of 4, and my biggest issue is not having a way out other (after teleport/finisher combo) than using smoke and hope to have enough energy to teleport or attempt to run with 5-10 enemies blocking the way. 

Edit 1:

Hmm...wonder if that is the intentional use for Teleport, a situational/tactical finisher opener that if not used carefully can leave you open as well.

This idea at least would allow me to hit a large unit with a finisher, teleport out and work on the remaining smaller enemy units afterwards.

 

Edit 2:

Sorry if I disagree with OP ideas suggested, they do sound fun, but so was pressing 4...initially.

 

Lots of edits, apologies.

Edited July 27, 2015 by Souldend78

[(PSN)Remnant_DeMuerte]

As an avid ash user I would say that having to have a live tagger to teleport too is to limited. Also throwing a shuriken and teleporting to it would take too long especially in a fight.but doing it like blink in dishonored is a perfect way to go about it you can get in and out of sticky situations as well.

Also idc what people say but I'm my opinion bs should be like mesa skill and go until I have no more energy or enemies bs would be much more useful then...

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

Also idc what people say but I'm my opinion bs should be like mesa skill and go until I have no more energy or enemies bs would be much more useful then...

As much as i'd personally love any change on BS, i just can't see it working out. Both, the max counter and the animation are limiting factors on BS. Thats the trade DE put on the ability for making it do finisher damage+slash proccs. Any change, be it a sword-mode on the same dmg type, a cast without ash, a typical aoe or a second stronger mesa would make the game implode the moment it releases.

I can't stress it enough: BS is fine as it is. It could need more animations and some fixes (remaining +lvl100 eximus units should be swarmed with hits. Not showing a repeating loop. Falling trough the floor etc) but thats about it. It rather keep the working version then getting a overpowered one that leads to a rework on different dmg types...