Warframe Pay-2-Win? Riven Black Market!

[Valiant]

1 minute ago, Ziltrex said:

My intention was to tell the system is not perfect but you are still a monkey.

Well, if you're claiming you didn't try to insult others earlier you've kinda done it now...

[xXDeadsinxX]

2 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

My intention was to tell the system is not perfect but you are still a monkey.

What the...now you’re just insulting people, which does not only help your case but that’s also incredibly rude.

[DeMonkey]

2 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

My intention was to tell the system is not perfect but you are still a monkey.

Really? You "attempting" to call people "dumb" (I assume, you can't spell) was your way of telling people the system isn't perfect?

Do you regularly attempt to insult people when explaining things? That sounds like a nasty habit to have.

And yes, I am a Monkey... congrats on reading my name?

[Ziltrex]

2 minutes ago, Valiant said:

It's not a hard force.

If you want to grind you can grind. There's a choice. Your argument was initially that it's pay to win, not how people are forced/inclined/encouraged to obtain platinum - that isn't pay to win. Slot removal would be nice but honestly? They aren't that expensive. Doubt it's their main source of plat expenditure. Further to that you can get free (weapon) slots - events such as the one taking place right now or other ones often reward weapons with slots.

Seen numerous people saying on this forum they've never paid for plat and only traded for what they wanted. It's believable.

That said, all in all, is it that bad of a thing to want to spend money on this game, especially if you've played it a ton and enjoy it? I have spent money because I enjoy the game, not because I feel forced. You don't need to dish out millions to get by.

Either way going into depth about where the platinum has come from is getting into pedantics.

" They aren't that expensive " If the air cost money then you still breathing. No matter how expensive is if it is there. 1 plat is still cost money no matter how trivial it is. It is a thing which should not be cost platinum at all they can get more platinum if they remove this restriction and just charging cosmetics only. What is the better in appeal the system where you need to pay for mailing "free to play wow" or pay for grouping "still wow" or just play the game and pay only if you like a skin or just want an item faster than others. 

If you want to spend money on what you enjoy it is legit and you can pay for certain things but for others to ask money is makes them beggars because they beg in every corner for money. There are better systems for free to playing where you didn't need to pay a cent only if you want cosmetics but in gameplay sense it is not restrict you. Slots does because your entire existence here is the grinding.

[Zyneris]

4 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

That is a great convenience with a harsh restriction. See I have a tons of slot because I bought it otherwise no reason to play the game because the reason you play it collecting stuffs and kill for loot. It is a restrictive and bad game design to put items behind paywall to get "convenience" which is a baseline thing in other normal games. Peoples here think the platinum grows on tree "like monkeys" and saying "repeating" the same thing which is fail. You can trade for credits but if you haven't slots the whole trading falls into the deep. 

As a person who has been playing for a short time now, I have to say there are TONS of other reasons to play. If you, as the player, choose to allow that to be your only reason to play, that is YOUR CHOICE. You cannot blame the developer for that. That being said before I ever used my first amount of plat, I have 0 need for additional slots. Once you master an item you can get rid of it, freeing up space. Unless it's a prime piece or super-mega-ultra-rare-hard-to-get item, you can easily sell it for credits and get it another time if you so choose. The proof of your mastery with said item is basically your way of collecting without having to keep the item. There are a ton of items that I sell once I master because I'm like "ew never again". 

In closing, this game is 100% playable without needing to purchase plat or trading. It may take you longer, but that's the point. It is a GREAT design to force people to pay for convenience, otherwise you punish long standing players that have taken the time to grind everything by handing stuff out like candy. We are VERY lucky that DE gives up so many options to have EVERYTHING in game when tons of other games take those items away and that's that. 

I'm rambling. My thoughts. Out.

[Ziltrex]

3 minutes ago, Valiant said:

Well, if you're claiming you didn't try to insult others earlier you've kinda done it now...

The monkey is still not an insulting thing. please read above.

[Ziltrex]

2 minutes ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

What the...now you’re just insulting people, which does not only help your case but that’s also incredibly rude.

I think you guys living in the US. It was not intended insulting but if needs I could insult to prove a point which is still there. If you can't do with sweets you can try with vinegar.

[SirinCorium]

25 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

This game in the sense pay to win because you must buy platinum if you wish to buy slot...

There are so many fallacies in just 19 words.

1) No one MUST buy platinum. It can be gotten completely free from trading. Except for Excalibur Prime and Zephyr Prime, I have obtained every frame. And I have paid exactly ZERO real world money for them or their slots, Or for reactors. Or for catalysts. Palettes. Boosters. Or anything.

2) Buying slots does NOT equal winning. There is no magic insta-kill God mode unlocked by increasing your inventory capacity.

3) And winning what? Leaderboards for PvE? This game has a sparse, less-than-prestigious PvP aspect that is hardly MLG-caliber competition. If people are paying cash to keep a high K/D or Win% in Conclave, especially by the purchasing of slots, they are certainly not doing it by playing Warframe as intended. 

[Ziltrex]

2 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

Really? You "attempting" to call people "dumb" (I assume, you can't spell) was your way of telling people the system isn't perfect?

Do you regularly attempt to insult people when explaining things? That sounds like a nasty habit to have.

And yes, I am a Monkey... congrats on reading my name?

Technically those peoples whom thinking this system is perfect and good are dumb but thats an different thing. I pointed out if you not pay you get nothing. Others whom are trading for platinum mainl those whom not paid a cent on the game. I spent a lot of it just only for slots because I won't play a game in other wise if I need to sacrifice my weapons and frames. And not insulting peoples when arguing but arguments are comes with insults too if the others doesn't understand a simple thing. You guys tried with the other line but still not got what is my point was. 

I appreciate it and I congrat you now focusing.

[Valiant]

1 minute ago, Ziltrex said:

" They aren't that expensive " If the air cost money then you still breathing. No matter how expensive is if it is there. 1 plat is still cost money no matter how trivial it is. It is a thing which should not be cost platinum at all they can get more platinum if they remove this restriction and just charging cosmetics only. What is the better in appeal the system where you need to pay for mailing "free to play wow" or pay for grouping "still wow" or just play the game and pay only if you like a skin or just want an item faster than others. 

If you want to spend money on what you enjoy it is legit and you can pay for certain things but for others to ask money is makes them beggars because they beg in every corner for money. There are better systems for free to playing where you didn't need to pay a cent only if you want cosmetics but in gameplay sense it is not restrict you. Slots does because your entire existence here is the grinding.

It isn't expensive though. If you're suggesting the grind is bad and people are forced to spend money it would go hand in hand with that they are required to spend even more money because the slot price is too expensive. But it isn't and it's actually easy to get whatever the cost is via trading chat if you know what to do. Slots simply aren't as big a problem as you're suggesting because you can get the plat if you're patient.

Putting that aside, who's exactly begging for money? You lost me there. 

[xXDeadsinxX]

1 minute ago, Ziltrex said:

I think you guys living in the US. It was not intended insulting but if needs I could insult to prove a point which is still there. If you can't do with sweets you can try with vinegar.

Why does it matter where I live? You didn’t prove your point before the insult, and you still haven’t. 

I’m just waiting for this thread to being locked since it’s honestly derailed into a lot of nonsense.

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, Ziltrex said:

Technically those peoples whom thinking this system is perfect and good are dumb but thats an different thing.

No, that's the thing I was talking about. Not a different thing at all.

You attempted to insult people, you pretended otherwise. Your argument is soured by ad hominem attacks.

[Valiant]

8 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

The monkey is still not an insulting thing. please read above.

Uh wrong. 'you are still a monkey' - can definitely be interpreted as an insult in the way you've used it. Kinda struggle to pull the wool over eyes there. Why repeat his name like that exactly? Didn't even use his full name.

It's the way you've used it and trying to backtrack isn't working out well. For the record I live in the UK.

Edited March 28, 2018 by Valiant

[Ziltrex]

4 minutes ago, Zyneris said:

As a person who has been playing for a short time now, I have to say there are TONS of other reasons to play. If you, as the player, choose to allow that to be your only reason to play, that is YOUR CHOICE. You cannot blame the developer for that. That being said before I ever used my first amount of plat, I have 0 need for additional slots. Once you master an item you can get rid of it, freeing up space. Unless it's a prime piece or super-mega-ultra-rare-hard-to-get item, you can easily sell it for credits and get it another time if you so choose. The proof of your mastery with said item is basically your way of collecting without having to keep the item. There are a ton of items that I sell once I master because I'm like "ew never again". 

In closing, this game is 100% playable without needing to purchase plat or trading. It may take you longer, but that's the point. It is a GREAT design to force people to pay for convenience, otherwise you punish long standing players that have taken the time to grind everything by handing stuff out like candy. We are VERY lucky that DE gives up so many options to have EVERYTHING in game when tons of other games take those items away and that's that. 

I'm rambling. My thoughts. Out.

There is tons of reasons but the reasons come from one fact you want to enjoy a game. Normally if you enjoy a game you buy it and you play it because of fun. In this game your fun cannot be full if you are limited to enjoy the game. See I can buy the best items in the game if I wish to but if I have not spend on slots then I must sell one by one and there is no point to play the game because.

1. Most of the items in game are needs levelling and formaing and that is time and costed in rescources. You need to sell them and repeat.

2. The early levels are not fun and if you do them then you still forced to stay in the early phase of the game but you cannot go further because you have no better items and gears because you constantly sell them for better shinies. That is not a fun in my experience to have only 1 pair of weapons and 1-2 frame.

The time invested into get a gear is not balanced with the fun factor so you do more and more work and you cannot enjoy what you earned hard because the slots. Thats all.

[Ziltrex]

3 minutes ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

Why does it matter where I live? You didn’t prove your point before the insult, and you still haven’t. 

I’m just waiting for this thread to being locked since it’s honestly derailed into a lot of nonsense.

I proved the point when I pointed out but you guys attacked it because you think it otherwise. I give examples and pointed out directly what makes the game pay to win but these phrases seems went far far away. Np next time I won't comment these things and let your point of views untouched. Not derailed btw because the point is what makes the game pay to win. Rivens luxury items those are not pay to winish because you can ask as much for them as much you ask. The point here the slots which unable to earn other ways. 

[Ziltrex]

4 minutes ago, Valiant said:

Uh wrong. 'you are still a monkey' - can definitely be interpreted as an insult in the way you've used it. Kinda struggle to pull the wool over eyes there. Why repeat his name like that exactly? Didn't even use his full name.

It's the way you've used it and trying to backtrack isn't working out well. For the record I live in the UK.

That is worse than the US but don't get it as insult.

[Ziltrex]

5 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

No, that's the thing I was talking about. Not a different thing at all.

You attempted to insult people, you pretended otherwise. Your argument is soured by ad hominem attacks.

Okay then change subject. Peace be with you. Monkey.

[xXDeadsinxX]

3 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

I proved the point when I pointed out but you guys attacked it because you think it otherwise. I give examples and pointed out directly what makes the game pay to win but these phrases seems went far far away. Np next time I won't comment these things and let your point of views untouched. Not derailed btw because the point is what makes the game pay to win. Rivens luxury items those are not pay to winish because you can ask as much for them as much you ask. The point here the slots which unable to earn other ways. 

Insulting people doesn’t prove your point, which is what you’ve done here. The trading system is not even close to being a pay to win system, nor is it a leeching system.

[Ziltrex]

1 minute ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

Insulting people doesn’t prove your point, which is what you’ve done here. The trading system is not even close to being a pay to win system, nor is it a leeching system.

Then think this. Peace be with you too. I decided to stop pointing out things here so please don't reply to this. Thanks and see you guys in the next time.

Edited March 28, 2018 by Ziltrex

[(XBOX)MerlyBR]

Yeah sure *coughing noises*

[Zyneris]

1 minute ago, Ziltrex said:

There is tons of reasons but the reasons come from one fact you want to enjoy a game. Normally if you enjoy a game you buy it and you play it because of fun. In this game your fun cannot be full if you are limited to enjoy the game. See I can buy the best items in the game if I wish to but if I have not spend on slots then I must sell one by one and there is no point to play the game because.

1. Most of the items in game are needs levelling and formaing and that is time and costed in rescources. You need to sell them and repeat.

2. The early levels are not fun and if you do them then you still forced to stay in the early phase of the game but you cannot go further because you have no better items and gears because you constantly sell them for better shinies. That is not a fun in my experience to have only 1 pair of weapons and 1-2 frame.

The time invested into get a gear is not balanced with the fun factor so you do more and more work and you cannot enjoy what you earned hard because the slots. Thats all.

This is a state of mind. You, as the player, feel that you NEED those items determined to be "best". However, TONS of players will tell you that you can achieve great things with basically anything in this game. 

 

You #1: That's the point of the game isn't it? If you want to collect all the things, you level them. You don't have to forma every single item in the game and really, why would you? I would never forma my tutorial MK-Bo, or the MK-Paris. If you're going for endgame, you need to find what works best for you as the player. Level up that frame, the weapons, the mods, etc. All that can be done without the need of plat. 

Your #2: Why are the early levels not fun? Why are you playing a game that doesn't feel fun to you? I'm currently leveling 2 new frames and I LOVE doing the early planets just farming out the survival missions trying to see how much damage I can do and learn how to play the frame. For example: Leveling Harrow, I'd NEVER want to take him somewhere to level where I needed to be on point with my skills. I'd ruin the whole thing for my team and drag them down with my stupid. I have a specific frame I take to high-level/endgame because I know the frame and the weapons front to back. Do you see where I'm going with this? You don't need the better 'shinies' for endgame. You truly don't. Does it help? It might, but it's not mandatory. It's more for the "wow look at my damages zomgdabest#dpscharts2018". 

Again I feel like I'm starting to ramble, but I think my point comes across. Everything you're mentioning is YOUR  state of mind. No developer should have to accommodate that. You are in control of your life and your time. 

[Pyrewyn]

Just now, Ziltrex said:

-multiple post rant snip-

it's very obvious english isn't your first language, but it isn't socially acceptable to call someone else an animal anywhere in the world, back on topic of your actual argument, even if someone has to buy the plat to begin with, alot of the time purchased plat stays in circulation for a long time because it's only used for trade, people are allowed to spend money on DE not only to get plat, but to support the company too  

[DeMonkey]

3 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

Then think this. Peace be with you too. I decided to stop pointing out things here so please don't reply to this. Thanks and see you guys in the next time.

Not a fan of this, seems too much like a cop out and trying to get the final word in, all in a single post.

Of course, the best cop out is to simply apologise. 

[Ziltrex]

2 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

Not a fan of this, seems too much like a cop out and trying to get the final word in, all in a single post.

Of course, the best cop out is to simply apologise. 

I won't apologize for nothing. Peace be with you see you in the next thread.

[Valiant]

10 minutes ago, Ziltrex said:

That is worse than the US but don't get it as insult.

Really? Doubt it.

Anyways, if you don't supposedly understand how it was used as an insult (think you're dishonest) that's your problem and you should be more considerate in how you type/phrase/speak in the future.