Saryn's DPS

[ThatOddDeer]

1 minute ago, Rambit23Z said:

Got a double one (23k x2) with Corrosive Dual Ichors. Only source of DOT was from Toxic Lash's toxin.

The ground finisher applies 2 slash procs. That's what you most likely experienced.

[ThatOddDeer]

Here is the video showing that toxic lash can NOT crit bleed by using a weapon and stance incapable of inflicting slash procs.

Then I use a weapon that CAN inflict slash procs and low and behold, crit bleeds.

[Rambit23Z]

4 minutes ago, ThatOddDeer said:

Here is the video showing that toxic lash can NOT crit bleed by using a weapon and stance incapable of inflicting slash procs.

Then I use a weapon that CAN inflict slash procs and low and behold, crit bleeds.

Alright, I get it now. Thanks for clarifying it for me.

[ThatOddDeer]

Just now, Rambit23Z said:

Alright, I get it now. Thanks for clarifying it for me.

Now if toxic lash could crit bleed it wouldn't need any other offensive bonuses. It could just be that. On the other hand it's defensive and synergistic aspects could be improved. Changing the blocking bonus to a substantial increase makes it useable by all forms of saryn while keeping 2 of its 3 parts locked to melee, similar to speed and warcry in that regard. Also maybe allowing the energy return per spore hit scale from 1/2/3/4 per level and/or allowing it to scale with power strength OR allowing it to return 6 energy if your last melee attack kills the target with 3 spores, or 4 energy with 2 spores. 

 

[Rambit23Z]

I seem to only get off a tick or two, but I have a sneaking suspicion that it's due my lack of Naramon at the moment.

1 minute ago, ThatOddDeer said:

Now if toxic lash could crit bleed it wouldn't need any other offensive bonuses. It could just be that. On the other hand it's defensive and synergistic aspects could be improved. Changing the blocking bonus to a substantial increase makes it useable by all forms of saryn while keeping 2 of its 3 parts locked to melee, similar to speed and warcry in that regard. Also maybe allowing the energy return per spore hit scale from 1/2/3/4 per level and/or allowing it to scale with power strength OR allowing it to return 6 energy if your last melee attack kills the target with 3 spores, or 4 energy with 2 spores. 

 

I see what you mean, and I agree with your proposed changes.

[Rambit23Z]

I'd like to point out some more anti-synergy too. Taking on single target with Toxic Lash leaves your enemy without spores to keep the Viral proc up. And recasting is no good either because only the pop has 100% proc chance. And only on surrounding enemies. Toxic Lash should never be able to remove the last Spore on an enemy.

[ThatOddDeer]

10 minutes ago, Rambit23Z said:

I'd like to point out some more anti-synergy too. Taking on single target with Toxic Lash leaves your enemy without spores to keep the Viral proc up. And recasting is no good either because only the pop has 100% proc chance. And only on surrounding enemies. Toxic Lash should never be able to remove the last Spore on an enemy.

I can agree to that entirely. That would fix a LOT of problems.

[IamTheSparta]

I did this in 30 sec, the max allowed by the free version of FRAPS :)

Slash proc are OP? i dont ground finish them all, deal with it thatodddeer, your build is horrible

[ThatOddDeer]

4 minutes ago, IamTheSparta said:

I did this in 30 sec, the max allowed by the free version of FRAPS :)

Slash proc are OP? i dont ground finish them all, deal with it thatodddeer, your build is horrible

I saw multiple ground finishers. Please don't say flat out lies when your own video says otherwise. 

[IamTheSparta]

1 hour ago, ThatOddDeer said:

I saw multiple ground finishers. Please don't say flat out lies when your own video says otherwise. 

And? look at how i kill them even without ground finisher.

Edited April 8, 2016 by Letter13
Let's avoid that sort of language

[ThatOddDeer]

1 hour ago, IamTheSparta said:

And? look at how i kill them even without ground finisher.

The point of the builds in the last video was not to be effective. They were to showcase critical bleeds without anything other than toxic lash. Please don't make such hasty judgement and your choice of language is far from pleasant.

[IamTheSparta]

1 minute ago, ThatOddDeer said:

The point of the builds in the last video was not to be effective. They were to showcase critical bleeds without anything other than toxic lash. Please don't make such hasty judgement and your choice of language is far from pleasant.

You are using primed flow even in your serious build, and just for that, this is not a good build.

[ThatOddDeer]

8 minutes ago, IamTheSparta said:

You are using primed flow even in your serious build, and just for that, this is not a good build.

Primed flow bad? I never thought I would hear those words. Especially on an energy hungry frame like Saryn.

[IamTheSparta]

3 minutes ago, ThatOddDeer said:

Primed flow bad? I never thought I would hear those words. Especially on an energy hungry frame like Saryn.

Saryn is not an ability spammer anymore, 1 spore here and there, a toxic lash sometimes, same for miasma when it's needed, that's all.
It's all about STRENGTH, STRENGTH, STRENGTH.

Look at how i have infinite energy when i pop up the spores under toxic lash, who need primed flow? wtf. i'm not even using chaneling for 50% more dps.

Edited April 7, 2016 by IamTheSparta

[Shuuro]

21 minutes ago, IamTheSparta said:

I did this in 30 sec, the max allowed by the free version of FRAPS :)

Slash proc are OP? i dont ground finish them all, deal with it thatodddeer, your build is horrible

I'm sorry, what does this video have to do with Saryn again? All I'm seeing is melee Swirling Tiger over and over. Please elaborate.

[IamTheSparta]

1 minute ago, Shuuro said:

I'm sorry, what does this video have to do with Saryn again? All I'm seeing is melee Swirling Tiger over and over. Please elaborate.

She is an incredible dps, a team buffer with venom dose, a huge debuffer with her -50% hp everywhere and a stunner sometimes with her miasma

 

That's the point, saryn is NOT trash at all and doesnt need any kind of buff actually, i will not cry if she is buffed, but it is not needed at all ~~

[achromos]

1 minute ago, IamTheSparta said:

She is an incredible dps, a team buffer with venom dose, a huge debuffer with her -50% hp everywhere and a stunner sometimes with her miasma

 

That's the point, saryn is NOT trash at all and doesnt need any kind of buff actually, i will not cry if she is buffed, but it is not needed at all ~~

 

the issue is that if she is mistakingly buffed... she WILL be nerfed in the end too.  Do you want that?

[Shuuro]

1 minute ago, IamTheSparta said:

She is an incredible dps, a team buffer with venom dose, a huge debuffer with her -50% hp everywhere and a stunner sometimes with her miasma

 

That's the point, saryn is NOT trash at all and doesnt need any kind of buff actually, i will not cry if she is buffed, but it is not needed at all ~~

Okay, but that video is just showing Dual Ichor being really good at DPS. Where is her kit involved in that?

[IamTheSparta]

Just now, achromos said:

 

the issue is that if she is mistakingly buffed... she WILL be nerfed in the end too.  Do you want that?

Why it would happen? She is strong, not op.

[ThatOddDeer]

1 minute ago, achromos said:

 

the issue is that if she is mistakingly buffed... she WILL be nerfed in the end too.  Do you want that?

Atlas needed buffs and got them. Was he nerfed afterwards? Not as far as I know.

[IamTheSparta]

4 minutes ago, Shuuro said:

Okay, but that video is just showing Dual Ichor being really good at DPS. Where is her kit involved in that?

The -50% hp? the insane dots on everyone? The infinite energy for perma channeling maybe? Hell, do you have eyes? Do you even play saryn?

[ThatOddDeer]

1 minute ago, IamTheSparta said:

The -50% hp? the insane dots on everyone? The infinite energy for perma channeling maybe? Hell, do you have eyes? Do you even play saryn?

-50% Hp is just 2x damage. Any number of frames can do that easily and more for the team. Infinite energy for channeling means you're using focus energy at least and that is terrible for DPS because you give up the possibility of running 100% status slash weapons or better mods since modding is so cramped. As far as your claim for insane dots, there are none. Your weapon is carrying you. My video with the lanka had the highest DoTs out of anything so far and had nothing to do with saryn and that was a measly 2k at best. Even a charge attack from a heavy blade like the scindo prime with toxic lash on a spored target won't break 700 a tick and that doesn't stack btw because of how spore transfers toxin procs. 

[SirWolfen]

Saryn isn't a dps frame she is a debuffer. Stop trying to make her be a damage frame happen she's a debuffing melee frame.

[ThatOddDeer]

1 minute ago, SirWolfen said:

Saryn isn't a dps frame she is a debuffer. Stop trying to make her be a damage frame happen she's a debuffing melee frame.

Which is why all of my suggestions, which have been buried by now, have been about making her a debuffer  and fixing odd design choices rather than increasing her damage.  I am fine with her damage right now it's the lack of important debuffing tools,that would already be thematic to her, miasma shredding armor for example, and anti-synergy in her own kit like toxic lash making you not want to load up a target with toxin, spores not truly spreading all the procs properly, molt dieing too quick to do its job, not scaling at all, not taking aggro away from saryn and not scaling with range mods.

[PikeOrShield]

22 minutes ago, ThatOddDeer said:

Primed flow bad? I never thought I would hear those words. Especially on an energy hungry frame like Saryn.

Adding Primed Flow is like building a fancy refrigerator for a starving family.  General consensus is it's only worth adding if you normally have max energy without the mod or you carry around restores.  If a Saryn is energy inefficient, building for efficiency is better that having extra storage space you never use.