Eidolon hunts are beyond frustrating - because of players

[Guest]

I'll keep it short: Tridolons are a mess. Heck, even Teralysts are a mess, and extremely frustrating due to players often not knowing what to do.

The fact that you can access those with almost no requirements is terrible, since it leads to a chance of encountering people lacking... everything, and just either confusedly wandering around or expecting to be carried. It's endgame content and shouldn't be so easily available. 

Even in the case of the simple Teralyst, the lack of ANY SORT OF PROPER TUTORIAL OR POINTERS leads to an EXCRUCIATING amount of cases where people destroy limbs prematurely, shoot the shields with regular weapons, get an excessive amount of lures (one time I saw a total of 8 in a Teralyst hunt...), which leads to far longer lure charge times and stretches the hunt for needless amounts of time. If you're trying to squeeze in several hunts in one night, unless you have a bunch of trusted clanmates or friends, you're at the mercy of matchmaker RNG.

I have no problem with people picking non-meta frames, non-meta weapons, dying occasionally. I usually pick Harrow so I can mitigate most of that. What I have a huge issue with is people having no basic understanding of how to do this type of mission and potentially dragging everyone else down, which is fun neither for them, nor for anyone else.

And this is both on them (for not bothering to watch any of the dozens of guides that exist) as well as on DE (for not providing a proper tutorial or experience gate). 

I mean heck, just as an example... would it be so troublesome to have Onkko say something along the lines of "Careful, if you kill the limb now, the Teralyst might escape!"? Do I have to roll the dice every time on whether people know or don't know what to do? It's not like the night's too long, right?

Before you mention it: Yes, I've tried Recruitment chat. I've organised parties. People of MR15 and higher claim they know what to do, then go ahead and commit the same rookie mistakes, ruining the experience for everyone. I've seen even MR20 people run around cluelessly. It's not an MR issue as much as it is a lack of proper guidance issue. 
I've also had some basic pointers ready to be copy-pasted, like "2 lures max, charge 1 before kill limb, charge 2 before kill teralyst" but sadly people rarely read/care about the chat, which is also infuriating.

Possible solutions that could mitigate this issue: 
-add extra voice lines for Onkko reminding of basic hunt principles, specifically on limbs requiring a charged lure or the amount of needed lures (e.g. "The teralyst has 4 limbs. 2 lures should suffice")
-make actual requirements for accepting the Teralyst/Tridolon bounty from Konzu, to prevent curious or malicious players from venturing into a mission they have no basics for
-possibly create a quest mission where you hunt a lesser Teralyst with less health and shields that can be soloed with the mote amp, just to go through the basics.
 

Until then, I see myself forced to solo the Teralysts and probably give up on Tridolons due to a lack of a godroll Lanka or whatnot, which I personally don't enjoy. Warframe is not meant to be played solo, but the current status quo of things forces you to either find a dedicated group of friends to play with, or endure going through the same mistakes at the cost of your time. 

Or solo. And last time I checked, Ninjas played free, not alone.
 

[(PSN)robotwars7]

man, I sure do love Solo mode. Solo mode is the best. you never get any problems like this in Solo mode. have you tried Solo mode? Solo mode is great!

Edited August 30, 2018 by (PS4)robotwars7

[Guest]

Just now, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

man, I sure do love Solo mode. Solo mode is the best. you never get any problems like this in solo mode. have you tried solo mode? solo mode is great!

Judging by the speed of your reply, you probably didn't read until the end, did you?

[(PSN)robotwars7]

1 minute ago, VeloxPrime said:

Judging by the speed of your reply, you probably didn't read until the end, did you?

oh I did. you're just having the same problem as everybody else: you're trying to PUG eidolons and are expecting every team you get to be top-tier pros. isn't working out for you is it?

bad teams will happen from time to time, there's nothing anyone can do about that.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

oh I did. you're just having the same problem as everybody else: you're trying to PUG eidolons and are expecting every team you get to be top-tier pros. isn't working out for you is it?

bad teams will happen from time to time, there's nothing anyone can do about that.

I'm starting to suspect you didn't read at all. Everything you've mentioned in your sharp reply was addressed by me in my initial post. I propose to read it again, carefully, so I don't have to explain things I've already covered.

[Spartan336]

Woah. It's like, I dunno, this is a multiplayer game and not everyone is a pro or something. 

You'll have to deal with it. There's no fix for public matches that wouldn't screw something over. 

[Joe_Barbarian]

Your current stats:
Eidolon: Captures / Kills
Teralyst: 156 / 15
Gantulyst: 6 / 0
Hydrolyst: 3 / 1

Teralyst is soloable, I've taken 3 rookies that only have Mote Amps to kill the Teralyst repeatedly to show them the basics and go over any questions they might have or just to show them how it's done. You're relatively inexperienced when it comes to the last 2 Eidolons. Harrow is meta but only in super elite groups that are well versed in working together and have their timings down, in all other cases Oberon not only mitigates the "Eidolon Roar" But offers team support in the forms of "Phoenix Renewal" or if damage focused "Smite Infusion (This bad btw but meh)"

My suggestion is:

• Make some friends and start forming a regular group.
• Join a Clan where it's members actually have more than 2 active brain cells (Consider this a more 'Advanced Recruit Chat'
• get some more practical experience in forming a group instead of taking the first person you see that has a pulse.

[Sintag]

16 minutes ago, VeloxPrime said:

get an excessive amount of lures

This isn't exactly a bad thing.  Unless they're all uncharged (likely, they are) and they're being brought right up to Terry's face (which, again, they probably are).  Having a couple spare Lures is handy if one of them unexpectedly kicks the bucket.

Other than that though, get some clanmates or get into Recruiting.  There's nothing I can say or do to fix this issue.

[Guest]

Brilliant you guys. Not one time did I mention "pro players"; I explained several times that people with NO UNDERSTANDING AT ALL shouldn't be put through endgame content. 

To all of you saying "There is no fix" I... specifically mentioned 3 fixes... as opposed to no fixes at all in its current state.

I see what you're trying to do. "See the problem in yourself, not others". But it doesn't apply to an issue that was poorly designed and could be improved.

[thegreatAce21]

I think the goal here is to educate yourself first before the others. Casually hunting eidolons have a lot of consequences.

• Since you're waiting for a lanka riven makes me think that you still don't have much experience about eidolon hunting - it's not a requirement.
• You've tried recruitment channel, have you asked them nicely if it's their first time hunting? 
• You can hunt teralyst without asking bounties from Konzu. Go to Cetus, if there's an existing party, leave to host. 
• Players knowing what to do is part of the process. Teach them.

[Yuri_Doujinshi]

I mean, what are you expecting from endgame activities that require a high degree of communication between players? This is the reason why raids died, and the only reason why Tridolons are alive is because they're extremely lucrative and comparatively easier.

Also, you are aware that bringing 8 lures to terry for charging is meta, right? DPS grabs first lure, trin goes and grabs 7 more before the healing phase, and they're all charged there. 5+ cap strats might be different, but what I just described allowed me to do many 3 caps and a 4 cap as trin. 

[Joe_Barbarian]

Just now, VeloxPrime said:

Brilliant you guys. Not one time did I mention "pro players"; I explained several times that people with NO UNDERSTANDING AT ALL shouldn't be put through endgame content. 

To all of you saying "There is no fix" I... specifically mentioned 3 fixes... as opposed to no fixes at all in its current state.

I see what you're trying to do. "See the problem in yourself, not others". But it doesn't apply to an issue that was poorly designed and could be improved.

20 minutes on the forums and you're already screeching that things aren't going exactly as you want it to. If your behaviour in this thread is anything to go by, I'm not surprised you usually can't get past the Teralyst. 

[thegreatAce21]

2 minutes ago, VeloxPrime said:

Brilliant you guys. Not one time did I mention "pro players"; I explained several times that people with NO UNDERSTANDING AT ALL shouldn't be put through endgame content. 

To all of you saying "There is no fix" I... specifically mentioned 3 fixes... as opposed to no fixes at all in its current state.

I see what you're trying to do. "See the problem in yourself, not others". But it doesn't apply to an issue that was poorly designed and could be improved.

So you want the game to tell you step by step on how to defeat the boss? I guess you're on the wrong game my friend.

[(XBOX)Danowat32]

The issue here seems to be.......

"It should be DE/the games job to teach players, not mine"

There isn't anything inherently wrong with that statement, but your life, and everyone elses, would be made so much better if you pointed out peoples errors with hunting, rather than venting here.

Excess lures isn't a problem, especially if you're trying to mainline a tricap without having to jump away after each battle to pickup more lures, infact, I'd say it's almost a bonus to do this.

[Guest]

Just now, thegreatAce21 said:

I think the goal here is to educate yourself first before the others. Casually hunting eidolons have a lot of consequences.

• Since you're waiting for a lanka riven makes me think that you still don't have much experience about eidolon hunting - it's not a requirement.
• You've tried recruitment channel, have you asked them nicely if it's their first time hunting? 
• You can hunt teralyst without asking bounties from Konzu. Go to Cetus, if there's an existing party, leave to host. 
• Players knowing what to do is part of the process. Teach them.

Lots of assumptions... I mentioned the Lanka riven, because it would make soloing Tridolons easier and more casual. I mentioned that I solo Teralysts no problem. Tridolons seem to be a headache to solo either way.

Yes, I've asked people in recruitment nicely. Why would you assume I haven't? Is "Have you done this before?" nice enough?

Yes, you can hunt terries without asking for bounties. But if you DO ask for bounties, you would expect to be matched with people who also want to hunt the eidolons. This is where new players shouldn't go.

Also about the "teaching" part, I did mention how people often don't read the chat. Also, it's on DE to teach the BASICS of their game, not the players. There's also tons of material online to learn the BASICS from. Learning is a player's own responsibility, going into a mission all clueless and expecting to be taught is selfish and shouldn't be condoned.

If someone ASKS me to teach them, I will gladly do so. But not when someone forces me to.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Joe_Barbarian said:

20 minutes on the forums and you're already screeching that things aren't going exactly as you want it to. If your behaviour in this thread is anything to go by, I'm not surprised you usually can't get past the Teralyst. 

Your hostile attitude is baffling. Also I've been in this game for over 5 years.

Do you have anything of actual substance to say, or is it all just personal jabs?

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, (XB1)Danowat32 said:

The issue here seems to be.......

"It should be DE/the games job to teach players, not mine"

There isn't anything inherently wrong with that statement, but your life, and everyone elses, would be made so much better if you pointed out peoples errors with hunting, rather than venting here.

Excess lures isn't a problem, especially if you're trying to mainline a tricap without having to jump away after each battle to pickup more lures, infact, I'd say it's almost a bonus to do this.

Yes, the last part is correct, unless you've queued for a Teralyst bounty or gathered a party for a Tera hunt. The problem isn't excessive lures per say; it's people not knowing how many lures they need to begin with and snatching each and every one they see, then bringing them to the Tera's face, extending charge time.

[(XBOX)Danowat32]

1 minute ago, VeloxPrime said:

Yes, the last part is correct, unless you've queued for a Teralyst bounty or gathered a party for a Tera hunt. The problem isn't excessive lures per say; it's people not knowing how many lures they need to begin with and snatching each and every one they see, then bringing them to the Tera's face, extending charge time.

Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he'll eat forever.

Just explain to them what they are doing wrong.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, thegreatAce21 said:

So you want the game to tell you step by step on how to defeat the boss? I guess you're on the wrong game my friend.

It's not like there are tutorial quests already that teach the basics, right...
Also eidolons are not a simple boss as any other. It's a completely different level of play, unlocked after a specific story quest, that introduces new mechanics. Eidolons incorporates those mechanics in tandem with the previous ones. No need to brush it off like that.

Honestly, I'm shocked how most people here are so against making the content more explained and newb-friendly, as opposed to me just sucking it up. What happened to the community over the years...

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, (XB1)Danowat32 said:

Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he'll eat forever.

Just explain to them what they are doing wrong.

I addressed that already. Please read my post carefully...

[(XBOX)Danowat32]

39 minutes ago, VeloxPrime said:

IWarframe is not meant to be played solo, but the current status quo of things forces you to either find a dedicated group of friends to play with, or endure going through the same mistakes at the cost of your time. 
 

 

1 minute ago, VeloxPrime said:

I addressed that already. Please read my post carefully...

In that case, your final sentence is your only option, I can't imagine DE are going to address this issue.

[thegreatAce21]

2 minutes ago, VeloxPrime said:

Lots of assumptions... I mentioned the Lanka riven, because it would make soloing Tridolons easier and more casual. I mentioned that I solo Teralysts no problem. Tridolons seem to be a headache to solo either way.

Yes, I've asked people in recruitment nicely. Why would you assume I haven't? Is "Have you done this before?" nice enough?

Yes, you can hunt terries without asking for bounties. But if you DO ask for bounties, you would expect to be matched with people who also want to hunt the eidolons. This is where new players shouldn't go.

Also about the "teaching" part, I did mention how people often don't read the chat. Also, it's on DE to teach the BASICS of their game, not the players. There's also tons of material online to learn the BASICS from. Learning is a player's own responsibility, going into a mission all clueless and expecting to be taught is selfish and shouldn't be condoned.

If someone ASKS me to teach them, I will gladly do so. But not when someone forces me to.

Believe me it's more headache doing tridolon with a team that doesn't know what to do than solo. Go to recruitment channel.

Then if they haven't replied or you don't want their answer, why invite them?

I think they have covered the BASICS of their game. If you're referring to the game play of the eidolon hunt, its on the players on how they will defeat the enemies. 

As from the post above, you have already 156 teralyst captures - i think by this time you know how to charge the 2 lures first before engaging the teralyst. In that way, your problem about early shooting of the limbs will be solved. 

[Guest]

Just now, (XB1)Danowat32 said:

 

In that case, your final sentence is your only option, I can't imagine DE are going to address this issue.

Not with this community mentality. I mean just look at it. The majority of people are plainly AGAINST DE teaching new and inexperienced players on the basics of endgame content. Most people here are trying to somehow make it my responsibility, or outright suggest I stay away from coop, as opposed to focusing on the "new players can join endgame bounties with no idea or requirement" bit.
 

With a mentality like this, DE doesn't have to fix anything. Don't like it? Stay away from the game. 

[Joe_Barbarian]

1 minute ago, VeloxPrime said:

I addressed that already. Please read my post carefully...

You should take some of your own advice, you've completely bypassed my first post giving you some good suggestions on what you could to improve your current situation. I have no problems getting into or even starting my own groups. This is a prime example of making mountains out of an anthill.

As for my screeching comment, you're complaining that no one is listening when there are suggestions posted by multiple people on how to improve your situation.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

3 minutes ago, VeloxPrime said:

What happened to the community over the years...

 

1 minute ago, VeloxPrime said:

Not with this community mentality. I mean just look at it.

oh, here we go with the "everyone disagrees with me so clearly there's something wrong with the community as a whole" shtick. was just waiting on that. that one should be on the bingo card...

also, if you were actually serious about wanting to educate people on Eidolons, you'd have an actual plan on what tutorials to implement and how to do them, and would have put it in #Feedback. that's what a reasonable, intelligent player would have done. but instead you've decided to rant in GD and play the victim card because it's so much easier.