Feedback On Duality

[SasoDuck]

So awesome augment idea, really love the alternate gameplay style for Equinox.

However, there are some key points about the aug that make it really lackluster in practice:

 

1) The duration. Why so dang low? I have maxed Primed Continuity and Constitution, and 8/10 Narrow Minded and it still only lasts for 18 seconds, requiring me to cast it all the time. Not really an issue for casting, but it makes it so that I have to basically use whatever gun I want the clone to use because it becomes cumbersome switching to my secondary to give to the clone (because I want it to use the Talons for example), then switching back to my primary to use (because I want to use my Hek),,, every 18 seconds. And then you put the exact same duration build on Atlas' rumbler golems.... 95 freaking seconds! I don't have to recast it ever practically. I recast Rumbers more often because they fell behind and I need them to catch up to me.

 

2) A little bit less important, but the Duality clone seems really timid. It doesn't like to attack things. It stays back, hides behind cover too much, and (the worst part) reloads all the freaking time. I give it a Penta with an 8-round mag and it fires one or two shots and then reloads. Like, why are you reloading?? You're wasting even more of your already short duration! Hell, you could probably fire every shot in the clip before despawning if you just didn't reload until you actually needed to! Sorry... got kinda ranty. Anyway, it needs to be more aggressive, and not reload so damn much. I feel like I could give the Hostage my secondary and he would kick more rear end than my clone.

[ZodiacShinryu]

1) likely the attempt to have Equinox have her switch forms more often which was the original intent behind the power at base.

2) AI problems of tenno helpers since the dawn of the game.

[tnccs215]

1) likely the attempt to have Equinox have her switch forms more often which was the original intent behind the power at base.

Maybe. But if DE wants that, than they have to actually make constant change of aspect something reliable: Having to reactivate every ability after using metamorphosis does not help. At all.

Duality's low duration is not an incentive. It is just pressure. You don't change because you gain something, you change because you don't loose. In the end, for such a low duration, I think its best to keep this augment reduced to "foolin' around" builds. Unlike the other two augments. Damn, those are simply GREAT.

[TwiceDead]

You can't do anything about #2 I am afraid. The AI in this game is just plain bad, and that's not going to be fixed anytime soon. If it was easy to fix, maybe they'd have done so 2 years ago, but since they haven't I assume engine limitations, I don't know. 

[SasoDuck]

It's hard to like an ability that creates a crappy AI for almost no time.

[streepe]

I love the mod and I would be fine if duration remained the same if at least AI was fixed. Sure its annoying to recast so often be it wouldnt be such a pain if it would do more than watch the paint dry for the whole duration while there's 2-3 enemies right next to it. It Seems affected a lot by the room you're in.

[Bobtm]

As for the first part;  Metamorphosis is still a 1 ability you can't expect it to be on par with a different frame's 4, that's just silly.  As a note;  Metamorphosis costs 1/4 as much as Rumblers, and 1/4 of 95 = 23.75.  So all thing's considered they aren't far off in terms of cost to duration ratio.  Atop that Metamorphosis is a faster cast which doesn't root you in place, however you'll spend more total time casting in order to maintain your summoned clone.

 

Rather than just ramping up the duration on Duality, I'd prefer seeing a more fluidity to become existent with Equinox's two ability sets.  Rather than ending almost any active ability (foes under the effect of Rest or Rage won't be undone upon casting 1) there should be a transition.  This could possibly even open up room for a third niche set of traits.  For instance ending Mend & Maim while in the central form while changing would cut the displayed value in half, granting one half as a heal as per Mend, and the other half as damage as per Maim.  Her 3 would briefly provide half benefits of each of its sides, before swapping to the alternate one.  Leaving the current functionality on Rest & Rage as it currently is.

 

This way, casting your 1 more often for the sake of maximizing Duality becomes more core to the frame's use, and better incentivizes the player to want to shift forms.

 

All that said I do partly agree with the weapon swap thing, but in a different regard.  Weapon swapping across the board should be much, much faster than it currently is.  If this were the case quickly swapping weapons for reasons like this, or for the sake of actually using different weapons for different scenarios would just feel so much better.  This would alleviate the issue you're seeing while simultaneously improving gameplay fluidity as a whole.

 

In regards to the AI of Duality's clone, it actually appears to use targeting type parameters based on the weapon you've given it.  Give it an explosive, or some slower charge weapon (worst of both worlds an Ogris) and it'll feel like it is dumber than a bag of hammers.  Throw a hitscan semi-auto or fully automatic rifle on and watch your clone become some sort of wannabe MLG sharpshooter.  Gave it a Lex Prime and it just starting popping shots from upwards of 40 meters out (its accuracy did suffer a little at the outer ranges).  I was re-ranking the Tysis to mess around and the Duality copy went straight berserk with that weapon.  The same seems to hold true for melee weapons, the faster the better.  It would be nice if it were more overall solid with a variety of weaponry, but for now this will at least suffice to aid in its usability.

[streepe]

I tested with a few weapon: twin grakata, hikou prime(with concealed explosive), sancti tigris and veykor hek. Hikou is so far the 1 that was the most successful. Twin grakata was probable the worst. It seems it has a hard time with long reload. But even with hikou if I'm in a complex room it will attack nothing for the 10 secs (duration I have).

[SasoDuck]

I obviously agree with everything you said, but still.... it doesn't matter that it's a 1, plenty of frames have 1s that are amazingly useful, often more so than their ult. Mirage, Nyx, Saryn, and Mag all have really good 1st abilities. Nyx's Mind Control has a really long duration, at 30 seconds base. Why shouldn't Equinox have a similar duration? I mean, I'm consuming an entire mod slot to use the ability, why shouldn't it be good?

 

Again, I agree with all your points (especially about having all her abilities remain active between switching forms, and simply switch their effect to match the form she/he switched to), but there's no reason for Duality to have such a crappy short duration.

[Kalvorax]

what DE SHOULD do with Duality is make a toggle for the split, or press for change. (NO duration, but just a drain on energy overtime like the rest of her abilities (apart from 2 which i find useless), that alone would make me want to use Night form more often...and her abilities should stay active in terms of the Stacking thing until the ability is turned off.

Edited February 10, 2016 by xcynderx

[Kaidinah]

I just want the duration buffed. I don't care if they have to nerf the 300% damage to do it

[tnccs215]

As for the first part; Metamorphosis is still a 1 ability you can't expect it to be on par with a different frame's 4, that's just silly. As a note; Metamorphosis costs 1/4 as much as Rumblers, and 1/4 of 95 = 23.75. So all thing's considered they aren't far off in terms of cost to duration ratio. Atop that Metamorphosis is a faster cast which doesn't root you in place, however you'll spend more total time casting in order to maintain your summoned clone.

Rather than just ramping up the duration on Duality, I'd prefer seeing a more fluidity to become existent with Equinox's two ability sets. Rather than ending almost any active ability (foes under the effect of Rest or Rage won't be undone upon casting 1) there should be a transition. This could possibly even open up room for a third niche set of traits. For instance ending Mend & Maim while in the central form while changing would cut the displayed value in half, granting one half as a heal as per Mend, and the other half as damage as per Maim. Her 3 would briefly provide half benefits of each of its sides, before swapping to the alternate one. Leaving the current functionality on Rest & Rage as it currently is.

This way, casting your 1 more often for the sake of maximizing Duality becomes more core to the frame's use, and better incentivizes the player to want to shift forms.

All that said I do partly agree with the weapon swap thing, but in a different regard. Weapon swapping across the board should be much, much faster than it currently is. If this were the case quickly swapping weapons for reasons like this, or for the sake of actually using different weapons for different scenarios would just feel so much better. This would alleviate the issue you're seeing while simultaneously improving gameplay fluidity as a whole.

Basically this. As she Works now, on simple terms, Aspect changing is not incentivized. Since you loose your abilities upon doing so, basic logic on your brain goes "aspect changing=bad". Should something like you proposed be implemented, it would quickly become "Aspect changing=good". I actually already proposed something similar, but I didn't thought about that Mend&Maim functionality. Its actually very good.

I remember how Metamorphosis got its transition time halved a while ago. It was a very useful buff, but, honestly, I'd like to have those 2 seconds back with those changes you propose.

Also, completely agree with you on the gun swapping thing. Honestly, its funny how underused the scroll wheel is in this game. It could allow much faster weapon swapping, and, on this game, that is fundamental. Its simply too fast paced for such a slow weapon swapping speed.

Also, I'm gonna had that Mend&Maim idea to my Equinox tweak thread, if you allow me to.

[Heliopata]

I would be fine with a 10-11s base duration

[SasoDuck]

I just want the duration buffed. I don't care if they have to nerf the 300% damage to do it

The clone has a 300% damage buff?? Hell, scrap that and give me 300% base duration! It's not like my Hek or Talons NEED 300% extra damage when an AI is using it.

[AstroLord]

For me they could incrase it to 15 seconds and everything will be done.

Edited February 15, 2016 by AstroLord

[Kalvorax]

The clone has a 300% damage buff?? Hell, scrap that and give me 300% base duration! It's not like my Hek or Talons NEED 300% extra damage when an AI is using it.

god i know right. even with my Duration at 189% it still a measly 10-11 seconds before the clone actually does anything.

[Veihl]

The clone has a 300% damage buff?? Hell, scrap that and give me 300% base duration! It's not like my Hek or Talons NEED 300% extra damage when an AI is using it.

This.

 

god i know right. even with my Duration at 189% it still a measly 10-11 seconds before the clone actually does anything.

And this.