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Do You Like The Direction Warframe Is Heading And Has De Bitten Off More Than They Can Chew?


MEsoJD
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 I've been a supporting this game since closed beta because I thought it had a lot of potential. Today I'm skeptical of DE's decisions and abilities. 

 

Enemies - Aren't very intelligent and rather than fix this or improving, they make them beefier, stronger, and have them spawn out of thin air. I like a challenge, but this is the cheap way to go at it.  

 

Stealth - Still not viable. They briefly showed some enemy reaction content for stealth, but this has been so slow going. Back stabs don't follow the principle. Back stabs are meant to be a one hit kill as a reward for sneaking up on an enemy and hitting a vital organ. Create distractions like throwing objects and knocking on surfaces. You should be able to also be able to destroy alert consoles. An enemy sense icon should be implemented and you should be able to utilize shadows/light. You get the drift.

 

Weapons - Balance is a very big problem and it doesn't help that they aren't more transparent about stats. Melee has been outclassed by primary and secondary for a long time.

 

Load outs - We were briefly teased about this long ago, but it was buggy and taken out. Since than, no word. This should be an obvious feature. Who likes having to switch mods in and out? It can take a long time. Now call me crazy, but I think they are conflicted about load outs because of money and mods. They want you to have a max serration for each weapon in the hopes you paid for those fusion cores.

 

Platinum - This is nothing new in f2p games, but I was hoping DE would be like valve and use real money prices. Platinum's purpose is to disguise amounts.

 

CPU Performance - The game doesn't have the best utilization of multiple cores. If your a quad core user, you've probably noticed.

 

Co Op Performance - We need more options in this regard, they need a better net code, and or both. Hosts with even good internet download and upload speeds still have problems with fellow players. Maybe Private Servers or a browser can be an option?

 

Story - This has been very slow coming. I won't give them too much grief in this area.

 

Lotus - Has been a constant annoyance. Love an option to turn her off without turning off other sounds.

 

Hud - Many suggestions by users, but it's been very slow coming. Sentinels still don't have a health/status bar...

 

Better Fov- If you play pc games up close on a monitor, you may have noticed how important this is to gaming and that it can cause motion sickness if not properly set. I got word that this was being worked on, but that was long long ago. Proper fov/camera options would improve gameplay by managing enemies and the sentinel on screen. 

 

Content - The f2p model demands constant content. Has their pace been satisfactory? Are they keeping up well with the competition?

 

Communication - I admit, that they are better than a lot of devs in this regard, but there are many times they aren't. Looking at you, stealth nerfs...

 

 Now I understand that DE is a small game dev, but I wonder if they can handle the f2p model? If they can handle it, are they willing to go beyond the competition? Yes it's in beta, but for how long? When it's out of beta, how different will it be from today? Are you confident that things are going well for DE and us/gamers/consumers?

 

 Please understand that I love DE, but I'm not sure I can support this game for much longer. You may disagree and blow this off as another rant, but know that I have invested time and money into this game. I want it to succeed. If you have something to say, try to be respectful. I'm sure there's better rants/criticisms, but that's my quick 2 cents.

 

ok I'm tired... night.

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I think they have bitten off more than they can chew and they are pretty close to choking, weapons in this game need some serious balancing as there are only a few options for endgame. I have noticed it is fairly laggy even though I have a good pc, definitely needs loadouts etc.

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DE is focusing too hard on pumping out new content like weapons, tilesets, weekend events etc. while the core gameplay (weapon balancing, enemy behaviour and variety, defense dominating the game etc.) is getting increasingly stale. That's the biggest reason why it seems that Warframe is slowly starting to come apart. So no, I don't like the direction that the development is heading, though no comment on whether DE has "bitten off more than they can chew". I feel that these are mistakes due to inexperience, which isn't too late to be remedied, it's just a matter of whether DE can listen to the right feedback and learn from their mistakes and successes/gain more experience fast enough.

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game provides no challenge. as result it's boring.

grind is not a content.

frames and weapons have tiers. as result players are doomed to use only those weapons which are efficient. and it doesn't matter do they like those weapons or not. same goes to frames, also majority of frames are not thought out. there are way too much ultimate frames, they provides an edge that even toughest mobs can't overcome.

overall game mechanics that includes aura system and dual mods are making game effortless.

 

p.s. DE you are screwed some players with aura system, so why don't you remake entire game mechanics wise. it's a beta after all.

Edited by Althix
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IMHO they're going fine, just that the polishing/reworking is taking its toll on them. Give them some time and space. Overhauls are a lot of work, compared to adding in things.

 

And we'll never know where the intended end result is if we tell them to go back, or veer away at the slightest hints of a bump in the road. Like how the ridiculous resistance scaling on enemies is actually intended, so logically there 'must' be an incoming buff/tweak/rework so that all weapons can be viable against them, rather than continue to be mediocre choices.

 

5) Armor (Scalability and Difficulty)
Several great posts have emerged that tackle “Armor” and its effectiveness at high levels and how this affects players options when facing high level enemies. This conversation boils down to what kind of changes will Armor undergo, if any? The answer is that Armor is currently working as intended and is unlikely to change, Edit: but now being discussed.

6) Power Creep/Difficulty/High Level Gameplay
This complements the above topic but from a different perspective. To borrow a quote from the thread from  player 11.11.11:

“My point is, a lot of the games current difficulty is, as Litler puts it - not based around player skill or emergent game-play. Its simply about getting weapons that allow you to spit out enough damage per second, to take on incredibly beefed up enemies.”

This is an apt summary of player concerns and something that is being brought up around the office.  So many factors can go into “fixing” what is identified here, we are always tweaking and adding new content to allow for new gameplay experiences. Truthfully we like being Elite Tenno: Grineer, Corpus, and Infested killing machines, but we also love creativity in what our players can bring to the table. Finding balance in this is our continued goal.

7) Continued Warframe Buff

Trinity and Ember are currently on Scott’s list to be buffed. Mag, Rhino, and Volt got a brush up in 8.3 and are still being reviewed. The rest of the bunch will eventually be addressed as well, so if you don’t see “insert Warframe here” now, the time for review will come. Baby steps!

8) Buff Weapon “X”
Like the Great Warframe Buff, some weapons will receive a review as well to account for the evolving gameplay elements. When in doubt, read the FAQ:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/5898-warframe-faq/

Warframe/Gun X is over(or under)-powered! (Why did you nerf? Why did you boost?)
We are rolling out balance changes very quickly. We love the feedback (good and bad) and take it very seriously. Our goal is to avoid having a single dominant weapon, build, mod configuration...

 

That is, if Update 9 is still considered an overhaul/repolish update...

 

About content: from what I can see, this is one place where it's impossible to please anyone for long.

A hotfix with new weapons/maps/gamemodes? People will clamor about how DE needs to stop making content and fix bugs, or rework outdated/outmoded things.

Weeks without anything new? (probably because DEvs are busy with fixing/reworking something) People will clamor about how the game is dead without new content.

 

DE is focusing too hard on pumping out new content like weapons, tilesets, weekend events etc. while the core gameplay (weapon balancing, enemy behaviour and variety, defense dominating the game etc.) is getting increasingly stale.

Point in case ;P

 

Update 9 was touted as the "reforging" update. It's good that they're adding anything new at all, while also overhauling things. I'm just thankful that they didn't go "well we'll be taking the game down for some time while we rework and fix things, seeya in a month or so o/".

Edited by Shion963
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Oh man... all these depressing rant threads are coming out at the same time.. 

Raise the red flags guys.. 

 

To be honest I never seen this many general unhappiness with so much of the game before. Maybe it will shine a light in the right direction for DE :p

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And gameplay, at first there wasnt to many warframes. To get the picture how things were, look at Ash warframe.

Before it was:

Shuriken: omfg, i can silent kill that dude over there and amazing damage.

Smoke Screen: omfg, i can be invisible and attack them, they dont know where i am, im amazingly strong.

Teleport: omfg, they cant escape me now, who is my next victim?

Bladestorm: omfg, madness, no way, best skill ever, look at me, im on killing spree!!!

Now its: ussless, totally eclipsed by nova. Why to silent kill enemies when you can destroy a entire room? Why to go invisible when you can kill a entire room? why to chase them when you can kill all of them? why to kill 1 by 1 when you can kill all?

Before it was a challenge to do a defence mission, now its not. Nova and Vauban eclipsed other warframes, its simple as that, you are the offensive type, you get nova. You are deffensive type, you get vauban.

The point is simple, before there was a joy playing in diversity, because there wasnt required to have a ogris, nova, vauban, or armor ignore weapons. Now we just molecular prime the room, collect exp, and..... thats it.

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Enemies - Aren't very intelligent and rather than fix this or improving, they make them beefier, stronger, and have them spawn out of thin air. I like a challenge, but this is the cheap way to go at it.  

 

----

Agreed. They do do some daft things.

----

 

Stealth - Still not viable. They briefly showed some enemy reaction content for stealth, but this has been so slow going. Back stabs don't follow the principle. Back stabs are meant to be a one hit kill as a reward for sneaking up on an enemy and hitting a vital organ. Create distractions like throwing objects and knocking on surfaces. You should be able to also be able to destroy alert consoles. An enemy sense icon should be implemented and you should be able to utilize shadows/light. You get the drift.

 

---

Agreed. It is just no viable atm, especially when it is way more productive with your time to simple kill as fast as you can which you can't do stealthily. But getting a mix of stealth and fast past action in a game is very difficult to get right, so don't expect this to happen fast.

---

 

Weapons - Balance is a very big problem and it doesn't help that they aren't more transparent about stats. Melee has been outclassed by primary and secondary for a long time.

 

---

I have to disagree, melee is a very viable, especially against light infested. Some weapons do need looking at, though I don't mind having tiered weapons, i.e. crap guns are easy to get but the better ones will take more effort.

---

 

Load outs - We were briefly teased about this long ago, but it was buggy and taken out. Since than, no word. This should be an obvious feature. Who likes having to switch mods in and out? It can take a long time. Now call me crazy, but I think they are conflicted about load outs because of money and mods. They want you to have a max serration for each weapon in the hopes you paid for those fusion cores.

 

---

I so want this. Kind of an essential feature needed. I doubt very much that it has anything to do with DE wanting you to maxed serration for every weapon, that would literally cost 1000's of dollars if you bought fusion core packs as you suggest. It does seem they are slowly updating the UI a bit at a time so hopefully we will see this feature soon.

---

 

Platinum - This is nothing new in f2p games, but I was hoping DE would be like valve and use real money prices. Platinum's purpose is to disguise amounts.

 

---

This is common with many many f2p games. Yeah it does disguise the amount, but no different to going on holiday to another country and getting used to their currency. I can deal with it. Plus they can't really show 'real' values as the game would have to know where you bought you plat from, did you get a discount on it etc...

---

 

CPU Performance - The game doesn't have the best utilization of multiple cores. If your a quad core user, you've probably noticed.

 

---

Haven't noticed. I have 6 cores.

---

 

Co Op Performance - We need more options in this regard, they need a better net code, and or both. Hosts with even good internet download and upload speeds still have problems with fellow players. Maybe Private Servers or a browser can be an option?

 

---

Yeah, this still needs fine tuning.

---

 

Story - This has been very slow coming. I won't give them too much grief in this area.

 

---

Soon tm :P

---

 

Lotus - Has been a constant annoyance. Love an option to turn her off without turning off other sounds.

 

---

Would be nice to have quite a few more sound options.

---

 

Hud - Many suggestions by users, but it's been very slow coming. Sentinels still don't have a health/status bar...

 

---

Someone posted a fecking awesome HUD mock up, looked the bees knees. We can live in hope :P

---

 

Better Fov- If you play pc games up close on a monitor, you may have noticed how important this is to gaming and that it can cause motion sickness if not properly set. I got word that this was being worked on, but that was long long ago. Proper fov/camera options would improve gameplay by managing enemies and the sentinel on screen. 

 

Content - The f2p model demands constant content. Has their pace been satisfactory? Are they keeping up well with the competition?

 

---

We get a whole new tileset soon, depending on the success of this weekends event. New mission types and more than likely some more weapons will come this patch too. Plus they are getting the PS4 version up to speed. tbh I want to fix bugs and balance things and get the UI sorted (loadouts!!)

---

 

Communication - I admit, that they are better than a lot of devs in this regard, but there are many times they aren't. Looking at you, stealth nerfs...

 

---

All in all I would say that they are very very good. Patch notes could be a bit more thorough though.

---

 

My comments in bold.

Edited by Shifty_Shuffler
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I've been saying it for a while but only recently have other people finally started agreeing with me: DE's biggest issues is that they A. don't seem to have an idea of what they want to do with the game yet, there's no core direction and they keep waffling about on what they want. And B. They adamantly refuse to fix the core issues of the game, proclaim everything's fine and then toss us a few weapons and call it a week. Then make posts on the forums about how they don't make enough income off their crappy cash shop.

 

DE tries to hide behind "beta is beta" without seeming to understand what beta even means, you have to listen to your beta testers. If not you're going to doom your own game the moment it his release.

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I'm still holding out for PvP. I want it and I hope to see it in Warframe.  I want...

 

*Search & Destroy

*Infiltration 

*Siege 

*Team Death Match 4vs4

*Death Match 

 

This is what I want. You don't have to agree with me but you have to respect my opinion. 

 

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And gameplay, at first there wasnt to many warframes. To get the picture how things were, look at Ash warframe.

Before it was:

Shuriken: omfg, i can silent kill that dude over there and amazing damage.

Smoke Screen: omfg, i can be invisible and attack them, they dont know where i am, im amazingly strong.

Teleport: omfg, they cant escape me now, who is my next victim?

Bladestorm: omfg, madness, no way, best skill ever, look at me, im on killing spree!!!

Now its: ussless, totally eclipsed by nova. Why to silent kill enemies when you can destroy a entire room? Why to go invisible when you can kill a entire room? why to chase them when you can kill all of them? why to kill 1 by 1 when you can kill all?

Before it was a challenge to do a defence mission, now its not. Nova and Vauban eclipsed other warframes, its simple as that, you are the offensive type, you get nova. You are deffensive type, you get vauban.

The point is simple, before there was a joy playing in diversity, because there wasnt required to have a ogris, nova, vauban, or armor ignore weapons. Now we just molecular prime the room, collect exp, and..... thats it.

 

And gameplay, at first there wasnt to many warframes. To get the picture how things were, look at Ash warframe.

Before it was:

Shuriken: omfg, i can silent kill that dude over there and amazing damage.

Smoke Screen: omfg, i can be invisible and attack them, they dont know where i am, im amazingly strong.

Teleport: omfg, they cant escape me now, who is my next victim?

Bladestorm: omfg, madness, no way, best skill ever, look at me, im on killing spree!!!

Now its: ussless, totally eclipsed by nova. Why to silent kill enemies when you can destroy a entire room? Why to go invisible when you can kill a entire room? why to chase them when you can kill all of them? why to kill 1 by 1 when you can kill all?

Before it was a challenge to do a defence mission, now its not. Nova and Vauban eclipsed other warframes, its simple as that, you are the offensive type, you get nova. You are deffensive type, you get vauban.

The point is simple, before there was a joy playing in diversity, because there wasnt required to have a ogris, nova, vauban, or armor ignore weapons. Now we just molecular prime the room, collect exp, and..... thats it.

Dude, you really need to fight higher level mobs.

 

Don't bring an Ash though, a Vauban or Frost will suffice.

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I'm still holding out for PvP. I want it and I hope to see it in Warframe.  I want...

 

*Search & Destroy

*Infiltration 

*Siege 

*Team Death Match 4vs4

*Death Match 

 

This is what I want. You don't have to agree with me but you have to respect my opinion. 

Have you ever used Rhino Stomp in the duel room?

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1 Enemies - Aren't very intelligent and rather than fix this or improving, they make them beefier, stronger, and have them spawn out of thin air. I like a challenge, but this is the cheap way to go at it.  

 

2 Stealth - Still not viable. They briefly showed some enemy reaction content for stealth, but this has been so slow going. Back stabs don't follow the principle. Back stabs are meant to be a one hit kill as a reward for sneaking up on an enemy and hitting a vital organ. Create distractions like throwing objects and knocking on surfaces. You should be able to also be able to destroy alert consoles. An enemy sense icon should be implemented and you should be able to utilize shadows/light. You get the drift.

 

3 Weapons - Balance is a very big problem and it doesn't help that they aren't more transparent about stats. Melee has been outclassed by primary and secondary for a long time.

 

4 Load outs - We were briefly teased about this long ago, but it was buggy and taken out. Since than, no word. This should be an obvious feature. Who likes having to switch mods in and out? It can take a long time. Now call me crazy, but I think they are conflicted about load outs because of money and mods. They want you to have a max serration for each weapon in the hopes you paid for those fusion cores.

 

5 Platinum - This is nothing new in f2p games, but I was hoping DE would be like valve and use real money prices. Platinum's purpose is to disguise amounts.

 

6 CPU Performance - The game doesn't have the best utilization of multiple cores. If your a quad core user, you've probably noticed.

 

7 Co Op Performance - We need more options in this regard, they need a better net code, and or both. Hosts with even good internet download and upload speeds still have problems with fellow players. Maybe Private Servers or a browser can be an option?

 

8 Story - This has been very slow coming. I won't give them too much grief in this area.

 

9 Lotus - Has been a constant annoyance. Love an option to turn her off without turning off other sounds.

 

10 Hud - Many suggestions by users, but it's been very slow coming. Sentinels still don't have a health/status bar...

 

11 Better Fov- If you play pc games up close on a monitor, you may have noticed how important this is to gaming and that it can cause motion sickness if not properly set. I got word that this was being worked on, but that was long long ago. Proper fov/camera options would improve gameplay by managing enemies and the sentinel on screen. 

 

12 Content - The f2p model demands constant content. Has their pace been satisfactory? Are they keeping up well with the competition?

 

13 Communication - I admit, that they are better than a lot of devs in this regard, but there are many times they aren't. Looking at you, stealth nerfs...

Divided the quote into points for easier reply.

 

1. AI is not entirely accurate. They could make it wonderfully powerful, but the way you play it, might wreck it. AI is something that need to be tested in tons and i really mean tons of ways to achieve a "jack-of-all-trades" AI.

 

2. Stealth will come, although i would highly prefer a 1hit kill like you mentioned, since if you snap a neck, or slit a throat there is no way it would survive, yet, they announce they will sooner or later have it working "properly" but they have priorities, and atm, their priority is keeping content coming.

 

3. Balance, the all mighty multi-weaponry problem. This is inevitable. Today all weapons are the same, until someone finds out a new mod spec to wreck it. But i like you've mentioned, melee is... weak. Even my Fang.

 

4. not a big issue honestly, but could be a nice addon

 

5. Platinum is just fine as it is, even the prices (both for buying with RLC and ingame prices). No one makes you buy it, you buy it free willingly.

 

6. I read about some "bad performances" i got a I3 and have absolutely no problem at all.

 

7 . It's not DE fault. Hosting a private server costs money, and it's an expense they actually don't need. If they actually find out that "this" needs a change, just lock Hosting to specific requirements.

 

8. If you think Lore comes out of thin air, it doesn't, they need it to make sense with everything that is already here, everything they intend to add, and let loose ends to add extra features with time.

 

9. Options, Sound, Speech Volume. Problem solved.

 

10 . Cosmetic. The current HUD works perfectly. You don't need to know sentinel health, you can't heal it. Although would be a nice feature, is simply an extra. Not a priority not in a long shot.

 

11. I didn't really get what you meant, so i'll say nothing.

 

12. Perfect in my opinion. Both in Tenno Reinforcements (i mean, usable content) and events (playable content)

 

13. They are not forced to say every move. If they wish to pick up Rhino and delete it from their database, they can, and not only they don't need to announce it, and they don't even need to explain it. It's their game, all rights of it belong to them. Every info they let out, every announcement/news is more of a "favor" than actually a obligations. In this case, i believe they are one of the best i've had the pleasure to communicate with.

 

 

Regards

Your fellow Tenno, Endrance

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Abandon ship!

But on topic, yes, the game seems to be dying for some time now and there is an air of pressure every time I come to the forums. Heck I don't even play the game anymore, just scout for an ocassional alert and that's it. The reasons are listed in the OP. And considering the pace they're updating and fixing stuff I'm beginning to question how long this game can last. I mean it's been, what, seven months now and they've added one page of lore and 30+ weapons ^^" Plus these weekend events seem like desperate attempts to stop the outpour of players and get some time to work on some update.

All in all, the atmosphere is sad and concerning and it is a real shame.

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I agree as well with OP points.

To add more thing to the list:

 

- Daily logins:  Mainly suit/primary exp. This has been patched every time and still isn't perma fixed. Atleast make the daily login reward claim be accessable by a seperate button, so you still could change frames (ie unmaxed) before you claim it. Now we're being forced to change frames before logging out, which many of us would be forgetting.

- Alerts: What I noticed from this system is that it isn't consistent and/or versatile. After an update you get quite  lot of alerts + bunch of BP with it. Look at it lately, barely any alerts (1-3/hour) let alone BP's + worthless BP's. where are the catalyst BP's for all these weapon content updates?

- Resources: Imho the resources shouldn't be in the market at all, although I understand why it's there. cashing is good for devs (paychecks) but bad for cunsumers since it turns the game around to, to easy - to fast - to boring.

- Forma: All the new content comes with forma. Since the adding of forma, just got the a few in the beginning by logins, 3 in about 2weeks. Since then nothing by a close shot, no bp's either.

 

In my opinion these 4 points point out towards: 'We need money and only satisfy the consumers with "some" content that'll increase our income again.'

 

Even more stuff:

Weapon slots, pure plat but there's no way to know if the New weapons that come out are better than your current ones. The only way to test it is to sell your probably maxed weapon to create your new one, if it isn't better, you gotta start over.

And talking about weapons:

- We've been asking more info on our weapons in the UI/Arsenal since the beginning of CBT. Still the same, no new info.

We want our Modified values (all) + charge dmg/spd (melee) values to be visible, to be more precise.

The previous mod system let us see the chrg dmg/spd, now we've gotta guess =/ (aka, "is this a charged or basic attack based weapon?")

- Paris: is once again f*ed up at close range. You can't hit enemies right in front of your nose. It was patched, was a lot better but it's gotten broken again.

 

I could go on on this but there's no point atm. They rather input more content in a half broken galaxy rather than fixing the more pressing issues and implementing whats being asked for a long long time. The more they add, the longer and more difficult the balancing willl become.

Fix eveything first, add new stuf, then balance the new stuff. Since the rest is already done balancing so it become more reliable and easier to balance.

 

Just my 2cents about it. Don't get me wrong, I like the game, dev's and idea's. It just has been itching me before it even began.

I just kept my hopes up (still am) that they aren't going further in the wrong direction. But unfortunatly in it's current state, it's going backwards.

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currently the game seems to be the same since i joined(4 months ago), sure there are new weapons and frames but essentially i don't see any really NEW content, by that i mean some real challenge or some fun modes of gameplay, its all been the same since i joined, defense and mobile defense for affinity, boss only to farm for rare resources/blueprints and the other places just in order to free the map.

 

something that they could have implemented is a Boss Rush mode with all bosses levels going up to match the players, that way even vor would be worthy to fight against and not just used to farm seer/morphics

 

besides that we need a REAL boss, one that requires real strategy, a longass fight, see raids from other games, bosses with 3 phases, tons of hp and which a single mistake would cause you dearly because of the constant threat they create, thats something i'd like to see

Edited by Paptimus
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Dude, you really need to fight higher level mobs.

 

Don't bring an Ash though, a Vauban or Frost will suffice.

The point is that some players like Ash more then Nova, and in some cases they feel usseless. Warframes shouldnt be like a consumable item, that you change/switch from time to time, it should be YOU.

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Regarding performance, I have a fairly nice machine that I built myself. 

 

If there's a bottleneck, it's probably the CPU. Even so, it's a fairly nice Phenom XII - 3.4GHz on four processor cores.

 

When I do get slowdowns, sometimes they're huge and happen for reasons I can't pin down. That's the frustrating part about performance issues in Warframe. I want to say the enemy AI and spawning are just hogging resources (and using them inefficiently), but that's only my best guess.

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