Coptering Vs Parkour 2.0 - How Much Speed Did We Really Lose?

[Rexlars]

Some people even argue that we need to press even more buttons now. That leads me to think these crybabies aren't even actually trying to learn the new mechanics and refuse to give parkour 2.0 a chance, just because they think it looks bad, or they just have unconditional hate towards it.

 

I'm pretty much with this notion. 

 

As an avid Tipedo (with Bersker) copter'er, I find Parkour 2.0 to be quite sufficient in speeds attainable. Prior to using the new mod "Mobility," I could reach speeds that would seem fast if coptering was never a thing; not unbearably slow & not physics  breaking fast. And I was okay with that. Now, with Mobility, I can literally go faster than your average speed copter weapons & have quickness reminiscent of the Tipedo—all with greater control & PROPER animations, with a dash of cool factor. 

 

Coptering really just spoiled the playerbase to the point of near no return it seems (for a select few that is). You could literally go so fast that in an ideal situation with a setup that gave you a straight shot from the beginning room to extraction with no closed, you could likely clear it with only ~3/4 copter swings. When you're used to something like that, it's hard for people to accept anything less apparently. I literally see players who sprint the entire mission. The ENTIRE mission. Folks don't even give it a try. Meanwhile, I'm hopping all over the place taking their kills with my Tonbo. 

 

In all honesty, WITH the new Parkour mods, you'd likely take back everything you said about the speed of Parkour 2.0. However, I'm not getting behind the notion that those mods are necessary, because they're not. You can still reach good speeds without them. Only my Excal has a Parkour mod equipped (Exilus ftw). Neither Mesa, Loki, Ash, or Volt have one & switching between the aforementioned & Excal isn't painstaking in the slightest.

[NyxCrab]

Coptering may be faster, but the new Parkour is more fun than coptering. It's not that hard to pick up on, and it feels so awesome to jump off of a structure and bullet jump and clear some of the room while in the air. Hate it if you want, but I personally love Parkour 2.0.

[Sh0ck-Wave]

Never coptered.

 

Parkour 2.0 seems to be concentrated on vertical movement rather then horizontal, and they've left horizontal speed for mods like Rush, Armored Agility and Sprint Boost.

 

I ran these on Mirage before parkour 2.0 anyway, so the removal of stamina just made missions super fun for me now.

I love the constant speed without thinking I'm milking some bullcrap mechanic.

 

The Bullet Jump alone is the reason I love parkour 2.0 .. still coming to grips with no backflip on wall climb, but with bullet jump who cares ?

 

Parkour 2.0 is a big 'hell yeah' for me :)

[Acidtrees]

Coptering really just spoiled the playerbase to the point of near no return it seems (for a select few that is). You could literally go so fast that in an ideal situation with a setup that gave you a straight shot from the beginning room to extraction with no closed, you could likely clear it with only ~3/4 copter swings. When you're used to something like that, it's hard for people to accept anything less apparently. I literally see players who sprint the entire mission. The ENTIRE mission. Folks don't even give it a try. Meanwhile, I'm hopping all over the place taking their kills with my Tonbo.

 

Yes, it's painful having your speed cut by 4x. I don't see what it adds to the game at all. Missions aren't more challenging, maps aren't more interesting, parkour is still just as much a spamfest as before. It's just tedium.

 

I wouldn't mind it so much if the maps were designed to actually use the vertical aspect of parkour 2.0, or if missions were shortened to compensate, or if parkour 2.0 had some superdifficult high level technique to get omgwtf speeds. Or hell, anything that makes missions more interesting would be good too.

 

But no, it's just more tedium, and the icing on the cake is people calling people spoiled when they have the audacity to state their opinion about it.

[Grachuss]

As a somewhat new player I'm very much enjoying the new system, the idea that i had to use certain melee weapons to move around fast and get to certain places rubbed me the wrong way and now and it's incredibly easy to move around and very much fun. 

 

Anyway i'm really glad the people complaining about MUHCOPTERING don't design the game

[Rexlars]

Yes, it's painful having your speed cut by 4x. I don't see what it adds to the game at all. Missions aren't more challenging, maps aren't more interesting, parkour is still just as much a spamfest as before. It's just tedium.

 

I wouldn't mind it so much if the maps were designed to actually use the vertical aspect of parkour 2.0, or if missions were shortened to compensate, or if parkour 2.0 had some superdifficult high level technique to get omgwtf speeds. Or hell, anything that makes missions more interesting would be good too.

 

But no, it's just more tedium, and the icing on the cake is people calling people spoiled when they have the audacity to state their opinion about it.

 

And it's also painful not being able to play the game when everyone on your team is rooms ahead of you with their Tipedo's killing everything & you're still near the spawn because you happen to choose the Scindo Prime. 

 

Plus, how would the maps be designed to "use the vertical aspects of Parkour 2.0" if the tilesets came way before the idea of Bullet Jump was even conceived? Or did you really expect DE to recreate every tileset from scratch to better accommodate Parkour 2.0 in one fell swoop? If you want to go REALLY fast, max out a "Mobility" (any higher mod) & use Bullet Jump --> Double Jump --> Dodge Roll. You still go fast without "Mobility." 

 

And yea, that's ludicrous—what audacity to state the obvious! Someone being used to something & not liking what said something was replaced with because it "doesn't compare"....what else should it be called? 

Edited August 5, 2015 by Rexlars

[Sh0ck-Wave]

As a somewhat new player I'm very much enjoying the new system, the idea that i had to use certain melee weapons to move around fast and get to certain places rubbed me the wrong way and now and it's incredibly easy to move around and very much fun. 

 

^

This is why we should listen to new players.

New eyes challenge the norm.

A broken mechanic is not a method for basing level design on.

[Acidtrees]

And it's also painful not being able to play the game when everyone on your team is rooms ahead of you with their Tipedo's killing everything & you're still near the spawn because you happen to choose the Scindo Prime. 

 

Plus, how would the maps be designed to "use the vertical aspects of Parkour 2.0" if the tilesets came way before the idea of Bullet Jump was even conceived? Or did you really expect DE to recreate every tileset from scratch to better accommodate Parkour 2.0 in one fell swoop? If you want to go REALLY fast, max out a "Mobility" (any higher mod) & use Bullet Jump --> Double Jump --> Dodge Roll. You still go fast without "Mobility." 

 

And yea, that's ludicrous—what audacity to state the obvious! Someone being used to something & not liking what said something was replaced with because it "doesn't compare"....what else should it be called? 

 

Yes, I'm glad that Scindo Prime is finally viable, but I don't see why it has to be at the expense of speed. Make parkour 2.0 faster and we can both be happy.

 

I expect DE to make a parkour system that plays to the strengths of the map design. I don't care if they redesign the maps in the process or not.

[f3llyn]

Yes, it's painful having your speed cut by 4x. I don't see what it adds to the game at all. Missions aren't more challenging, maps aren't more interesting, parkour is still just as much a spamfest as before. It's just tedium.

 

I wouldn't mind it so much if the maps were designed to actually use the vertical aspect of parkour 2.0, or if missions were shortened to compensate, or if parkour 2.0 had some superdifficult high level technique to get omgwtf speeds. Or hell, anything that makes missions more interesting would be good too.

 

But no, it's just more tedium, and the icing on the cake is people calling people spoiled when they have the audacity to state their opinion about it.

 

None of that is actually true. Coptering actively hindered how the game evolved. Perfect proof of that is how you guys are resisting even the slightest consideration that the new movement system might actually be better just because you can't run through an entire mission in 23 seconds.

 

It still amazes me that people can say things like that and expect others to take them seriously.

Edited August 5, 2015 by f3llyn

[Braini]

Up until now, melee was only there for coptering for most people. If someone played with a weapon they actually liked (blasphemy !)  they were greatly penalized. It was so bad that by the time the mission ended they were maybe halfway the map.

 

I find people who don't like the new system selfish. Did you ever stop to think about others ? I know this is the internet and nobody cares about nobody, but still...

 

Galatine, here I come !

[RedDirtTrooper]

None of that is actually true. Coptering actively hindered how the game evolved. Perfect proof of that is how you guys are resisting even the slightest consideration that the new movement system might actually be better just because you can't run through an entire mission in 23 seconds.

 

It still amazes me that people can say things like that and expect others to take them seriously.

So how does the new system fix that? People are still going to play as fast as possible to maximize rewards. New players are still going to be half way back in the map waddling along while the rest of us are just bullet jump+double jump+gliding as fast as humanly possible towards the goal and then the exit. The games evolution hasn't been changed. All that's been changed is coptering is gone, so all the people who think it looked dumb are happy, while wall bunny hopping, aim gliding, and bullet jumping are here looking just as or more silly in my opinion, and the over all pace and feel of the game has been slowed down. Oh, and now it takes an exilus adapter and a few more formas to actually finish a build, which everyone with any interest in efficiency will be using to slot in a bullet jump mod to make themselves faster, but still not as fast as before. But, you can totally get into void vaults real easy, if for some reason you feel the need, and you can hang what ever melee weapon you want on your back and never use it. Or use it while everyone else does the real killing with guns and abilities, your choice. 

[Braini]

So how does the new system fix that? People are still going to play as fast as possible to maximize rewards. New players are still going to be half way back in the map waddling along while the rest of us are just bullet jump+double jump+gliding as fast as humanly possible towards the goal and then the exit. [...]

 

Let's say I'm not noob and I know how to move fast like one of the "pros", BUT I want to play with a slow melee weapon. This new system fixes that.

 

People who want to get to the end fast will find ways, they obviously don't care what setup they have, they just care about getting there. That means, with the right mods / warframe, you can go fast as hell even after this "nerf" (which was more like a fix in my opinion).

[SiiNN321]

I don't know what to say. If you really believe coptering needs more skill, then there isn't much I can do to change your mind. Lets just agree to disagree and leave it at that.

*EDIT*

If you don't mind me asking what is your other way of going fast? Because I bet it has nothing to do with parkour 2.0 right? So I am curious what it is.

Slash dash. Portals. Speed. Or he doesn't play anymore

[RedDirtTrooper]

Let's say I'm not noob and I know how to move fast like one of the "pros", BUT I want to play with a slow melee weapon. This new system fixes that.

 

People who want to get to the end fast will find ways, they obviously don't care what setup they have, they just care about getting there. That means, with the right mods / warframe, you can go fast as hell even after this "nerf" (which was more like a fix in my opinion).

So, as I was pointing out, it didn't magically change how the game is evolving. All it did was make all melee weapons equally bad. Since melee damage is inherently inferior to using guns in every way but ammo efficiency. So, a few melee weapons that had a use for mobility are now just ornamental toys like the rest of them, and people are still just going to play the same way as before, only moderately to slightly slower(depending on if they have a bullet jump mod equipped or not) and with different animations. At least this will finally put to rest all the arguments that coptering was ruining the game, since everyone is just using parkour 2.0 to get as close to the same effect as possible. The slow players will finally have to admit that a large part of the player base just prefers a fast pace and objective oriented style of play.

[Defendor]

All it did was make all melee weapons equally bad. Since melee damage is inherently inferior to using guns in every way but ammo efficiency. So, a few melee weapons that had a use for mobility are now just ornamental toys like the rest of them

 

Melee is horrible. And... what's that guy using? A HEAVY melee weapon? Lol, you can't even copter with that toy.

[RedDirtTrooper]

Melee is horrible. And... what's that guy using? A HEAVY melee weapon? Lol, you can't even copter with that toy.

Reading comprehension is a thing. Melee is inherently inferior to gun play. After your video? It's still inherently inferior. All that video shows is that Valkyr is very survivable with niche melee load outs, but feel free to believe whatever you want.

[Nihillian]

So... From someone who has never Properly used coptering (me), the game's pace has sped up. I can easily go to higher levels and go faster to the next tile than I did before. 

 

You might ask why I never used coptering (proficiently)? Because I like to melee. I have never used the Tipedo to fling myself right out of the map.

It was a glitch, and should have been fixed a lot faster than it did. 

 

The new parkour looks great, feels fluid, sped up the NORMAL gameplay and I feel like I have control where i am going. didn't have that at times with the old system (Especially with wall running)

 

RedDirtTrooper: Melee can, with the right build, be better than guns in this game. I kill heavy gunner at lvl 95+ faster with my melee than with my guns. 

 

YES, my guns are properly modded for every situation, I am just capable of 4 hitting Heavies with my melee. Mostly due to combo chaining as well. 

Edited August 5, 2015 by DLGrave

[Braini]

Reading comprehension is a thing. Melee is inherently inferior to gun play. After your video? It's still inherently inferior. All that video shows is that Valkyr is very survivable with niche melee load outs, but feel free to believe whatever you want.

 

Same goes for you.

Before, you couldn't move around fast AND use the melee weapon of choice. Now you can.

Why does it bother you that I want to use a chopstick to kill mobs, even though a bazooka is better ?

 

Besides, the new parkour system is comparable in speed to the old one, you just need to get used to it; and you can use your favorite chopstick !

[Defendor]

Reading comprehension is a thing. Melee is inherently inferior to gun play. After your video? It's still inherently inferior. All that video shows is that Valkyr is very survivable with niche melee load outs, but feel free to believe whatever you want.

 

My reading comprehension is fine. You wrote that Parkour 2 made "all melee weapons equally bad" and that melee weapons are "ornamental toys" without coptering. Don't backpedal and try to make it look as if "inherently inferior" is the only thing you wrote. Now, please explain how a weapon that can be used to solo T4S until 1h 10min is bad.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Same goes for you.

Before, you couldn't move around fast AND use the melee weapon of choice. Now you can.

Why does it bother you that I want to use a chopstick to kill mobs, even though a bazooka is better ?

 

Besides, the new parkour system is comparable in speed to the old one, you just need to get used to it; and you can use your favorite chopstick !

I move around just fine using the D. Nikana.  The new system is a lot slower, even compared to the DN coptering or wall flinging. 

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

 Now, please explain how a weapon that can be used to solo T4S until 1h 10min is bad.

All your video proves is that the new melee weapon is even more restrictive than the old.

[KingTaro]

However, for the sake of your argument I'll only apply 1 of the new modifiers added by Parkour 2.0 that coptering does not have... Control....

There was control. Fast-slide was the way to go if you wanted control and speed in Parcour 1.0

Anyway, still experimenting with Parcour 2.0. I'm sure there are still more tricks to be discovered, so can't say much about it yet.

 

Demo of fast-slide in Parcour 1.0

[styxonfire]

I like that ever since we lost the ability to copter, I never experienced the random "OMG IM MOVING TOO DAMN FAST AND IM STRAIGHT OUT OF THE MAP AND FALLING" flinging effect that just randomly happens in the game.

[izzatuw]

I've said it many times I'll say it again. I love parkour 2.0.

It is definitely the update DE needed to gain back my interest. Kubrows, eh. Archwing. No, still haven't even levelled a single thing properly.

I have to ask all you pro-Parkour 2.0 players, have you ever used Frost with Galatine for an extent amount of time? I have and I felt really slow so I was forced to use Ichors for most things... With parkour 2.0 I feel fast even with a Frost and Jat Kitag or Galatine. This is a Frost, slowest frame in-game. Using slower frames don't feel like a total pain when comparing to using frames like Loki.

[f3llyn]

All your video proves is that the new melee weapon is even more restrictive than the old.

 

Wut.

 

I'm not even.... What are you trying to say here?