Solo Is Now Dull , And Not Rewarding Enough . Get A Squad For A Far More Easy Game.

[Gaslightingway]

TBH, I love the large amounts of enemies that spawn now, before it was too easy and boring, then again I never solo anything in this game. If you are viewing this game as a solo game, then you may as well not play at all since it was designed as cooperative. If you can't clear a mission because there are "too many enemies", then get more skilled with your frame and weapons. There needs to be NO nerf of ANY weapon since there is no point. Cry all you want about overpowered weapons, its not like you can't craft them and this game has no PvP outside of the dojo dueling arena. I think you also completely miss the point of most Warframes, they fit different roles. A Vauban won't out DPS a Nova, but it is the best choice for crowd control. A Nova is extremely squishy compared to a Rhino, but a Rhino will never beat a Nova in DPS. At the end of the day, you can whine and complain your frame can't handle solo missions all you want, but chances are you are either playing it wrong or like super easy games.

 

The buff in amount of enemies is amazing since it allows you to get more affinity and a higher chance to get large amounts of mods (correct me if I am wrong on that point). It is a sort of artificial increase in difficulty, which is a point we can both agree on, however I like the fact that there are a lot more than 10 enemies rushing an objective or guarding a hallway. Before the buff to the amount of enemies you could simply clear a room in a couple seconds and be bored for a minute until several more enemies spawned. Now it is a constant fight to keep the enemy at bay while you try and complete your objective, which is a lot more fun.

 

Lastly, why are you playing a coop game solo? As far as I can tell, difficulty doesn't scale well with different numbers of players in a game and usually relies that there are 4 people playing. That was the original intent of the game and I want them to CONTINUE to do so. When you can't complete something, go play with others no matter how much you don't want to. Posts like this dumb down the coop experience greatly. Warframe is not Rainbow Six 3, it is not a tactical shooter so don't try and make it out to be one or try to get it to become one.

[LazyKnight]

All caps, did not read.

However, as i was saying elsewhere:

Did DE put solo in the game as an alternative to multiplayer or as a hardcore mode?

I'd suggest that if anyone wants hardcore they can play alone in online mode, so solo should be of similar difficulty to a single player as online in a 4 man squad, taking into account the fact that in solo the player is alone.

 

 

All they would need to do is make nightmare mode a toggle option  and have normal mode more casual friendly. Really it not hard to do and wouldn't make the game easier because people can always just click nightmare mode for solo or on-line if they want to have a challenge.

 

 

Lastly, why are you playing a coop game solo? As far as I can tell, difficulty doesn't scale well with different numbers of players in a game and usually relies that there are 4 people playing. That was the original intent of the game and I want them to CONTINUE to do so. When you can't complete something, go play with others no matter how much you don't want to. Posts like this dumb down the coop experience greatly. Warframe is not Rainbow Six 3, it is not a tactical shooter so don't try and make it out to be one or try to get it to become one.

I find it more fun to play solo in a in a defense map or anything else just because it is frantic and my failure or success is 100% my fault. They just need to move defense maps off the main path on the star charts so people can skip them and it wouldn't effect people that like to play on-line in the slightest. I find game likes army of 2 mind numbing boring and hate forced co-cp

[TheHeraldXII]

All they would need to do is make nightmare mode a toggle option  and have normal mode more casual friendly. Really it not hard to do and wouldn't make the game easier because people can always just click nightmare mode for solo or on-line if they want to have a challenge.

 

I find it more fun to play solo in a in a defense map or anything else just because it is frantic and my failure or success is 100% my fault. They just need to move defense maps off the main path on the star charts so people can skip them and it wouldn't effect people that like to play on-line in the slightest. I find game likes army of 2 mind numbing boring and hate forced co-cp

Eh, as long as the early game content is made more casual friendly, there's not need for any other fixes. The planets beyond level 45 are supposed to be put there for a challenge. Level is the difficulty setting in this game. Nightmare mode should definitely be a toggle though, and DE is working on it.

I'm with you for playing solo because it's more fun, I'm not really a fan of the co-op in this game, there are too many instant room clear abilities in this game for co-op to really make sense outside of defense missions.

[Xylia]

I hate to mention "that" game, but Mass Effect 3 had some amazing enemy AI.

 

I remember anytime you're fighting high-level Cerberus forces, there are these katana-wielding guys who will one-shot you if you allow them to sneak up on you.

 

They also have snipers.

 

And they have grunts. Their favorite tactic is that the grunts will spray at you, the snipers wait for you to pop your head up and shoot at you, and if you're not watching your surroundings, the katana guy will sneak up behind you and execute you.

 

The enemy AI actively tries to achieve this whenever possible, and they use cover and flanking AI, where the grunts try to force you to get out from behind that object you're hiding behind, by sending guys to your flank.

 

If you spend a whole battle ducking behind the same crate, you are guaranteed dead.

[Gregio]

I replied in this thread earlier and clearly, me and 23 pages of people disagree with solo being impossible. It's difficult and at times unforgiving, but I have a different question.

Warframe is all about the PvE, that's what they advertise as, that's how they're 'selling' their game.
Is it weird then that they made solo more difficult and less rewarding than co-op?
They don't want you to solo, that's not what Warframe is about.

I have a bunch of maxed mobs and plenty of experience, I can solo anything in the game, in regular or nightmare mode, Nyx or Rhino can control a whole map, which just makes solo time consuming instead of difficult, so don't misunderstand me, I'm not AGAINST solo play.

But I am in favor of solo play being more difficult for newer players, in a game where you're trying to inspire co-op, make them need to co-op.
If one guy gets into the game, can solo everything, why would he bother with co-op or PuGs, when there are all those trolls around.

Instead of complaining about not being able to solo, complain about not being able to co-op better.
We need better matchmaking options, for Warframe to use more of the hardware capacity to avoid silly frame lags when it's barely using my computer's hardware. Also, CPU PhysX would be nice for us AMD players. Totally unrelated though.

[InFlames]

I replied in this thread earlier and clearly, me and 23 pages of people disagree with solo being impossible. It's difficult and at times unforgiving, but I have a different question.

Warframe is all about the PvE, that's what they advertise as, that's how they're 'selling' their game.

Is it weird then that they made solo more difficult and less rewarding than co-op?

They don't want you to solo, that's not what Warframe is about.

I have a bunch of maxed mobs and plenty of experience, I can solo anything in the game, in regular or nightmare mode, Nyx or Rhino can control a whole map, which just makes solo time consuming instead of difficult, so don't misunderstand me, I'm not AGAINST solo play.

But I am in favor of solo play being more difficult for newer players, in a game where you're trying to inspire co-op, make them need to co-op.

If one guy gets into the game, can solo everything, why would he bother with co-op or PuGs, when there are all those trolls around.

Instead of complaining about not being able to solo, complain about not being able to co-op better.

We need better matchmaking options, for Warframe to use more of the hardware capacity to avoid silly frame lags when it's barely using my computer's hardware. Also, CPU PhysX would be nice for us AMD players. Totally unrelated though.

well said.

[LazyKnight]

I replied in this thread earlier and clearly, me and 23 pages of people disagree with solo being impossible. It's difficult and at times unforgiving, but I have a different question.

Warframe is all about the PvE, that's what they advertise as, that's how they're 'selling' their game.

Is it weird then that they made solo more difficult and less rewarding than co-op?

They don't want you to solo, that's not what Warframe is about.

I have a bunch of maxed mobs and plenty of experience, I can solo anything in the game, in regular or nightmare mode, Nyx or Rhino can control a whole map, which just makes solo time consuming instead of difficult, so don't misunderstand me, I'm not AGAINST solo play.

But I am in favor of solo play being more difficult for newer players, in a game where you're trying to inspire co-op, make them need to co-op.

If one guy gets into the game, can solo everything, why would he bother with co-op or PuGs, when there are all those trolls around.

Instead of complaining about not being able to solo, complain about not being able to co-op better.

We need better matchmaking options, for Warframe to use more of the hardware capacity to avoid silly frame lags when it's barely using my computer's hardware. Also, CPU PhysX would be nice for us AMD players. Totally unrelated though.

Please type in white, yellow type on black looks like vomit.

The is a SOLO option at least have a valid argument its in game mode TOGGLE.

 

Co-op Please hit 4 key till all NPC are dead really FUN. DE has not a clue at all about game balance in a normal defense maps 2 people get 80% of the kills the other two are doing 20%.

Edited July 23, 2013 by LazyKnight

[Xylia]

Please type in white, yellow type on black looks like vomit.

The is a SOLO option at least have a valid argument its in game mode TOGGLE.

 

Co-op Please hit 4 key till all NPC are dead really FUN. DE has not a clue at all about game balance in a normal defense maps 2 people get 80% of the kills the other two are doing 20%.

 

Not to mention High Level Defense = Better have Frost's Snowglobe or you won't make it.

 

Yeah, nice. Balance the whole game around Snowglobe, why don't we? *rolls eyes*

 

Now, it is impossible to nerf Snowglobe because it is so required to actually pass endgame Defense, but yet it SHOULD be Nerfed BECAUSE it is overpowered.

 

That's what happens when you balance the whole game around 1 ability, assuming everybody will have it, because if you don't... those that DO have it will have a ridiculously easy time in Endgame and will whine that it is too easy.

 

I'm thinking they dug themselves a nice hole that might be difficult to climb out of with Snowglobe and Endgame Defense.

 

1). They made Defense required to get anywhere in progression.

2). They made High Level Defense so ridiculous, you NEED Snowglobe.

3). They made Snowglobe so Overpowered that everybody wants it in High-Level Defense (which causes #2 to happen).

 

It is basically a vicious circle, and the only way out is to piss a LOT of players off by nerfing both Snowglobe AND High Level Defense to make it possible without Snowglobe.

[LazyKnight]

 

 

It is basically a vicious circle, and the only way out is to &!$$ a LOT of players off by nerfing both Snowglobe AND High Level Defense to make it possible without Snowglobe.

The easier fix that wouldn't take a lot of work is to make all the defense maps have the object of protection inside a covered enclosure with the entrance that required the NPC to be inside of it to hurt it or next to it to be at the right angle to hit it. Another way would be having the pod in a room that had a door the NPC had to get past  to be able to fire at the right angle to hit it. This would just make it so the NPC couldn't snipe it and would make a frost non essential for the two faction that have guns.

Edited July 23, 2013 by LazyKnight

[Xylia]

The easier fix that wouldn't take a lot of work is to make all the defense maps have the object of protection inside a covered enclosure with the entrance that required the NPC to be inside of it to hurt it or next to it to be at the right angle to hit it. Another way would be having the pod in a room that had a door the NPC had to get past  to be able to fire at the right angle to hit it. This would just make it so the NPC couldn't snipe it and would make a frost non essential for the two faction that have guns.

 

That still won't stop something from getting close enough to the door to open it and then killing the pod in 2 seconds because stuff does such ridiculous damage to the pod at higher levels.

 

The pod is basically a piece of cardboard.

 

My friend and I were duoing some mission on Sedna, I forget which... it was a Galleon Defense. Lv36.

 

We had done several of these successfully, Banshee + Nova. I was the Nova.

 

I ran out of energy because we got one of these rounds where nothing wanted to drop blue orbs.

 

One dropped, and I ran full speed towards it (stuff was starting to get up on the upper deck near the pod).

 

I glanced at the pod health, it was 90%.

 

Got knocked down by a shield lancer right beside a blue orb. Got back up, got the orb, and started running back towards the pod, glanced up at the health..... 5%, 1%, MISSION FAILED.

 

Yeah. 90% to 0% in ~5 seconds.

 

*rolls eyes*

 

That's fair.

 

40+ mobs in a single wave with only 2 people in the mission.

[LazyKnight]

 

 

The pod is basically a piece of cardboard.

 

They need to drop the normal damage system with the pod and go to a 1% damage per hit model(or something similar) so it scales to any level.  It just not balanced at all and DE doesn't fix it because of the snow globe.

Edited July 23, 2013 by LazyKnight

[UnworthySeraph]

This thread is STILL here.

 

EDIT: Sorry if valid things have been discussed here, but from what I've read, not so much.

Edited July 23, 2013 by JustDylan14

[Xylia]

This thread is STILL here.

 

EDIT: Sorry if valid things have been discussed here, but from what I've read, not so much.

 

The thread is still here, because the issue is still very real.

 

New Newbies to the game are being swamped with ridiculous crap in early planets.

 

The game is still 99% Defense if you want any worthwhile rewards.

 

(Mobile)Defense is still nearly impossible to solo unless you've got ridiculously overpowered mods on the right weapons and frames.

 

Until DE fixes this, expect threads like these to exist.

[Xylia]

They need to drop the normal damage system with the pod and go to a 1% damage per hit model(or something similar) so it scales to any level.  It just not balanced at all and DE doesn't fix it because of the snow globe.

 

1% per hit?

 

Why, so the 30 grineer can kill the pod in 2 seconds instead of 5 with their grakatas/burstons?

 

Basically it'd be Low Level Defense and High Level Defense are just as hard, only you're less likely to see a Frost in Low-Level Defense. What a new way to screw over newbies, lol.

Edited July 23, 2013 by Xylia

[LazyKnight]

1% per hit?

 

Why, so the 30 grineer can kill the pod in 2 seconds instead of 5 with their grakatas/burstons?

 

Basically it'd be Low Level Defense and High Level Defense are just as hard, only you're less likely to see a Frost in Low-Level Defense. What a new way to screw over newbies, lol.

No I have seen games do this it just a system that has a standardized how many hits till defense target dies it not based on how hard it was hit. DE would have to pick how many hits they want the target to be able to take before a fail happened(I have pity for the person that would be balancing that).

 

In my previous post said to also make it so the Grineer and Corpus can not snipe it and have to get past the player before they can automatically win. Defense is a mess right now with non infested NPC and they should make new maps that actual let you defend the target and not just watch how fast it gets sniped outside of your control.

 

Reactor defense maps are currently only possible with a frost with the reach(or was it stretch I keep forgetting since they changed it name) mod to make a large enough bubble. The maps themselves are bad and the reactor is a  paper target it just badly or haphazardly made and doesn't function with NPC with guns.

Edited July 23, 2013 by LazyKnight

[Xylia]

No I have seen games do this it just a system that has a standardized how many hits till defense target dies it not based on how hard it was hit. DE would have to pick how many hits they want the target to be able to take before a fail happened(I have pity for the person that would be balancing that).

 

In my previous post said to also make it so the Grineer and Corpus can not snipe it and have to get past the player before they can automatically win. Defense is a mess right now with non infested NPC and they should make new maps that actual let you defend the target and not just watch how fast it gets sniped outside of your control.

 

Reactor defense maps are currently only possible with a frost with the reach(or was it stretch I keep forgetting since they changed it name) mod to make a large enough bubble. The maps themselves are bad and the reactor is a  paper target it just badly or haphazardly made and doesn't function with NPC with guns.

 

The reactor (Asteroid Defense) is especially horrible.

 

Horrible Design.

 

I absolutely refuse to do Asteroid Defense.

 

There's no point in it, as you can't guarantee there'll be a Frost with maxed Stretch in every run, and that's basically what is required to actually win one.

[fatpig84]

The reactor (Asteroid Defense) is especially horrible.

 

Horrible Design.

 

I absolutely refuse to do Asteroid Defense.

 

There's no point in it, as you can't guarantee there'll be a Frost with maxed Stretch in every run, and that's basically what is required to actually win one.

 

It is doable up to wave 15 even on Varro without Frost.

As long my SV ammo holds of course since it one shots most stuff still.

Otherwise Ogris and despair.

 

And the mods to the make the difference.

 

But beyond that Napalms and rollers will do far too much damage.

Edited July 23, 2013 by fatpig84

[Gaslightingway]

Please type in white, yellow type on black looks like vomit.

The is a SOLO option at least have a valid argument its in game mode TOGGLE.

 

Co-op Please hit 4 key till all NPC are dead really FUN. DE has not a clue at all about game balance in a normal defense maps 2 people get 80% of the kills the other two are doing 20%.

 

While using your Warframe's ultimate does clear large amounts of enemies in the noob zones, it is a lot less powerful against high level enemies. I don't know if you stay in level 1-15 zones constantly, but I can certainly tell you that there is a lot more to killing high level stuff in Warframe than pressing 4. The 4 key doesn't win missions, teamwork does.

 

 

Also on the subject of Snowglobe. The ONLY way to make it so Rhino, the other tanking Warframe, gets all the aggro from all the mobs in the area as long as Iron Skin is up, which would make the new changes to Iron Skin worthless. I don't think you guys understand this is a CLASS BASED game. When you have a Tank, 2 DPS, and a Support, you will win. The problem is out of the two tanks, Frost and Rhino, Frost is the only one with a reasonable defensive measure and can protect an area with Snowglobe since there is no ability to pull all the aggro. Rhino is a tank and is not a DPS Warframe even though everyone seems to think it is and treats it as such. However, you can't win a defense misison with just a Frost, you need at least a Vauban and Nova/Nyx/Sayrn/Ember/whatever to wipe up the mobs.

 

I said this earlier but I guess you people simply have no capacity for understanding, THIS GAME IS NOT MADE FOR SINGLEPLAYER! If you want a singleplayer experience, go elsewhere and stop clogging the forums with useless threads trying to get the devs to reshape the entire focus of this game which is COOPERATIVE GAMEPLAY. When you complain about the amount of enemies, the inability to defend the objective in Endless Defense with 1-2 players, the insanity of Mobile Defense with 1-2 players, and how hard it is to solo high level content, you are missing the entire point of the game. I love this game as a cooperative game and there are tons of other players that do, and it is a pretty damn well made one. All the complaining going on here and in any past or future thread is making the game WORSE off than what it should be. Granted, difficulty could be scaled better depending on the number of players, however even though it is a challenge with less than the ideal 4 player group, it is doable.

 

A previous poster said it exactly as he should have. ""Instead of complaining about not being able to solo, complain about not being able to co-op better." This is what people should be posting about, a better way to get people into coop rather than allowing them to think that Soloing the game is somehow an option given the current difficulty levels, which should not change and IMO needs a bit more of a buff. This is something the devs will really need to figure out because just making the game cooperative only is not the way to deal with it, its making certain missions coop only, like defense missions, so that people can actually complete them. I think this leads into a whole different direction than the original post though. In the end, the game is definitely harder than it used to be, but it is still a cakewalk for veteran players, but it seems that some people don't understand the fundamentals of Warframe.

[LazyKnight]

 

I said this earlier but I guess you people simply have no capacity for understanding, THIS GAME IS NOT MADE FOR SINGLEPLAYER! If you want a singleplayer experience, go elsewhere and stop clogging the forums with useless threads trying to get the devs to reshape the entire focus of this game which is COOPERATIVE GAMEPLAY.  of players, however even though it is a challenge with less than the ideal 4 player group, it is doable.

 

When you make that type of comment it basically puts you on my ignore list. Only defense has a goal that is COOPERATVIE by definition no other maps have goals that need or are benefited by having more warm bodies in seats. 

 

I am all for them making the on-line better but until they get dedicated servers its a peer-to-peer game. The only person I will play with is one friend I know in real life because we can play lag free together. I  randomly pop in on-line to XIn with a pug group when I am bored but its hardly entertaining to quit at round 5 every time when I can solo to wave 15 easily.

Edited July 23, 2013 by LazyKnight

[TheHeraldXII]

The easier fix that wouldn't take a lot of work is to make all the defense maps have the object of protection inside a covered enclosure with the entrance that required the NPC to be inside of it to hurt it or next to it to be at the right angle to hit it. Another way would be having the pod in a room that had a door the NPC had to get past  to be able to fire at the right angle to hit it. This would just make it so the NPC couldn't snipe it and would make a frost non essential for the two faction that have guns.

Yeah, I'm with you there, making the Defense maps set in a defensive position would be nice. Also, the new changes to the AI on defense is clearly an attempt to get around people snowglobe camping, but all it did was make snowglobe even more necessary. What's with that anyway?

 

@N0M4D1C, the basic mechanics of this game, with the fast paced feel and instant room clear abilities make co-op coordination next to impossible. 4 man teams are a mess on anything except mobile/defense missions.

[Gaslightingway]

I think I went a bit too hardline on the subject. My point is the game wasn't designed around solo play, but it is an option you can choose. Currently the game does not seem to support scaling difficulty depending on the party size, which can be unfortunate, but it still is not all that difficult until you start hitting high level content, and even then its doable. I agree that mobile/defense mission should be optional, because it is not something you just jump into and say, "Okay, lets do this!" without some level of cooperation. I just get so tired of all the people trying to make this into a singleplayer game that I get a little too intense.

[TheHeraldXII]

I think I went a bit too hardline on the subject. My point is the game wasn't designed around solo play, but it is an option you can choose. Currently the game does not seem to support scaling difficulty depending on the party size, which can be unfortunate, but it still is not all that difficult until you start hitting high level content, and even then its doable. I agree that mobile/defense mission should be optional, because it is not something you just jump into and say, "Okay, lets do this!" without some level of cooperation. I just get so tired of all the people trying to make this into a singleplayer game that I get a little too intense.

I kind of agree, the game was designed for co-op and so you should expect more of a challenge if you go solo, but even so in my experience it plays better solo. Bosses put up a fight for one, actually proving to be a challenge rather than just emptying mags into them until they cough up blueprints.

[Loswaith]

Given the game is about, as the devs have said "one tenno having the ability to take on a whole ship of enemies" (cant recall which live stream it was) saying you shouldnt be able to solo key missions is obscure.

 

The game has a solo option built in, so if the devs "dont want you to solo" why did they even include that option at all.

 

More is the factor why have so many nodes in the game too, thats basically spreading your community for a multi-player game very thin.  One node per planet randomly generating maps would produce the same effect as numerous nodes do now but also pool your playerbase for multi-player.

That aside, I do like that there is allot of choice.

 

Realistically even playing online I have found that less than half of any missions I actually do will have other players in it (not including those mission that I do with friends/clanmates).

 

So while yes they should fix the multi-player side of things, however that takes 10 times the work and while that is occuring you have people waiting in queues instead of playing your game.  Im sure we can agree having people waiting for people to play with is generaly seen as bad.

 

At the end of the day having both solo and multi-player available is better for the game as a whole as it hits a larger market.

 

Though all in all by making it as hard as they have its discouraging new people to play the game, so the community will get smaller and smaller as current players drop off.   DE could have had the best of both sides by simply adding a secondary rank to the panets, so you have a beginner mode (the old difficulity) and an advanced mode (the new difficulity) and it would make everyone happy. 

 

The fact that its randomly generated based around certain enemy levels actually means they can have many difficulity levels.  Take defence as an example, enemeis constantly rank up getting tougher and tougher.  If you have planets with a base level then add an optional stage modifier, say +20 levels once you have completed an area, then +50 levels once you completed that planet a second time (with the increases in loot obviously as enemies become higher level).  Im sure its easy for everyone to think of at leat 1-2 games that have done this before and it worked for those games.

 

 

Another way DE could of gone is add nodes off the main progression path to planets that are considerably higher level as well.  This way the missions you have to do to progress dont slow you moving from planet to planet, but still gives options for doing harder missions for those players that want more of a challenge.

Edited July 23, 2013 by Loswaith

[arch111]

So much division here.

I think both modes should exist. Most vets say they farm solo, so this is mostly a problem for new players.

The lag, rushers, trolls etc sometimes makes Solo the better choice.

I can even imagine missions Designed for Solo play.

I agree that the last planets should be hard, but the middle content should be easier.

If defence are moved from the path, i think everyone will be happier. I dont touch some maps, i know its a death trap without better gear or vets.

I mean, the point for DE is that players get to the end planets, get vetstatus, spend platinum in a clan, run the void etc.

Besides, on wf all squads ive seen more looks like 4a ppl playing solo together.

many squadgames do this well, but wf needs better squad teamwork.

Edited July 23, 2013 by arch111

[HammerHead90]

Why isn't pod's HP/shields/armor scaled to the level of mobs? Low level mobs are having hard time killing the pod, while high level enemies can tear it in a second. The challenge for the new player on his first defence is to kill the enemies before they kill the pod. If shifts to "kill the enemies before they can SEE the pod", which is impossible for one player, since he cannot block two paths at once, for example. High level defence should then shift from four people bunching under the snowglobe to two/three teams blocking the attack paths, without the need for a snowglobe (if it would be nerfed, with pod getting buffed).