Killingblow And Pressurepoint Should Be A Single Mod

[CubedOobleck]

Because you cannot contemporarily benefit from KillingBlow and PressurePoint it's inefficient to equip both so players tend to use only one to make room for a different mod.
I think that this is essentially detrimental, because it discourages mixing up regular and charged attacks which makes melee gameplay more stale than it needs to be. This set up also discourages the use of versatile weapons that are ok with both kinds of attacks because they require both mods to truly retain their versatility; unlike specialized weapons that are great with only one kind of attack and only need one of the two mods to buff it's speciality.

It's also a matter of balance: KillingBlow's damage increase doesn't affect elemental damage (unlike every other damage mod) which makes it pointlessly misleading and, of course, PressurePoint simply needs a buff.

 

So we would be better off with a single melee damage mod (about +100% when maxed out?) that affects both regular and charged attacks without any weird elemental incompatibilities.
Players would be more inclined to vary their attack pattern depending on the situation and probably would enjoy melee gameplay a bit more, I know I would.
Better still! Weapons wouldn't need to be rebalanced for this: charged attacks would work as expected with elemental and regular attacks would get the buff they so sorely need.

 

To me, the current set up feels like an unwanted result, an old choice that unexpectedly backfired as the game progressed. After all, if DE thought the division of damage mods was positive then relatively recent bows would also have a specific mod for the charged shots and Serration would only work on the regular ones (I bet the bow users are groaning at the thought of this).

 

PS: 'Charged attack' includes ground finishers and stealth attacks, while 'regular attack' includes the spin attack (and maybe slam attack, not sure).

Edited July 4, 2013 by CubedOobleck

[MetalGerbil]

potatoes make it possible to have both.

forma make it very easy to do as well.

few weps actually benefit enough for having both to..... have both. they are just not designed to make both options viable. you would never use normal hits on a dark sword even if you could have both mods on.

[Mythrex]

I agree.

[Bakim0n0]

And lets make fury and pressure point one mod, and all the elemental damages one mod... and crit chance and crit damage one mod.

Or how about no, there is already plenty of room to use the mods and build them for it.

[Probta16]

No, they shouldn't.

 

It would require a rebalance of all melee weapons, a waste of time.

[Zanukacola]

charge attacks really dont need another reason to be better than normal attacks

[BladeFade]

No, chose one, either specialize into charge attacks or pressure point- normal attacks, both if enough points..

Edited June 30, 2013 by BladeFade

[Mudriski]

DE already knows abt this in the latest stream.They probably gonna do something.

[http404error]

It would require a rebalance of all melee weapons, a valuable use of time that would benefit the game greatly.

Fixed that for ya.

 

=========

 

Melee is getting another look, but I think it needs a slightly different overhaul.

 

I'll make a post about it sometime.

[Greene]

Just no.

[Tatersail]

Remove armor ignore on charge attacks... fixed

 

Also would be nice to remove armor ignore from Kunai, Paris and Boltor

 

REMOVE ARMOR IGNORE FROM THE GAME!!

Edited June 30, 2013 by Tatersail

[CubedOobleck]

potatoes make it possible to have both.

forma make it very easy to do as well.

few weps actually benefit enough for having both to..... have both. they are just not designed to make both options viable. you would never use normal hits on a dark sword even if you could have both mods on.

Potatoes and forma (if you have enough) make it possible, but as more and more worthwhile mods are added to the game the 8 slots simply won't be enough.

And yes the weapons that are versatile are few, perhaps there would be more if it were worthwhile to use them.

 

charge attacks really dont need another reason to be better than normal attacks

I don't follow your logic, how does encouraging the use of both regular and charged attacks make charged attacks stronger? 

 

Remove armor ignore on charge attacks... fixed

 

Also would be nice to remove armor ignore from Kunai, Paris and Boltor

 

REMOVE ARMOR IGNORE FROM THE GAME!!

This is offtopic.

[LasersGoPewPew]

pressure point should be an armor IGNORE mod for melee, and killing blow should be a normal and charge attack weapon damage buff, all melees become effective for endgame and people won't complain about "PP IS UP" because it'll do something extremely effective for its medium % that it gives now.

[MJ12]

No, they shouldn't.

 

It would require a rebalance of all melee weapons, a waste of time.

 

If Killing Blow was just +25% damage a level for both charge and normal attacks, that would rebalance melee weapons significantly. Because right now charge attacks are exceptionally good and regular melee is horrible, unless you use the Dual Ethers, in which case regular melee is merely okay.

Edited July 1, 2013 by MJ12

[Grilleds]

No, they shouldn't.

 

It would require a rebalance of all melee weapons, a waste of time.

This. I'll add that making Pressure Point and Killing Blow the same mod would remove some of the melee balance complexity that the melee weapons are based around. Re-balancing them around this wouldn't just be a waste of them, it would largely kill some of the complexity around the already overly simple melee combat system we have in place.

Sundering Strike already adds almost entirely unmitigated damage to both normal and charge attacks. Use that instead of Killing Blow and Pressure Point if you must.

Also lets not do anything to Killing Blow until Pressure Point is buffed first. Once Pressure Point gets buffed, we can see if normal attack builds on weapons like the Ether Daggers and the Heat Sword work, then decide if Killing Blow needs a tune-up.

---

tl;dr

Lets fix the melee mods that are broken first before messing with the ones that actually do their job right.

[CubedOobleck]

This. I'll add that making Pressure Point and Killing Blow the same mod would remove some of the melee balance complexity that the melee weapons are based around. Re-balancing them around this wouldn't just be a waste of them, it would largely kill some of the complexity around the already overly simple melee combat system we have in place.

Sundering Strike already adds almost entirely unmitigated damage to both normal and charge attacks. Use that instead of Killing Blow and Pressure Point if you must.

Also lets not do anything to Killing Blow until Pressure Point is buffed first. Once Pressure Point gets buffed, we can see if normal attack builds on weapons like the Ether Daggers and the Heat Sword work, then decide if Killing Blow needs a tune-up.

Ok if we really want to talk about balance, well you are right there is some, but it's weird and doesn't follow the format of other damage mods: KillingBlow gives a high damage increase to the charged attacks, but doesn't affect elemental damage, I find this not only misleading, but also insanely dumb when DE can just lower the +X% and then make it affect elementals; then, as you mentioned, PressurePoin simply needs a buff. 

 

So instead of these 2 mods we would be better off with a single that gives around +100% damage when maxed out always affect elemental damage: this wouldn't unbalance charged attacks and would make them more streamlined with the rest of the game while regular attacks would get the buff they so sorely need, so basically weapons wouldn't need to be rebalanced... they would be MORE balanced.

 

I have the strong impression that the current need of 2 different melee mods is just an unwanted result of coding charged and regular attacks differently, some old choice that turned into an annoyance. The current division doesn't add anything positive to melee gameplay, it creates that awkward incompatibility between KillingBlow and elementals and is arguably the cause of the current disparity between regular and charged attacks.

 

Perhaps part of the reason melee combat seems overly simple too you (besides the fact that it is kind of simple), is that you have no incentive whatsoever to mix up regular and charged attacks (because you most likely have only modded one kind).

Edited July 1, 2013 by CubedOobleck

[3XT3RM1NATUS]

Just buff pressure point. I want to see non-charged melee gameplay worth it again.

[3XT3RM1NATUS]

Remove armor ignore on charge attacks... fixed

 

Also would be nice to remove armor ignore from Kunai, Paris and Boltor

 

REMOVE ARMOR IGNORE FROM THE GAME!!

Not sure if trolling or just $&*&*#(%&...

[ZWarhammer]

Pressure point needs to be a 108 or something, normal attacks don't do much damage to begin with, increasing nothing with almost nothing is't gonna do anything. 42% is a joke.

[TheAscendedOne]

I support this. 

[mogamu]

I always thought separating pressure Point and Killing Blow into two different mods was counterproductive..not to mention repetitive and boring

 

+1 this.  They need to be combined.

 

I dont mind Fury and Reflex Coil being different mods, but PP and KB really should be combined.

Edited July 1, 2013 by mogamu

[elindred]

+1

 

But first, they have to meaningfully differentiate charge attacks from melee attacks in a way other than just pure DPS. Melee needs a major change. Otherwise, it doesn't matter how they change melee mods, people will just do whatever does the most DPS, like they're doing now.

[Eldorian]

All the melee weapons and their mods need one big rebalance.  And by rebalance I mean buffs, and maybe a look at the underlying melee system.

[fatpig84]

Change Pressure Point into something else.

Change Killing blow to include normal attacks.

 

I mean this doesn't make sense.

A Dread on full charge and a Dread on "quick fire" still benefits from Serration.

There is no mutual exclusive issue.

[Unibot]

I agree as well.

I like diversity, but having 2 mods 1 for boosting charge attack and other for boosting regular attack doesn't make sense. I'm fine if charge attacks get its own mod, but then pressure poit should boost charge attacks as well, since charge attacks base on regular(at least should be...) but not in this game.

So yeah, they need to be merged.