Valkyr Is Ridiculously Op - Lvl 200+

[IceColdHawk]

Still waiting for this to be answered:

Maybe i'll answer you when you answer me how a frost can be killed against grineer and infested. Grineer and infested are a walk in the park.

[(PSN)Ana_Nuann]

Depending on their level they simply sponge her damage until she dies through energy starvation.

The real problem isn't the frames, it is the scaling system.

Or even just the concept of endless missions. If that concept was removed, missions could actually be tuned to a difficulty rather than have it scale enemies with millions of hp and one shot capabilities.

Missions would be designed rather than... Leaving a bad system to its own devices.

That approach is why frames are in their current situation. If it were changed, youd be asking for a buff to val instead of a nerf, because invuln would simply not be a useful trait anymore.

But yea... Val is trash in everything but survival and she falls off like all the rest.

But again, with better design players would never be in a situation where falloff is present. Falloff does nothing but make the player feel insignificant and useless. Not a good thing. Most people aren't masochists.

[(PSN)Draconis1981]

Still waiting for this to be answered:

afk?

[Specific.Zod]

Still waiting for this to be answered:

Cat hate grineer and infested.

[(PSN)obsidiancurse]

No outside factor? Fine, use Rage, calculate the damage needed to refill your energy without killing you (The range would be big mind you). Turn Hysteria off when the damage counter is in the calculated range, enjoy your immortality.

lol and now you have finally drifted off into either fantasy or insanity, I'm not sure which. At higher levels the damage would accumalate much too quick, plus you would still be taking incoming damage while trying to constantly flip in and out of hysteria.

Even if you could do it (you couldn't but still), even if you could how does that strategy fit into your pervious assertion that she requires no effort? Seems like a lot of effort and micro manangement to me, much more than most frames? You are totally contradicting yourself and tieing yourself in knots trying to win an unwinnable argument.

[(PSN)Dark-TailedFox]

Cat hate grineer and infested.

nope, kitten hates corpus.

[Ninjamander]

This thread to be lock, like seriously.

Edited February 1, 2016 by Ninjamander

[(XBOX)MK Ultra K11]

*raises hand* I have a question. If the Corpus are dumber than the Orokin and the sentients are smarter or smart as the Orokin then why don't the sentients have nullifiers? Nullifiers go against lore...if sentients don't have them. In fact nullifiers already go against lore because the sentients will probably have them and if they do that will mean that the only reason the Tenno won the old war(their void powers) would be gone. Basically the existence of nullifiers isn't only stupid(because it is just a lazy annoying attempt at balance) but its also lore shattering.

[sappinmahsentry]

Lol, yes they can, atlas can petrify them then proceed to kill one bye one.

The only way you can reliably petrify is by ruining all of his other abilities, and even then the ability sucks.

[GnosticCat]

*raises hand* I have a question. If the Corpus are dumber than the Orokin and the sentients are smarter or smart as the Orokin then why don't the sentients have nullifiers? Nullifiers go against lore...if sentients don't have them. In fact nullifiers already go against lore because the sentients will probably have them and if they do that will mean that the only reason the Tenno won the old war(their void powers) would be gone. Basically the existence of nullifiers isn't only stupid(because it is just a lazy annoying attempt at balance) but its also lore shattering.

Why do you think that Orokin would be smarted then Corpus? Lore doesn't support such statement. Orokin caused all problems that they had - Grineer, Infested, Sentients, Tenno. Doesn't seem that smart at all. Even Corpus are smarter than that.

[ClinkzEastwood]

lol and now you have finally drifted off into either fantasy or insanity, I'm not sure which. At higher levels the damage would accumalate much too quick, plus you would still be taking incoming damage while trying to constantly flip in and out of hysteria.

Even if you could do it (you couldn't but still), even if you could how does that strategy fit into your pervious assertion that she requires no effort? Seems like a lot of effort and micro manangement to me, much more than most frames? You are totally contradicting yourself and tieing yourself in knots trying to win an unwinnable argument.

Valkyr has 22000 EHP following Rage build, so I have no idea at which level you are playing that could make the counter going up fast enough to kill her immediately.

[(PSN)Dark-TailedFox]

Valkyr has 22000 EHP following Rage build, so I have no idea at which level you are playing that could make the counter going up fast enough to kill her immediately.

1. Tell me where you get those numbers of 22k effective health, I'd love to hear it.

 

2. Do you not know how fast sentients and lv 70+ enemies can knock out Valkyr? Relying on Rage at that point when it comes to the casting delay is effective suicide. "Hey, your bullets do a ton of damage per shot right? I need you to hit me with just 7, can ya do that? I just need my health to stay above 5, I don't have Quick Thinking installed. Oh, and try not to give me a slash proc, those hurt a lot."

[ShortCat]

Maybe i'll answer you when you answer me how a frost can be killed against grineer and infested. Grineer and infested are a walk in the park.

Bombard rockets' explosion used to go through the globe(not sure if they still can), furthermore if one unit with high enough lvl happens to get inside the globe, there is a chance for frost to die. Or Eximus units with fire or toxic auras...

I think it is eough.

Edited February 1, 2016 by ShortCat

[Xaero]

So what exactly is wrong with invincibility ? 

 

Trinity is almost as invincible and no one seems to have any issues with that ?

 

So what what are you trying to archive here ?  Balance Really? do you think anyone really bevies that argument ?

 

Here is what it's about : Frame X can out kill me and I am jealous so I will go the forums and get it nerfed.

 

Mesa and Sayrn were throw under the bus for this very reason. where are these frames now ? No one plays them any more.

 

All nerfs like this do is drive people away from the game.

 

Actually, they were nerfed because they promoted AFK gameplay.

[EmptyDevil]

Why do you think that Orokin would be smarted then Corpus? Lore doesn't support such statement. Orokin caused all problems that they had - Grineer, Infested, Sentients, Tenno. Doesn't seem that smart at all. Even Corpus are smarter than that.

 

The Orokin Empire is smarter. It's definitely shown in the lore as well. The Corpus tend to worship and make knockoffs of Orokin tech because they are too dumb to make the originals work IIRC. The Orokin being the cause of the system's problems have nothing to do with their ability to make advance tech.

[ClinkzEastwood]

1. Tell me where you get those numbers of 22k effective health, I'd love to hear it.

 

2. Do you not know how fast sentients and lv 70+ enemies can knock out Valkyr? Relying on Rage at that point when it comes to the casting delay is effective suicide. "Hey, your bullets do a ton of damage per shot right? I need you to hit me with just 7, can ya do that? I just need my health to stay above 5, I don't have Quick Thinking installed. Oh, and try not to give me a slash proc, those hurt a lot."

w

WELL

Considering rage build with maxed vitality, steel fiber and 200% power strength.

Valkyr's armor=600×(1+1.1+1)=1860

Valkyr's health=100×(1+4.4)+200=740

Valkyr's base ehp= 740×(1+1860/300)=5328

Hysteria only stores 30% of the damage

5328/0.3=17760

Hysteria deals impact damage, which is 75% effective against Warfram's health

17760/0.75=23680

That's Valkyr's ehp.

As long as Hysteria's counter does not excess 5328, you'll be fine, but if it does, remember that you've actually tanked 23680 points worth of damage.

This number is not very impressive comparing other overpowered frames like Trinity or Chroma, but this is the lazy build and one OP frames' existence does not validate other OP frames' so whatever.

And no I don't know how hard those lvl 70+ Sentient hits Valkyr, bebauce they make up less than 0.01% of the content and Valkyr is literally invunerable and she can just run and hide in a corner before deactivating Hysteria to avoid damage anyway if the counter excess the number cap.

[SaurusRex]

Ah, back to hating on valkyr again.

 

Yeah, she's really good at survival missions, we get it. But that's it. How does she help you defend an extractor? How does she get past lasers on spy missions? How does she help keep enemies off the (mobile) defence objective? Or help with hijacking something?

 

If she's so amazingly OP, how come you never see her in raids except as little more than emergency medic? Even then she's a poor choice, as nekros can perform the same function at range. There are many frames who excel in their field (Frost, Loki, Trinity, etc), yet they never receive anywhere near the amount of "omg plz nerf" threads as Valkyr does.

 

There's more to Warframe than killing things in survival. Will you please get over it already.

[GnosticCat]

The Orokin Empire is smarter. It's definitely shown in the lore as well. The Corpus tend to worship and make knockoffs of Orokin tech because they are too dumb to make the originals work IIRC. The Orokin being the cause of the system's problems have nothing to do with their ability to make advance tech.

So if Corpus lack infrastructure to replicate what Orokin had and are plagued by Grineer that means that they are dumb. And Orokin having full domination over solar system and no enemies, creating multiple enemies by themselves means smart. Advanced tech =/= smart.

[IceColdHawk]

Bombard rockets' explosion used to go through the globe(not sure if they still can), furthermore if one unit with high enough lvl happens to get inside the globe, there is a chance for frost to die. Or Eximus units with fire or toxic auras...

I think it is eough.

Last time i checked, the frozen bombards couldn't shoot rockets. And before they enter my globe, they're frozen (4 is a button too since U17). And you shouldn't die by toxic auras unless you're bathing in them and don't give a crap or they are such an extremely high level that they oneshot you. If that happens, valkyr definitely isn't dealing enough damage to them and just being a wall on 2 legs. Ps: You can still counter toxic auras with health plates. And frost can keep the whole team invincible, valkyr only herself.

 

At least you tryed to answer me how he can be killed, now i will keep my word. How can valkyr die? Energy leech eximus, dead cryopod or console (yes, mission loss can be counted as a death, it's even worse than a death), no Life support, not fast enough to hold interception points thus making the enemies probably win.

 

She brings nothing for the team, is just a being a damage dealer with high defenses. Does it bother you? Too bad then. There are players who enjoy her and they also get bothered by threads like this. I could understand you for saying she's op in dojo duels, but not in the normal PvE gameplay in warframe.

Edited February 1, 2016 by IceColdHawk

[ClinkzEastwood]

Frost? lol. Frost is a good caster frame who becomes strong because of how easy it is to gain energy in this game. Really, without infinite energy, there won't be infinite globe stack, and he'll run out of juice after casting 4 twice.

[EmptyDevil]

So if Corpus lack infrastructure to replicate what Orokin had and are plagued by Grineer that means that they are dumb. And Orokin having full domination over solar system and no enemies, creating multiple enemies by themselves means smart. Advanced tech =/= smart.

 

Take a look at the post you were originally replying to in regards to Orokin, Corpus, and Sentients. Now look at your reply to him and then at my reply to you. Do you see where you went wrong? You're comparing 2 different things for god knows what reason. The Orokin making stupid decisions doesn't mean they are inferior to Corpus in tech design at all(Orokin is definitely superior).

[GnosticCat]

Take a look at the post you were originally replying to in regards to Orokin, Corpus, and Sentients. Now look at your reply to him and then at my reply to you. Do you see where you went wrong? You're comparing 2 different things for god knows what reason. The Orokin making stupid decisions doesn't mean they are inferior to Corpus in tech design at all(Orokin is definitely superior).

But your post says that they are smarter because they make better tech. Yet they make far more stupid decisions than Corpus. So they are not smarter they just got better tech.

Are they actually better in tech? Wiki says - "During what was known as the Orokin Era, they built technological masterpieces that rival even present day technology". Rival not surpass. Also how much of that tech was developed by ancestors of current Corpus?

[(PSN)Dark-TailedFox]

w

WELL

Considering rage build with maxed vitality, steel fiber and 200% power strength.

Valkyr's armor=600×(1+1.1+1)=1860

Valkyr's health=100×(1+4.4)+200=740

Valkyr's base ehp= 740×(1+1860/300)=5328

Hysteria only stores 30% of the damage

5328/0.3=17760

Hysteria deals impact damage, which is 75% effective against Warfram's health

17760/0.75=23680

That's Valkyr's ehp.

As long as Hysteria's counter does not excess 5328, you'll be fine, but if it does, remember that you've actually tanked 23680 points worth of damage.

This number is not very impressive comparing other overpowered frames like Trinity or Chroma, but this is the lazy build and one OP frames' existence does not validate other OP frames' so whatever.

And no I don't know how hard those lvl 70+ Sentient hits Valkyr, bebauce they make up less than 0.01% of the content and Valkyr is literally invunerable and she can just run and hide in a corner before deactivating Hysteria to avoid damage anyway if the counter excess the number cap.

Uh-huh. So which part of this is telling me how Valkyr has 20k hp? You only mentioned Steel Fiber and Vitality, which you said constitutes 5300 hp. Where's Armored Agility and Vigor? Do they add another 15k on together? How does Hysteria's damage give her effective health as well (not talking lifesteal)? How does stored damage give her any area of added health?

 

You gave 1/15 of the answer that 2 mods give her effective health. Where are the others? Physique gives added health, Rejuvenation gives back health (quite nicely at that).

 

Then you mentioned hysteria deals damage against a warframe's health. Are we talking about pvp now? Because I haven't seen a "Tenno" target that we had to assault besides infested Mesa, and hers is infested flesh I think. Impact is HORRIBLE against armor (bring a Rakta Cernos and see how far you get), and hysteria deals all 3 forms almost evenly, its mostly puncture and impact, yes, but again, how does this affect how much health she has?

 

And I didn't say sentients were lv 70, they never spawn above 30, but if you're seriously wanting to talk about the game in the 20-50 range, Ash, Chroma, Saryn, Mesa, Equinox, and Ember are your main culprits of being "overpowered" in that range, and they kill en masse FAR higher than Valkyr is capable of at strictly melee because they have their main weapons on top of their ongoing abilities.

 

As for her "running to an empty corner to drop damage", does it not even to Ash spamming bladestorm from a safe zone? Or Mag polarizing a map from a safe zone? How bout in infested missions when Ember stands on the beams safe from tar moas and ancient hooks and world on fire burns them all?

 

And then you have Wukong with Defy and Rage who has the same "never die as long as I have energy" detail Valkyr does, except he can use ALL of his weapons (unless you use Primal Fury at the same time), yet you don't see nerf threads about him either.

 

So where is your argument besides the part of her being a face tanker/berserker as intended? If you're in the "give her damage reduction" crowd, power strength, war cry and augment, duration, high crit/damage weapon, life strike, there's your "damage reduction Hysteria". You have that option already and just refuse to use it because you see a Valkyr every once in a while not budge at the 60+ Napalm or Scorch who just kicked your &#! 10 seconds ago.

[EmptyDevil]

But your post says that they are smarter because they make better tech. Yet they make far more stupid decisions than Corpus. So they are not smarter they just got better tech.

Are they actually better in tech? Wiki says - "During what was known as the Orokin Era, they built technological masterpieces that rival even present day technology". Rival not surpass. Also how much of that tech was developed by ancestors of current Corpus?

 

Yeah, my post is completely relevant to MK Ultras K11's post. He was referencing their technology and their intellect to invent it, not their ability to run an empire. What you're doing would be like bringing up a company's bad business decisions that lead to their downfall, when the topic is only comparing their ability to invent great technology. They can still be great inventors but fail to run a business.

 

The wiki is not a 100% valid source for information; The wiki is outdated in information in some areas and has conjecture to fill in some lore. That statement is not written by DE. 

Edited February 1, 2016 by EmptyDevil

[(XBOX)MK Ultra K11]

Yeah, my post is completely relevant to MK Ultras K11's post. He was referencing their technology and their intellect to invent it, not their ability to run an empire. What you're doing would be like bringing up a company's bad business decisions that lead to their downfall, when the topic is only comparing their ability to invent great technology. They can still be great inventors but fail to run a business.

 

The wiki is not a 100% valid source for information; The wiki is outdated in information in some areas and has conjecture to fill in some lore. That statement is not written by DE.

Empty...I think this is the wrong topic. Are commenting on my nullifier topic?