MillbrookWest Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 (edited) Additional Info: - Not isolated to mission; happening in any mission type, on any tileset. - Hardware polling period (relevant to video): 250 milliseconds System Specs: - CPU: Fx-8320 @ 4.0GHz - GPU1: SSC GTX 970 - GPU2: GTX 660 [dedicated physX card] - RAM: 8 GB - SSD: Samsung Evo In-game settings: - Resolution: 1920x1080 - Constant weapon trails: off - Vsync: off - Everything else: on Launcher settings: - Full screen - 64-bit Mode - DX11 - Multi-threaded rendering Additional Settings: - Driver forced FPS limit of ~120fps - All other driver settings at Default Edited April 12, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDr3x Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 I just picked up the same video card, EVGA GTX 970 SSC a few days ago and am having this same stuttering issue.... If you find the answer to the problem, please share it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Linkski Posted April 16, 2015 Share Posted April 16, 2015 - SSD: Samsung Evo Is this the only hard drive you currently have in your system? Is there any chance you could try installing Warframe on another drive to see if the stuttering continues? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 17, 2015 Author Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) Is this the only hard drive you currently have in your system? Is there any chance you could try installing Warframe on another drive to see if the stuttering continues? Thanks! I have 4 drives :) Intel 530 (iirc) Boot SSD 80GB WD Black 1TB Storage Samsung Evo 240GB (Warframe Install location) - Drive not full, only gets used for games tbh. WD Red 4TB Back-up drive/ Home videos/ photo's etc ^that's also the order they're plugged into the Sata connectors of the mobo if that helps. Edited April 17, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salenstormwing Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Try turning off DirectX 11 (and 10). For some reason, the game is really stuttering with the DirectX 10 or 11 turned on for right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 17, 2015 Author Share Posted April 17, 2015 Is this the only hard drive you currently have in your system? Is there any chance you could try installing Warframe on another drive to see if the stuttering continues? Thanks! Hmmm, Installed Warframe on my boot SSD, and still getting stuttering. Stutter intervals seem consistent between the intel and samsung ssd. It may bit a bit better on my boot drive, but i can't say for certain given the 'random' generation of levels. But definitely present on Boot SSD. Additional note: Warframe is 'technically' installed on my Intel boot drive all the time. I use a symbolic link to my Samsung SSD where i moved the warframe files. There was no 'custom install' option when i installed Warframe, It always got put in my AppData folder which i don't want. (i don't know if this has changed) Further note: For my little test above, Warframe was installed on the Intel boot SSD alone. No symbolic links. As far as i can tell, that's it's default install location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Error989 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) why are you using your 660 to do physics?? 970 is MUCH better at doing everything alone...you can try unparking your cpu cores https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/289244-framerate-drops-high-cpu-loads-cpu-overheating-this-might-fix-it-cpu-core-unparking/ the problem also might be the fact that 970 has 3.5GB of fast VRAM and 512MB of super slow VRAM... (tho I dont think warframe fills it up soooo it probably isn't the problem)edit: dont blame your storage, it's 10x faster than it needs to be Edited April 17, 2015 by Error989 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonicSonedit Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 MillbrookWestWhat is your OS? It's a common issue on 32bit OS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 17, 2015 Author Share Posted April 17, 2015 why are you using your 660 to do physics?? 970 is MUCH better at doing everything alone... you can try unparking your cpu cores https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/289244-framerate-drops-high-cpu-loads-cpu-overheating-this-might-fix-it-cpu-core-unparking/ the problem also might be the fact that 970 has 3.5GB of fast VRAM and 512MB of super slow VRAM... (tho I dont think warframe fills it up soooo it probably isn't the problem) edit: dont blame your storage, it's 10x faster than it needs to be When you fully load the 970 (100% core load), having a separate card that can do the PhysX calculations will keep your frame-rates up. Especially when some PhysX workloads add another 40% to your cards workload. At the moment, quite rightly, few games do that. But since i'll end up with the set-up anyway, i might as well run it like that now. There's no loss or gain from running it my way except in the instances where i want to supersample and have physX on (like i would do with warframe if the UI allowed me) ie, run Warframe in 4K. DE_Dmitri asked after my storage. For thoroughness, i answered his query regarding my storage set-up. And quite rightly, he/she doesn't know how i run my system. Drive could be old and dying for example. Or, i could be doing something stupid like i am doing with the symbolic links. It's a perfectly valid question and hopefully i answered it...hopefully. MillbrookWest What is your OS? It's a common issue on 32bit OS. Windows 8.1, 64-Bit OS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salenstormwing Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Still curious if you've tried turning off DirectX 10 & 11 yet. Just to test to see if the problem is still happening. I had to turn both off to get Warframe running steady again, so I'm thinking that might be the issue, but it would be nice if someone else could try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frawg Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) When you fully load the 970 (100% core load), having a separate card that can do the PhysX calculations will keep your frame-rates up. Especially when some PhysX workloads add another 40% to your cards workload. Bear with the withdrawl, have you tried turning off PhysX (or moving it to the 970)? Your OSD shows neat things: Only GPU1's first percentage (and the game's frames) drops during the freezes . Everything else seems pretty consistant. Things I sort of wonder: Also, does the stuttering happen in other games? (To test if it's specific to warframe) Other games with PhysX? (To test if WF's PhysX is odd) Any IO activity during freezes? (I had a very similar problem a while back, and I boiled it down to hard drive failure; CPU was waiting on the hard drive to respond, and didn't do anything else until then.) the problem also might be the fact that 970 has 3.5GB of fast VRAM and 512MB of super slow VRAM... (tho I dont think warframe fills it up soooo it probably isn't the problem) Unless he didn't update his drivers in the past 2-3 months, the drivers should partition all video activity into the first 3.5 GB (which he doesn't even come close to--he sits at just above 1200 MB the entire video.), and if the system uses all of that, it will start using that last 512. (Moreover, Nvidia uses that 512 as a cache until then; some odd cases should see a performance increase.) Edited April 17, 2015 by Frawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 17, 2015 Author Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) Still curious if you've tried turning off DirectX 10 & 11 yet. Just to test to see if the problem is still happening. I had to turn both off to get Warframe running steady again, so I'm thinking that might be the issue, but it would be nice if someone else could try. DX9 isn't natively Multithreaded aware being predominately single threaded. So as i understand, running DX9 incurs a significant performance overhead when multithreading, as a result. I can try running in DX9 mode if need be, but it's no secret that the FX CPU chips from AMD perform very poorly when you start stripping away multithreading and relying on single core grunt. ie, Single threaded performance on my CPU sucks. Bear with the withdrawl, have you tried turning off PhysX (or moving it to the 970)? Your OSD shows neat things: Only GPU1's first percentage (and the game's frames) drops during the freezes . Everything else seems pretty consistant. Things I sort of wonder: Also, does the stuttering happen in other games? (To test if it's specific to warframe) Other games with PhysX? (To test if WF's PhysX is odd) Any IO activity during freezes? (I had a very similar problem a while back, and I boiled it down to hard drive failure; CPU was waiting on the hard drive to respond, and didn't do anything else until then.) Unless he didn't update his drivers in the past 2-3 months, the drivers should partition all video activity into the first 3.5 GB (which he doesn't even come close to--he sits at just above 1200 MB the entire video.), and if the system uses all of that, it will start using that last 512. (Moreover, Nvidia uses that 512 as a cache until then; some odd cases should see a performance increase.) I haven't tried PhysX on/off, but as GPU2 in the OSD displays, it barely (if at all) got used. Any activity on that GPU[2] is PhysX related, if PhysX were causing the problem the stalls should coincide with a bump in activity for my 660. However, like the DX9 thing, if required i will run it on/off, as annoying as it would be given the sparse PhsyX usage...That's not a dig at the devs, just an observation of it actually being annoying to test :/ - Stutters are isolated to Warframe - Games and PhysX work fine with the set-up, even when stressed. - 970 rendering 4k image (iirc) downsampled to whatever it's downsampled to in the pic below. - 660 pulling the PhysX workload -970 doing all the work - Warframe runs off of an SSD. Remaining life in both are 99% and 96% for the Samsung and Intel respectively. EDIT: For thoroughness, i ran it in both DX9 without PhysX, and DX11 without PhysX. Both still produce a the same type of stutter in the video. I should also note, i've been running my set-up for a few months now and haven't had issue. The stutter is new to me. Video of the DX11 run with no PhysX, cut together with the DX9 run with no PhysX (API in OSD) Fun note - My driver limit of 120 fps got overridden in DX9...weird :/ Edited April 17, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weezedog Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 any kind of malware/spyware being on the system can cause this too, you may want to look for other processes using considerable amounts of RAM and CPU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 17, 2015 Author Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) any kind of malware/spyware being on the system can cause this too, you may want to look for other processes using considerable amounts of RAM and CPU. System is clean Would manifest with other titles too if that were the case. Even more so with more taxing titles, however again, not the case. Additionally, I haven't downloaded anything recently, been to any other site i don't normally go to recently so there's little chance of malware of spyware getting onto my system. even more so considering i run Malwarebytes and Eset scans every other week. Eset being my real time AV solution. Malwarebytes functions as an 'on demand' scanner. Edited April 17, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandingy Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) For anyone wondering if this is an Nvidia GPU-related issue, it definitely is not. I have an AMD R9 270 and this has been a constant issue for the past few days for me, since whatever recent update caused this problem. I have no issues whatsoever in any other games, even Dragon Age: Inquisition on high settings. I run Dragon Age with Razer Cortex just because I lack an SSD and it helps quite a bit, but even when trying to run Warframe with Cortex, the stuttering still occurs. Luckily (or maybe not so luckily) I haven't been having crashes related to AMD, though, so that's something. EDIT: I disabled DX10 and DX11 in the launcher, and that seemed to fix the issue. On top of that, I haven't been able to see anything visually different. I'm not entirely sure why that is, since I really don't mess with my hardware options too much, but whatever. I'm just happy that the stuttering is gone. Edited April 18, 2015 by ABipolrMandingo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 18, 2015 Author Share Posted April 18, 2015 (edited) Reported my system stuttering here a few days ago: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/439664-persistent-stuttering/ Did a little digging on my end to make sure i was good (virus, background programs etc.) and i saw these: (Stutter starts where i have highlighted) - Duration column provided Certain Cache reads are 100x longer than the others [i have not provided a location where the stutter stops...i forgot :/] A clip of my game running to verify the pics above correlate to the stuttering^ The two pictures above are the ones in the video background as the game stutters. So, is this an issue on my end? If so, how do i fix it? Frame-rates don't bother me, but the hitching is annoying. My system specs, and more, are in my other thread. EDIT: Data logging from a game session: Edited April 22, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aim4it Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 Defrag your hard drive, add the game exe's and the /Warframe/* folder to AV exclusions, don't play vlc media player while playing warframe may also help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 18, 2015 Author Share Posted April 18, 2015 Defrag your hard drive, add the game exe's and the /Warframe/* folder to AV exclusions, don't play vlc media player while playing warframe may also help. System specs in other thread. Defragging an SSD is never a good idea. Eset doesn't play nice with Warframe, been added to exclusions since before time VLC wasn't open. Unless you're talking about the pics in which case Warframe wasn't open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeGeeFi Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 I have been getting annoyed at this stuttering as well. Funny thing is that I'm quite new player and I don't think the hitching happened when I started playing ~couple of weeks ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 19, 2015 Author Share Posted April 19, 2015 (edited) I have been getting annoyed at this stuttering as well. Funny thing is that I'm quite new player and I don't think the hitching happened when I started playing ~couple of weeks ago. Yeah, it's new for me too. Started happening ~1 week ago. Edited April 19, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pythadragon Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 (edited) From the video clip, I wonder if the stuttering correlate with item pickup portraits displaying and incoming video/auto transmissions. I suspect that you have some video and/or audio codecs that aren't playing nicely with the game computer. Temporarily uninstall all codecs on your computer that are not Microsoft provided (as an example, codec packs are often installed along with media players such as vlc, mediaplayerclassic). Otherwise, read through this link and at least try DPC Latency Checker. It might help you diagnose your problem. I did have a similar issue at one point and I managed to diagnose it with these tools. I forgot what specifically was causing the issue, but it was something ridiculously obscure like an outdated printer driver that really shouldn't have been related but was... http://www.sysnative.com/forums/windows-7-windows-vista-tutorials/5721-how-diagnose-fix-high-dpc-latency-issues-wpa-windows-vista-7-8-a.html Edited April 19, 2015 by Pythadragon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frawg Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 (edited) - Stutters are isolated to Warframe - Games and PhysX work fine with the set-up, even when stressed. - Warframe runs off of an SSD. Remaining life in both are 99% and 96% for the Samsung and Intel respectively. EDIT: For thoroughness, i ran it in both DX9 without PhysX, and DX11 without PhysX. Both still produce a the same type of stutter in the video. Wow, that killed off a good number of ideas. All I have left: * Nvidia drivers up-to-date? ** Did it begin sometime after driver update? After Warframe's U16? ** Nvidia pre-render frame thing turned off? ** Tried with vsync on? * Stuttering persists if ran main on 660? * Turn off all Warframe's graphics settings, slowly turn them back on? * any IO activity on or relative to any drive during spikes (this will be hard to isolate; Windows loves to access drives all the time)? * Force CPU+GPU clocks (You got Afterburner for GPU; CPU, I'm pretty sure you can force it in the advanced power settings in Windows)? * Want to mention the end-all path: Wipe out everything and do a fresh install of Windows. ** Multi-day project ** Using linux to back up+restore entire partitions will make this thing a whole lot easier+faster (I can walk you through this). Edited April 21, 2015 by Frawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegtro Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 (edited) I get the same stuttering on my PC (2500K/970GTX/Win8.1/SSD) and PS4 on the liset/mission. It's been like that since update 15 and am quite surprised DE would have noticed it by now. Edited April 21, 2015 by vegtro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 (edited) Wow, that killed off a good number of ideas. All I have left: * Nvidia drivers up-to-date? ** Did it begin sometime after driver update? After Warframe's U16? ** Nvidia pre-render frame thing turned off? ** Tried with vsync on? * Stuttering persists if ran main on 660? * Turn off all Warframe's graphics settings, slowly turn them back on? * any IO activity on or relative to any drive during spikes (this will be hard to isolate; Windows loves to access drives all the time)? * Force CPU+GPU clocks (You got Afterburner for GPU; CPU, I'm pretty sure you can force it in the advanced power settings in Windows)? * Want to mention the end-all path: Wipe out everything and do a fresh install of Windows. ** Multi-day project ** Using linux to back up+restore entire partitions will make this thing a whole lot easier+faster (I can walk you through this). I created a new thread with some stuff i found: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/443422-warframe-cache-reads-causing-stutterhitching/ It looks like it may be a problem with Warframe accessing its files. Since i've already messed around with running it off 2 different SSD's i think i will be out of luck until the problem gets fixed accidentally. Some (Warframe)cache read attempts take stupidly long amounts of time, ~100x the time to complete. And it's being read off an SSD. EDIT: - Drivers up to date - Nvidia CP options are default (don't tend to mess with it tbh) - A Warframe update caused the issue, don't know which one unfortunately, but a recent one within the last couple of weeks. Warframe ran perfectly fine before that for over a year on my current PC. It ran fine on my old PC too. - Haven't installed any new programs in a long, long, time either. What's running on the PC was running when Warframe was running fine. Edited April 22, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MillbrookWest Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 (edited) Had some time to sit down with Warframe again and got to logging a game session. If you need a full read out of just about every sensor on my system, i can post those too if need be. Warframe has been moved back to my Boot SSD and is running from it's default install location. Graph notes: - Polling period for data was 100ms Additional note: - I really dislike stutters, hence the time investment on my part >_< Edited April 22, 2015 by MillbrookWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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