Quantum_rage

i know warframe is peer to peer, but would it really hurt performance that much to have a spectator mode and then let 2-3 extra people watch the game? look you don't need 20 people spectating the game at the same time, you just need people to join, vote and then leave, it's pretty damn obvious from watching about 30 seconds of gameplay or less to figure out if they are afk farming or not, you can give them the option to vote, or after a minute or so, it will force the connected spectator to leave so a new spectator can join this doesn't even need to be a thing where ALLOT of votes happen all in the one single session, they can rack up votes over time until they are, eventually just banned from the game, even if 5 people join and vote that they are afk farming, the next time they afk farm 5 more people join and vote for them, if their in public lobby's they might get votes as well, etc etc at that point, the voting system is just a super simple and reliable way for the DE moderator team to go "alright who are we banning today" then simply, they go and find the people with the most votes, and start at the top of the list, inspecting their gameplay, their logs, whatever they can inspect, and if found guilty they get banned, if not found guilty the vote count is reset fundamentally the biggest issue with this system would be detecting possible afk players in the first place, they would need an afk detection that is either very, very sensitive, to the point where it is giving allot of false negatives, or, you give the players the opportunity to spectate any game in progress and rely on the players to hunt down the possible afk farms

ONCE AGAIN you miss the point i am talking about a "new" concept that has not been done in, many if any game that i can think of? here i will explain lets say, for example, we keep the bad "oh your not moving, let me flag you for possible being afk" system, ok lets keep that after 2 minibus or 5 minutes or whatever i don't care the system will flag you (although i would recommend a better system like this as the starting step since this as it is, gives ALLOT of false negatives and is super easy to avoid triggering to begin with) once the player has been flagged, a message will be sent to "other random players online" like allot of them, as many as it can or maybe just a bunch of random ones, that are, sitting in their orbiter, sitting around in their dojo. and also not in currently in a group, IE the notification will get sent to solo players maybe the notification stays on their screen for a minute or so, 30 seconds whatever, and if they click on the notification they will be able to spectate the "spectate the afk user" at that point they can vote if the user is afk farming, or not or doing anything malicious in any way and keep in mind, this would not just be one person voting it would be many YES you are correct, not everyone will use this system, not everyone will care, but guess what? that's the beauty of this system. it would be a simple opt in or opt out type of thing, super super OPTOINAL, if you want you can completely ignore it, however, some players will want to use this system, because some players realize that "afk farming ruins the game" I'm saying yes i would GLADLY go and vote on someone randomly if it means my gameplay is not being affected on a day to day basis and their are other people out their that would be happy to vote on people as well, to say they are afk farming at that point, if this "one person:" gets enough votes, then DE can take a look at it and see if the player is actively doing something malicious who gives a damn if it nothing gets done imminently, if DE is looking at a player, and this player is afk farming, and they have a bunch of resources, guess what BAN BAN BAN BAN BAN sometimes, it is just enough for the community to KNOW a system like this is in place, it doesn't have to be perfect but it does need to at least be reliable, just KNOWING that a system like this can "actually" catch you doing naughty things, rumors of players being banned for afk farming etc etc, will be enough for them to "not do it in the first place" why am i pushing for this so much? well, because something you said in your previous post is find stupid, you said movement is the only way to prevent people from afk farming, well no that is not true at all, whatsoever, unless it is complex movement, making someone move to a certain ledge or area etc, you can EASILY have a script or whatever push your W key, and currently in game, that is pretty much all you would need just something to move your character forward 5 meters and then back

I'm not arguing with 90% of what your saying, i get it and i am not here suggesting a 100% fully automated system, i get it, in get everything your saying. 100% of it, but your wrong, you "CAN" create an afk detection system that IS reliable, THIS is an undisputed fact simple put, it does not matter if you have a junk afk detection system if a human at some point is verifying that, it is in fact, an afk farmer then the system will be very very very reliable, maybe not 100% but like 99% or whatever good enough a hell of allot better then what we currently have the point of this is not to have an automated system, the point is to GET RID OF, the automated systems because automatics afk detection systems suck you use the detection system as an indicator to INDICATE to a HUMAN that "hay someone over here is might be doing some of that afk stuff you don't like, go check it out" and i know what your going to say "ehh DE wont want to hire 500 something humans to moderate the game, and your right, you get your community playing the game to do it. and i know what your going to say, but, the community will be unreliable, and your right, well kind of to a certain extend, if you get enough people to vote on a single match to say that "someone was afking" that is a very very high indication that they were afk farming and again, this doesn't even need to be a thing where the comment votes cause the punishment, the community votes can jut be another step in the chain until it gets back to someone who works at DE, the point of this is to reduce the size of the "afk detection team" at DE down to a minimal number of people, the way you do that is by filtering out games where "you know no afk stuff is happening" think of the detection methods as "filters" not absolute truth, a system like this would be very very reliable,

i don't like you, you are telling me words without giving me reasons, i don't like that you either don't understand my suggestion, or point of what i was posting or you are just here for the sake of arguing i was simply giving an example of something that could prevent afk farming, ok you say accessibility? cyphers whatever, you know some activities in this game wont allow you to use cyphers right? also the whole hack thing was just an example as making the player do a "random set of EASY inputs" i said a random set of easy inputs for a reason, it can be something easier then a hack task, it could be as simple as pressing W then S then D then W in a very specific order, i was just giving a single example to get you to think about the possibilities, look forwards, be forward thinking, don't look backwards, come up with new ideas, don't prevent them, think about them actually consider them and consider what it might be like if the ideas were to be implemented, don't just say "no no no no" and hand wave the idea away without a second thought if a system was thought through thoroughly enough it is quite possible to detect afk players without detecting normal players, theirs allot of stuff you can do, and remember, the system can air on the side of caution, the detection system could be tweaked and changed until it reaches a point where it works, the bigger issue here is that DE is unlikely going to go to the effort to do it also consider this, what if their was an afk detection system.. but the system itself did not decide to punish afk players, and instead random players that are online that are 30+ while also not being in a mission, are given the option to go and inspect the the potential afk farmers gameplay, then if enough people vote "yes this person is afk farming" like more people vote yes then no then and only then, will that person be punished they would have to implement a spectator system that lets you see the users gameplay, and a voting system sure you might get false negatives but if they really were not afk farming, the game devs should be able to see that if they investigate further you can't remove farming methods from the game, unless you prevent real players from also doing farming, IE khora, nekros, speed nova, in a survival, killing stuff repeatedly maxing out loot drops, what. you want DE to remove that method of getting resources as well? because if you don't remove it, people will find a way to AFK that, when you suggest removing farming methods, your suggesting taking gameplay away from players, that's not a good option

just thought i might add, this one is kind of interesting, 90% of people who play this game, have probably never actually come across the fact that you can "press e to pick up orbs" simple due to the fact that, orbs get automatically picked up most of the time "and" if you don't need the orbs normally, the option to pick up the orb wont be displayed in the first place however due to this weird specific set of circumstances where "i need the orbs" but "the afk detection system or whatever is not letting them be picked up automatically" then only in this very very specific situation, will you ever be able to manually pick up the orbs while messing around with this new found talent i found another one of DE either bugs or stupid afk prevention methods? basically, you can press E to pick up the orbs, and this will work for a while but at some point, while pressing E to pick up the orbs, they literally just stop giving you energy outright this btw, can't be a bug, it is literally coded into the game to be able to pick up the orbs by pressing E, I'm willing to consider my first issue not a bug, and instead see it as "afk prevention" but just because it is afk prevention does not make it any less annoying their afk prevention is so bad, that it comes across as a bug in the game, because it acts just like a bug doing something that shouldn't be happening it's garbage like this in the game that makes me hate using the build i spend HOURS grinding for to get working, sure the build works but. it's just fing annoying to be getting punished because "someone else was probably doing a bad thing with the dispensary" also no update on the second bug yet, haven't seen it appear again? but it happens super randomly have been trying to replicate the issue in the simulacrum with no luck, for all i know it could be, another players buff breaking equilibrium, it could be random, it could be a set of 3 things that have to all happen at once, i don't know what causes it

if DE actually implemented a proper afk detection system, their would be no reason why communal pickups could not be a thing think about that, everyone in here is arguing that, DE would not add this because it would make it easier to afk farm but if their afk detection system would good enough in the first place, that would not be a problem currently their afk detection system is more likely to catch someone answering their front door, then someone who is actually intentionally trying to afk farm people already join index runs and then just, "afk" sitting somewhere while their team does all the work now how is that fair to me as a player who is actively killing stuff, but i happen to be using masa, thus I'm not moving around as much while someone is standing up on a ledge walking back and fourth to avoid being detected i kid you not. i have been doing solo defense missions in the past and had the afk system trigger on me leaving me with no rewards after like 6 rounds of something something to try and farm for a piece of gear that drops on a c rotation or whatever. hell if i was afk how did all the enemies die? yeah i have some volt builds where you press 4 and everything dies, am i wrong as a player to fine tune a build like that, stand in the center and then press my number 4 button? your telling me. my normal gameplay now involves me purposely trying to avoid the AFK detection system? just because i stood in one spot for longer then 2 minutes while killing things during a half hour run. i get punished for that? excuse me? what? take the simulacrum for example "sorry hunter i have disabled that ability" what, is this supposed to prevent people from nuke the entire map of enemies?? are you joking me? you know how many people run the simulacrum with volt, syran, Mirage, they aren't preventing map nuke at all as long as you cast the ability slow enough, like 10 seconds apart or something like that you can completely avoid the system all together, while still nuking the map my point being, what they current have, does nothing if a player really wants to avoid the detection they can do it with a script quite easily just to have their character move around enough to not get detected. so this raises the question, if their is a way to already avoid the afk detection what is the point of it in the first place? either design a better detection system that actually detects afk players and wont detect players for "doing normal game things" or don't bother with an afk system at all this may take some small level design changes for example, on defense missions, you might be required to do a small quicker and easy hacking task that is randomized to prevent "scripts" from doing the task for you, maybe you have to do this a few times per round or just at the end of each round while not the ideal solution since, a player could technically sit in front of their pc and watch a script run then do the hacking task manually, it would prevent the player from getting up and walking away from the pc for 2 hours straight while your warframe runs through 20 rounds of defense or whatever you could have a system that detects basic afk strategies by looking for repetitive inputs, if someone is standing still and they do nothing but press the number 4 button 20 times in a row without touching the mouse, moving their character, or whatever, they are probably scripting/ afk farming, this can be more advanced you could detect a pattern of "W4S4W4" repeating over and over again, and after a certain threshold, flag them as an afk farmer you could get around a detection method like this by, having a script that adds some random keyboard inputs however. but it would catch the majority of people who don't know a system like this is in place having a system that lets players vote on people who are afking, leaching on purpose, piggy backing, however you want to name it, the system would not need to detect the player for afk imminently, but if they get enough votes from enough different players, then they are probably afk farming and either get a human to ban them or time them out whatever they want to do with that the last problem to solve however, is group afk farming, where 3 people are afk all with and one person does all the work to avoid the afk methods this could be avoided with method one, however, the person who needs to hack would be chosen at random meaning, theirs a good chance it will choose anyone who is trying to afk farm preventing one person from being able to do the afk check after each round, you could even do a thing where, this hacking thing might also be something that ties into a more general overarching story line concept, maybe something is tampering with your transference link and that happens randomly to 1 person per round, making the player temporarily invulnerable in the process which would prevent annoying deaths from occurring I'm just ranting about various ideas here, but i think you see what I'm trying to say, their are ALLOT of options for preventing afk farming in a more reliable manner, maybe it's not exactly this idea, maybe it is something slightly different, but either way, forcing the payer to do something which requires a random set of inputs or forcing them to complete a task, would help prevent afk farming and if DE really really, wanted to prevent afk farming of any kind, they could do it in a way that would not effect the user experience in a way that would frustrate them from a gameplay standpoint, in my opinion, if the user is forced to change how they play in game, to avoid a certain game detection system, that's bad game design. you should seamlessly integrate your afk detection system into the game itself in a way that does not take away from the players experience, in a way that the player probably wont even notice, or realize that "this is here to prevent afk players"

i will try that, also i always run a amalgam barrel diffusion + a yellow tau forged shard for increased parkour velocity, which means. I'm rolling around the map as fast if nor faster then most players, while being in my ultimate. point being. i don't want to role half way across the room or leave my defensive position, i just find it annoying, especially since the role distance is longer while backflipping, so if i role forwards and then back I'm further back then i was. if i was standing on a pillar to get a better view of the map i need to exit my ult and recast it, wasting energy. it's just annoying i will do more tests to see if i can figure out if anything in particular causes it to break but. this bug only appears after a while if playing, and rather randomly sometimes a health orb from the dispensary will be bugged. but i can go and pick up a different health orb just fine. it is rather inconsistent so i will have to play for a while to see if it happens again

as you mentioned it is from an afk prevent, the problem is, it happens so often to me because I'm playing mesa, and when I'm doing something like "defend this one single spot for the entire mission" it gats rather annoying every 1 and a half minutes or so needing to role away and come back over and over and over and over again, it's just frustrating more then anything. it's not like I'm getting triggered for afk, then not receiving rewards at the end of the mission, I'm still shooting, I'm still picking up resources, I'm still playing constantly, I'm not AFK and if I'm not AFK the AFK detection should not be detecting me, that is a bad AFK detection system, it needs to be fixed. hell i don't even know why this system around orbs specifically is even a thing to begin with with the afk system, what purpose does it serve?? if someone wants to afk and not die, you would just go and hide in a corner somewhere or up on the ceiling in some dumb area, or any number of the spots where you can reach and enemies cant shoot you, their does not need to be a system that prevents you from picking up fing orbs, that serves little to no purpose other then pissing off players the problem with this is that, I'm using mesa, I'm in my ult, I'm shooting stuff. i don't want to exit my ult. i don't want to role away. i want to keep shooting stuff, my movement speed is so slow that walking 2-3 steps is more like walking 20 steps, i have high parkour speed. i don't want to role across half the room exit my alt, come back and jump up on my pillar or whatever I'm standing, i shouldn't have to play around the afk detection system when i am playing the game, i find that extremely unfun i want to build my build the way i want to build my build and play my build the way i want to play my build, is that too much to ask from a game where you can build a build and play a build the way you want to play a build? you may have a different build, you may play the game different, just because it doesn't effect you. does not mean it is not effecting other players if you read my original post more carefully and look at the screen shot i sent, you can clearly see i don't have full energy (look at the screen shot) i am still picking up energy orbs (look at the screen shot one new energy orb is spawning and their are like 6 health orbs on the ground, if i wasn't picking up energy orbs they would also be on the ground) the health orbs are on the ground (look at the screen shot) i am not picking up the health orbs (look at the screen shot) i have equilibrium equipped (trust me i have equilibrium equipped) also roiling away and then rolling back does not pick up the health orbs with the second bug, i might be able to pick them up by exciting ult and then manually clicking on them? (honestly didn't even realize that was a thing) but i have not tried it yet

i play on pc although i suspect this is not a pc specific issue, more just, an issue i have noticed with one of my warframe builds i have a build, on mesa which utilizes dispensary to dump orbs onto my face while I'm shooting, i am also running equilibrium these issues also only appear after a while of, standing around and shooting kind of randomly, i want to say after a minute and a half at least for the first issue, and a quite a bit longer for the second issue the first issue randomly, after a while (most likely due to me not moving very far from the dispensary) orbs will stop being picked up. i am only to assume this is either a bug or some kind of afk prevention junk, unfortunately. I'm not afk I'm standing in one location, defending something, or what have you moving/ roiling away, then rolling back fixes the issue instantly and i can continue to pick up orbs, however i don't see why i should stop picking up orbs to begin with. it makes no sense this has been an ongoing issue for this build for a while, and i would of hope it was fixed by now but hopefully you can fix it while you are fixing the new equilibrium bug second issue the new equilibrium changes where, you can pick up health orbs at full health? is inconsistent half assed, you understand? (funny reference) in this picture i am continuing to pick up energy orbs but as you can see at the bottom of the screen, it says health full. now i am running equilibrium. and i would expect that, while i am running equilibrium, have no energy on my energy bar, i should not be seeing the message "health full" to my knowledge their is no fix for this bug in game, other then taking damage now to be fair, their are ways around these issues. by changing up mods. and i have been using these ways for a while now synth fiber. if your in a game mode which allows a pet, synth fiber will let you pick up health orbs at full health arcane blessing, also lets you pick up health orbs at full health, but only up 50 per mission, unless you die to reset arcane blessing and of Corse combat discipline, purposely damaging yourself while you kill enemies, in order to pick up the health orbs here is my exact build, incase something specific in the build is causing the issue, like maybe when arcane blessing maxes that is triggering some code that prevents me from picking up orbs, or something like that i don't really know

yes that would be perfect, maybe putting these mods on the operator? perhaps? instead of fetch or vacuum the operator can just have "void suck" and "void sense" or whatever, more like an inherent ability that you can upgrade, i wouldn't even mind if we just had "basic" versions of these mods equipped when the game starts, up until the point where the player unlocks the operator. then they can uprate or change the mods etc. i think that would be more then acceptable that would then give a good reason for these mods to work "everywhere" you go with everything you do regardless.

yeah, i mean i don't mind the complexity of it, i just want it to be more obvious even with just removing multiplicative damage bonuses all together and having everything be adaptive, still wont really fix the problem because simply put, theirs allot of multiplicative stuff happening under the hood already damage X fire rate X multishot X Crit Chance X Crit Damage X Elemental Damage X outside multiplicative damage sources i know it doesn't work exactly like this its a but more complicated but i think you get the idea. even if you just remove the last leg of the chain, the entire chain still exists, hell some people don't realize that elemental damage bonuses are multiplicative with normal damage etc

so the rewording of the faction mods is a good start, it is now super easy to understand that. it is s multiplier and not just adding to the base damage value, but this needs to be a standard across the board, anything that is adding to base value should be +100% damage and anything that is a multiplier should be 2X damage take the letrum for example we have these 2 perks 50% chance to deal +2000% damage on no crit hits? (%1000 on average) as far as i can tell this is a multiplicative effect that applies after all your mods? and +400% for 10 seconds stacking up to 3 times (%1200) as far as i can tell, this buffs base damage of the weapon. so if you already have %400 something percent base damage to end up with %1600 base damage, and then everything is calculated the problem is, the only difference between how these things are worded is one has a Damage with only a capital D and the other one is DAMAGE ah yeah thanks, new payers are really going to know the difference between % Damage and % DAMAGE good one one is a 20X multiplier (10X adjusted) and the other adds base damage to the weapon so a 12X multiplier BUT only to base damage numbers of the weapon point being, if your going to have a way to make things obvious to players, do it across the board everywhere, have standard ways of formatting your information boxes to make it easy to players to see what's going on with damage calculation numbers. it's all quite overwhelming and convoluted if you ask me also just as another small example i know of mesas peacemakers have a 4.86X damage multiplier, but this is actually just a +486% damage increase to the base value of her peacemakers, which is additive with mods. it is not a damage multiplier. it is a damage increase. stuff like this annoys me quite allot, when you do the whole X multiplier, when it is a +something% damage increase, absolutely no consistently across the game for mod damage values

not really asking for a new companion mod slot? it should just be a default thing like the radar, it's basic ass quality of life stuff. i don't know why the mod exists to begin with. sure have the mods to extend the range if you want to go crazy with farming or whatever but, honestly. i would prefer if the vacuum/ fetch mods were deleted and it was just, there from the get go.

oh i read what the other people were talking about, i just didn't care about the afk thing. who gives a rats ass, this is a PVE looter shooter. have a system to let us report afk players, if they get enough votes let them continue playing the game, but don't give them any resources at the end their are ways around it, to make it not annoying for players, while also preventing AFK players. also if players AFK, what do i care? hell i can solo 90% of the missions in the game anyway and it makes very little difference to me if someone is afking or not in the vast majority of situations not everything needs to be a communal pickup. hell they already have a system for communal pickups when it comes to voidplooms and those new whatever resources from the new missions this is such a nothing burger issue were talking bout here. the solution is simple, they just need to implement any number of systems that any other game has for dealing with this junk

just remove the "hold to pick up thing" make everything an items that gets automatically collected, give a base vacuum/ fetch radius, which we can increase with mods then use the current afk detection to remove rewards (although the afk detection can probably could be bypassed with macros) and if stuff getting teleported out of the map is an issue, just make item collection work through walls :P huhu you could also do a thing where, if one player picks it up, everyone gets the item but only one player needs to pick up the item etc, many options here

been a while since i have cared about what mods go on my pet because their has never really been "a ton" of good mods to put on pets. so fitting on fetch/ vacuum was rather easy bot now we have a TON of good mods for pets (thankyou i love it, they feel useful now) similar to how wireframes now just have a build in enemy radar. it would make sense to also have a build in vacuum/ fetch mod, maybe a 10M radius? or so? not sure how big the default range should be this would also make the fetch/ vacuum mods amazing for farming resources since we could stack the range on top of our default range, giving us a 20M+ item collection range

this would just be a really nice quality of life change, it can be easy to accidently select one of your main warframes or weapons that you have put time and effort into, while going through and clearing out your inventory, making space etc, especially if you are deleting a long list of items, having a way to just, lock items, to prevent them form being sold in the first place would just, fix this problem