Invisibility Abilities Don't Really Turn You Invisible In Conclave.

[-InV-igo95862]

Take Ivara Prowl for example.

 

 

It so easy to see that there is not a single point of casting that ability.

 

Loki's Invisibility is slightly better but still rather easy to see especially on a bright surfaces.

Here is an example then I see a Loki thought the invisibility.

 

 

Those abilities are pretty bad in its current state. There is little point of using them unless you play against people who don't know how they work. I suggest removing all the blur effects and making them completely invisible.

[Wheels204]

I could hardly see loki there in the video, if they were moving around a lot they would be really hard to focus on and shoot. I think it still has an advantage going invisible.

Also does black energy make you completely invisible? I know it does in PVE

Edited February 18, 2016 by Wheels204

[Scandroid]

Ever heard of balance? How balance would it be if you could go full invis almost all the time since those abolities cost almost nothing to cast

[-InV-igo95862]

Ever heard of balance? How balance would it be if you could go full invis almost all the time since those abolities cost almost nothing to cast

 

You probably never played conclave. 50 energy is a lot.

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

You probably never played conclave. 50 energy is a lot.

Not anymore

[Lordricker]

I think the loki invis is fine, you can definitly make use of it but the ivara prowl really is useless, im not even sure what it is supposed to do you can only slow walk with it on and you are still visible 

[ANGELVIXEN]

The Invisibility skills are 100% invisible to me due to me playing on low settings, so in my experience, people with poor settings / computers won't be able to see them.

The only one I can see is Ash's smoke screen, but prowl and loki's are the ones I cannot see.

[SamSlade]

Ivara needs her arrow bubbles to not be a bit 'Shoot Here' arrow.  I don't really use her in Conclave but I do know that those bubbles are lame.

[Lord_Noctus]

If u turn of effects in graphics ull see how invis rly should look like. But its hard to say if it would be balanced. U know im personaly using invis loki with snipetron. For me it seems allready strong with these kind of weapons.

[Lordricker]

thats the problem though most people dont turn off effects so some invisible stuff is very obvious. I do believe they changed ivara prowl though

[-InV-igo95862]

 

Here are issues with the way it works now:

 

1). It depends on the surfaces you are looking through. On some maps its easy visible on others completely not.

2). Depends on graphical settings. Without motion blur or depth of field it not visible.

[SevenLetterKWord]

Maintaining consistency across graphical settings is very important.
Players should not feel compelled to change certain graphics settings to gain an advantage.

To this end, invisibility in Conclave should be changed to full invisibility, but with certain drawbacks.
Ivara's Prowl already has many of these drawbacks: various actions will temporarily disrupt her invisibility, others flat-out end it.

These drawbacks could easily be adjusted and implemented for invisibility abilities in Conclave, and would serve to balance the mechanic against its buff to full invisibility.

[R-GUN]

I am sorry to nekro this.
but i am having trouble with an invisible ivara one shotting everything with his/her navigated glaive.
The only thing i could do was dodge that thing, I can't fight back if i don't turn on motion blur and depth of field.

Please make them completely invisible if this is intended, at least i won't have to suffer from motion blur. Or make them barely visible no matter what graphic settings it is.

[.HanZo.]

Navigator glaive drains the energy bar really quickly so he cant keep up for long. And its not harder to dodge a glaive flying around then arrows/projectiles. But there should be consistency about invisibility in both DM and TDM and independent of energy color or graphic settings, absolutely true. I think it should be visible , even when standing still, like depth of field makes it pop out, but no coloration at all. 

Edited March 4, 2016 by .HanZo.

[(XBOX)Lorewalker1022]

Actually invisibility is quite useful in conclave. Obviously you can't go full invisible otherwise that really wouldn't be too fair. Even active camo in H5 makes u visible once you start moving. 

[SevenLetterKWord]

7 hours ago, (XB1)Lorewalker1022 said:

Actually invisibility is quite useful in conclave. Obviously you can't go full invisible otherwise that really wouldn't be too fair. Even active camo in H5 makes u visible once you start moving. 

Your post has nothing to do with the current state of the thread.
This thread is now about significant visual inconsistencies across graphics settings.

In Halo, everyone is using the same hardware, same settings. Invisibility is rendered in the same way.

In Warframe, the practical effectiveness of invisibility varies depending on your opponents' graphics settings.
This should not be so.

The best way to resolve this is to buff invisibility to full invisibility while also attaching certain drawbacks, as I stated earlier.
Full invisibility by itself is unfair, but these drawbacks can balance it.

[Forizenajay]

The invisibility reminds me of HoTs.

The stealth chars are not really 100% invisible, they are little shimmery blurs that are hard to detect but still exist. 

 

I think that would be a good way to "rework" invisibility for conclave. Not make them completely invisible but rather harder to detect and NOT base it off of energy color. 

Edited March 5, 2016 by -FV-Forizen
dead space

[-InV-igo95862]

2 hours ago, -FV-Forizen said:

The invisibility reminds me of HoTs.

The stealth chars are not really 100% invisible, they are little shimmery blurs that are hard to detect but still exist. 

 

I think that would be a good way to "rework" invisibility for conclave. Not make them completely invisible but rather harder to detect and NOT base it off of energy color. 

NO, NO, NO...

That invisibility serves no purpose but only to stomp noobs. I watched some Starcraft 2 (same engine and same effect) games and literally any pro can tell exact location of a unit.

I want full invisibility as it will be as effective in against a high skill player as it is against inexperienced players..

[Forizenajay]

2 hours ago, -cS-igo95862-ICE- said:

NO, NO, NO...

That invisibility serves no purpose but only to stomp noobs. I watched some Starcraft 2 (same engine and same effect) games and literally any pro can tell exact location of a unit.

I want full invisibility as it will be as effective in against a high skill player as it is against inexperienced players..

I just don't think muzzle flashes and sound are pronounced enough in the game to warrant fair and real invisibility.

 

Most stealth themes have indicators that balance it out, otherwise invisibility truly is overpowered.

 

This is Loki masterrace discussion all over again. 

 

If real invisibility was added it would be the most overpowered thing up to date unless there were methods of counterplay. 

[Rilexi]

6 hours ago, -cS-igo95862-ICE- said:

That invisibility serves no purpose but only to stomp noobs. I watched some Starcraft 2 (same engine and same effect) games and literally any pro can tell exact location of a unit.

I want full invisibility as it will be as effective in against a high skill player as it is against inexperienced players..

I play Loki all the time, so just adding my 2 cents. A pro can tell the exact location of a blurry invisible unit because, well, they're pros. They quickly notice everything that might normally be passed over. If you can consistently gun down invisible Lokis bouncing wall to wall above your head - have a cookie. 

However, most of the people I play in public conclave don't track an invisible Loki all that well. Reactions range from simply running and waiting it out, to blind spray and pray (mainly the noobs), to shooting somewhere in my general direction. When I'm circling another fight, I usually don't get noticed until I start attacking. I've had people run right past me, oblivious. The ones that do notice often get distracted by the more obviously visible (and easier to kill) threats nearby. I imagine I'd rack up quite a few kills if I could actually...aim. XD

Many of the times I died while invisible from well-aimed shots were when I got lazy. I stopped being as mobile. Much like the Lokis you killed in your videos - they were on the ground, leisurely coming straight at you. Not using a tool in your arsenal to its full potential is the fault of the player, not the ability.

 

If you still don't see Loki's invisibility giving your enemies any notable advantage, keep in mind that what may be a good challenge for you may simply be unfair to the majority. 

Edited March 5, 2016 by Rilexi

[.HanZo.]

In S

8 hours ago, -cS-igo95862-ICE- said:

NO, NO, NO...

That invisibility serves no purpose but only to stomp noobs. I watched some Starcraft 2 (same engine and same effect) games and literally any pro can tell exact location of a unit.

I want full invisibility as it will be as effective in against a high skill player as it is against inexperienced players..

In SC2 you also have stealth detection units/abilities. Warframe would need something similar , or stealth becomes way too strong even against high skilled players. Maybe something like a thermal camera as a usable item. 

[Naftal]

Just now, .HanZo. said:

In SC2 you also have stealth detection units/abilities. Warframe would need something similar , or stealth becomes way too strong even against high skilled players. Maybe something like a thermal camera as a usable item. 

So you'd have to swap to a thermal camera to see enemy, then swap back to weapon and kill them (while not seeing the thermal camera anymore)?

[.HanZo.]

Hmm.. my first idea would be it its usable for a short time and has a cooldown so you cant use it for every stealth, you put on the camera and can only use your secondary for its duration. Coming from the top of my head, i just woke up.

[SevenLetterKWord]

Buff all invisibility abilities to full invisibility.

Attach the following drawbacks to all invisibility abilities:
No pickups can be collected while invisible.
Firing (or charging) a weapon will fade you out of invisibility for the duration of the firing plus 2 seconds.
Melee actions (including channeling) will fade you out of invisibility for the duration of the action plus 1 second.
Bullet jumping will fade you out of invisibility for 1 second, or at least for however long the bullet jump takes.
Sprinting, jumping, rolling, sliding, wall-jumping, wall-latching, and other "calmer" parkour actions will not disrupt your invisibility.
(Give it some time to play out, then we can better assess which actions are "disruptive" and which actions are "calm".)

It's not that hard. There's no need to make up new items like "thermal detectors" used just to detect abilities that only three frames have.
These abilities can be internally balanced.

[(XBOX)LastxMOHICANx]

On 2/18/2016 at 4:50 AM, -cS-igo95862-ICE- said:

 

You probably never played conclave. 50 energy is a lot.

You ever heard of loki with a rubico and the follow through MOD it gives you 8 energy after 8 secs per kill . with rubico I can pick off 3 to 4 ppl in my view in 8 seconds and ban theres 39 energy added to whatever i amready have while im invisble for 19 seconds. Invisbilty isVERY difficult to spot past 15- 20 M and thata the sweet spot for snipers. And even if you spot it a person that knows how to play and has the agile aim mod equipped can just trot left and right while shooting at you and you be will have a really hard time trying to hit them. Also with a sniper or bow by the time you see the invisibilty blur with loki its too  late with a seasoned player.