List of Vauban Grenade/Mine Suggestions; NO to Turrets/Drones; Ending Thread

[FoxFX]

POSITIVES ON CURRENT TESLA

• Recent rework attempted new CC-damage change with the "Holding-Down" Charge Mechanic
  • Full Charge adds Damage and Status Chance up to 100% at max

NEGATIVES ON CURRENT TESLA

• Tesla still remains attacking one enemy at a time where in game players are often in situations surrounded by enemies
  • This aspect of Tesla's 1-hit enemy at a time requires max casting of the ability to make it effective
• Current abilities Bastille and Vortex are considered greater options to use then Tesla practically at all times
• Damage of Tesla still negligibly weak for a grenade-type ability
• Holding down mechanic can leave players open to counterattacks which is very detrimental for Vauban and his relatively below average Health + Shield + Armor

 

SUGGESTION: "TAP-TOGGLE" TESLA CONCEPT AND HOW IT WORKS

{TOGGLING ON TESLA}

• Paying the low initial cost for this ability (somewhere around 20-25 Energy), Vauban holds onto the grenade
• While Vauban holds onto the grenade, he is actually adding charge to the Tesla Bomb
• Each second, Tesla drains ~1 Energy which also adds damage to the ability's damage
• [Vauban receiving a buff while Tesla is toggled on] Candidates for this buff can include:
  • Decreasing Shield Recharge cooldown
  • Granting some other defensive buff
  • Granting some movement buff such as reload speed or running speed

{TOGGLING OFF TESLA}

• Toggling of Tesla causes Vauban to throw the grenade which explodes in a dome of electric surges for a few seconds much like the picture above
• Stuns all enemies that are hit and that enter the electric dome
• Three optional functions for this detonating Tesla
  • Damage could either be a burst shock grenade which inflicts a high stun duration,
  • a continuous stunning and damaging field which deals damage over time
  • pulsing electric charges as an AOE burst
• Range of this Tesla variant can hit at a larger radius than the previous one

{TESLA NEW AUGMENT FUNCTION: FEEDBACK}

• Vauban receives a buff which improves the damage of the next Tesla thrown based on how many enemies are hit by a current Tesla
• Buff lasts for XX seconds (affected by duration)

 

NOTES ON MINELAYER VARIANT OF THIS CONCEPT

{HOLDING DOWN TO SWITCH MINES}

• Options for mines in this Minelayer follows:
  • [TESLA] Burst Electric mine creating temporary Electric-proc shock field
  • [MOLOTOV] Bursts Heat mine creating temporary Heat-proc fire field
  • [CRYOGENIC] Burst Cold mine creating temporary Cold-proc ice field
  • [SMOG] Burst Toxic mine creating temporary Toxic-proc gas field

{OPTIONAL REPLACEMENTS}

• Other replacing options for mines
  • [FRAG] Burst Slash mine shredding enemy armor and inflicts 100% Slash proc
  • [CONCUSSION] Burst Radiation mine deafening enemies and inflicts 100% Confusion
  • [MAGNETIC] Burst Magnetic mine temporarily preventing enemy movement and inflicts 100% Magnetic Proc
  • [PULSE] Burst Impact mine disarming enemies and inflicts 100% stagger

 

---

 

SEEKER MINE CONCEPT AKA "CLUSTER" AND HOW IT WORKS

 

{ACTIVATE TO SUMMON CLUSTERS OF SEEKER MINES}

• Seeker Mines from this ability draw enemy aggro (attract enemies that are X-XX meters afar)
• Vauban summons 6+ Seeker Mines
• Seeker Mines move around enemies for a while until they decisively latch onto enemies
• Seeker Mines that latch on enemies successfully staggers the enemy
• Seeker Mines from Vauban can be destroyed by three ways
  • DESTROYED WHILE LATCHED ON ENEMIES: Triggered when a player targets the mine on the enemy
  • DESTROYED ON ENEMY DEATH: Triggered when the attached enemy is killed
  • DESTROYED IF ENEMY DESTROYS THEM BEFORE LATCHING ONTO ONE OF THEM: Works when an enemy destroys the Seeker Mine still on the field unattached
• Seeker Mines have a Health of XXXX

{LIST OF POSSIBLE EFFECT OF SEEKER MINES WHILE LATCHING ONTO ENEMIES}

• Debuff enemy Damage Output
• Debuff slowing down enemy movement
• Debuff periodically jamming attached enemy weapons (can happen every 8 seconds jamming their weapons for 5 seconds)

{LIST OF POSSIBLE EFFECT OF SEEKER MINES EXPLODING}

• Dealing XXX Radiation Damage while deafening surrounding enemies caught in the explosion
• Dealing XXX Blast Damage while shredding enemy armor
• Dealing XXX Magnetic Damage disarming enemy weapons
• Dealing XXX [Damage-Type] Damage as a debilitating smoke mine reducing enemy accuracy
• Dealing XXX [Damage-Type] Damage as a stun mine stunning enemies for a few seconds
• Dealing XXX [Damage-Type] Damage which makes the explosion force enemies to drop Ammo/Orbs/Battle Loot

 

---

BOLAS CONCEPT AND HOW IT CAN WORK FOR VAUBAN

 

{VAUBAN THROWS THIS ABILITY AS A SPECIAL TRAP+BOMB PROJECTILE}

• Sends the Bolas which are 3 Magnetic Mines tied together on one end of a tether.
• The projectile has the Bolas spin around and pulls enemies toward its epicenter having each of the 3 mines deal Magnetic Damage when their revolutions hit enemies
• As the ability's projectile duration ends, the Bolas explodes dealing 3 instances of Damage to surrounding enemies
• This ability can become a means to reposition, push away, and gather a small group of enemies fast and quickly.
• Enemies hit by the Bolas explosion are stunned for a few seconds.
• A DEAD SPACE VIDEO OF HOW A BOLAS COULD BE IMPLEMENTED IN WARFRAME

 

---

MOTOLOV BOMB FOR VAUBAN AND MECHANICS

{EXPLODES IN A LINGERING PATCH OF FIRE}

• Deals XXX-XXXX Heat damage per second
• Patch radius of X - XX meters laid on the point of impact

{ENEMIES CAUGHT IN THE MOTOLOV INITIAL EXPLOSION PANIC RUNNING AROUND LEAVING BEHIND FIRE TRAILS}

• Enemies hit by the initial Motolov explosion are affected by a special panic proc
• panicked enemies affected by this leave behind flame trails dealing XXX = XXX Heat damage per second

{MISCELLANEOUS EFFECTS FOR MOLOTOV}

• ARMOR DEBUFF - Each Heat damage from Molotov reduces enemy armor
• DAMAGE OVERTIME DEBUFF - Enemies in Molotoc explosion/fire patches receive increased damage by +XXX% per second in Molotov

 

---

QUANTUM BOMB MECHANICS

{TRAPS ENEMIES IN A TIME-STOPPING STASIS FIELD}

• Duration of this bomb's stasis effect can be very low
• Blasts creates a time-stasis dome absorbing all incoming damage added to it
• Other grenades thrown in this dome adds XXX% of the bomb's damage to the stasis field's explosion
• gimmick can be added to dome where enemies enter the dome can shorten duration of the stasis

{EXPLODES AFTER STASIS DURATION ENDS}

• Explosion deals base Blast or Impact damage and also adds in all incoming damage values added to it
• Could also add in all elements added to it for additional damage type effect

{UTILITY POSSIBILITY}

• Can act as a grenade with a temporary defensive utility that can even stop enemy projectiles

 

---

SONIC/CONCUSSION MINE/GRENADE MECHANICS

LINK TO FLAVOR GIF

{EXPLODES INTO A SUPERSONIC BLAST DEAFENING AND STUNNING NON-ROBOTIC ENEMIES}

• Enemies deafen remain this way for XX seconds and can be vulnerable to Vauban's passive while the duration lasts

{NEW EFFECT ON ROBOTIC ENEMIES}

• Mine in this version distorts robotic enemy circuitry and signals turning them into allies of Vauban
• The robotic enemies turned this way are vulnerable to all damage sources

{POSSIBLE ADDED DAMAGE MULTIPLIER CONSIDERING THE CONFUSION THIS ABILITY OFFERS}

• Can cause enemies affected (mostly non-robotic enemies) to receive x #.# damage from all sources.

---

MAJOR ISSUES BEING OVERLOOKED IN THE IDEA OF GIVING VAUBAN A TURRET

Quote

I have been severely against the idea of a turret ability for Vauban for the longest time. Namely because of how passive and non-engaging his playstyle is now, and how a turret would just worsen this aspect of Vauban.

We already have a turret ability not just in the form of the current Tesla, but in the form of Chroma's 4th ability Effigy. If Vauban was to have a turret as well it would validate debate on how the two abilities are rather too similar or one is much more efficient than the other. We also need to understand how just suggesting either of the abilities to be stronger will result in major balancing consequences.

The idea of giving Vauban a turret also would in sound conflict with [DE]'s Warframe design philosophy of trying to avoid abilities that are "Press-and-Forget." If such a turret would exist for Vauban, there is certainty that Vauban builds would arise where players would most likely AFK in missions most of the time. The recent Warframes that have been released and ones that have been reworked a bit more have their ability playstyle garner some means to build themselves up to match their abilitie's strength against higher level enemies. Examples such as the recent Saryn rework require a bit more effort to spread her Spore-spread playstyle since the strength of the ability will decay if no enemies are within her reach. Nidus' striking power of his first ability and his survival are built up through the use of his passive ability. Warframes with melee-striking abilities or Exalted-Melee playstyles have the current reliance of the combo counter in order to have their attacks reach high levels of damage.

We should not keep throwing the idea that a turret ability would save Vauban, there are better options to consider. In this thread, I chose the option of developing ideas for more improved grenades/mines/traps/etc. I feel such a direction could not only maintain his "CC specialist" status to some degree, but also give him a more versatile role that could lead to support and damage with this.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 5, 2018 by FoxFX

[BiancaRoughfin]

I think the ideal for Tesla would have been making it work like the Arc Traps from Grineer Tilesets, make it Duration based and not Charge based, have it fire a constant electrical arc onto  1~3 enemies that move near it and make it so the charge function caused the Arcs to chain from one enemy to another for another 1~3 enemies hit depending on the charge level.

Edited August 17, 2018 by BiancaRoughfin

[FoxFX]

3 hours ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

I think the ideal for Tesla would have been making it work like the Arc Traps from Grineer Tilesets, make it Duration based and not Charge based, have it fire a constant electrical arc onto  1~3 enemies that move near it and make it so the charge function caused the Arcs to chain from one enemy to another for another 1~3 enemies hit depending on the charge level.

So more in line with the continuous option I provided in this toggle-off concept?

[FoxFX]

I'll see if I can find some sort of animation to better visualize what I am trying to show as the alternative Tesla. While some believe Tesla should be some sort of Grineer Arc Trap, I fel it would be best suited to be just a burst AOE shock grenade.

I suggest this to make sure Vauban's 1st doesn't appear to be something like a rehashed Volt ability.

[FoxFX]

Working on a Minelayer variant of this concept. Will keep at it for now unless some feedback is given on this.

[FoxFX]

The same for this particular concept of the Tap-Toggle charge can work for a Minelayer variant of this ability.

Though, the question is what type of bombs would one want for this concept.

[FoxFX]

NOTES ON MINELAYER VARIANT OF THIS CONCEPT

{HOLDING DOWN TO SWITCH MINES}

• Options for mines in this Minelayer follows:
  • [TESLA] Burst Electric mine creating temporary Electric-proc shock field
  • [MOLOTOV] Bursts Heat mine creating temporary Heat-proc fire field
  • [CRYOGENIC] Burst Cold mine creating temporary Cold-proc ice field
  • [SMOG] Burst Toxic mine creating temporary Toxic-proc gas field

{OPTIONAL REPLACEMENTS}

• Other replacing options for mines
  • [FRAG] Burst Slash mine shredding enemy armor and inflicts 100% Slash proc
  • [CONCUSSION] Burst Radiation mine deafening enemies and inflicts 100% Confusion
  • [MAGNETIC] Burst Magnetic mine temporarily preventing enemy movement and inflicts 100% Magnetic Proc
  • [PULSE] Burst Impact mine disarming enemies and inflicts 100% stagger

[FoxFX]

I'll be working on a second forum thread on the CLUSTER MINE ability. I hope it can provide an option for a protective/offensive ability for Vauban.

[FoxFX]

Updated OP with the CLUSTER MINE ability concept. Will carefully work a little more on the suggestion.

[RhagosRedlux]

How about this guy?

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/warframe/images/3/3e/CCTeamBRaptorAgent.png/revision/latest?cb=20161021004942

I think the "seeker mine" should be this guy because it can follow enemies much faster (i think). I think this guy may perform better since its airborne and can drop bombs overhead in a straight wide line.

[FoxFX]

8 hours ago, RhagosRedlux said:

How about this guy?

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/warframe/images/3/3e/CCTeamBRaptorAgent.png/revision/latest?cb=20161021004942

I think the "seeker mine" should be this guy because it can follow enemies much faster (i think). I think this guy may perform better since its airborne and can drop bombs overhead in a straight wide line.

 

I am going to have to softly disagree with this idea. Initially, Vauban just throws devices around which are noticeable bombs, mines, and other traps. I want to bring and emphasize that root of his kit further.

The Seeker Mine idea does have Vauban throw down clusters of autonomous mines that roll around the area drawing enemy fire and attaching themselves to the enemy (much like the bombs the Grineer Seekers use), but I wouldn't depend too much on a second AI to spawn more AI-based entities in this game.

Besides, I wish to suggest ideas to create a certain level of engagement for Vauban's playstyle and not create some "press-and-forget" ability. Not until we ground down his playstyle with a more effective and quicker route.

[FoxFX]

Next mine/grenade ability to be worked on will be the "Bolas Mine." How this mine could be restructured will be further explained.

[FoxFX]

NOTES BEFORE DEPLOYING NEXT GRENADE

BOLAS

• Spinning mechanic which stuns and pulls enemies to the center
• After spinning for  few seconds, all 3 grenades on the Bolas collide with each other detonating 3 instances of damage
  • Each 3 instance could contain 3 different Elemental/Status/Debuff effect
• Could be a potential new ability for 2/3 slot

[FoxFX]

Working on an experimental ability known as "STICKY BOMB." A toggle ability where Vauban emits an aura and also gains a buff while the ability is active. Enemies that enter the aura are attached a mine to them each second inside the aura. Once Vauban toggles the ability off, Vauban actually triggers the attached bombs to enemies which can deal massive damage.

The work on this ability will be completely an "escape ability" which provides Vauban a more defensive measure if he ever is surrounded by enemies.

[FoxFX]

Upon some thoughts on the "STICKY BOMB" ability work, I have realized that most of the mechanic of this ability would be something of a more AOE-variant of Ash's Bladestorm. I will have to cancel this idea and work a bit more on the BOLAS ability.

[FoxFX]

Updated the OP with a preliminary description for the Bolas ability for Vauban.

[FoxFX]

Working on a small experimental idea for a new Bastille effect that has it as the new 4th ability for Vauban.

[FoxFX]

NOTES ON BASTILLE CONCEPT

{BASTILLE INSTEAD BECOMES A GRENADE THAT LEVITATES ENEMIES AFFECTED BY THE BLAST IN A ZERO-POINT ENERGY PRISON}

• Bastille no longer will have enemy limits to CC enemies, but will not levitate outside enemies that enter the cage
• Enemies suspended receive extra onus damage from Vauban's Tesla and Seeker Mine abilities
• Enemies suspended drop Omni Ammo ever X seconds while levitated by Bastille's effect
• Enemies killed while under Bastile's imprisonment have a 100% chance to drop Energy/Health Orbs on death
• {Debating} New effect of Bastille will have it drop enemies to the ground with devastating force when an enemy's levitation duration expires. Enemies levitation height can be increased when the CC-ed enemy is hit

[FoxFX]

MAJOR ISSUES BEING OVERLOOKED IN THE IDEA OF GIVING VAUBAN A TURRET

Quote

I have been severely against the idea of a turret ability for Vauban for the longest time. Namely because of how passive and non-engaging his playstyle is now, and how a turret would just worsen this aspect of Vauban.

We already have a turret ability not just in the form of the current Tesla, but in the form of Chroma's 4th ability Effigy. If Vauban was to have a turret as well it would validate debate on how the two abilities are rather too similar or one is much more efficient than the other. We also need to understand how just suggesting either of the abilities to be stronger will result in major balancing consequences.

The idea of giving Vauban a turret also would in sound conflict with [DE]'s Warframe design philosophy of trying to avoid abilities that are "Press-and-Forget." If such a turret would exist for Vauban, there is certainty that Vauban builds would arise where players would most likely AFK in missions most of the time. The recent Warframes that have been released and ones that have been reworked a bit more have their ability playstyle garner some means to build themselves up to match their abilitie's strength against higher level enemies. Examples such as the recent Saryn rework require a bit more effort to spread her Spore-spread playstyle since the strength of the ability will decay if no enemies are within her reach. Nidus' striking power of his first ability and his survival are built up through the use of his passive ability. Warframes with melee-striking abilities or Exalted-Melee playstyles have the current reliance of the combo counter in order to have their attacks reach high levels of damage.

We should not keep throwing the idea that a turret ability would save Vauban, there are better options to consider. In this thread, I chose the option of developing ideas for more improved grenades/mines/traps/etc. I feel such a direction could not only maintain his "CC specialist" status to some degree, but also give him a more versatile role that could lead to support and damage with this.

 

[kapn655321]

I want Vauban's 4 to push/roll like a Katamari, with a projectile redirect like Zephyr has. 😃

[FoxFX]

Rather a bit jarring I haven't gotten a relevant feedback on any of the mine/grenade ideas I have posted nor on my excerpt on the whole "Vauban needs a turret" quote.

 

Anyways, working on the next grenade/mine "MOTOLOV" to be more of a stand-alone ability for Vauban. More details soon.

[FoxFX]

9 minutes ago, kapn655321 said:

I want Vauban's 4 to push/roll like a Katamari, with a projectile redirect like Zephyr has. 😃

You said the same thing in another thread. Is there any other comments you have in this particular one?

[kapn655321]

Just now, FoxFX said:

You said the same thing in another thread. Is there any other comments you have in this particular one?

Yes, actually. I appreciate the art assets to illustrate your ideas.
The idea of elemental grenade options is pretty excellent, also.

In hindsight, I think organizing these thoughts a bit would have been helpful.
Not to be harsh about it, but you've created your own wall of walls of text, which is pretty uninviting..
but that doesn't detract from the ideas you have.

The bolas, or at least some form of snare would be brilliant.
Perhaps they could drop enemies to prone, to set up for ground finishers?
That would be an excellent way to add skilled damage to his tactical CC.


Sorry to have posted my same idea in several threads..
but there are currently 4 threads up about vaub reworks..
and I didn't want to be thread #5. Get's a bit excessive.

[FoxFX]

8 hours ago, kapn655321 said:

Yes, actually. I appreciate the art assets to illustrate your ideas.
The idea of elemental grenade options is pretty excellent, also.

In hindsight, I think organizing these thoughts a bit would have been helpful.
Not to be harsh about it, but you've created your own wall of walls of text, which is pretty uninviting..
but that doesn't detract from the ideas you have.

The bolas, or at least some form of snare would be brilliant.
Perhaps they could drop enemies to prone, to set up for ground finishers?
That would be an excellent way to add skilled damage to his tactical CC.


Sorry to have posted my same idea in several threads..
but there are currently 4 threads up about vaub reworks..
and I didn't want to be thread #5. Get's a bit excessive.

Understandable.

I'll add in the Bolas Ground Finisher support effect you have added and see what more this would offer Vauban.

[FoxFX]

NOTES FOR "MOLOTOV" BOMB {COULD BE RENAMED ARSON BOMB}

• Has Vauban throw a grenade which explodes on surface contact igniting enemies in the blast and creates a patch of flame
• Enemies ignited run in panic and will not attack while haphazardly fleeing for X-XX seconds
• Enemies ignited by this ability will create fire trails in their path
• Fire Trails made form the ignited enemies and the flame patch of this ability itself deals XXX Heat damage per second
• Enemies not caught in the initial blast that enter the flame patch will NOT panic and flee from this effect.