Map-Wide "Blinds"/Stuns (Mirage, Excal, etc.) need NPC Counterplay

[o.0-]

What about flipping how Prism Blinds and Damages?

So when casting it, the Lasers Blind the enemies it hits, so to keep them blinded Mirage needs to keep Prism active (so should also consider reducing the energy drain on the ability), and when bursting it, the explosion causes the Radiation damage and scales with Power Strength.

If that can work, there could be other tweaks considered to the casting animation, velocity on Prism and so on to consider.

[PsiWarp]

1 hour ago, SPARTAN-187.Thanatos said:

What about flipping how Prism Blinds and Damages?

So when casting it, the Lasers Blind the enemies it hits, so to keep them blinded Mirage needs to keep Prism active (so should also consider reducing the energy drain on the ability), and when bursting it, the explosion causes the Radiation damage and scales with Power Strength.

If that can work, there could be other tweaks considered to the casting animation, velocity on Prism and so on to consider.

Interesting, but that effectively places a target cap on the number of enemies that can be blinded at one time (20 lasers), until they or the prism moves out of range anyway. Although, does anyone know if Power Strength actually increase the laser count or not (I checked abilities page but can't really tell in mission).

I'm okay with this swap as long as the laser prioritize the closest enemies and the Radiation has a chance to proc.

[RealPandemonium]

6 hours ago, tripletriple said:

If you apply Los to her prism it will simply become a radial blind and mirage will sink to nothing. The nerf mentality people have here shouldn't exist. It's a balance mentality that should be used.

Have it only able to blind for its intial duration and then after that enemies suffer from an accuracy debuff. Then increase its damage by 2x and make it stagger enemies that the laser hits encouraging it to be left up.

The enemies can still fight back but we have a viable and unique ultimate.

 

 

Mirage will be far from nothing if they add LoS, but the other suggestions you make are a step in the right direction.  

[Sold0ut]

I'm always surprised when people seem to think that a nerf can't be balanced.

 

Oh well, it's that or a full rework of how blinds work (which I wouldn't even mind, alongside a stealth rework eventually).

[Dallian]

On 14/4/2016 at 9:20 AM, AKKILLA said:

The Best way to fix blind abilities is ENEMIES LINE OF SIGHT that should determine whether the enemies blinded or not. So the enemies will have a cone line of sight that functions on blinds that reach the enemies cone sight. If the blind is being obstructed by a wall the enemy will not be blinded. This is common sense. LOS requires enemies AI to be fixed aswell

I agree, "for immersion purpouses" the effect of the blind should be radial not automatic to all the enemies in range, it should last longer on nerby enemies, and prism shouldn't reset the blinding time on blinded enemies (They are blind :|) but let's not forget that the prism ignores obstacles, this last is probably what makes it broken. The thing, a huge range prism is basically too powerful when it comes to cc, adding a LoS cap seems pretty ugly to me, the ability needs to be balanced not nerfed. By removing the obstacle-ignore part, make the blind duration based on radius (And even power strength), less effective if casted on the same enemy and, perhaps, reducing the range of the blind itself the ability would be an option to cc but it would not render the enemy helpless as it does today. 

[Neightrix]

On 04/11/2016 at 6:58 PM, EmptyDevil said:

Need that Prism LoS nerf, DE.

Hopefully soon considering this issue is well over a year old.

 

It doesn't matter if Excalibur has a "blinding" themed ability or not. It doesn't matter what Mag used to be like or how she was changed. It doesn't matter if another frame can do such and such thing, they can be addressed in another thread. What matters is, when a Mirage joins a game and the player presses 4 twice, the game breaks. You're standing around waiting an interception to end, or arbitrarily doing whatever the mission is. Why do you think the LoR meta is "don't kill anything"?

"But the ability is based on duration and will wear off."

It's recast-able, and Trinity, energy plates, and Zenurik all exist. LoS will be just fine. She's still amazing otherwise, and you can still pick Loki or another CC frame for making large groups of enemies completely useless.

Warframe isn't even a hard game to start with, but it's not fun when literally all of the challenge is removed.

Some of the suggestions are very good, but I still think LoS is best, and if reworked then it should have a different effect.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Neightrix

[EmptyDevil]

3 hours ago, Neightrix said:

Hopefully soon considering this issue is well over a year old.

 

It doesn't matter if Excalibur has a "blinding" themed ability or not. It doesn't matter what Mag used to be like or how she was changed. It doesn't matter if another frame can do such and such thing, they can be addressed in another thread. What matters is, when a Mirage joins a game and the player presses 4 twice, the game breaks. You're standing around waiting an interception to end, or arbitrarily doing whatever the mission is. Why do you think the LoR meta is "don't kill anything"?

"But the ability is based on duration and will wear off."

It's recast-able, and Trinity, energy plates, and Zenurik all exist. LoS will be just fine. She's still amazing otherwise, and you can still pick Loki or another CC frame for making large groups of enemies completely useless.

Warframe isn't even a hard game to start with, but it's not fun when literally all of the challenge is removed.

Some of the suggestions are very good, but I still think LoS is best, and if reworked then it should have a different effect.

You said this perfectly. +1

[Deviantis]

Mobs need a 50% chance to spawn with Kamina shades. Problem solved.

[TheBrsrkr]

But why should enemies be allowed to do anything? Do you like to die? Do you HATE TENNO!?!?!??!? 

[Kotsender_Quasimir]

1 hour ago, TheBrsrkr said:

But why should enemies be allowed to do anything? Do you like to die? Do you HATE TENNO!?!?!??!? 

lel

[Kotsender_Quasimir]

1 hour ago, TheBrsrkr said:

But why should enemies be allowed to do anything? Do you like to die? Do you HATE TENNO!?!?!??!? 

lel

[Sakatchi]

On 4/9/2016 at 2:26 PM, SortaRandom said:

I think LoS would be cool, but a flat range nerf would be rather boring. I think that the range should stay as is for both Blind and Prism.

 

The real issue here isn't that the blind duration or range is too long-- it's that enemies are completely helpless when they can't see their target.

Enemies need to react more intelligently to targets that they can't see: they should shoot blindly at noises (already in the game, but needs improvement); they should shoot blindly/toss grenades at the source of the Blind if they don't hear anything during the initial stun; they should attack blindly in the direction of things that damage them; etc.. Fighting enemies that can't see you should rely heavily on being careful not to give away your position. Whether we're playing as Excal/Mirage or Loki/Ash/Ivara/anything-with-Naramon, we shouldn't be able to hit a button and then stand right in front of an enemy, shooting it in the face repeatedly, with no repercussions. We should instead focus on staying one step ahead of the enemy to maximize the ability's effectiveness.

These AI changes should make blinding and invisibility more intuitive and less godly for the player, while keeping things fair and accomplishing what blinding and invisibility is conceptually expected to do.

Huh, I actually like this idea. Why hasn't it happened yet?

[Sold0ut]

I kinda almost want to add Sound Quake to this list. Perma stun without any real problem thanks to instant energy regains... oh well.

 

I still like my nullifiers.