Should Oberon Be Reworked?

[Epsik-kun]

1 minute ago, DxAdder said:

Well since most thought his new passive was great and were willing to accept that, I don't think a re-work is needed.

 

Oi oi, go easier on him.

[(PSN)CommanderC2121]

Can we just all agree he needs a new passive?

 

honestly, how many times have you thought "man, im over run. I could really use the help of a skate (or any other animal) right about now..."

and even then, it only works for 15 seconds!

[felixsylvaris]

Something to think about:

Hallowed Ground armour buff isnt useful. If we play squishy frame it dosnt help since our armour is minimal anyway. If we play hard frame, we probably have steel fiber already, and change from 420 to 480 isny that significant. Futhermore we already had healing in Renewal and reckoning, so we have healing in 3 different skills and all of them are still worse than Blessing. 

Maybe instead Hallowed Ground should imbue allies with nature wrath (or something) giving damage bonus. At least it will be something different, and there is never enought dps buffs.

[cookieknife]

On 7/18/2016 at 10:56 AM, PickleMonster21 said:

I've had 3 and a half years to play around with Frames. I'm confident I know how they all work. All except Saryn, which I never cared to learn after the rework.

But since Saryn is the only one you're bothering to correct me on, I'm assuming Saryn's the only one that  you can prove me wrong against? Either way, I think Oberon is fine where he is. I've seen the numbers (thanks to the Warframe Wiki) and I know that each of these Frames I've listed are more than just Damage Dealers. Like Excal can use Blind to get out of situations, or to melee enemies for extra melee damage, or that Rhino has Roar to buff allies, or that Mag can use Magnetize as deployable cover while still soaking damage to a single target to explode it all out after the duration, or that Nezha exists,

And then I believe I went on to show that Oberon can also Heal and CC (as well as deal damage)

 

Just a side note, I don't understand why people can't grasp the fact that Oberon isn't supposed to excel at anything. I'm not saying he's strong in every aspect. I'm simply saying he does what he's supposed to, well.
If he was on par with how Trinity heals, we wouldn't need to use Trinity.
If he was on par with the best damage dealer, we wouldn't need them.
If he was on par with Nyx for Crowd Control, we wouldn't need a Nyx.
Oberon is supposed to be average at all these things, which he is. And if you think he needs as buff for End Game content, he doesn't, because if you can't utilize him to his fullest in End Game, then that's on you. Oberon is supposed to be average in every class, whether it be Damage Dealing, Support, Crowd Control, Tank, he's supposed to be average. Not great in all aspects. Only average. Because if he was great in all aspects, Oberon would simply be overpowered as hell.

you still aren't listening to anyone in this thread. no one said HE HAS TO BE JUST AS GOOD but he has to be competeable. yes he can damage and heal and do a lot of stuff but he does not do it well enought to be a working functioning member of a team., his powers need more to make him better.

[cookieknife]

On 7/18/2016 at 8:26 AM, (PS4)bonateIIo said:

Those discussions always puzzle me, just like always it was not specified what level we are talking about. are we talking about lvl 40 or lvl 100?

id say if you cant do decent against level 70 void enemies then you need to be buffed or reworked. (i dont mean kill them with your powers but if you cant really use your powers to survive and get an advantage over level 70 enemies. like i said you need a little fix)

[cookieknife]

On 7/18/2016 at 1:40 PM, felixsylvaris said:

Something to think about:

Hallowed Ground armour buff isnt useful. If we play squishy frame it dosnt help since our armour is minimal anyway. If we play hard frame, we probably have steel fiber already, and change from 420 to 480 isny that significant. Futhermore we already had healing in Renewal and reckoning, so we have healing in 3 different skills and all of them are still worse than Blessing. 

Maybe instead Hallowed Ground should imbue allies with nature wrath (or something) giving damage bonus. At least it will be something different, and there is never enought dps buffs.

i totally agree with you, except on the hallowed ground damage bonus, yeah it would be cool but DE would never do it with his radiation damage buff augment for his first ability :/ id like it to slow enemies down and strip their armor or something like that, maybe do a bleed proc that only works when they're standing on it? idk, it sorta looks like it would do either of those 

i think he needs higher base armor and his hallowed ground needs to be 20% bigger or it needs to be a radial aura around him with a bigger armor buff, or something close to that

[jfhsanseiIII]

Yes. I'd like to see his abilities better match his theme and work better together like newer/recently reworked frames.  If hallowed ground could be a toggle me ability that allowed renewal and reckoning to work differently. That might be kind of cool.  Renewal could heal if it's on or status with ___ effect when off.  And reckoning could buff teammates' ___ when on or wrap enemies in roots rendering them immobile for a time killing them in roots would release a health orb. Imagine if hallowed ground popped up like some kind of energy tree that pushed out an aura on the ground around it. It could still maintain his support role but allow him to be more flexible for team needs or solo play.  

[cookieknife]

40 minutes ago, jfhsanseiIII said:

Yes. I'd like to see his abilities better match his theme and work better together like newer/recently reworked frames.  If hallowed ground could be a toggle me ability that allowed renewal and reckoning to work differently. That might be kind of cool.  Renewal could heal if it's on or status with ___ effect when off.  And reckoning could buff teammates' ___ when on or wrap enemies in roots rendering them immobile for a time killing them in roots would release a health orb. Imagine if hallowed ground popped up like some kind of energy tree that pushed out an aura on the ground around it. It could still maintain his support role but allow him to be more flexible for team needs or solo play.  

id like his second and fourth to do different stuff or atleast function better together, same with his first, i think his first is perfect but if they add a synergy element between the three or atleast radiation procs. that would be great

[felixsylvaris]

1 hour ago, cookieknife said:

i totally agree with you, except on the hallowed ground damage bonus, yeah it would be cool but DE would never do it with his radiation damage buff augment for his first ability :/ id like it to slow enemies down and strip their armor or something like that, maybe do a bleed proc that only works when they're standing on it? idk, it sorta looks like it would do either of those 

i think he needs higher base armor and his hallowed ground needs to be 20% bigger or it needs to be a radial aura around him with a bigger armor buff, or something close to that

Yes, dont have to be damage buff, could be debuff. Strip armour is always good. The point is that armopur buff is generally insignificant. Even Equinox damage reduction is more useful, since it is less target dependant. Other aproach would be fixed value of armour. Like 100 flat add (which we can pimp with mods) So at least quishies will get something.

Hallowed ground being place it ability is ok. We have some modes which support it: MD, D, Surv, Inter, Exc. And there are frames with place abilities Frost, Hydroid, Vauban, Ivara,,, and they see the play. It just need to be the size of Ice Wave (frost) so we can catch enemy outside some very specific corridor maps.

Other thing which does not work: Phoenix Reneval works best when duration is long, but Renevals is shorter the longer duration we have. So the better Reneval is the worse Phoenix is. Shorter time to save ally. Solution: Make it healing per tick. WHich we can prolong with another cast. Or tap again to second spike.healing. Or change phoenix so it will auto revive bleeding allies.

 

Edited July 20, 2016 by felixsylvaris

[cookieknife]

6 minutes ago, felixsylvaris said:

Yes, dont have to be damage buff, could be debuff. Strip armour is always good. The point is that armopur buff is generally insignificant. Even Equinox damage reduction is more useful, since it is less target dependant. Other aproach would be fixed value of armour. Like 100 flat add (which we can pimp with mods) So at least quishies will get something.

Hallowed ground being place it ability is ok. We have some modes which support it: MD, D, Surv, Inter, Exc. And there are frames with place abilities Frost, Hydroid, Vauban, Ivara,,, and they see the play. It just need to be the size of Ice Wave (frost) so we can catch enemy outside some very specific corridor maps.

Other thing which does not work: Phoenix Reneval works best when duration is long, but Renevals is shorter the longer duration we have. So the better Reneval is the worse Phoenix is. Shorter time to save ally. Solution: Make it healing per tick. WHich we can prolong with another cast. Or tap again to second spike.healing. Or change phoenix so it will auto revive bleeding allies.

 

see the thing with hydroid or ivara or vauban is, all of their place down abilities are large radius (depending on  how you mod of course but large at base) and have CC

hallowed ground only has small damage to enemies.... its not enough especially when theres nothing keeping them on it

[SilvaDreams]

12 minutes ago, cookieknife said:

see the thing with hydroid or ivara or vauban is, all of their place down abilities are large radius (depending on  how you mod of course but large at base) and have CC

hallowed ground only has small damage to enemies.... its not enough especially when theres nothing keeping them on it

True Oberon needs some QoL tweaks, not so much a full rework as he was introduced back when the level cap for enemies was 30 so his damage doesn't scale past 45 very well.

I run a smite/reckoning spam build and don't get me wrong my Oberon can floor a room full of lvl 60s in seconds but it requires me using reckoning like 4 times in a row if not more and I've had to give up survivability to do so.

But can he still heal? Yup he'll top off all but a max vitality Inaros , his Hallowed ground while massive is short lived  but is still good enough for process cleansing and protection.

[cookieknife]

4 minutes ago, SilvaDreams said:

True Oberon needs some QoL tweaks, not so much a full rework as he was introduced back when the level cap for enemies was 30 so his damage doesn't scale past 45 very well.

I run a smite/reckoning spam build and don't get me wrong my Oberon can floor a room full of lvl 60s in seconds but it requires me using reckoning like 4 times in a row if not more and I've had to give up survivability to do so.

But can he still heal? Yup he'll top off all but a max vitality Inaros , his Hallowed ground while massive is short lived  but is still good enough for process cleansing and protection.

hallowed ground is small at base, if you cant fit in 2 range mods you'll have a small one,,,, and i never said he couldnt heal , its just he cant compare to trinity, or inaros, or even limbo's heal augment or hydroid's

[felixsylvaris]

24 minutes ago, cookieknife said:

see the thing with hydroid or ivara or vauban is, all of their place down abilities are large radius (depending on  how you mod of course but large at base) and have CC

hallowed ground only has small damage to enemies.... its not enough especially when theres nothing keeping them on it

I totally agree. This is why i mentioned Frosts Ice Wave. Which have size of 3+/20m (cone shape) and it is sometimes useful.

If we translate it to Oberon would be 5m/15m base.

Even Embers RIng of Fire is twice as big (since circle). So it would be 4/12m

Current size does not match map size.

 

Debuffs, and slow are always useful, even more on placed abilities, since that allow grouping enemies for some other abilities - Smite.

But to be clear: passive, Hallowed Ground, Reneval need buff/rework. But Smite and Reckoning are more or less ok.

Edited July 20, 2016 by felixsylvaris

[SilvaDreams]

2 minutes ago, cookieknife said:

hallowed ground is small at base, if you cant fit in 2 range mods you'll have a small one,,,, and i never said he couldnt heal , its just he cant compare to trinity, or inaros, or even limbo's heal augment or hydroid's

He does just fine healing but he's not a healer like Trinity or Inaros, he is a support type.

He causes mass rad procs and completely negates all procs, something no other frame can do effectively.

[cookieknife]

2 minutes ago, felixsylvaris said:

I totally agree. This is why i mentioned Frosts Ice Wave. Which have size of 3+/20m (cone shape) and it is sometimes useful.

If we translate it to Oberon would be 5m/15m base.

Even Embers RIng of Fire is twice as big (since circle). So it would be 4/12m

Current size does not match map size.

 

Debuffs, and slow are always useful, even more on placed abilities, since that allow grouping enemies for some other abilities - Smite.

id like a coneshape or atleast it be twice as wide.. its really small at base is my problem and without a little breathing room (or spamming the crap outa it) you're a sitting duck, and it also doesnt even really give enough of an armor buff to make a difference, like i said before it only gives 20% armor, oberon has 150 at base, valkyr has 600 at base and hers gives 50% armor (and gives melee speed and enemy armor debuffs) and chroma's im not getting into too much but he has 350 armor and his buff gives him 350% and if you use ice you get another 150% so a total of 500% armor at base,,, while oberons been dead for minutes chroma has a chance, same with valkyr. the armor scale that oberon has makes no difference at all honestly. it cant stack so,,, whats the point of even using the ability? sure theres status immunity but you can use renewal which i really like, (it needs tweaked) and your status proc is gone .. so hallowed ground is pretty useless imo,, if it was bigger cone shaped like you said or even an aura i would love it... 

[cookieknife]

3 minutes ago, SilvaDreams said:

He does just fine healing but he's not a healer like Trinity or Inaros, he is a support type.

He causes mass rad procs and completely negates all procs, something no other frame can do effectively.

yeah getting rid of procs is a plus but they arent that common that you would need him.. everything he does needs to be buffed and changed around... hes not in a good place

[SilvaDreams]

4 minutes ago, cookieknife said:

yeah getting rid of procs is a plus but they arent that common that you would need him.. everything he does needs to be buffed and changed around... hes not in a good place

Not sure where you play... But procs happen a lot.

During a radiation hazard sortie he is virtually irreplaceable unless everyone goes hallway warrior.

Like I said he needs some QoL tweaks more than the one he got that sped up his healing ability recently.

[cookieknife]

Just now, SilvaDreams said:

Not sure where you play... But procs happen a lot.

During a radiation hazard sortie he is virtually irreplaceable unless everyone goes hallway warrior.

Like I said he needs some QoL tweaks more than the one he got that sped up his healing ability recently.

i play him everywhere. hallowed ground isnt that useful just because if theres a crowd of enemies near or even one, that 20% armor buff wont help, even if you have power strength at 200% its still only 40%, and yes the status is useful in only some situations,,,, it still isnt a good ability

[PickleMonster21]

5 hours ago, cookieknife said:

you still aren't listening to anyone in this thread. no one said HE HAS TO BE JUST AS GOOD but he has to be competeable. yes he can damage and heal and do a lot of stuff but he does not do it well enought to be a working functioning member of a team., his powers need more to make him better.

I've heard. I simply just don't agree. I think he's in a good spot and I'll leave it at that.

[cookieknife]

Just now, PickleMonster21 said:

I've heard. I simply just don't agree. I think he's in a good spot and I'll leave it at that.

and ill leave it at, he's in the most need of a rework out of all of the warframes in the game, its been that way for 2 years.