Ember Warframe

[AlvaroXDM]

Well, before I began this topic, I searched for other topics concerning ember, and, to my surprise, couldn't find any. Not sure if Ember is just overlooked by everyone, it's just me that doesn't play her right or what reason there is for so many post requiring a Frost buff, Nova nerf, etc and none about Ember.

 

Ember is a damage oriented warframe, and so relies basically on offensive skills, I get it. Unfortunately, when the skills are too similar, or to underpowered, they end up being useless. Choosing World on Fire, with way more duration, damage and range, for only 25 more than the weaker Fireblast, which has a not very reliable range is almost not an option, but a must. Fireball, too costly for spamming, too weak to have a niche, also falls down behind A) Firepower B) World on Fire.

 

So, when adressing the problem of Ember skills we can focus on several points:

Is the problem the brutal ulti she has? No, I don't think World on Fire is a problem, yeah, it's a great ultimate, but not so different from all those ulti-nukes around there, and, since it's purely offensive, in a character with little to no utility, I don't see it as overpowered.

 

Is the problem the amount of damage each skill does? Partially, while it is logic that the ulti deals more damage than weaker skills, I think that in the case of Fireball, the problem relies on DPS. Two ticks of Ember's shield deals more damage than an almost single target skill.

 

Is the problem the versatility of Ember skills? Yes, it is. This is what I think is the major issue. It does have sense for all her skills to be damage oriented, but not as single "DPS bursts". See for example Saryn, with contagion, it's a DPS skill, yet it works differently from Embers nukes, or Rhino's DPS buff. Or Frost's Freeze. All of them are offensive oriented, yet they vary, making them all useful. That is what ember lacks.

 

Fireball: It does have the chance to stagger, but it's not a sure thing to do so. I think that if it was used as a stun, or semi stun, it would recover certain utility in a way, without varying too much. It's range could also be increased to 2m, instead of 1.

 

Fireblast: With the same idea (Slams the ground for high damage in a small radius and creates a persistent ring of fire which deals high damage over time.), you could make a fire-wave with a knock-back, ideal for pulling of enemies from you or your teammates, leaving a lingering fire effect for those enemies trying to get back at you.

 

This way, with the Firebolt stun, you could help a teammate being overwhelmed, or just crush that enemy far away. With the Fireblast you could have another option different to the burst of World on Fire, with more utility but far less damage.

 

Have fun and a great day! :)

 

***

So how about this?

Firebrand (25 energy) Gives Embers weapon a +% fire damage for X duration.

Flame burst (50) A targeted ranged AoE fire explosion that hits enemies even on cover.

Igneous charge (75 energy) Ember dashes foward, knocking enemies back and leaving a burning fire trail behind her.

World on Fire (100 E) Same as it is now, but static, won't follow you around, larger area, a little bit longer duration.

 

All of this skills are focused on DPS. Firebrand gives a little boost to damage, not too useful, but a nice extra buff for cheap energy.

Flame burst is your main ranged skill, it is meant to wipe out those enemies on cover, or debilitate that infested wave coming near.

Igneous charge, a mobility skill, useful to run out of danger, when overwhelmed by mobs or maybe set the World on Fire and return to Frost's snowglobe.

World on Fire, it would be loosing it's versatilty, you couldn't run around burning things anymore, yet the better duration and range would still be usefull as Fireblast is on defense misions. Also by using igneous charge you could cast n run for enemies to die while crossing a hallway, bridge, etc.

Edited July 18, 2013 by AlvaroXDM

[krisp]

Ember is being looked at by the devs from what Steve said.

[Hybridon]

Steve said Ember is being reviewed, she was in the list after the last 3 reviewed, Rhino, Mag and Volt :)

 

Edit: Ninja'd, damn =P

Edited July 17, 2013 by Hybridon

[Finch.]

it would be awesome if fireblast ragdolled enemies, probably op, but still awesome

[BIossome]

They should do the same thing that they did with Rhino Ult, combine her 3rd and 4th together. She already slams the ground with her 4th, might as well add fireblast along with it(maybe give it a knockdown/kickback).

 

Her new 3rd can be some type of team buff or a giant meteor slam(idk just tossing ideas out there).

 

I don't know what to do about her 1st to make me use it over my 4th, even if it had a stun. The ultimate CC is death, which is what the 4th does best.

[eltronix]

Maybe she can have a skill where she uses her fire to quickly boost forward or backward so she can quickly get out of trouble.

[Rynax15]

Since ember already is pretty squishy having average shields,hp and running speed with the lowest armor i think we can go a bit out there with the tweaks but not too far. So my suggestions would be:

 

1:fire ball - i was thinking that it should be like a 10m explosion that would leave behind a short lived pool of fire of the same size adding offensive utility

 

2:overheat - fine as is, my favorite skill along with world on fire

 

3:fire blast - i had problems with this skill and didn't come up with something good enough imo. Someone said that the ulti and this should be combined but that would't work too well as wof is a mobile ulti of mass destruction were as fire blast's ring of fire is immobile. I was considering making it a huge self centered explosion (like 30m) having enemies within 15m take regular damage, enemies farther away take reduced damage and enemies 10m away take increased damage. This idea would have the ring of fire gone though since wof does a better job.

 

4:World on fire - my only issue with this (besides the sudden changes with the hotfixes) is that it's affected by armor. this makes wof very weak as enemies get higher in level even ancient infested which is the main faction ember is great against.

[Ddublu]

Her 4th ability basically has a Fireblast in it as it is a persisting aoe around her. I kinda like the idea of adding some sort of knockback to Fireblast. Instead of a ring persisting; it just blasts a ring of fire around her that knocks people back :D.

Instead of Fireball; could give her Flamethrower; that instead of sending off a projectile; just has a short duration blast of fire in a cone.

On a sidenote; do Ember players just max out World on Fire and Overheat and leave Fireball/Fireblast at rank 1?

[AlvaroXDM]

Her 4th ability basically has a Fireblast in it as it is a persisting aoe around her. I kinda like the idea of adding some sort of knockback to Fireblast. Instead of a ring persisting; it just blasts a ring of fire around her that knocks people back :D.

Instead of Fireball; could give her Flamethrower; that instead of sending off a projectile; just has a short duration blast of fire in a cone.

On a sidenote; do Ember players just max out World on Fire and Overheat and leave Fireball/Fireblast at rank 1?

Not sure about the others, I do. Fireball is just usless. Fireblast DOES have some utility on defense misions, but I still prefer only using fireblast.

[AlvaroXDM]

Maybe she can have a skill where she uses her fire to quickly boost forward or backward so she can quickly get out of trouble.

 

Yes, I thought of that, due to how frail she is an escape mechanism would be nice. A fire trail to burn enemies chasing you, and a quick dash. That would be nice. Or a dash that ends up with a fire explosion with AoE.

[TheRA1LGUN]

Since ember already is pretty squishy having average shields,hp and running speed with the lowest armor i think we can go a bit out there with the tweaks but not too far. So my suggestions would be:

 

1:fire ball - i was thinking that it should be like a 10m explosion that would leave behind a short lived pool of fire of the same size adding offensive utility

 

2:overheat - fine as is, my favorite skill along with world on fire

 

3:fire blast - i had problems with this skill and didn't come up with something good enough imo. Someone said that the ulti and this should be combined but that would't work too well as wof is a mobile ulti of mass destruction were as fire blast's ring of fire is immobile. I was considering making it a huge self centered explosion (like 30m) having enemies within 15m take regular damage, enemies farther away take reduced damage and enemies 10m away take increased damage. This idea would have the ring of fire gone though since wof does a better job.

 

4:World on fire - my only issue with this (besides the sudden changes with the hotfixes) is that it's affected by armor. this makes wof very weak as enemies get higher in level even ancient infested which is the main faction ember is great against.

1:fire ball - 4m or 3m radius explosion (max) should be fine, 10m are too much (it cost 25)

2:overheat - agree*

3:fire blast - just adding a knockdown effect to the initial damage of 15m (or only in 10m) should be fine, the fire ring does not do a great damage and the enemy MUST pass over that ring to be effective

4:world on fire - just fixing it is fine**... 3 targets per time and a little faster cast animation, because it is quite annoying to be knocked down while casting... she waste time to cast it again.

 

she is a light armored warframe so should (...maybe must) have a speed of 1.1 or 1.2 instead of 1.0...

*at least a better armor (50 or more instead of 10) that should be usefull with overheat...

or adding some buff (attack movement speed and speed buffed) to overheat (like 20% fastest)...

and a 20% of knockdown recovery

 

That's all (IMHO) ... Ember <3

**EDIT: i've just noticed that world on fire it's working correctly but not if she's cloaked by shade's ability !

Edited July 20, 2013 by TheRA1LGUN

[Ferriwind]

Too much resistance to her damage and not enough compensation/cc.

[Retni]

Overheat and World on Fire are great, Fireball and Fire Blast or whatever are barely worth consideration. At least in my opinion, having a level 30 / 5 forma Ember.

 

Overheat is perfect for when I need some damage mitigation or to keep disruptors off of me, whereas World on Fire is nice to pop when I'm too lazy to gun things down one by one.

 

Fireball isn't worth the energy consumption, and whatever the actual name of her 3 ability is, sure it can be handy in defense missions, but that's pretty much the only time. I find World on Fire to be more effective for area denial, anyways.

[Shockwave44]

The problem with world on fire is it takes up the entire area on defense maps. If it's stretch's fault, it still needs to be smaller in circumference.This alone is what makes playing along side ember really uneventful to say the least.

 

Kills everything in sight after leaving nothing left.

 

Real challenging....

 

This goes for other warframes as well, such as nova and volt.

 

Compare the size of this ult to the the tiny vortex.

 

 

Edited July 20, 2013 by Shockwave44

[HAYABU5A]

there is one thing you have to take note u can activate and stack all her abilities easily at once

ie; overheat into brawl mode (now u have very strong defence and do fire damage at close range) and approach mob with world of fire, then slam down 2 fireblasts  which throw off the 2 initial long range blasts and stacked inner rings + whatever your personal weapon damage is = its alot of

dps/dmg

with ember u have use good timing and prediction, that perfect moment to unleash hell on the max amount of enemies

 

now that u can stack continuity and constitution your looking at a pretty damn long time for the duration of overheat and world on fire which in turn makes them more useful and energy efficient 

 

fireblast needs to clearly show its 10 sec burn circle 5m around the player again instead of the fireblast initial range so u can accurate judge where to throw them down

 

who uses fireball ? its pointless atm unless maybe at low lvls,, it needs more utility perhaps something akin to saryns venom so its like napalm that can burst onto nearby enemies like the spores

or give it a very long duration so u can throw them on the ground at chokepoints 

cone of fire flamethrower sounds fun too! 

 

agree she should be a faster frame, as she isnt tanky overheat aside and needs mobility to play the strategy of her abilities

[Pyromite]

I haven't bothered to equip Fireball for long time. It was good at lower levels, to stun ancients. Fire Blast is useless. If it last two or three times longer, it would be great for defence. World On Fire's problem is that it's affected by armor, it becomes useless on higher level grineer, corpus and ancients. Nothing bad about Overheat.

What comes to stats, Ember is close combat frame, why is she so slow? Low armor, average health and shield and high energy I understand, but speed?

Her Phoenix helmet is good, but Backdraft is crap. 15% health at the cost of 3% speed. SERIOUSLY?

[Ketec]

the new helmet is junk indeed. 25% energy vs 15% hp (which isnt much at all... even 30% wouldnt make big of a difference).

[AlvaroXDM]

The problem with world on fire is it takes up the entire area on defense maps. If it's stretch's fault, it still needs to be smaller in circumference.This alone is what makes playing along side ember really uneventful to say the least.

 

Kills everything in sight after leaving nothing left.

 

Real challenging....

 

This goes for other warframes as well, such as nova and volt.

 

Compare the size of this ult to the the tiny vortex.

 

 

 

 

First, that's not Ember ulti, that's her Fireblast. Fireblast doesn't deal damage to all enemies on radius, but on the fire ring. That being said, after they pass the ring, no effect whatsoever. Plus, you have the same range on your "levitate" thing. Ember's ult is probably OP, but all the character is so underpowered that it ends up making for it. 10 armor, low shields and low health. If you dont' have a nice range, you are useless. A 5 meter range with an almost defensless warframe? Makes no sense.

[AlvaroXDM]

there is one thing you have to take note u can activate and stack all her abilities easily at once

ie; overheat into brawl mode (now u have very strong defence and do fire damage at close range) and approach mob with world of fire, then slam down 2 fireblasts  which throw off the 2 initial long range blasts and stacked inner rings + whatever your personal weapon damage is = its alot of

dps/dmg

with ember u have use good timing and prediction, that perfect moment to unleash hell on the max amount of enemies

 

now that u can stack continuity and constitution your looking at a pretty damn long time for the duration of overheat and world on fire which in turn makes them more useful and energy efficient 

 

fireblast needs to clearly show its 10 sec burn circle 5m around the player again instead of the fireblast initial range so u can accurate judge where to throw them down

 

who uses fireball ? its pointless atm unless maybe at low lvls,, it needs more utility perhaps something akin to saryns venom so its like napalm that can burst onto nearby enemies like the spores

or give it a very long duration so u can throw them on the ground at chokepoints 

cone of fire flamethrower sounds fun too! 

 

agree she should be a faster frame, as she isnt tanky overheat aside and needs mobility to play the strategy of her abilities

 

Even with that damage spike, that's not a normal Ember. You can do that  on defense missions, which are Ember's bests. (Against infested), in a normal mission, doing that against 10 enemies will leave you with no energy. World on Fire only is more efficient :)

[AlvaroXDM]

I haven't bothered to equip Fireball for long time. It was good at lower levels, to stun ancients. Fire Blast is useless. If it last two or three times longer, it would be great for defence. World On Fire's problem is that it's affected by armor, it becomes useless on higher level grineer, corpus and ancients. Nothing bad about Overheat.

What comes to stats, Ember is close combat frame, why is she so slow? Low armor, average health and shield and high energy I understand, but speed?

Her Phoenix helmet is good, but Backdraft is crap. 15% health at the cost of 3% speed. SERIOUSLY?

 

Exactly - mobile ulti, the defense buff with small AoE damage, I get it, it should be tanky, but slow as she is there is no sense. Luckily world on fire has such range, if not ember would suck. We need a smaller AoE ember, with way more speed :) that would make her more fun!

[Ketec]

ember fails anywhere but defense - without constant supply of energy orbs and mobs, he becomes weak frame with just a weapon to use.

[HAYABU5A]

streamline + flow and energy siphon on all 4 teammates

so many orbs everywhere when u melt 10-15 enemies

cant remember the last time i ran out of energy using ember..

 

but i digress

 

would be nice if devs could just fine tune a couple of her abilities

[NLCFX]

Yeah, I can't wait to see what the devs do with Ember. Steve definitely said that Ember was being looked at so we'll have to wait and see.

[Lazer]

Why on Earth would you suggest to replace Overheat?....... 

 

Fireball and Fire Blast need to be re looked at or simply replaced with something else.

 

A small increase on speed couldn't hurt either. 

[Grulos]

Is her new alt helmet bugged? It does not give any additional HP.