Should we have harder MR tests?

[Spartan336]

So we all know MR doesn't mean skill. If that's news to you, MR doesn't mean skill. I've seen MR 17's with super low playtime who didn't know who the void-trader was. 

That being said, I've a MR12 who's been playing since 2013. I'm only MR12 because I'm honestly more of a "OMG SPACE NINJA" person than a grinder. Throughout my Warframe experience, I've encountered multiple people complaining that the MR# test is to hard. I always viewed this as strange, since all the tests I've taken up to this point are yawn-worthy. So I decided to look at the tests, thinking that they actually get harder, and they don't. Here's a list of MR tests I consider appropriate for the level of experience/skill that MR presents.

MR22(If you don't have an invincibility frame.)

MR19(But just barely. Highly debatable) 

MR24(Have to have the main quests completed, and fairly hard.)

I hear complaints about the MR23 test, but while it's unique, you just need to mod for speed. 

And that's the list.

Honestly, if MR is going to hold more weight, we're going to need some new tests. 

[LightningsVengance]

no (Are you talking about beefing up the currnet ones or making the ones to come harder? Because if it's beefing up the current ones...) no

[faiznorizan]

MR never held any weight besides showing people what stuff you've gone through so why bother with messing around on test difficulty anyway

[Spartan336]

4 minutes ago, LightningsVengance said:

no (Are you talking about beefing up the currnet ones or making the ones to come harder? Because if it's beefing up the current ones...) no

I'm talking about completely doing some of the later ones over completely. 

[(XBOX)Jay5446]

Calling for harder MR tests doesn't really make sense when you also state that MR has no correlation with skill.

Also, the current ones use a range of basic "skills" such as parkour, stealth, weapon types, etc. 

[Spartan336]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Mr Calverley said:

Calling for harder MR tests doesn't really make sense when you also state that MR has no correlation with skill.

Also, the current ones use a range of basic "skills" such as parkour, stealth, weapon types, etc. 

Let me re-phrase that. It doesn't have a correlation with skill currently. It could, if the tests were re-done properly. 

[VirtualViolet]

Erm, if you're only MR12, how would you know how difficult any of the MR14+ tests are? AFAIK, in Simaris's Sanctuary you can only play the ones up to your current MR +1.

[FLSH_BNG]

Just now, VirtualViolet said:

Erm, if you're only MR12, how would you know how difficult any of the MR14+ tests are? AFAIK, in Simaris's Sanctuary you can only play the ones up to your current MR +1.

This ^

[(XBOX)Jay5446]

Just now, Spartan336 said:

Let me re-phrase that. It doesn't have a correlation with skill currently. It could, if the tests were re-done properly. 

Ah, I see. But I don't know what the tests could actually entail to teach players complex strategy. They'd probably have to be quite intricate and lengthy, I think.

[Spartan336]

10 minutes ago, VirtualViolet said:

Erm, if you're only MR12, how would you know how difficult any of the MR14+ tests are? AFAIK, in Simaris's Sanctuary you can only play the ones up to your current MR +1.

Youtube.

[VirtualViolet]

Just now, Spartan336 said:

Youtube.

Yeah, because watching someone else do it is just like playing it yourself.

[Spartan336]

1 minute ago, VirtualViolet said:

Yeah, because watching someone else do it is just like playing it yourself.

Dude. It's not that hard to judge the difficulty of something from seeing it. 

[(XBOX)ItsMast3rking]

Lmao im laughing so hard at this thread atm...there's a difference between watching someone do something and actually going through it yourself...so u saying "they're not hard" has no proper foundation since u r giving ur view as a spectator, not as a challenger.

[o.0-]

Should we have harder MR tests? I dunno, some are hard, others tricky and so on, and it varies due to the nature of the test like MR19 due a change to enemies that impacts the test.

I'd certainly rather see MR only visible in our in-game profiles and when it relates to trading MR restricted trade goods, otherwise does it really matter that much?

[(XBOX)ItsMast3rking]

Just now, SPARTAN-187.Thanatos said:

Should we have harder MR tests? I dunno, some are hard, others tricky and so on, and it varies due to the nature of the test like MR19 due a change to enemies that impacts the test.

I'd certainly rather see MR only visible in our in-game profiles and when it relates to trading MR restricted trade goods, otherwise does it really matter that much?

Well MR doesnt really have any actual impact in the game as it should(u r right on tht note)..i do agree with OP on one thing..it should change to have at least some visible impact

[VirtualViolet]

Just now, Spartan336 said:

Dude. It's not that hard to judge the difficulty of something from seeing it. 

Well, I guess you're right. I've seen a few basketball games, maybe I'll try out for the NBA draft next year.

Sarcasm aside, Mastery Rank has never been a measure of skill, and it's not intended to be. It's a measure of the size of your arsenal, or at least the variety of weapons/warframes/etc. that you have experience with, and your ability to choose the right loadout for the situation. The tests are fine for what they are, and very few of them are "too easy." Most people couldn't do them on the first try going in blind. If you practice them and bring the right equipment to make it easy, then yeah, it's easy, but that's the whole point - going through your arsenal and choosing the right tools for the job. THAT is what Mastery Rank is about.

[Spartan336]

6 minutes ago, VirtualViolet said:

Well, I guess you're right. I've seen a few basketball games, maybe I'll try out for the NBA draft next year.

Sarcasm aside, Mastery Rank has never been a measure of skill, and it's not intended to be. It's a measure of the size of your arsenal, or at least the variety of weapons/warframes/etc. that you have experience with, and your ability to choose the right loadout for the situation. The tests are fine for what they are, and very few of them are "too easy." Most people couldn't do them on the first try going in blind. If you practice them and bring the right equipment to make it easy, then yeah, it's easy, but that's the whole point - going through your arsenal and choosing the right tools for the job. THAT is what Mastery Rank is about.

Except I also play basketball daily.

But my opinion is that MR should not be just about the tools, but about the player's ability to use them. Currently, you can pick the tools, but there's no real challenge when using the tools. Admittedly, this is kinda how Warframe is structured, you know, giving that massive player power fantasy. But you should still have to put in more effort than just choosing Valkyr and turning invincible for the MR22 test. If anything that should be around MR13. 

As Thanatos said, however, this all doesn't matter to much. I also agree strongly with the 'Only view MR in your profile' part, because that would cut down on confusion drastically for new players. 

[VirtualViolet]

8 minutes ago, (Xbox One)ItsMast3rking said:

Well MR doesnt really have any actual impact in the game as it should(u r right on tht note)..i do agree with OP on one thing..it should change to have at least some visible impact

There are plenty of benefits to raising your MR (beyond unlocking MR-locked weapons). There's: increased daily trade cap (1 per rank), daily syndicate standing cap (1000 per rank), void traces cap (50 per rank), a new loadout slot every two ranks, a Mastery Sigil (which really only changes every 3 ranks, but still)...did I miss anything?

[o.0-]

4 minutes ago, (Xbox One)ItsMast3rking said:

Well MR doesnt really have any actual impact in the game as it should(u r right on tht note)..i do agree with OP on one thing..it should change to have at least some visible impact

Sure, I've been thinking that tweaking the system a little would be a way to go, so currently Master provides tons indirectly.

What if the existing system becomes say a Tactician Mastery Rank and continues as it works.

Then the devs can work on ideas that might not have fit that framework as a new system that for example could be a Strategist Mastery Rank or however else to best frame it that can then focus towards different elements of Warframe. And then here provide cosmetic elements that we can mount on Warframes to provide a visible impact?

What the old and new system get named can even be closely tied to Warframe lore, such as Executor Mastery Rank or Sectarus, Dax even Archimedian.

[Spartan336]

1 minute ago, SPARTAN-187.Thanatos said:

Sure, I've been thinking that tweaking the system a little would be a way to go, so currently Master provides tons indirectly.

What if the existing system becomes say a Tactician Mastery Rank and continues as it works.

Then the devs can work on ideas that might not have fit that framework as a new system that for example could be a Strategist Mastery Rank or however else to best frame it that can then focus towards different elements of Warframe. And then here provide cosmetic elements that we can mount on Warframes to provide a visible impact?

What the old and new system get named can even be closely tied to Warframe lore, such as Executor Mastery Rank or Sectarus, Dax even Archimedian.

I like the idea you have going, but that'll need some flushing out. Perhaps the new system could have an actual story to it as well. Something like 'Whats the honorable thing to do here' with more characters involved than just the Lotus. 

[(XBOX)ItsMast3rking]

9 minutes ago, VirtualViolet said:

There are plenty of benefits to raising your MR (beyond unlocking MR-locked weapons). There's: increased daily trade cap (1 per rank), daily syndicate standing cap (1000 per rank), void traces cap (50 per rank), a new loadout slot every two ranks, a Mastery Sigil (which really only changes every 3 ranks, but still)...did I miss anything?

What i mean is like it doesnt take that much skill and doesnt really have that much of an impact in the game..MR in the game atm is like conclave..its there but thts it..i mean for example if a player just spend money in the game(a lot) he/she will b high MR within a month or so(depends on dedication ig).so i believe there should be something to actually prove ur skill or so on(like how the riven challenges are..some of em are quite the headache)

[VirtualViolet]

1 minute ago, Spartan336 said:

Except I also play basketball daily.

But my opinion is that MR should not be just about the tools, but about the player's ability to use them. Currently, you can pick the tools, but there's no real challenge when using the tools. Admittedly, this is kinda how Warframe is structured, you know, giving that massive player power fantasy. But you should still have to put in more effort than just choosing Valkyr and turning invincible for the MR22 test. If anything that should be around MR13. 

As Thanatos said, however, this all doesn't matter to much. I also agree strongly with the 'Only view MR in your profile' part, because that would cut down on confusion drastically for new players. 

Let me know which NBA team drafts you. That'll be fun to watch.

Also, good luck keeping Valkyr's Hysteria up without energy restores.

[o.0-]

2 minutes ago, Spartan336 said:

I like the idea you have going, but that'll need some flushing out. Perhaps the new system could have an actual story to it as well. Something like 'Whats the honorable thing to do here' with more characters involved than just the Lotus. 

Yes, that would be an awesome direction to go and stays within a PvE setting compared to Conclave, that came to mind, when thinking of the cosmetic items available there as you rise in rank.

[VirtualViolet]

I find it rather off-putting that you feel qualified to comment on the difficulty of mastery rank tests which you can't even be bothered to attempt to reach.

Edited September 23, 2017 by VirtualViolet
Minor grammatical correction

[Spartan336]

3 minutes ago, VirtualViolet said:

Also, good luck keeping Valkyr's Hysteria up without energy restores.

The map provides the energy required.

1 minute ago, VirtualViolet said:

I find it rather off-putting that you feel qualified to comment on the difficulty of mastery rank tests that you can't even be bothered to attempt to reach.

You may continue being off-put.

3 minutes ago, SPARTAN-187.Thanatos said:

Yes, that would be an awesome direction to go and stays within a PvE setting compared to Conclave, that came to mind, when thinking of the cosmetic items available there as you rise in rank.

Oh man don't even get me started on conclave. That's a mess for another thread. But if cosmetics are going to be added, I'd just like the new system to be a challenge so that the cosmetics have some meaning to them. That's all I'm really asking with this entire thing.