Dedicated Servers

[What_is_your_ip]

I know this game pulls in lots of money. Why no dedicated servers?

You trying to line you're pockets with money?

 

If you like i can give you some links. Just google Dedicated Servers BOOM 100's of websites come up.

 

This Person 2 Person is dumb the only time i see this is when you are torrenting.

 

Warframe on the PS4 going to be P2P? No one will play this game if it is. Do to the lag of the host.

[MetalGerbil]

how do you know that?

seriously how did you come by such information? they has mad monies? we arent getting content all the time? free content is produced for free now? they just sitting on piles of money now?

dont assume. it would be nice if we could get it but that stuff isnt free. its not like flipping a switch and most games have super expensive multi-year contracts for 3rd parties to do it. its that expensive.

[KindCollusion]

You make a very good point, it might even cost less at the end of the day. the problem is they will have to give up control and i doubt they are willing to do that. So years down the line this game might end up like MW2 or ME3 with no one willing to play and match making usless

[Masterchops]

I seriously agree with him, we really DO need Dedicated servers. Say you have a bunch of people in your clan that have Void keys or are needing help witha mission but you don't really wanna join because you know that they have kinda crappy internet and DONT wanna lag.

 

To avoid this DE's need to implament DServers. Yes, they might go down for maintenance but it would improve a lot of players in game experience and enjoyment. Just sayin'.

[Masterchops]

how do you know that?

seriously how did you come by such information? they has mad monies? we arent getting content all the time? free content is produced for free now? they just sitting on piles of money now?

dont assume. it would be nice if we could get it but that stuff isnt free. its not like flipping a switch and most games have super expensive multi-year contracts for 3rd parties to do it. its that expensive.

They already said in one of the livestreams that they didn't think that they would make this much money from this game.

Edited June 13, 2013 by Masterchops

[What_is_your_ip]

how do you know that?

seriously how did you come by such information? they has mad monies? we arent getting content all the time? free content is produced for free now? they just sitting on piles of money now?

dont assume. it would be nice if we could get it but that stuff isnt free. its not like flipping a switch and most games have super expensive multi-year contracts for 3rd parties to do it. its that expensive.

 

Let me be you're host. You will wish there was a Dserver. lol

[SunBlade_ger]

Let me be you're host. You will wish there was a Dserver. lol

Yea, when i host and more then one player joins, all scream beacause of lagg.

8K upstream is not enough to host.

 

i'm renting a Linux VServer, so a dserver would help me and my clan.

even a simpke relay server would improve my situation a lot.

[shut]

Wait, this game is P2P? I was NOT aware of that. Especially considering that I host missions all the time with no lag to any party members, and I join other peoples' parties all the time with no lag.

 

To elaborate, I can't even host a 2-party battle in Vindictus (another P2P-based game on a much more primitive engine) without having both of us teleporting backwards every half-second, even if it's my next-door neighbor.

Edited June 14, 2013 by SortaRandom

[Sorana]

I know I am not the only one with problems regarding not seeing people online exc.....

 

Yes I have tried everything and had warframe support to help.

Yes I have opened all my ports, toggled p2p.

Yes I have tried 6 ways to sunday setting up DMZ, proxies, and everything else I could think of.

 

Its a known bug and dedicated servers would help solve it, but because it would be an expensive choice I have another Idea.

 

Get a few servers and use them for a new party system and allow it to choose the host with the best ping.  This way we can all see eachother online no matter what our personal network issues are and it can help with the lag issue when bad hosts...well host

 

IE if the host has a high ping with other party member with low ping have the server take it over switch hosts give it back.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Sorana

[Cpl_Facehugger]

I know this game pulls in lots of money. Why no dedicated servers?

Because while the game does (hopefully) pull in a fair amount of money, it probably doesn't pull in enough to offset the absolutely massive cost that dedicated servers entails.

Warframe on the PS4 going to be P2P? No one will play this game if it is. Do to the lag of the host.

Just like nobody on PS3 or 360 played Mass Effect 3's multiplayer, right?

Wait, this game is P2P? I was NOT aware of that. Especially considering that I host missions all the time with no lag to any party members, and I join other peoples' parties all the time with no lag.

It's not. It's still a standard server-client model, it just has one player act as the hosting server.

[iamah]

Maybe this is part of why mixing PS4 and PC players is not guaranteed yet: Sony may want to provide it's users with dedicated servers otherwise the game will sometimes degrade into an unplayable experience, which happens quite often in PC matches.

 

Heck, looting items is more often than not a painful experience, due to items flying in slow motion. I can't imagine Sony allowing this kind of inconsistency pass down to the users.

Edited June 15, 2013 by iamah

[NuSpirit]

Yeah, agree too, there should be option to "P2P", "P2P"+DS and DS only, because lately even with my 100 Mbps optic and fast enough PC I am lagging when someone else is hosting (and ping limit is set to 150 from default 300). Nothing against some people, but hell if your net is slow as hell or your PC can sometimes remember Bill Clinton as president, you shouldnt be hosting gane!

 

(P2P - client hosting)

[Cryp2Nite]

+1

 

I've never experienced such bad latency/lag problems through a whole game away.

Maybe 1 of 10 matches i play runs fine. At least 7 of 10 matches are significantly delayed or really unplayable.

Ping limit seems to have very limited influence on this.

 

I have a 20Mbit down, 2Mbit upstream connection. The latency (for example) to New York is about 70 milliseconds,

from Germany/Europe. My connection is good enough to play for any other game without problems.

 

I really hope this isn't the final version of the netcode, or connection architecture.

[shut]

It's not. It's still a standard server-client model, it just has one player act as the hosting server.

 

That's how the Vindictus system works too, so I'm quite confused by the shocking difference between the two games. I'm honestly finding it rather difficult to believe that this game is P2P, considering how smooth the connection always is, no matter who hosts or how many players are in the run. XD

[Ced23Ric]

Currently, no dedicated servers are planned and will more than likely not follow in the future, either. That is a semi-frim "No." on dedicated servers from DE's side. Nevertheless, DE has not ruled out the possibility of "fanservers", as in, a dedicated server kit people can install and run themselves. This, however, is just an idea and there is no guarantee. All I got for now, folks.

[mogamu]

My void keys are useless because for some reason I cant host a game...and Im not looking forward to solo'ing a T3 lol.

[BiancaRoughfin]

First of, game is still beta so dedicated servers are more then out of question.

Second, Dedicated Servers opens the possibility for Pirate Servers wich brings no funding for the game development and opens doors to possible exploits of game`s backdoors for hackers.

Third, by playing on the Official server, developers can better keep track of what needs changes/fixes to work on updates.

[-Eliminator-one-]

i want dedicated servers for clan dojo... tired of lags

[TennoSkoom]

Moneywise P2P Is better, both in the short and long-term. Period.

That said, DE's constantly improving their netcode, and that's a good thing- personally i don't see a need to migrate to dedicated servers, which for an indipendant developer are quite costly. Sure, DE's made heaps of money, and will more than likely make heaps more- but i'd rather the dev time be spent fixing current problems and optimizing the p2p network code.

As an indie dev, they needed some serious hardware upgrades just to keep the accounts database servers running decently (I still remember many growing pains from open beta's initial release just a few months ago) and not to mention the stats server taking a dive.

 

Think for a moment, do you really want your game-server going offline in the middle of a mission because it can't handle the hundreds pr even thousands of concurrent connections coming in alongside the traffic they generate from actual missions? Hell the chat servers are regional and they've have had so many issues.

 

At this point- even if there were dedicated servers in each region, i think the sheer amount of traffic would cause more problems than it's worth. And I say this as someone that's managed 40+ public TF2 servers for a Brittish GSP (and that's not including PC Magazine's TF2 server or my personal servers) Dedicated is not always the best route- especially for smaller indi devs who don't have the infrastructure and resources to support it.

 

If you have trouble hosting one mission imagine what a server will have to have to host hundreds at a time? Sorry, I can't support OP's request, seems like a waste of time that could be better spent fixing things including but not limited to the existing p2p netcode.

[Kamal965]

Uuuuhuh.

 

I have 512kbps internet, and I don't lag at all when in a game, whether it's with my clan mate from Austria or the US. The only real time I lag is with hosts that have crap internet (like me).

 

Really now, this game may be popular, but it doesn't mean it's racking in the cash. There's no way DE can support dedicated servers at the moment.

[SunBlade_ger]

dedicated servers are not necessary to improve player experience.

mass effect 3 has demonstrated, that every gamer pc and playstation has enough calculating power to host a game session.
but ea is kind enough to host relay servers, with this they remove the need to forward ports.
unfortunately those relay servers have not enough processing power to make use of me3's encryption, so the game host needs to send update packets for each player separately.

i don't know how its like in the rest of the world, but the situation in germany is as follows:
- almost every pc gamer has a ton of processing power and a poor internet connection at home.
- most people have enough money to rent a linux v-server with poor processing power and a few terabyte traffic free per month.

my suggestion for DE:
build a simple and lightweight relay server executable. that exe just needs to be linux 64/32bit compatible (if you stick to ansi-c, compatibility is assured for most distributions). you don't need to make init-scripts, installer, or whatever, i am sure the community will take care of that.
with minor code changes that exe should also be windows compatible. that would be a win-win situation. every player could decide to host his own relay. you could either include the relay code into warframe or run the relay as sub-process. everyone willing to host a relay on his linux box, decreases traffic on DE servers. and relays would be scattered all over the world (nearly everyone would have a relay in his "neighborhood").

as long as i can configure the relay, that it runs only a limited number of sessions, and me and my friends have reserved "slots", that relay would run indefinitely on my linux box.



pro/con list:

relay pro:
- no game code required => makes reverse engineering useless
- many people may set up a relay => relays all over the world
relay con:
- separate program => increased maintenance
- only sufficient processing power to copy update packets => game encryption needs to be changed

dserver pro:
- permanent game session => clients can disconnect and reconnect at will (without host migration)
dserver con:
- most game code required => reverse engineers might copy warframe
- sufficient processing power required on servers => server cost exceeds most peoples budged

current system pro:
- one exe for everything => reduced maintenance
- processing power and internet bandwidth forced upon gamers => reduced costs
current system con:
- hosting player needs stable and fast internet connection (can not be fixed) => player complain about "laggy" servers
- broken upnp detection (needs fixing) => players getting frustrated
- broken nat detection (needs fixing) => players getting frustrated
- broken port forwarding detection (needs fixing) => players getting frustrated
- frustrated players => reduced income

[Oz270]

While I don't have a serious problem with P2P (I run warframes via an Iphone hotspot) dedicated servers would be nice for the Dojo, sick of host migrations when i'm in the dojo or dueling somebody..

 

[TennoSkoom]

While I don't have a serious problem with P2P (I run warframes via an Iphone hotspot) dedicated servers would be nice for the Dojo, sick of host migrations when i'm in the dojo or dueling somebody..

your clan can alleviate this by having one person with a decent internet connection and machine stick an account in the dojo and just have it sit there the whole time. There you go, a dedicated p2p dojo host.