Real Cover System for mobs

[asparon]

Hi all,

Posting here wondering about how the actual cover system is doing now.

Its not really clear and it really feels like it could find a better place in the game than the one it actual has.

i remember crouching behind stuffs to avoid bullets, and i can see some mobs doing it from time to time, but as soon as the amount of ennemy is kinda too much taking cover for each of the sides is kinda useless and tenno need to rely on CC linked with powers and same for mobs.

Problem is that the technics used by mobs are more and more getting the fun out of the play.

I'd like to see more mechanics, from both sides, linked to covering mechanics.

Kinds of ideas:

Allowing some grinneer unit to insta-strafe from cover to cover to get at you

Allowing some corpus unit, when then can gather behind cover, can build a tenno power EMP bomb

Allowing some grinneer to move in formation, hiding completely and getting out with a shout at the same time with a charge buff

Allowing some infested to become live invisible mines, if stayed hidden long enough behind covers.

Allowing some infested unit to plant themself on the ceiling, tongue down, rdy to grab unaware tennos (half life style)

Already have some grinneer unit building a cover, make em have turrets or aura on higher level

With warframe powers linked with cover, u can deal with entirely new mechanism for all endless missions u can allow frames to link their power to the cover their using, build new kinds of cover.

In some games u have an toggle button to be actively taking cover when on, that could be an idea.

In capture missions, instead of outbuffing ridiculously the target, being now abusrd and lore-unfriendly, make a whole squad, entranched behind traps and ennemies behind covers. Kinda spy style mission, but with only one vault, not for securing data or emprisonning a tenno (rescue) but more like a little headquarter/fortress for the dude and his lieutenant, knowing he is a target but not knowing when and how the tenno will come for him. This gives many new possibilities in awards, since u can stealth it, kill the lieutenants, disarm traps, etc...

Sorry for my bad english, hope u understood where i am getting at, need you all to help me brainstorm this stuff. Since i don't really know how exactly the cover system is right now.

Edited July 25, 2016 by asparon

[artemisfortune]

DE already said no to a cover system, as it's counter-productive to the direction of gameplay they are pursuing.

As for enemies, they're AI is constantly evolving. You should have seen 3 years ago. I like some of these ideas, but they seem kind of pointless when most enemies die immediately.

Edited July 25, 2016 by JSharpie

[asparon]

Yeah but there is actually a cover system.^^ we can all see grinneers hide and we all use cover from walls and such from time to time.

When the enemy sees us or know we 'r there, he will fire, and sometimes at the cover u are using. Whether u want it or not, there is a cover system.

So u say they aim to reduce it? not doing nothing more with?

[motorfirebox]

To be clear, you're talking about an ENEMY cover system, not a cover system for players. You might want to edit your title to reflect that, so people don't get the wrong idea.

I agree that the enemies need to use cover better. One thing I've noticed is that a lot of times Corpus units will take cover around a corner. When you get close, they'll pop out, but they don't fire. I think they're trying to aim at you. What they should do instead is pop out and fire straight ahead, without necessarily aiming—just fire right down the hallway or whatever. That way, they have a chance to actually hit you unless you're dodging.

[LogaMC1995]

1 minute ago, asparon said:

Yeah but there is actually a cover system.^^ we can all see grinneers hide and we all use cover from walls and such from time to time.

When the enemy sees us or know we 'r there, he will fire, and sometimes at the cover u are using. Whether u want it or not, there is a cover system.

So u say they aim to reduce it? not doing nothing more with?

Devs said no cover system for Warframes, only for enemies. I think the first replier didn't read through your post.

[asparon]

one question; if an ennemy sees u, and u get behind cover, will he know u'r behind this particular one, or will he think u'r invisible?

[artemisfortune]

59 minutes ago, asparon said:

one question; if an ennemy sees u, and u get behind cover, will he know u'r behind this particular one, or will he think u'r invisible?

Enemies do track you, yes. Even if you're invisible, they'll shoot at the last known location or at wherever you fired a non-silenced gun.

[LogaMC1995]

Just now, asparon said:

one question; if an ennemy sees u, and u get behind cover, will he know u'r behind this particular one, or will he think u'r invisible?

Yes he'll know you're behind that particular cover. Heck, even they know you're on cover without them seeing you...all with just one alarm.

[PopGligor]

There's already a cover-based Warframe-but-worse and it's called The Division. 

However, I think enemy movement needs to be redone. I'm noticing enemies often "snap" to a new location, instead of moving there. When enemies jump to new places, they often teleport up and it just doesn't look good. Same when I'm solo, so it's not lag. Their movement doesn't look organic, as opposed to how warframes move, which looks and feels right.

[asparon]

57 minutes ago, JSharpie said:

As for enemies, they're AI is constantly evolving. You should have seen 3 years ago. I like some of these ideas, but they seem kind of pointless when most enemies die immediately.

 

I alrdy feel like the wish of the devs are to have those factions feel like armies, from meatbags to bosses. Thing is u can undistinctively kill everything except when they have a a particuliar mechanic (such has power immunity), this adds other way to have lieutenants like nullifiyers to stay and live longers facing tennos andwith other mechanics than simply multyplying par ten the amount of armor, ennemies, nullifiers and suchs.

If some ennemies are considered immune (when behind cover) to area of effects powers damages or psychic ones (distinctivly) or weapons, it lets them build new strategies in the few secs they have before tennos flank them, nullifying at the same time their immunity to psychic, damage or...

If u think about it, and how the ennemies as an army should react strategically to the overwhelming force of tennos, it makes sense;

Most of the time, we seem to catch them by surprise, so they send meatbags so they can build defense. the lower the mission, the slowest and the lowest levels and traps and lieutenants will be spawned to defend the objectives.

We are always, lore-friendly as spaceninjas better rewarded if u quickly stealth a mission. But we can too, if we want to encounter the big bad &#! boss, go make a fuss on an important planet, for big objective, crush methodicaly the defenses in place to force the army to aknowledge our will to fight and send us real challenges.

 

I really loves the turrets, when not aware u get powned by a smal grineer, this kinds of stuff is immersive, u can't just go trough a grinneer barricade without looking at the big turret facing u. But thats too rare.

We have seen assault map on pvp, with different tileset on the same mission; why not implementing them pve, the fastest u complete first tileset the less prepared and aware they are on the second on with lieutenants, and the lesser or highest boss (depending on lore/objective) u get on the third.

U make those lieutenants drop relics, and  those boss drop prime parts; but im dreaming x)

Edited July 25, 2016 by asparon