BeardyKyle
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Posts posted by BeardyKyle
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6 hours ago, (PS4)Darth-Escar said:
First, Hallowed Ground is great. It's great status immunity with some bonus effects. Hallowed Reckoning, I don't care for it, but I've used it enough to see it's good. (9 forma and 35% usage on Oberon tends to have me able to say that about a lot of his stuff.) Renewal, it has good healing. If it takes too long to heal teammates, stand closer, use more strength, and/or use more duration. Phoenix Renewal, it's only bad if you neglect strength. Too much duration will make it redundant, but use strength, so Renewal will heal you well. If the healing is not enough, which is rarely the case with a good build, Phoenix Renewal will then save you. The healing is important to keep you alive during the cooldown. It may seem counterintuitive, but any situation you'd die while healing, you instead wouldn't. His passive is his worst thing, IMO. I don't need it. I don't try to use it. It just gets in the way of some Grineer missions, and kavat scanning. I want it fixed, or replaced.
hallowed ground can be great at mid level. The stat immunity is great. But once you reach levels of being one shot its better to move around than stay on it. It also relies on range, strength, duration and multiple casting to be useful imo - you can cast a few to cover a large area and go to town. At higher levels tho this just doesn't work, its only a stat removal at that point. Believe me I've experimented with just about every mod set up for Oberon and I know what you're talking abt, over 40% usage and quite a few forma invested as well.
high duration with renewal increases the bleedout reduction on teammates and is actually very useful with high strength. The prob with using phoenix renewal with high strength at high levels is you have a very small window where it can activate, quick thinking works out better as a fail safe than this augment does and it doesn't hinder hallowed ground at all.
so back to my point, the augments aren't useful as they should be and these two powers hg and renewal need to be fixed.
as for the passive, the health orb companion revive is the one of the more useful passives in the game I think.
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6 hours ago, Chipputer said:
Stop comparing frame abilities to other entire frames. Oberon does everything a little bit. Who cares if Nyx can control better? This is the reason why people write him off and then are all surprised when they see someone doing well with him.
You've clearly never used it. Enemies don't walk around it. They walk straight through it almost every time.
You're also both forgetting that radiation procs cannot be nullified.
you missed the point. You can cast hg twice to get that effect on the enemies who are on it...or you can spend the same energy to cast reckoning and hit those enemies plus more for the same effect with possibly more damage, since hallowed eruption damage is based on both strength and its remaining duration. Reckoning is simply more reliable and efficient
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16 minutes ago, Chipputer said:
Wow. You're missing out on DoT and guaranteed radiation procs for any enemy that walks over the little AoE, essentially making you able to control crowds much more effectively. Try it before you write it off.
its a waste of a slot. You already get a guaranteed rad proc from Reckoning. The area is too small to assume that other enemies will walk on it..yeah you could do it in a tight space..but that's what hallowed ground should be for.
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12 minutes ago, JSharpie said:
I'm just saying bud.
If you insist on making a rant post, at least provide how you would change it for the better at each point.
As for the topic at hand, I use him and I succeed with him. He's a bit boring, but not useless.
I did make some suggestions. I suppose I'll edit it to be more clear in a bit
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This has been a long time coming for me. First off let me say, I LOVE Oberon. Practically everything I do in Warframe is centered around playing Oberon and him being useful in as many situations as possible from Modding him, companions, weapon choices, focus choices. Everything is so I can play Oberon as effectively as possible.
Yet for all that fun I have playing him there's always this constant seething hatred that his some of his abilities are just outdated and just ever so slightly kind of lack luster.
I'll start with his augments which draw the bulk of my rage.
Hallowed Eruption - Why? WHY?? It does EXACTLY what Reckoning does but is limited to Hallowed Ground's area, Only a Max Duration+Range+Strength build would make it useful and even then Reckoning would STILL be the better choice. I get that it's supposed to be this lay a trap and trigger it at the most opportune moment kind of move but HG is already a very lackluster Trap ability because it isn't stealth based and even if it were, why would you ever need to use this over Reckoning - which practically has potential to do more damage at the same cost with one cast plus the added effect of a blind. In the name of Esteban Rodrigo Manuel Delgado Roberto Gonzales, get rid of this useless crap.
Suggestion: Enemies entering HG are instantly Irradiated and have 50% chance to explode after 12s dealing AoE Radiation and leaving behind a small HG puddle like current Hallowed Reckoning.
Phoenix Renewal - A mod I would actually love if you didn't need to cater your entire loadout in order to use it effectively at higher level. Effectively you need negative duration and relatively low strength in order for it to even have a window to activate - and with your healing being so slow/weak you might as well put in a max steel fiber so you don't die while healing/cooldown is happening. - Do Not misunderstand this combo works well and you are essentially a tank that can heal continuously and stay in a fight slightly longer because you know you won't die right now. BUT none of your other abilities work quite well, Hallowed Ground is all but Useless. Smite and Reckoning become dedicated CC only because that Rad proc lasts 12s flat. OH and the Augment benefits teammates less often than I see shooting stars.
Suggestion:
- Revive Effect applies to teammates who are already bleeding out.
- Phoenix Renewal blinds nearby enemies when activated for 4s
- Oberon gains 2.5% energy for each enemy killed while Phoenix renewal cools down.
Hallowed Reckoning - Never used it. Probably never will. It has a better armor buff that Hallowed Ground but no one wants to stand still on hallowed ground much less on a manhole sized hallowed ground.
Suggestion: All allies in range have stat procs removed and +150 armor for 12s.
As for his abilities I have absolutely no problems with Smite and Reckoning as they are but am open to them being changed for the better, whatever that may be.
Hallowed Ground - again this is such a lovely ability but its just a stoned throw away from being truly useful. I know legos that would do more damage to high level grineer if they step on it. The armor buff is just laughable. I have no problem with the cast being the way it is but it should be justified by being much more powerful - I.E an Oberon on Hallowed Ground should be as dangerous as a Limbo in the Rift. Also why doesn't it destroy Sapping ospry orbs. Buff the Silvester Stallone out of it.
Suggestion:
- Tap to cast normally. Gains exact values of current Hallowed Reckoning buff/DoT.
- Hold to cast as an aura. Armor buff is halfed and DoT is replaced by Damage Reflection in the form of Radiation with a chance to proc.
Renewal - Again, fantastic ability with just a hit of Crappyness in it. It ends at full health. Does it presume that I will no longer be hit for the duration of the mission? It doesn't mod well with the other abilities. Does it also feel jealous that I have other abilities and so sabotages them? Is it the anti-synergy of abilities? It should at Least provide some damage reduction/reflection to synergize with Hallowed Ground. Or some over-health. Whatever, just reduce some of that squish.
Suggestion: Remove negative duration and duration cap. Health Orbs add Over-health OR 10% armor while renewal is active.
Passive - I actually don't mind his passive. I mean controlling wildlife is whatever, but reviving pets by picking up health orbs is nice. Why in the 72 seals of solomon can't this also apply to sentinels. That's all I ask for his passive. I mean a buff for pets would be nice too or have the pick up orb revive companion apply to teammates as well.
Suggestion: Health Orb revive applies to sentinels as well.
I am by no means satisfied with the content of this rant but its late i'm tired and I want to finish this sortie now. And I'll be using captain mediocre himself, obviously. So good night, you adorable regurgitated cretins.
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2 hours ago, Lord.Kaho said:
We can start by not making him a Paladin.
It just doesn't work. The druid archetype is waay to different than a paladin.Except for Restoration...
All he needs to fit that "paladin" description is a better defensive buff and a offensive buff to go with it.
See some of the previous posts for examples to better the defensive buff on HG and add some to Renewal.
In addition a damage related buff while on hallowed ground, even something like increased melee channeling efficiency would make him more of a paladin and even open up some game play with dual stat changeling mods which are rarely used (killing blow etc)
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2 hours ago, Lord.Kaho said:
We can start by not making him a Paladin.
It just doesn't work. The druid archetype is waay to different than a paladin.Except for Restoration...
All he needs to fit that "paladin" description is a better defensive buff and a offensive buff to go with it.
See some of the previous posts for examples to better the defensive buff on HG and add some to Renewal.
In addition a damage related buff while on hallowed ground, even something like increased melee channeling efficiency would make him more of a paladin and even open up some game play with dual stat changeling mods which are rarely used (killing blow etc)
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5 hours ago, (XB1)EternalDrk Mako said:
the overhealth is a good idea, its not yet a mechanic and i think would be nice
hows this
Hallowed ground- allies and oberon when on HG are granted Sanctified , an overlay power that grants damage refllection %
Renewal - toggle on/off, while active drains energy , periodically releases wisp orbs to seak allies and heals them , when oberons health is maxed by renewl it will then grant a small overhealth portion of origionnal regneration rate
HG and renewal synergy
while standing on HG oberon when casting Renewal grants energy along with health
the cost of renewal reflects the % of energy granted by orbs
This would be an improvement over the current. (Technically fire chroma gives over health for a short period.)
Hallowed Ground definitely needs either a straight buff to scaleable damage or better cc mechanics. Either enemies are slowed, rad proc'd on entry, damage is multiplied by melee combo counter/amount of enemies on hallowed ground, or enemies take % more damage from elemental. Any one of those would be an improvement.
Its augment is supposed to be cc but it is exactly what Reckoning does except it is limited to hallowed ground's area...reckoning is a better choice in 100% of situations and it costs just about the same to cast. Hallowed Ground augment could be casting a 2nd time to create a Hallowed Aura.
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2 minutes ago, Chipputer said:
It's not about what can help it, it's about if it actually needs anything or not, which is doesn't.
You shouldn't try to fix what isn't broke. His 2nd and 3rd are alright abilities but need to be more useful, overall. His 1st and 4th are highly effective at what they do and incredibly reliable-- one is a targeted, long range tag, the other is a short ranged PBAoE.
The direction Oberon needs to be taken in is development of HG and Renewal and maybe a tweak to his passive (even though I personally love the wackiness that comes along with turning animals).
If his passive were to provide a slight buff to pets or even simply have the health orb revive work on sentinels as well it would be a Massive Improvement.
As for Renewal, simply letting it sustain after max health would make it more useful. Other options are:
- providing Overhealth at the rate of heal would make it better.
- A slight damage reduction like blessing would be nice as well
Hallowed Ground feels pretty good to me right now and just needs a mechanic to make the damage/armor scale.
Synergy between his 2 and 3 would be the icing on top.
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See some people complaining so i'm just gonna give my two cents.
First, after seeing the recent sentinel usage chart its nice that me and the other 3 people who like Djinn get a cool weapon effect for it. A pretty decent one too.
Second, it looks bad-&#!.
Third, build requirements are easy to get.
though the damage isn't much the status chance is great. Coupled with that corrosive buff I imagine it'll be just fine.
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my take on this is simply some changes to HG and Renewal:
- The armor bonus becomes 30% of Oberon's base armor that is given to all allies.
- Enemies on it are 25% weaker to elemental damage
- 20% Bonus damage to Impact, Puncture and radiation damage types
- +100% Melee channeling efficiency
All affected by strength - This makes Hallowed Ground useful defensively and offensively. Boosts Smite and Reckoning damage and makes him a good melee-paladin while on HG. Not overpowered since Impact, Puncture and radiation aren't the best damage types anyway.
Renewal:
- No duration cap at full health
- phoenix renewal does a radial blind on activation
- small damage reduction while active, 10% [affected by strength]
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Great ideas for both except you overlook one thing, which is what a lot of rework ideas overlook - and that is the way it would affect pvp. Hallowed Ground as it is, is Oberon's best pvp ability because of its stationary cast - the buff in conclave is 1000% armor and it does 100 Rad damage. I like you ideas but I wouldn't want them the change the effectiveness of HG in conclave.
To fix this I'd suggest HG casts like normal with a slight tweak on your effects:
It grants you 25% increase in armor, 20% increase in Damage and 40% increase in health.
It grants you aura effect that protects you from all status effects/ debuffs.
It damage enemies that enter
And now add a combo mechanic with Renewal where casting renewal on HG will transfer the buffs via the Renewal Orbs to teammates giving them the HG aura you suggest in addition to Renewal buffs.
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this would be pretty cool. The simplest way would be to add additional augment mod slots...or a criteria where you can purchase an upgrade with syndicate offerings that gives you an additional augment slot.
alternatively as a perk system maybe having the syndicate sigil equipped allows you to use that syndicates augments.
second alternative, syndicates offer modified warframe parts like a syndicate foundry segment that lets you rebuild warframe parts that have syndicate cosmetics and built in augments.
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honestly Oberon isn't bad once you throw on a few forma and have decent mods like rage. He lacks the armor and damage he should have and his cc is not noticeable but still there.
a few changes:
smite orbs can be directed by aiming.
new augment: Smite has a % chance to inflict an additional status effect at random
hallowed ground: Enemies on hallowed ground deal 30% less damage. Allies on hallowed ground do 30% more.
renewal: Vacuums in health orbs in range. Picking up health orbs while renewal is active increases armor by 25 per orb capped at 100
reckoning: Enemies have 30% reduced armor
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just had a weird idea while playing for hallowed ground and renewal.
first while renewal is active picking up health orbs will increase armor by 10% per orb for the duration of renewal.
hallowed ground scales off aura mods. For instance it gains the effect of whatever aura you have equipped, say you have corrosive projection, then while on hallowd ground enemies loose a further 30% armor.
though this would work better with some auras like energy siphon, rifle amp, steel charge, corrosive projection an not sure what happens with the other auras
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8 hours ago, chainchompguy3 said:
Mini-disclaimer, While I am mostly fine in regards to being conscious and not being rushed, I am currently typing at midnight, so I may be a bit sleep-deprived.
Very well, you are discussing general changes rather than the "For specialization" that I mentioned. I did not know.
I had assumed, that, seeing as how your post (the one including your proposed changes) started off with quoting me (and my specialization changes), that you were trying to build off of them, or comment on them.
(However, as a small issue I have with your post, I'd like to assume you haven't actually found any information pertaining to how DE envisions Oberon, as the only canonical text we have of him [that I am aware of] describes him as ONLY a paladin. So to say that your changes are to better how DE envisions him, provided my assumptions are correct, would be rather...how would I put it...."off".)
Now, as for your post, it's building off of his (What I feel is forced) role as a Jack-of-all-trades, able to do many things, but none of them especially well. While I think such a role is better suited to frames such as Equinox, (From what I've heard, not from actual experience: Excalibur, Rhino,), and maybe even Volt, who seem to fit the role better, I do admit that it is a rather fitting description of his current state, and to build off of it would not be out of place.
For your proposed changes, with the above context in mind, your changes do add a bit more diversity to his kit, bettering his ability to perform multiple tasks. The only questions I have with them are:
- How do the changes affect Hallowed ground, in regards to it's most common point of contention: It's fixed, rather small, location/size?
- In regards to making him more Jack-of-all-trades-y, would it be better or worse to add yet another set of affects to his abilities. His 4, for example, is terribly convoluted as is, and might be better off having it's effects transferred over to other powers.
- Your renewal changes mention both Removing it's cap, and reversing it's already reversed means of being affected by duration. Care to elabortate? and perhaps, also mention how you see these changes affecting his semi-popular augment, Corny-name-Phoenix-revival.
I typed up the following explanation of my proposed modding process before I read the whole post, and was going to delete it when I realized it was unnecessary, but I figured it might be nice to Leave it available to other readers, mostly because I didn't want all the typing I put into it to go to waste. Apologies for the Knee-jerk-reaction. As you can probably tell from the rest of this post, I make assumptions quite frequently. (And yes, I know the saying, "To assume is to make an &#!- out of -u- and -me.")
As I was explaining in my last post (usingTanking as an example), is that while Yes, modding in such ways does Objectively make his kit as a whole better, it does not make it very specialized. Modding for High strength and Duration, for example, to get the most out of his Hallowed ground for tanking, would result in Higher damage and healing, as well as more burst-focused healing, negating the ability to rely upon his Renewal augment as tanking (at least, currently. For your changes, it would be reversed, and have higher duration mean longer, more drawn out heals). This is not the way I envision a Pala-druid-in, as one who is focusing on tanking shouldn't have need of increased damage, and increased...(Well, Duration really only affects his 2 and his 3, with miniscule effects on his 1 and 4.)...projectile duration....
I'd say it would be better if we could actually mod for them in particular.
for example, a rudimentary change list:
- Hallowed ground's boost to armor is determined by his own health/armor values.
- Renewal heals based on Duration and his own health value, rather than Power strength.
- Smite and Reckoning receive aspects to them that better enforce tanking and healing; the former increased by his E-HP, the later by his Duration. the increasing affects only those aspects of the powers, and not others.
- Range buffs ability to knockdown large groups of enemies (as is), thus allowing for more CC.
etc.
Therefore resulting in clear modding lines: Range for CC, Health/Armor for tanking, Duration for healing, and Strength for damage.
If you, for example, wanted to mod for a CC-Healer hybrid, you could do so; mod for both Range and Duration.
Okay, let's get a few things out the way first:
- I believe it was around devstream 50 something that oberon was first introduced and the discussion clearly established him as a paladin-druid hybrid. Mostly because of his name lore and visuals being fairy related but It's definitely been a part of his concept from the start and not just since his deluxe skin came out.
- Rhino can do Tanking and CC, Excal and Volt can do Damage and CC. I'd hardly call either a jack of all trades though. Their kits are just good and useful in various situations.
- Going with the idea that Oberon is in fact a Hybrid of Hybrid classes, specializing him will not limit him to just one aspect. Instead we'll have two, much like the aforementioned frames. For example you can already mod him to be a CC-Healer with High Range-Efficiency and Moderate Strength. Modding for pure tanking however is almost impossible...and for me at least, doesn't suit him at all - since he is more of a pseudo-tank - But that's where the additional suggestions come in to bolster that.
I will try to answer your questions about the changes but you cannot look at the abilities individually - you have to look at the changes as a whole because, for example, what I've suggested for Renewal will also make HG better:
- HG being fixed isn't a problem in my eyes, a lot of rework suggestions tend to overlook PvP entirely. It's extremely useful as a fixed trap in a tight area and the buff and damage is nigh-OP if you can't avoid it. As for PvE it can be re-casted and "linked" to cover large areas. With the proposed melee changes this makes its range even less of a problem since you'll mostly likely be in close range using it. The buff to armor used together with renewal will provide a fair amount of protection while in melee - plus Renewal augment.
- His 4 for me is the more difficult to suggest a rework for. It's an okay ability but doesn't quite seem like an Ultimate. It's usefulness at high levels is just for CC with the Confusion proc, the blind is irrelevant. The Confusion proc however does need to be done at a range to be effective since target can and will still target you/allies if you are close. It's health drops are also unnecessary. An interesting change to it could be instead of a health drop an armor reduction to enemies who survive the slam - or a unique orb drop that increases armor for a short period for oberon/allies.
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Renewal ends when your health is full, at which point you get a status heal and the ability ends - however, you still lose energy if teammates are under the effect while you are not. It's inverse duration means the lower your duration stat the faster the heal-over-time BUT the higher the duration means the more bleed-out timer is slowed. The inverse duration also hurts all his other abilities - like Reckoning's blind and specifically for this discussion, Hallowed Ground - which should be used in conjunction with Renewal for Tanking. His augment also requires renewal to be active to trigger - which means you have to avoid fully healing - Which is to say, make Renewal LESS effective with Lower strength, which again hurts his other abilities.
- All of these issues would be fixed if Renewal's duration was Positive and the ability did not end at full health: The extended energy drain could be removed in place of a fixed duration affected by Mods. The augment would be more useful in that you wouldn't have to limit every aspect of his kit to use it effectively. Renewal in itself would be more effective as a continuous HoT limited by the Duration instead of being limiting by reaching full health. Which is essentially saying "the fact that renewal is good at healing, is the reason it's not so good at healing."
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On 8/26/2016 at 3:21 PM, chainchompguy3 said:
(Disclaimer: I am rather tired at the moment, and also kind of rushed, so this reply may not be as intellectually sound as my last one).
I don't quite understand what you're getting at here, so let me ask some questions.
You say "How to simplify the Paladin + Druid hybrid", yet the following portion of your post lists Druid as Long-Range DPS Casting, CC, and ...Beast-master Passive? I thought I covered that Druids were far more specialize-able than just those three things. And while yes, many druids have beast-master type passives, it is not an inherent trait of them, as many others shape-shift, and some simply have spiritual projections in place of actual animals.
And the changes you propose...I'm sorry, But I don't see how some of them will make him better fit his hybrid-ized role. After all, The biggest problem I see with his hybridized role is how to mod him: He already has healing, CC, Casting Damage, a small melee component (Knockdowns on 2 abilities, and ground finishers are a thing.), and some degree of tankiness.
But Try to mod him for, say, tanking. You throw on Durability mods, like vitality and steel fiber, but then what? If you go for Power strength, you increase the protections provided by Hallowed Ground, But you also buff his damage and healing of the other abilities. range increases his Hallowed ground's length of effect, but specifically modding for it with Over-extended makes it a lot less effective. Duration will buff how long his HG will stay around, but modding for that will destroy his range with Narrow minded.
His kit is already half-decent, but you can't do much with it, so far as specializing him, which is one of the core aspects to Paladins and Druids.
(Though, on a smaller note, "Weaken"/Puncture proc's seem rather ineffective for actual CC or tanking. His 1 applying it is already almost a waste....)
Okay, I wasn't trying to specialize Oberon according to what the wiki stated about Druids or Paladins, rather I was trying to categorize DE's vision of Oberon under those two archetypes. Simply to identify what aspects of each THEY choose to create the Druid/Paladin hybrid and build off of that.
I didn't include anything about shape-shifting or animal specters, since it isn't part of his kit now and would only confuse his identity more to add it in, IMO.
So, essentially i'm just building on what they already have. What they have if a frame that can do many things at once.
-----------------------let's look at what they have and the changes I suggest to fit his Hybrid role.
For Tanking what he has available is Hallowed Ground's armor buff and Renewal.
Basic modding includes Vitality and Steel Fiber. The limitation however is Duration - Renewal is stronger with low duration+high strength, while HG needs High duration+high strength.
Simply changing Renewal to be better with high duration and remain active after health cap would boost his ability to tank. Increase the armor buff from hallowed ground and give renewal a slight damage reduction.
This is basic, because as you said the his other powers will benefit from high strength as well...so now...
Now, to go a step further. For Tanking + Melee DPS I suggest Hallowed Ground have a Melee based buff. For example while on Hallowed Ground Melee attacks have +x% radiation damage and +x% blocking/reflection while channeling and + n crit multiplier while channeling affected by Strength mods.
In theory, this lets you build for High Duration, Strength with Low Efficiency - Since melee channeling isn't affected by Warframe efficiency but melee channeling mods.
Also in theory, a Higher Range and Lower Strength build could work with this because of the melee combo multiplier. (on condition that a small static damage reduction is added to renewal and the % blocked while channeling can make up for the reduced armor buff of HG)
This lets you play as a Melee DPS Tank, while still having access to a powerful but costly 1 and 4. It would also let you mod to balance between play styles which is what a lot of people like about Oberon.
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That's just an example of where I'm going with this - Sorry if it it seems a bit jumbled, not 100% focused right now - you're right about modding him though, the only specialization I see him having now is Casting -
1. CC - Building for High Range and Efficiency with low strength
2. Damage - Building for High efficiency and High Strength
Both of which limit his ability to tank severely.
Adding the weaken effect to Reckoning would make up for this very slightly. It's a very subtle but effective proc
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26 minutes ago, bluepheonix13 said:
Nope, I think the only change recently was a new Augment (Phoenix Renewal).
that and the addition of health orbs reviving companions.
22 minutes ago, secret9005 said:One thing that's bugging me is that most of your ideas are based around the skin.
During Oberon's release, he was themed as paladin. Your spiced up abilities focus on him being a druid (thanks to the skin). You might need to make your abilities more paladin friendly (holy and light).
Yeah that's true. DE has stated numerous times that he's a hybrid though. I'd prefer to stay in the middle ground since the Druid thing can be represented by his faery like abilities (Orbs and stuff) as well as the passive. As for everything else is shared between paladin and druid.
11 minutes ago, Dragonblack175 said:Yes hes a druid/paladin, smth in between
In my eyes all of his abilities can be interpreted in both ways (with the exception fo renewal), the radiation effect kinda represents holy damage.
I made renewal as druid-ish as possible i guess, but reckoning....well im even speaking of holy energy...
Regarding smite i havent changed much and hallowed ground just got tweaked mechanicaly and got added damage reflection. Imo the damage reflection is more paladin-ish in the aspect of a holy guardian/warrior than druid-ish.
Renewal for me ties the Druid and Paladin thing together the most. Which is why I think it should remain ambiguous and not have a tree effect. The damage reflection would be better on renewal - that way using it with hallowed ground would have a benefit. Armor bonus + Reflection.
52 minutes ago, Dragonblack175 said:Warframe is about mobility, regarding this aspect of the game standing still is pretty dangerous. Like many others i would suggest making it a aura around him, but a bit more complex.
- Drationbased, recastable, stackable five times, old stacks refresh upon recast
There was one guy who enjoyed the micromanagment when playing Oberon, using all his skills together and perfectly for the best result possible, that inspired me to another suggestion: Buff effects dont stack equally. Smth like 20/+16/+20/+24/+40%. The fifth stack would grant 40%, which would be a third of the max possible buff value, so sustaining at max stack would result into max efficiency. In addition to this, sustaining at max stacks would also grant 20% damage reflection, for all those who wonder and like to tell me " but damage reflection sucks", yes u are quite right atm, but i also have a suggestion how damage reflection should be changed to make it more reliable.
(Im thinking about adding a cooldown nearly as high as the the modified duration of the skill, for all those SirSpamALots, to prevent exploiting and fast stacking of the skill, feedback needed)
Mobility, yeah. Stackable aura? not sure about that. Cool down? hell no.
For me HG is a very interesting ability. The casting is great and can create a variety of shapes to cover a wider ground than a circle or aura would. The only limitation is you have to stack a lot to have meaningful damage/buff and FPS tends to drop if you have too many active.
I'd prefer if HG could be chained together and than would stack the duration as well as the buff/damage
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On 7/27/2016 at 0:28 AM, SoulOfTheHunter said:
Edit: In adition, Phoenix Renewal could provide knockdown resistance to players under the it's effects. Maybe even remove status effects on initial heal.
I'd be satisfied with the cooldown being 90s if you also gained a 90% damage reflection armor for that period
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On 8/23/2016 at 9:52 PM, chainchompguy3 said:
------------------------------------Introduction------------------------------------------
After having heard many ideas about how to make Oberon better, I realized it might benefit us to step back, and figure out exactly who Oberon is, and what he needs to be.
---------------------------------------What is Oberon?-----------------------------------------------------
The most common consensus is that he is a Paladin/Druid Hybrid.
So I wiki-pedia-ed "Paladin" and "Druid", and came across a Wikipedia-level summary of the origins of the themes.
(Those who wish to follow my footsteps, make sure to get the page with the suffix "(Character class)".)
Paladins, in summary, were hybrids from the start, meant to be a more durable version of a priest (Healer/tank hybrid).
But the class was eventually expanded upon to feature specialization: The player could choose to focus on Melee DPS, Healing, or Tanking, and ALMOST ignore the other aspects of the hybrid.
On a Fun-facts note, "Paladin" literally means "Hero" or "Champion".
Druids, in summary were a specialization class from the beginning, With multiple forms to shape-shift into to focus on certain roles (And literally, almost all of them: Melee DPS, Ranged DPS caster, Healer, Tank, CC, so on).
However, their base, un-shape-shifted form is usually tied to spell-casting damage and Healing.
On a Fun-facts note, "Druidism" was an actual religion/philosophy in ancient rome, who spent a great deal of time in forests, practicing human sacrifice, and learning intelligent trades such as poetry and doctor-hood.
So, in a sense, Oberon is a Hybrid of Specialized Hybrids, with both of his two themes both having a primary role in Healing, and sub-role in both tanking and Melee damage.
--------------------------------------What would make Oberon like this?-------------------------------------------------
Taking this into account, Oberon, if stuck to his themes, would be a highly-specialize-able (Aka: mod him to make him fit the role), Healer who could be modded to specialize in roles such as tanking, casting, and melee.
One way to do this would be to give him a kit of multi-faceted powers, and modding him would greatly increase certain facets of them, while decreasing/leaving neglected other facets.
For an example, Perhaps +Health and +Armor mods would increase the Tanking aspects of his powers, such as Increasing damage-resistance multipliers, etc.
-------------------------------------------Final words----------------------------------------------------
This post is greatly flawed, as I am still trying to figure all this out myself. After all, the base idea (That Oberon is a Paladin/Druid hybrid) is complex in-itself. Some people dissent with this view, and claim he is supposed to only be one or the other. And then you have the issue about how to make him feel "Able to specialize in different things" without feeling "Jack-of-all-trades"-y
But overall, I'd like to see a frame meet the challenge, and I'd like this thread's input on this.
So, please, anything you have to add, dispute, argue, or comment, please do so.
For the cause of Oberon Improvement !
Good post. Good editing. I read the whole thing. I think this sums up Oberon perfectly - his powers do match this description even if they fall short. Gonna try to add to this.
-------------------------------------How to simplify the Paladin + Druid Hybrid---------------------------
Let's try to categorize his abilities to suit.
Under Druid we have:
- Long range DPS Casting.
- Crowd Control.
- Beast-master passive ability.
Under Paladin we have:
- Melee DPS.
- Tanking.
- Healing.
----------------------------How to structure his abilities for both-------------------------
With just a few small additions we can start to get him functioning more like we want him to
Starting with Paladin:
- Changing Renewal's negative duration would instantly make it work better with Hallowed Ground for increased survivability.
- Adding a melee buff to hallowed ground.
- Have an increased armor buff. - Or a damage reduction on renewal that stacks when using Renewal+Hallowed Ground.
- Remove the cap on renewal's duration
For Druid:
-
Smite and Reckoning cover most of this well but could use a slight buff to function:
- Interactive smite orbs - Aiming down the sights select a target for them if one isn't already assigned. ("Weaken" status effect stacks with each orb hit)
- Reckoning now inflicts a "weaken" status on survivors.
- Passive is fine assuming DE will add more wildlife in the future.
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9 hours ago, (PS4)Oreic-Reynier said:
Hallowed Ground: For me this is my favorite skill and one that can be focused on and really grant him a “role” on the field of battle. I used to truly feel it should be an aura, however, there are more and more frames that have an aura. Hallowed Ground should remain a static AOE. It should become a circle. Its effect should be similar to the ring of runes you see in Dark Souls when you cast a healing miracle. Should not be able to place more than one, should instead be a channeled static AOE. When you cast it it appears around you with you at it's center. Basically you turn it on and it appears where you “turned” it on. It remains there draining energy until you turn it off or run out of energy. The focus would be holding an area and Protecting your friends. While in the ring allies and Oberon would heal some HP per second. When in the ring Oberon would channel a portion of damage received by allies in the ring to himself. Channeling damage would not stack with electromagnetic Shielding or similar mods. Would still grant immunity to knock downs, proc's, and removes proc's upon entering
I also used to think it should be an aura or circular cast. However after playing using exclusively HG, I came to the conclusion that currently the way it casts isn't bad and making it a channeled 1 instance cast would be worse. Here's why:
Right now its a quick static AoE that lets you temporarily hold a small area and then move on without a second thought. The area can be expanded infinitely with recasts (limited only by duration) and you can have multiple areas across a map.
This for me would be better than a circular cast if the effect was buffed.
Also, once Renewal's negative duration is fixed HG would be more versatile because 20s base duration is not bad at all and you would be able to mod him more like a Vex Armor Chroma with high damage and duration.
-
After playing Conclave for most of the weekend with Oberon - I noticed a few things about his abilities and how they differ from PvE.
1. Smite is not very useful in PvP - It can be cast without a target which can miss a lot and waste energy.
2. Reckoning is equally difficult to use. - Very slow animation and the power doesn't affect enemies until his hand is fully raised. Enemies recover almost instantly if they survive.
3. Renewal - The fact that it stops at full health doesn't even matter since just getting the heal at all is great. It's still not good as a pre-preemptive/reactive heal, unless you're fast, paying attention and quite near to allies.
4. Hallowed Ground is awesome. Seriously, it's The game changer in his arsenal. In an open space its not that good since it can be avoided easily, but if you're caught in a dog fight you can retreat, lure the enemy to an enclosed area where you cast hallowed ground. Suddenly you have the advantage as your opponent now has to dodge your attacks plus stay off hallowed ground. You gain 1000% armor which is 78% damage reduction on Oberon, the range and duration are fine considering it will kill even the most tanky frames if they stay on for too long. (under 10s will kill a Rhino with iron skin active)
So how do we make the PvE version closer to this tactical masterpiece without making it over powered. It will need to be buffed but it also requires a change to his other abilities and also the enemy AI.
- Make it powerful. I'm talking 250 radiation damage every half second with a damage multiplier. For example, say every enemy that steps in it adds 25% damage for the remaining duration. They fuel the fires of their own demise.
- Make it useful to Tenno. 40% Damage reduction is fine with me.
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19 hours ago, Navarchus said:
I'm not sure what you mean. Should this replace the current? Replace the suggestion? Be an augment?
You're wanting Hallowed Ground to turn from a defense ability to an offense ability so I'm assuming it's an augment suggestion.Originally I meant for it to be added to what it currently does. It could be an augment that would be fine.
However after playing a lot of conclave with Obi over the weekend, i'm leaning towards just buffing what Hallowed Ground does now, make it a very defensive ability that functions as a trap. The offense comes from it inherently dealing a lot of damage to enemies.
At least that's how I use it in conclave and its very tactical and effective. It's easily x10 more useful in conclave than pve
-
Maybe your idea for his passive could be a part of hallowed ground instead.
- The longer you stay on it your armor increases by 20 armor per second. (Affected by duration and strength. - So at base 20 x 25 = 500 armor if you stay for the full duration. In theory this works out for modding since you can still get a decent buff with high strength and low duration. Example double strength and half duration gives 40a x 12.5s = 500) To be balanced the armor buff is capped at the Power strength x Duration max, so with 20 x 25, recasting will not reset the armor gain but will not increase it past 500, you'll just stay at 500 for longer. However, recasting will increase the rate or armor x each instance of HG so you reach the cap faster for more energy. You lose all the armor if you leave hallowed ground.
Hallowed Heaven with 50 radiation damage per second is VERY weak. Instead I think because Hallowed Ground is a small area and stationary it should be a very dangerous place for enemies and very beneficial for allies.
- Status immunity remains because its amazing.
- Hallowed Ground adds 80% radiation damage while channeling melee and 80% channeling efficiency. Since Oberon is a paladin I think he should have some melee themed buffs. Since his element is radiation he should be able to use it to power at least melee. This gives you more build options for melee in theory.
- Enemies loose any elemental damage resistances - IE enemies who are resistant to radiation will now have that ability removed - Eximus units.
Renewal would be good and synergize with Hallowed Ground fine if the negative duration was removed and the health cap as well. For added synergy maybe combine Hallowed Heaven ideas:
- If renewal is cast on Hallowed Ground it absorbs hallowed ground's effects and passes it on to allies through renewal.
- So they gain full stat immunity. A small radial aura that does half of the radiation damage of HG per second and they gain armor at half the rate of stationary HG. Melee buffs exclusive to stationary HG however.
- Phoenix Renewal should add a 30% damage reduction while cooling down.
Reckoning reducing armor would be much appreciated
The Oberon Rant.
in Warframes
Posted
I mentioned the use of duration with renewal to slow bleedout, I wasn't saying I mod for all of renewals effects at once including the augment.
I already stated the status immunity is solely what makes hg useful at higher levels. It doesn't however increase your survivability by a substantial amount, at max strength you get almost 50% armor increase and that's better than nothing but it isn't a game changer.
my current set up is high range and strength with 115% efficiency and 90% duration, no augments. I get a good balance and use out of all his powers. With rage and prime flow to keep energy up. For the sake of these discussions remove focus abilities as a variable since some are op.
at some higher levels I might drop duration for efficiency with steel fiber and phoenix renewal
phoenix renewal really depends on personal preference and playstyle to use but that does not change my point that it doesn't mesh well with his kit. As you said he is outclassed when modded for a specific role and therefore should not have abilities/augments that gimp other aspects of his kit. That's fine for warframes that can specialize but he's not that.
also, I'm aware what aspect of the passive you're not happy with but My opinion was the health orb revive affecting sentinels as well would make it excellent despite the beastmaster thing being just a fun niche.
if you're going to nit pick at what I say please re-read my comments so I don't have to repeat myself answering you.