Is there a place in warframe for slower martial arts

[Chef_Lu_Bu]

Is there a place in warframe for slower, more methodical or more elegant martial arts stances. That's my question I want to parse. I will be dropping several dank references and Chinese words, so please, if you need help, google is your friend.

Currently we have some really awesome stances that look amazing and do super cool stuff, we have some cool looking ones that do nothing(scythes) and we have some stances that you level up for rank and nothing else(cough machete cough). We also have the great hammer/galatine stuff, if that's your swag bag. Generally everyone is hauling so much butt through each mission that getting beyond RUNNING AND SMASHING E in regards to melee is reserved only for a handful of missions and even then, a subset of players, so I don't, in my time, see a whole lot of people doing a whole lot of sweet melee combo stuff, which stinks, cause melee combos look sweet, and a game with zero gravity fencing ninjas doing barrel roll decapitations should also let you see someone izuna drop a mutant dog off the moon. Maybe that's just me feeling that. *shrug* 

All this leads to my actual point, should and can there be slower, more methodical or more elegant martial arts via stances in Warframe. 

1. Slower/Methodical Martial Arts. Moves based on smaller combos that deal significantly more damage at the cost of being able to run 1000 mph while doing them. Moves that require those slow charges, but at max charge are given greater effect. You want examples, I GOT EXAMPLES.  Sōkotsu (双骨, Double Bone)  is a slow, insanely powerful melee move executed by handsome grandpa and murderous sociopath Yamamto Genryusai in Bleach. It's the core of what I think embodies slow martial arts. It has a charge, a wind up, and an explosion of power. It stems, from what I can tell, heavily from Xing Yi Quan, a short range explosive linear martial art that is popularized by it's opposite nature of the circular Baguazhang(an elegant martial art we'll get to later. So what's the plan, Stan, you ask because you think my name is Stan. Simple, allow this move to exist as a charge at the end of a combo using fists, where the attack that comes out is based on the amount of time charged before releasing it. Give it blast proc and let it ragdoll grineer down the halls like a hot dog fired out of a cannon. Create a scenario where this attack, given it's lack of range and speed, benefits from ignoring the enemies armor. Something to offset the movement, by moving the opponent, to the afterlife, where their obliterated corpse will rest forever. Pros of Slow Martial arts: Intentional input, exceptional output. For those of us that like to tank, it gives us something to do(charge the fist laser) while we absorb dps in the middle of a crowd. A means of defeating a boss that's FUN doesn't involve the Tonkor.                                http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/bleach/images/c/cc/Sokotsu.gif/revision/latest?cb=20101027000418&path-prefix=en
2. Elegant Martial Arts. Remember when I mentioned Baguazhang? Of course you do, you smart little jelly beans. So Baguazhang, or, that martial art Jet Li uses in "The One" as it's more often known, is a very elegant martial art using movement and an "inner circle" to move around and behind your opponent allowing you to attack them while they have no recourse. You may have also seen it in Tekken as Xiayou is a practitioner of it. There are lots of elegant martial arts. Many use weapons. Baguazhang actually uses a Bagua great sword, which is an enormous Chinese blade. It relies on long sweeping movements with steps to create a dance of death. It's incredibly cool to watch and has a lot of movement in all directions. It fits perfectly in my mind as a martial art the Tenno might use to sweep behind an enemy and stab them in the back.  Banshee swiftly swirling behind her opponent like the tall independent woman she is, only to impale the poor Corpus schmuck on her Dragon Nikana or whatever. These moves would also be distinctly slower than, say, your iai-style stances or your dual zoren stances, but would involve more movement per swing, allowing you to reposition as you attack during your combo. The added benefit being, perhaps, that they deal damage as you move through swaths of enemies without doing a spin attack, or giving you bleed or taking reduced damage or added evasion after completing specific combos.

Just my thoughts. I'll leave you guys with a handful of examples of each though, if you're interested in looking them up. 

Slow(er) or more Deliberate Martial Arts:

Choi Li Fut(amazing for fighting more than one person),  Hung Ga of Wong Fei-Hung, Pao Chui, Southern Dragon Kung Fu.

Elegant Martial Arts:

Five Ancestors, Five Animals, Choi Gar, Drunken Monkey/Master(IMAGINE A GOURD WEAPON), MIzongYi, Northern Praying Mantis.

 

 

Your thoughts an opinions are welcome. Many of these stances also have weapons training built into them, but for the purpose of really exemplifying the nature of them, I didn't go into too much detail about the weapons associated with each. If you want to look up stuff like that, wikipedia is a good place to start, but without a knowledge base, you might just be clicking links for a few hours trying to figure out what words mean what. <3

[Plushy]

Standing in place trying to get through a slow combo animation = you die at any reasonable level. Any stances that don't give you enough forward movement while you perform combos is just going to kill the enemy immediately in front of you and then leave you swinging at enemies that are more than 2 steps away. Just keep these points in mind. They are big reasons why some stances are junk mods. 

[Chef_Lu_Bu]

21 minutes ago, Plushy said:

Standing in place trying to get through a slow combo animation = you die at any reasonable level. Any stances that don't give you enough forward movement while you perform combos is just going to kill the enemy immediately in front of you and then leave you swinging at enemies that are more than 2 steps away. Just keep these points in mind. They are big reasons why some stances are junk mods. 

I disagree for a handful of reasons.

1. Lots of frames and lots of builds render you invulnerable for a significant amount of time for 90% of the content of warframe. You don't die at any reasonable level. My Nezha can pop his shield and kill 2/3rds of the bosses while I spam the bow emote. I'm not saying these need to be min/max stances for the hardest content in the game. I'm asking if they can exist and would be fun.

2. There are ways to give these stances advantages that the faster stances don't have to make them viable under certain scenarios. An obvious one would be aggro on slower stances in, perhaps, a defensive stance, to draw enemies in to you and away from allies, allowing you to absorb a % of their DPS and then dishing it back out. The other would be increasing your ability to evade on more elegant stances. 

[AsianLyf]

I'd say no, because Warframe tends to be a speedy game and people wouldn't wait for your combo to finish

[Chef_Lu_Bu]

7 minutes ago, Ankoku_no_Hime said:

I'd say no, because Warframe tends to be a speedy game and people wouldn't wait for your combo to finish

People don't wait to watch you execute enemies in stealth, either, but its gratifying to the player to do it, right? And it's functional. It one-shots most enemies.

[AsianLyf]

2 hours ago, Chef_Lu_Bu said:

People don't wait to watch you execute enemies in stealth, either, but its gratifying to the player to do it, right? And it's functional. It one-shots most enemies.

If a faster stance does the same job in a faster time, people won't care about the slower one.

[Sixty5]

You would need to rework melee to some extent in order to make it viable

Currently the meta for melee is berserker, blood rush, body count and shadow step. You stack combo, crit super hard, attack fast for more combo and have near perma invis. More hits, more crits, more combo more damage. 

Slow attacks need something going for them to make them worthwhile. Currently charge attacks are pretty much garbage for this reason, you stand there unable to do anything charging a mediocre attack. 

If you look at martial arts in the real world there is always an emphasis on speed. Faster attacks hit harder, are harder to avoid and leave you open to counter attack to a lesser degree. If you are fighting, you really want to telegraph what you are doing as little as possible.

Strong attacks do have a place, like your haymaker in boxing, or a turning kick, but even then you still want it to be fast. 

Back to a game perspective, I really wouldn't want to lock myself into a long animation for any reason. Mobility is king in this game. And losing that for even a second or two is not something I want. 

Slow attacks work in anime and crap because they build tension, show power and reduce the work the animator has to do. It is very much a film trope that has no bearing in terms of reall effectiveness 

[tennorod]

40 minutes ago, Sixty5 said:

You would need to rework melee to some extent in order to make it viable

Currently the meta for melee is berserker, blood rush, body count and shadow step. You stack combo, crit super hard, attack fast for more combo and have near perma invis. More hits, more crits, more combo more damage. 

Slow attacks need something going for them to make them worthwhile. Currently charge attacks are pretty much garbage for this reason, you stand there unable to do anything charging a mediocre attack. 

If you look at martial arts in the real world there is always an emphasis on speed. Faster attacks hit harder, are harder to avoid and leave you open to counter attack to a lesser degree. If you are fighting, you really want to telegraph what you are doing as little as possible.

Strong attacks do have a place, like your haymaker in boxing, or a turning kick, but even then you still want it to be fast. 

Back to a game perspective, I really wouldn't want to lock myself into a long animation for any reason. Mobility is king in this game. And losing that for even a second or two is not something I want. 

Slow attacks work in anime and crap because they build tension, show power and reduce the work the animator has to do. It is very much a film trope that has no bearing in terms of reall effectiveness 

I second that the concepts are nice but warframe is a fast pace game so going slow doesn't really work

[(PSN)robotwars7]

to answer your question, no. at least not currently. the idea for us right now is to attack as fast as possible, as enforced by mods like Fury and Berserker. plus while slower attacks are more elegant in their own way, faster attacks look better on screen. after all, why do you think swordfights and such are much faster in movies than the ones you may see in a demonstration of real martial arts? it's all about what the masses believe looks cooler, and that's fast and furious strikes and intense combos.

[tennorod]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

to answer your question, no. at least not currently. the idea for us right now is to attack as fast as possible, as enforced by mods like Fury and Berserker. plus while slower attacks are more elegant in their own way, faster attacks look better on screen. after all, why do you think swordfights and such are much faster in movies than the ones you may see in a demonstration of real martial arts? it's all about what the masses believe looks cooler, and that's fast and furious strikes and intense combos.

True

[Rakosta_Kai]

I don't like it... But to each their own.

It sounds like a reasonably close approximation of what a slow fist weapon would look like with taunt and without a stance...Likewise what the machete looked like before stances.

 

 

[fatpig84]

Because being slow is dead in Warframe and the suit themselves aren't in anyway remotely human.

Some frames can cross 200 meters in 6 seconds.
That is nearly 120 kph on foot.
Plenty of others can easily deflect bullets with their sword and melee, that indicates hyper fast reaction times.

Even the slowest martial art is going to be quick.

 

[Hatzeputt]