Really DE? we are talking about how we hate nullifiers and you just... BUFF THEM? REALLY?

[grimdraken]

They are not mutually exclusive points.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, grimdraken said:

They are not mutually exclusive points.

They are Mutually exclusive points... Nullifiers are 1 point, and the spawn rate/system is another. People hate nullifiers because they cant kill them as easy... thats a very weak reason. The Spawn system on the other hand does indeed have some problems.

[grimdraken]

And the spawn system of what, pray tell, is an issue here?

Edited July 10, 2016 by grimdraken

[Xzorn]

Typical Nullifier Retorts:

 

1) They're there to stop mindless 4 spam.

4 spam is a joke. Only people who hung out on the star map would think otherwise.

2) Working as intended they do what they're supposed to do.

I don't see the letters DE in front of anyone's name who says this. There's also more than one reason for an action. To think otherwise is kinda foolish. Even if a Dev said to me personally "This is what they're for" I would look at other repercussion.

_______________________________________________

From my perspective Nullifiers were added in an attempt to kick players out of high level Void missions by creating an unfair situation countering CC meta. I think this belief has recently been reinforced to the fact there is now no longer high level Prime farms.

Of course this CC meta wouldn't exist if enemy damage scaling was reasonable. If they had caped enemy damage and gone with other global or ability additions to create difficulty they could tone down CC and then there would be a reason to have Tanks and Healers in this game.

Instead we have Nullifiers dropping from the sky on our heads. Removing any frame preference in addition to their Rate of Fire problem. I now just run with a high innate eHP frame with high RoF weapons, usually Ignis & Akstilleto. My build doesn't matter, my damage type doesn't matter, my abilities don't matter and my buffs or team synergy don't matter.

Great design.....

 

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, grimdraken said:

And the spawn system of what, pray tell, is the issue here?

Enemies should be spawned on a teir system... Teir 1: Lancers, Shield Drones, Crewmen, Teir 2: Moa's, Heavy Gunners, Ancients, Teir 3: Nullifiers and Bombards...

For every 1 T3 unit, there should be 3 T2 and 6 T3... While limiting the max number of enemies spawned within the level. The end resuslt is a more evenly distribution of enemies. You problem is not with nullifiers... sure you may dislike them (most likely because of the same weak reason everyone else has) but the problem is not them.

[grimdraken]

Oh wow, Ad hominem, nice.  :)

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, Xzorn said:

 

From my perspective Nullifiers were added in an attempt to kick players out of high level Void missions by creating an unfair situation countering CC meta. I think this belief has recently been reinforced to the fact there is now no longer high level Prime farms.

 

And yet they are still easier to kill than every other enemy in the void.... 

[grimdraken]

Not true.  Not for a bow and bronco wielding Ivara, as a single example.

[Xzorn]

2 minutes ago, PureIcarus said:

And yet they are still easier to kill than every other enemy in the void.... 

 

Its not them you have to worry about.

 

An Un-CCed  Heavy Gunner will kill you before you drop the bubble and try that slide crap you'll be dead before you even get inside the bubble.

It's because of enemy damage scaling.

[Averath]

9 minutes ago, PureIcarus said:

They are Mutually exclusive points... Nullifiers are 1 point, and the spawn rate/system is another. People hate nullifiers because they cant kill them as easy... thats a very weak reason. The Spawn system on the other hand does indeed have some problems.

That is not true by a long shot. I can kill Nullifiers easily. 3 button clicks with my R. Ballistica and Nullifiers are toast. They are absolutely **no** threat to me at all. However, they are **frustrating as hell** to deal with because of how they're designed. If you make even the slightest mistake, Nullifiers punish you like Thor smacking a mortal with his hammer at full strength. A Nullifier can instantly kill Valkyr if it gets too close to her with over 2k damage stored in Hysteria. That should be a problem. Nothing should instantly kill you, but DE loves that sort of design because it makes it feel like difficulty.

 

If you want to fix Nullifiers, make their bubbles absorb all damage, and no longer shrink. This means that you have to go **inside** a Nullifier's bubble to kill them. When you go inside a Nullifier's bubble, all of your powers are disabled, including active powers. However, when you **exit** the Nullifier's bubble, all of your powers are restored to where they left off. Now they're a major threat, because they're a defensive shield for their allies, but they're not as **frustrating** to deal with because of their ability to render warframes with duration worthless.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

3 minutes ago, grimdraken said:

Not true.  Not for a bow and bronco wielding Ivara, as a single example.

Let me give you a few important facts that people seem to ignore.... 

1. Enemy projectiles fired from the outside of the bubble do not pass through the bubble.

2. Nullifiers have the lowest hp/shield pool out of every enemy in the void (barring crewmen and lancers in some cases)

3. Their Weapons have travel time and are not that accurate

4. They are BRIGHT GLOWING STARS... pretty hard to miss.

5. They are not immune to CC, enemies around them hit by confuse or radiation will attack the nullifier.

6. High Firerate weapons are actually less effective against the shield than a medium fire rate weapon, as the damage is delayed slightly so extra bullets will actually be wasted.

7. Enemies will actually move towards the nullifier setting up very easy kill zones...

In the end, Nullifiers are a very functional enemy that works rather well... The problem people have is that they cant just 1 shot them from all the way across the room. The spawn system on the other hand is very broken, if you wanna change something (which will reduce the number of nullifier spawns) point that out.

[grimdraken]

So, in your words, too many nullifiers are a bad thing?

 

But don't you love them?

[DaisyHead]

This just in. the nullifiers got nerfed. that mean they'll what pureicarus said they're supposed to be doing

Edited July 10, 2016 by DaisyHead

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, grimdraken said:

So, in your words, too many nullifiers are a bad thing?

 

But don't you love them?

Too many of anything is a problem, it takes away from lore, from balance, from variability... Thats why i hate Eximus Stronghold infested sorties... WAY too many parasitic... do i hate parasitics for it? no... i hate that they have a 90% chance to spawn due to the number/type of enemy spawn rates in warfarme.

 

I do love how nullifiers work, its something you don't see much in video games, an enemy that changes up the situation when they arrive. If it wasn't for nullifiers, what would you be doing? Spraying bullets and powers in every direction 1 shotting everything, nothing changes... just repetitiveness all day, every day.

[DaisyHead]

1 minute ago, PureIcarus said:

Too many of anything is a problem, it takes away from lore, from balance, from variability... Thats why i hate Eximus Stronghold infested sorties... WAY too many parasitic... do i hate parasitics for it? no... i hate that they have a 90% chance to spawn due to the number/type of enemy spawn rates in warfarme.

 

I do love how nullifiers work, its something you don't see much in video games, an enemy that changes up the situation when they arrive. If it wasn't for nullifiers, what would you be doing? Spraying bullets and powers in every direction 1 shotting everything, nothing changes... just repetitiveness all day, every day.

there's is not a single person disagreeing with your opinion on nullifiers. 

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, DaisyHead said:

there's is not a single person disagreeing with your opinion on nullifiers. 

Doesn't sound like it... everyone is adamant that nullifiers are the problem, when in reality it is the spawn system people are having an issue with.

[DiosGX]

So there's like a thousand nullifiers per void tear, and they're still not a problem for me.

 

What are you people doing?

[DaisyHead]

They become the problem because of the spawn. Now go onto the hotfix thread and the devs literally just fixed what this thread is about.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

1 minute ago, DaisyHead said:

They become the problem because of the spawn. Now go onto the hotfix thread and the devs literally just fixed what this thread is about.

Sorry to burst your bubble (No pun intended)

- Reduced the sound effect volume of enemy spawns from Void Fissures.

They nerfed the sound volume, not the volume of spawns.

[DaisyHead]

i'm looking at the text ingame, it's talking about the nullifiers

 

[grimdraken]

Might pay you to read.  It's there in black and white.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, DaisyHead said:

i'm looking at the text ingame, it's talking about the nullifiers

 

Just now, grimdraken said:

Might pay you to read.  It's there in black and white.

Im not in game, im on the forums while watching youtube and playing GTA online.

 

 

[grimdraken]

Here, let me help you:

 

 

[Kaiser_Suoh]

1 minute ago, DaisyHead said:

They become the problem because of the spawn. Now go onto the hotfix thread and the devs literally just fixed what this thread is about.

Hotfix:

• Fixed progression blocker due to ramp refusing to budge in Second Dream quest mission
• Reduced the number of Nullifier and Bombard units spawned during Void Fissure sealing process

 

Because they still destroy Snow Globes, because they still can reflect powers, because "Glaive explosion trick" dont kill them anymore... is enough for you?

And because still dont fix the shotgun/sniper problem too, i guess.

[Aquasurge]

i think these nullifier changes are garbage. i would prefer nullies to act more like stalker's dispel or just replace them with combas entierly